Additional Public Transit

[droidhacker 2]

Is that the amtrak?  I'm pretty sure those use overheads, thats grand central right behind it right?  I was looking online, I knew that the passenger trains to upper New York state were overheads but I thought they used third rail in the city, like I said I've never been there.  Regardless andre's tracks look much better.  I would use them as if the trains in the future no longer need overhead cables.  This picture only reinforces that the rails should be train track to unify the system.  Do these trains use the same lines as the metro tracks?  I do not believe they do since I am sure the mostly head straight out of the city to New Jersey or Long Island?

As far as the vote I think you should just keep doing what you are doing, it looks great and no matter what you decide you've added great new functionality. You obviously are great at models and textures so why don't you release multiple "looks" of train track and release your station tracks too; then modders can make stations as they please and players can use them any way they want.  With IPT you can change vehicle speed so if you add high speed rail looking tracks people can use those with high tech looking stations and simply make the trains they want to use faster using IPT.  This allows interconnectivity between different systems and allows people to use any asset for any system instead of making multiple proprietary network types.  In real life most high speed trains sometimes utilize lower speed lines for fiscal or logistical reasons.  Then if people want an above ground metro they can use underground "metro" train stations and "metro" train vehicles and connect everything with your awesome looking track.  If people (me!) want a really clean nice looking rail for their "maglev" the can use a futuristic train, raise the speed with IPT and connect the stations with your track.

[donoteat 478]

Amtrak runs on ex-PRR rails and ex-NYNHH rails into Penn Station, which has 3rd rail for the LIRR on the Long Island side, and overhead lines for long distance and NJT trains on both sides. Metro North runs into Grand Central and uses 3rd rail in the city, overhead lines or 3rd rail elsewhere. The MTA subway does not share tracks with commuter or freight trains.

Behind the Acela in that shot is the James Farley Post Office. Amtrak does not use Grand Central; it sends Empire Service trains and the Maple Leaf to Toronto via the Empire Connection (3rd rail) to the Spuyten Duyvil Bridge and points North.

 

I agree that there should be one network called "rail" with several options for power accessories, tunnels, street running, etc. but the overwhelming consensus seems to be it isn't possible...

[droidhacker 2]

Ah ok that is interesting, sorry for subway I meant metro north, I know the subway is independent, but I am pretty sure the metro is underground in Manhattan which is why I got them confused.

It isn't possible to simply connect andre's rail to normal rail?  I saw on the workshop there is a mod that adds six new types of tracks, each one has to be used independently?  Can they not hook to regular stations?

I understand its not possible to hook up with the snowfall trams, but I do not think that is a CRITICAL necessity even though it happens often in real life

[andreharv 1,197]

@droidhacker:Welcome.  I remember when I first started designing these new tracks I kept thinking 'It doesn't take much effort to make this look better than vanilla (IMHO).  Why didn't the devs do more?'  There was much more I could do in the way of details but it would all be to the hurt of those who don't welcome the extra tris count.  That said (to reiterate):

• The goal of this mod is simply to overhaul that minimal and...frankly...not very fun network we call Metro.  It is technically not adding a 'new' thing per se but really taking the skeleton of something that exists and making it better.  Therefore, it cannot connect to rail networks since such a connection, to my knowledge, doesn't exist for vanilla subway.  The moment it does, this should also (with little effort).
• Most major cities I studied have separate concepts for 'rail', 'subway/metro' and 'tram'.  I like the concept of using each where they work best.  Subways in this game operate at 2/3 the speed of rail but IRL, they regularly go above and below ground to blend in with the infrastructure of a bustling city.  Rails are typically more regional and trams...are like busses but are cooler.  I also like the idea of transfer stations which act as a hub for travelers of diverse transportation needs.
• Nothing about programming this stuff is easy, period (at least not for me)...
• While I agree that this will prob make the vanilla rail look kinda bland (if I may say so myself), I feel that there are enough things missing from this game that just about everything I make will need to 'do' something or at least give the impression it is brand new.  My next project may be high speed rail or maybe maglev...maybe...uhh...uhh high speed maglev.  Or maybe, because main street is cracked and broken, and the mob here at ST has spoken...about monorail...we could do that too. (If you don't watch the Simpsons then...nvm _{*monorail...monorail...monorail*})

By the way I would like to call a new vote for future stuff but I am not sure how...Ideas?

In other news, I am still working on raising/lowering station functionality.  So far, the popup with sliders wins (had to learn ColossalUI which is a CollosalPIA)...But I was able to make a popup that controls height of stations down to 36m (deeper than that and it starts lookin kinda fuzzy) and track lengths up to 150m (more than that and the station tracks stop supporting stops.  Current stations are 88m so 150 looks nice).  I may adjust the sliders based on what makes practical sense.  Should put out a new build tonight or tomorrow.  

ALSO:

Guys!...Gals?  People!!!  I guess I never really thought about this much but I really don't want just vanilla subway stations.  I was wondering if people could make general-ish styled stations for ground and elevated (even subway).  If my station tracks are currently too broken to explore this, please let me know.  I could make them all myself but that would take forever.  I will put a bug out in the ear of those on Reddit as well.  @BloodyPenguin and I could select a station (or 2) from each elevation to put out for release (not necessarily the initial release but @wasmic said he would not sub until they are in and I need him to ).  

Thanks again for your testing and support.

[LittleMac 48]

Thanks for your amazing job! I would like to make some ground and elevated stations, but only in the future, as i don't have the knowledge to do it by now.  keep the good work, and take your time, thanks again for everything!

[agunter999 200]

I think the best next project would be a reskin of the standard rails as they look just ew atm

[Tim The Terrible 586]

Just now, agunter999 said:

I think the best next project would be a reskin of the standard rails as they look just ew atm

I'm working on the overhead wires/catenaries, not anything special, but it's something  

[agunter999 200]

Yeh I know, I just commented on it asking for new rails lol

 

[droidhacker 2]

Regardless I think andre you should still release your amazing rails as train tracks as a standalone mod.  It could be months until network skins is ready for that kind of stuff and even more time until somebody has a network skin anywhere near as good as your rails.  TONS of people would download them as a train track because there isn't anything close to as good looking available for download right now.  Even if you continue your various projects and metro overhaul it would be nice to build with your tracks as a train track.  Even if you did release your overhaul all complete I would still want my regular train track to look as good as those tracks!

I think I might have confused you earlier I meant isn't it possible to open up the code and switch the track from metro to train?  Then the track you made would become train track and could connect to regular track and stations.  There is a mod that adds six new types of train track so I'm sure it would be possible to connect your track to other train tracks.

[Bad Peanut 826]

6 hours ago, andreharv said:

@droidhacker:Welcome.  I remember when I first started designing these new tracks I kept thinking 'It doesn't take much effort to make this look better than vanilla (IMHO).  Why didn't the devs do more?'  There was much more I could do in the way of details but it would all be to the hurt of those who don't welcome the extra tris count.  That said (to reiterate):

• The goal of this mod is simply to overhaul that minimal and...frankly...not very fun network we call Metro.  It is technically not adding a 'new' thing per se but really taking the skeleton of something that exists and making it better.  Therefore, it cannot connect to rail networks since such a connection, to my knowledge, doesn't exist for vanilla subway.  The moment it does, this should also (with little effort).
• Most major cities I studied have separate concepts for 'rail', 'subway/metro' and 'tram'.  I like the concept of using each where they work best.  Subways in this game operate at 2/3 the speed of rail but IRL, they regularly go above and below ground to blend in with the infrastructure of a bustling city.  Rails are typically more regional and trams...are like busses but are cooler.  I also like the idea of transfer stations which act as a hub for travelers of diverse transportation needs.
• Nothing about programming this stuff is easy, period (at least not for me)...
• While I agree that this will prob make the vanilla rail look kinda bland (if I may say so myself), I feel that there are enough things missing from this game that just about everything I make will need to 'do' something or at least give the impression it is brand new.  My next project may be high speed rail or maybe maglev...maybe...uhh...uhh high speed maglev.  Or maybe, because main street is cracked and broken, and the mob here at ST has spoken...about monorail...we could do that too. (If you don't watch the Simpsons then...nvm _{*monorail...monorail...monorail*})

By the way I would like to call a new vote for future stuff but I am not sure how...Ideas?

In other news, I am still working on raising/lowering station functionality.  So far, the popup with sliders wins (had to learn ColossalUI which is a CollosalPIA)...But I was able to make a popup that controls height of stations down to 36m (deeper than that and it starts lookin kinda fuzzy) and track lengths up to 150m (more than that and the station tracks stop supporting stops.  Current stations are 88m so 150 looks nice).  I may adjust the sliders based on what makes practical sense.  Should put out a new build tonight or tomorrow.  

ALSO:

Guys!...Gals?  People!!!  I guess I never really thought about this much but I really don't want just vanilla subway stations.  I was wondering if people could make general-ish styled stations for ground and elevated (even subway).  If my station tracks are currently too broken to explore this, please let me know.  I could make them all myself but that would take forever.  I will put a bug out in the ear of those on Reddit as well.  @BloodyPenguin and I could select a station (or 2) from each elevation to put out for release (not necessarily the initial release but @wasmic said he would not sub until they are in and I need him to ).  

Thanks again for your testing and support.

@andreharv I did those two based off the cim2 elevated and ground stations - already sent them through to penguin, could send them to you as well? do you want anymore?

[andreharv 1,197]

Just the guy!  Please do.  You can email them to me at sniggledigit@gmail.com or if you have a better way to send them, please let me know.

[R3V0 909]

12 hours ago, andreharv said:

@droidhacker:Welcome.  I remember when I first started designing these new tracks I kept thinking 'It doesn't take much effort to make this look better than vanilla (IMHO).  Why didn't the devs do more?'  There was much more I could do in the way of details but it would all be to the hurt of those who don't welcome the extra tris count.  That said (to reiterate):

• The goal of this mod is simply to overhaul that minimal and...frankly...not very fun network we call Metro.  It is technically not adding a 'new' thing per se but really taking the skeleton of something that exists and making it better.  Therefore, it cannot connect to rail networks since such a connection, to my knowledge, doesn't exist for vanilla subway.  The moment it does, this should also (with little effort).
• Most major cities I studied have separate concepts for 'rail', 'subway/metro' and 'tram'.  I like the concept of using each where they work best.  Subways in this game operate at 2/3 the speed of rail but IRL, they regularly go above and below ground to blend in with the infrastructure of a bustling city.  Rails are typically more regional and trams...are like busses but are cooler.  I also like the idea of transfer stations which act as a hub for travelers of diverse transportation needs.
• Nothing about programming this stuff is easy, period (at least not for me)...
• While I agree that this will prob make the vanilla rail look kinda bland (if I may say so myself), I feel that there are enough things missing from this game that just about everything I make will need to 'do' something or at least give the impression it is brand new.  My next project may be high speed rail or maybe maglev...maybe...uhh...uhh high speed maglev.  Or maybe, because main street is cracked and broken, and the mob here at ST has spoken...about monorail...we could do that too. (If you don't watch the Simpsons then...nvm _{*monorail...monorail...monorail*})

By the way I would like to call a new vote for future stuff but I am not sure how...Ideas?

In other news, I am still working on raising/lowering station functionality.  So far, the popup with sliders wins (had to learn ColossalUI which is a CollosalPIA)...But I was able to make a popup that controls height of stations down to 36m (deeper than that and it starts lookin kinda fuzzy) and track lengths up to 150m (more than that and the station tracks stop supporting stops.  Current stations are 88m so 150 looks nice).  I may adjust the sliders based on what makes practical sense.  Should put out a new build tonight or tomorrow.  

ALSO:

Guys!...Gals?  People!!!  I guess I never really thought about this much but I really don't want just vanilla subway stations.  I was wondering if people could make general-ish styled stations for ground and elevated (even subway).  If my station tracks are currently too broken to explore this, please let me know.  I could make them all myself but that would take forever.  I will put a bug out in the ear of those on Reddit as well.  @BloodyPenguin and I could select a station (or 2) from each elevation to put out for release (not necessarily the initial release but @wasmic said he would not sub until they are in and I need him to ).  

Thanks again for your testing and support.

Already made 3 stations and waiting your oneway tracks man. Without one-way tracks they're kinda useless. 

I can look into sub stations as well. 

[andreharv 1,197]

Oneway metro or rail?  In the case of metros, oneways will be in one of the next releases (it will take probably about 50% of the time to fully make one lane metro and get all the logic right...and by right I mean like the 1 way rail tracks which still need some lookin).  Perhaps I will release the stations first since they will be easier and modders on their way.  

[boformer 3,169]

You can use the context-sensitive panel from NetworkSkins. There is also an unfinished slider component for the panel in my GitHub repository.

[andreharv 1,197]

Thanks man.  You may have saved me a ton of time.  been using CollossalFramework.Threading....good times 

 

[R3V0 909]

2 hours ago, andreharv said:

Oneway metro or rail?  In the case of metros, oneways will be in one of the next releases (it will take probably about 50% of the time to fully make one lane metro and get all the logic right...and by right I mean like the 1 way rail tracks which still need some lookin).  Perhaps I will release the stations first since they will be easier and modders on their way.  

One lane above ground metro rails to be more specific. 2 stations need them in order to be released properly.

Also there's another issue we've encountered, which the game doesn't recognize MOM properly and doesn't allow us to make combined stations (such as rail station on the ground + metro below). In my case, it was supposed to be 2 lane MOM + 1 lane rail networks on the edges, but the game recognizes the station only as either Train or Metro station. 

[alkiskan 4]

So... are there any updates?

 

[Distanced 114]

@alkiskan I've been thinking the same thing... :/

@R3V0 Any new station releases? :3

[Bad Peanut 826]

6 hours ago, alkiskan said:

So... are there any updates?

 

 

1 hour ago, TransitAuthority said:

@alkiskan I've been thinking the same thing... :/

@R3V0 Any new station releases? :3

guys have fun with the current build, but remember it's not an actual release so just wait for it to be finished! If they have to keep updating here they'll never get anything done. I'm sure once there is a need for more testing Andreharv will put it up here

anymore stations from me won't be out until After the workshop release (which i'm betting will be after natural disasters comes out so they can rework anything that changes in that patch.

 

Sit tight

[R3V0 909]

12 hours ago, TransitAuthority said:

@alkiskan I've been thinking the same thing... :/

@R3V0 Any new station releases? :3

Not for the moment, stations are ready but I don't tracks to put them, currently waiting one lane station tracks, both ground and elevated. 

[wasmic 111]

So I checked the last few pages and wasn't able to find it. Have any ground-level or elevated stations been released for this mod yet? I've been testing the mod, but I'm not gonna use it on my main save before at least one aboveground station is available. 

[sokayha 30]

POC Metro Station of TheBigCon4800 is a ground-level station which is at page 9

I had tried it and it works.

[Distanced 114]

@R3V0 @BadPeanut Okay, that makes sense. I just want something to really implement this into my city!

 

[R3V0 909]

Just now, TransitAuthority said:

@R3V0 @BadPeanut Okay, that makes sense. I just want something to really implement this into my city!

 

Try it then

Ground Metro V5%002E4.crp

[wasmic 111]

Okay, so I have been thinking about the public transit system in Cities: Skylines for some time. Since this topic is called "Additional Public Transit" and not just "Metro Overhaul", I've decided to post this here - a list of all the things that would be necessary for the public transport system to be complete in my eyes. It's quite big and more of a wishlist; not something I actually expect to happen.

Buses:

This mode of transport fulfills two roles: normal bus lines and BRT lines. Normal bus lines are complete in the vanilla+AD game. BRT can be done with some elevator buildings, TM:PE and Elevated Stops Enabler mod, but it still lacks a few things.

• Bus station road. Like tram station road, but to allow BRT lines to have actual stations. Should be like the elevated roads in having a thinner lane width, so that there's extra space for platforms within two tiles.
• Elevated, sunken and perhaps underground tunnel station roads should also be added, although underground might not be very realistic. This would allow for elevated stations without needing perpendicular roads to fit elevators in.

Trams:

Trams, like buses, serve a dual purpose: as trams and as light rail. Trams are pretty much complete in the game as it is, but need one thing:

• One-lane one-way roads for trams and other traffic.

LRT can be done with Elevated Stops Enabler and some elevator buildings. Ground level tram station tracks and stations using these are available on the workshop. However, it is impossible to make a partially underground light-rail line (as is common IRL) without wasting a lot of space making sunken stations by hand. Things that should be added before light rail is complete:

• Elevated, underground and sunken tram station tracks, along with stations for these.
• One-way at-grade, elevated, underground and sunken tram station tracks, along with stations for each of these.

Trains:

Trains are pretty much complete as it is. Only a few things are still needed:

• Elevated, sunken and underground one-way one-track station tracks (I know of at least one awesome station [by Joak] that is currently waiting for this).
• At-grade, elevated, sunken and underground one-way two-track station track (not entirely necessary since the effect can be emulated by a normal two-track two-way and two one-track one-way tracks).

Metro:

Well, this one is being worked on, and will be complete once all the things that @andreharv has said he will include are included.

Taxis:

I don't use these so I don't really know.

Other:

• Allow buses and trams to have stops on top of each other. Seriously CO, not allowing trams and buses to stop at the same place is just lazy.
• Station roads/tracks that allow both trams and buses on them - a tram road station road. For when an LRT line and a BRT line share a stretch of road/track.

High-Speed Rail/Maglev/other such proposals:

This is very much not necessary IMO. The stretches served by these things in real life are far too long for them to be used to any practical degree in C:S. Besides, HSR can already be made by using custom train assets (or just AVO to edit the vanilla trains) and TM:PE. It's not worth sinking a lot of time and effort into, in my opinion.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This entire thing is seen only from a mechanics standpoint. Both the dedicated tram tracks and the train tracks could do with a visual overhaul, too, but IMO mechanics are more important than aesthetics.

Out of all these things, the one that I feel have the biggest impact on my gameplay experience is the lack of elevated tram station track and underground tram station track. I want my Stadtbahn/premetro

So I'm just tossing this up here, and then I hope to hear some of your opinions on this subject.

[Roadman20 601]

Exclusive bus only tunnels with underground stations extremely rare, the only one I know that exists is in Seattle, Washington.  Most cities make the jump to rail tunnels in one way or another and usually put buses on a ground-level bus-only corridors.  Although the Downtown Seattle Transit Tunnel is soon converting fully over to light rails operations by the end of the decade after being mixed together since 2007, so the bus tunnel with stations concept goes away again.  

[Igorp133 28]

17 hours ago, wasmic said:

Out of all these things, the one that I feel have the biggest impact on my gameplay experience is the lack of elevated tram station track and underground tram station track. I want my Stadtbahn/premetro

So I'm just tossing this up here, and then I hope to hear some of your opinions on this subject.

Wow, you read my mind. I'm dreaming about proper LRT/Stadbahn line in my city. I would also add possibility to create crossplatform interchange stations between metro/train or metro/tram, like Berlin Wuhletal station.

 

On 02.10.2016 at 7:57 PM, R3V0 said:

Try it then

Ground Metro V5%002E4.crp

I've tried your station. It's great, but connection point of the tracks with station is glitchy.

[Delta2k5 311]

1 hour ago, Igorp133 said:

I've tried your station. It's great, but connection point of the tracks with station is glitchy.

In my case it looks just fine. seems like your ground was not flat. also, did you use some anarchy mod while connecting those tracks?

I placed the station on flat ground + dragged the tracks in without any anarchy mod enabled.

Btw. nice trains you got running there!  

[Igorp133 28]

19 hours ago, Delta2k5 said:

In my case it looks just fine. seems like your ground was not flat. also, did you use some anarchy mod while connecting those tracks?

I placed the station on flat ground + dragged the tracks in without any anarchy mod enabled.

Btw. nice trains you got running there!  

You were right. I followed you advice and now it works brilliantly!

[LittleMac 48]

Is there any way to implement in future releases, demand and capacity data for both lines and stations?

  Edited October 4, 2016 by LittleMac  
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