Some Beginnerish Questions

[simchey 20]

Hello all! I started getting back into SimCity 4 for the first time in over a decade a couple of weeks ago, and I have to say: Thanks so much for all of the work you've all done here, it's been an invaluable resource for me. I've learned so much, and found a bunch of great resources (the NAM especially rules).

I could really use some help though, and I haven't been able to find the kind of tutorials that I need. There's great stuff for getting a city up and running, and great stuff for all kinds of more specific cities. But I keep running into problems whenever it comes time to start building up -- how do you transition from medium to dense? As soon as I start doing that, I end up with huge amounts of "no job" tags, mostly from high wealth people moving in and then not having a job. Are there any resources or tutorials that I haven't seen yet for making that jump properly (or maybe even just knowing when to do it)? At what point should I be adding a subway system? I have one in my 200k city, but hardly anyone was actually using it. 

Thanks in advance for any advice

 

[CorinaMarie 29,605]

5 minutes ago, simchey said:

But I keep running into problems whenever it comes time to start building up -- how do you transition from medium to dense? As soon as I start doing that, I end up with huge amounts of "no job" tags, mostly from high wealth people moving in and then not having a job.

I feel one of my best answers to this is here.

[jeffryfisher 2,176]

I agree that the less abandonment mod reduces unsustainable pop growth.

Other tactics:

Know where your traffic is, and zone commercial only where you see the 100% color (BTW, that's really only one quarter of what a road can carry). High-wealth residents find jobs in offices.

Fun fact: A busy freeway provides customers to businesses along its sides even though those businesses can only get road access from parallel roads behind them.

Don't be afraid to zone industrial and residential close together. Low wealth sims need places to live too, and pollution is one way to inhibit gentrification.

Low wealth sims need mass transit because something like half of them can't drive. Without buses etc, they'll claim there are no jobs unless they can walk to work. I recommend the road-top mass transit mod.

[simchey 20]

On 9/5/2019 at 10:48 AM, CorinaMarie said:

I feel one of my best answers to this is here.

That makes a lot of sense! That said, how would you suggest resolving the problem now that I know what it is? Do you just ride it out? 

 

[simchey 20]

38 minutes ago, jeffryfisher said:

I agree that the less abandonment mod reduces unsustainable pop growth.

Other tactics:

Know where your traffic is, and zone commercial only where you see the 100% color (BTW, that's really only one quarter of what a road can carry). High-wealth residents find jobs in offices.

Fun fact: A busy freeway provides customers to businesses along its sides even though those businesses can only get road access from parallel roads behind them.

Don't be afraid to zone industrial and residential close together. Low wealth sims need places to live too, and pollution is one way to inhibit gentrification.

Low wealth sims need mass transit because something like half of them can't drive. Without buses etc, they'll claim there are no jobs unless they can walk to work. I recommend the road-top mass transit mod.

I actually like leaving a little space on each block for my bus stops, because it also makes me leave room for small parks/plazas/subway stations if I need them later.

I'm just starting to expand my shantytown suburbs out to the industrial parks (which I've scattered around the outskirts of the map). This is in a new city, where I don't have any commute problems; bus stops on every block are keeping commute times between 1 and 2 units of commute time, whatever those are. 

My big plan at this point is to try and make really attractive areas (basically gated communities) of low density so that wealthy people will move in more slowly. 

Thanks for the advice, both of you! 

[CorinaMarie 29,605]

1 minute ago, simchey said:

That said, how would you suggest resolving the problem now that I know what it is

I'd be proactive and raise the taxes significantly on the R$$ Sims such that the demand for them goes to -2000 to -4000 on the graph. Then go around and bulldoze all the R$$ homes which dilapidated and were re-inhabited by R$. Get everything back in balance where you have the right amount of R$ and then set the taxes back for R$$. If you are using my no kickout mod this will keep the R$$ from moving in in droves and then disappearing.

[Cyclone Boom 16,875]

Just complementing what @CorinaMarie said above...

The method for using tax rate adjustments to control residential demand is really useful to encourage certain wealth levels to grow. Just small fine-tuning can make a big difference such as to prevent higher wealth moving in, and then combined with NKO also which is very powerful for diversity in development.

See this topic which features an exemplary explanation of the process:

(Pictured is Cori driving the Flying Scotsman train as a little side story when scrolling down.)

Additionally you may find this post Cori made which is an overview of using the Ctrl+Zoning method for more precise residential realism.

As follows:

Creating Realistically Zoned Residential Neighborhoods

Hope this helps too!

[simchey 20]

I... didn't even know there was a Ctrl+zoning tool. Thanks for that! (and to Cori for providing it in the first place).

On another subject: will sims take the bus to the subway? I'm preparing to cross a major river in my city square, and it's going to make for some longer travel times for certain sims -- adding a subway would make that go by much faster (I think?), but I don't know if it's worth it if I'll have to pay for subway tunnels as expansive as my current bus system is.

[Cyclone Boom 16,875]

3 hours ago, simchey said:

I... didn't even know there was a Ctrl+zoning tool. Thanks for that! (and to Cori for providing it in the first place).

You're welcome. On a related note, there's also a few other tricks for precision zoning techniques.

 

3 hours ago, simchey said:

On another subject: will sims take the bus to the subway?

Yes, this is very possible.

I believe it does depend on factors such as the pathfinder and wealth to determine which route commuters will take. Mass transit including subways can be reached by other means than just car, and placing bus stops near subway stations will provide the opportunity for them to travel this way. If designing city areas in certain layouts, Sims can be encouraged to use subways and hence reduce traffic congestion on the roads. In some way, this is similar to how an income stream is viable from toll booths.

Using the NAM also (as you've hinted at) gives a higher capacity for networks as well. So even just using traffic simulator z would help in that respect also, which is designed to give precedence to networks with faster speeds. There's lots can be done with the vanilla game also through experimentation.

For subways strategies specifically, I've got the ideal topic link for that:

By the way, just to say how in older topics we've no hard rules about bumping them, even if the previous reply has been months or years ago.

  Edited September 7, 2019 by Cyclone Boom  
Fixed link and edited in a slight clarification. (Thanks Cori for letting me know.)

[simchey 20]

Thanks! I really appreciate the help. 

[Cyclone Boom 16,875]

Just a little thing...

I'd made a little mistake posting the toll booths tutorial link the same as the precision zoning.

It should've gone here instead: Mega income from toll booths 

(Now fixed in my above post too.)

[CorinaMarie 29,605]

3 hours ago, simchey said:

Ctrl+zoning tool.

Speaking of which (and in addition to the linkys CB provided) there's another neat thing you can do with Ctrl+Zoning.

[simchey 20]

I feel bad asking so many questions! 

I've been trying to load custom regions downloaded from the STEX, but every time I try I get told that Region bitmap size is incorrect. These aren't obscure maps nobody's ever tried before... surely some of the most downloaded maps available aren't actually in the wrong size? What am I doing wrong?

[Cyclone Boom 16,875]

On 10/09/2019 at 2:00 AM, simchey said:

I've been trying to load custom regions downloaded from the STEX, but every time I try I get told that Region bitmap size is incorrect.

That sounds like the config.bmp file doesn't quite identically correspond with the size of the image being rendered.

This file controls the tile size allocation for Small, Medium, or Large cities positioned in a given map. As this guide explains, one thing to check is it proportionally matches how large the region is as a whole. For instance a map sized 3073 x 3073 would have a config.bmp sized 48 x 48 to fit.

Calculating for this instance involves subtracting 1 from both the width and height (to leave 3072 x 3072), and then dividing by 64 each way.

Here's a few more examples:

Map Size / Config Size

•  513 x  833  =   8 x 13
• 1025 x 1025  =  16 x 16
• 1537 x 1537  =  24 x 24
• 2049 x 2049  =  32 x 32
• 2305 x 2305  =  36 x 36
• 2561 x 2561  =  40 x 40

(The 1st example is with a smaller width than height.)

Usually maps will include one of these configs, and to then the idea is to have it included in the same folder prior to rendering. Should this be missing though, it's very possible to create one to whatever you'd like wither by hand or using a program like SC4 Mapper.

Describing 2 methods, here's a step-by-step overview for map installation I've adapted from my most recent map file uploaded:
 

A) In the game

1. Extract the map (a .jpg file or .bmp file) along with the config.bmp into a new named folder inside your SimCity 4 Regions folder.
2. Start the game and open the named region.
3. Press Ctrl+Shift+Alt+R to open the game's map rendering window.
4. Browse to the grayscale image in your Regions folder (either a .jpg file or .bmp file).
5. Select and click OK to start the rendering process. Once done, it's done!

Note: Whilst in progress, it's recommended to leave the rendering to complete uninterrupted. This map may otherwise be a corrupted render.

 

B) Using SC4 Mapper (or other compatible program)

1. Make sure you've downloaded and installed SC4 Mapper 2013.
2. Extract / copy the grayscale image to a convenient location.
3. Open the program and click Create Region.
4. In the list of import formats, choose Grayscale image.
5. Browse to select the grayscale image file.
6. Click OK to confirm the size.
7. A preview of the region will be shown. Next click Save Region.
8. Confirm the name of the region (can always be changed later), then click OK.
9. Once SC4 Mapper has finished rendering each tile, close the program.
10. Start SimCity 4 and open the region. Done!

Note: At first the region thumbnails will contain abstract colour shades. Don't worry, this is perfectly normal and is due to how Mapper processes renders.
When opening & saving each tile, it'll update the preview accordingly.

 

Specifically for SC4 Mapper and I wrote a couple of brief tutorials for the program as follows:

• Tutorial: Rendering a Grayscale Map using SC4 Mapper
• Tutorial: How to edit the Config.bmp file using SC4Mapper

 

On 10/09/2019 at 2:00 AM, simchey said:

I feel bad asking so many questions!

No worries at all.

Feel free to make this a catch-all topic (as done previously) for asking anything about SC4 if you wish.

Here as a community we're delighted to keep answering questions to help people like yourself best enjoy the game. It doesn't matter either whether unsure of basic things, or the more complex endeavours with SC4. The great thing then is how other people with similar questions can likewise be guided to solutions too.

There is a lot to learn, it can be overwhelming (we understand), and do keep asking whenever and however much you'd like.

[simchey 20]

Okay, so I think that I followed those instructions. I'm trying to use this map from the STEX: 

 I downloaded the .jpg and the .bmp, selected the .jpg through the ctrl+alt+shift+r window, but it wouldn't even begin to render -- it said that the bitmap size is incorrect. Are you saying I need to somehow get in and edit the .bmp?

[Cyclone Boom 16,875]

Looking at the linked "Twin Cities" map and I can confirm the config.bmp is correctly sized at 64 x 64 for being a 4097 x 4097 map. This config has all blue tiles allocated, which means how dividing by 4 makes this a 16 x 16 tiled region. So all good there and no editing required (unless wishing to change the layout).

To initiate the map's rendering to completion, try using the following steps:

1. Create a new folder in Regions named: Twin Cities
2. Copy both the 2 downloaded files into new folder:
   1. Twin Cities.jpg
   2. config.bmp

(Preview of the folder in Windows File Explorer.)

3. Start the game, then open the new region which will have the name: Twin Cities
4. This will initially appear all blank with no terrain. Use the Ctrl+Shift+Alt+R keyboard command to open the rendering selection dialog.
5. Browse to the Twin Cities.jpg inside the "Twin Cities" folder you created. The config.bmp file should still be inside there.
6. Make sure the file name is visible in the box, then click the OK button to begin.
7. The rendering should now start (and will take around half an hour, depending on your computer's CPU power).
8. Leave the render to fully complete, as switching focus from the game may otherwise interrupt the process.
9. All being well, the map is now ready to play.
10. Have fun.

Hope this works for you too!

[simchey 20]

I think my problem was that I was trying to rename the region -- I followed your instructions this morning (naming the region folder "Twin Cities") and it's working like a charm.

Thank you!

[simchey 20]

This may be a dumber question than normal, but:

I'm not super into the deep depths of customization as some people are (though I do love looking at them!), but I am starting to get tired of the repetitive buildings you get in the game. I don't really care WHAT I add to the game's library of buildings (lots?), I just want to add to it. Do there exist downloads that are a whole bunch of things together, instead of picking and choosing individual gas stations and low-rises? 

[simchey 20]

To clarify, I mean growable buildings, not ploppable ones.  

[twalsh102 1,601]

The only dumb questions are those left unasked.

While the vast majority of downloads you encounter will be of single buildings (possibly multiple lots of different sizes with the same building. there have been numerous content creators that have created packages of lots of different types.  They are almost always "themed" (i.e. warehouses, hotels, grocery stores, office buildings of different heights and sizes, etc.).  I don't recall running across anything like what you might be suggesting (some residential, some industrial, some commercial - all in one package) (that doesn't mean they don't exist).  Two that I can think of right off the top of my head are @madhatter106, and @SimGoober.  Madhatter's offerings are all commercial, and available on this site.  While Simgoober does have many offerings on this site, the majority of his "packages" are available over on the LEX at SC4D.  It is not unusual for content creators to be members of multiple websites (especially ST and SC4D).  It is also not unusual for content creators to not offer all their creations on multiple sites (some content may be on both; some content may only be on one and not the other).  So you need to look at both sites to see the full extent of their work. 

There are certainly other content creators than just these two that might offer what you are looking for.  Others will likely offer up suggestions for other content creators that offer up the same type of work (everybody tends to have their favorites).

But the bottom line is that unless you end up putting in the work and time to search all the available websites (to include foreign ones), you will end missing some truly incredible work.

Hope this gets you started.

[Prophet42 1,501]

Another good way to get content is once you find an artist that you like, click on 'Find their other files' and it will list out all their creations.  twalsh102 suggestions of madhatter106 and SimGoober are excellent choices.  I would also check out @Jasoncw, @paeng, @SimCoug, @Aaron Graham, @Reddonquixote, and  @mattb325. Just to name a few.

[simchey 20]

Thank you both for the pointers! Here I thought the STEX had an unimaginable amount of options... 

[jeffryfisher 2,176]

22 hours ago, simchey said:

Do there exist downloads that are a whole bunch of things together,

Some downloads fall into families that follow (or not) major mods such as SPAM, IRM and CAM. You should look into each of those mods and decide whether you want in or out. Then filter your download choices accordingly. Otherwise you could end up with buildings that never grow or mods that don't work as advertised.

[twalsh102 1,601]

If you aren't already,  you will definitely want to eventually become a member of SC4 Devotion (SC4D) (https://www.sc4devotion.com) as many of the Dependencies used by almost all content developers are only available there.  Just so you are prepared, you will need to apply for membership to the site, and then apply separately for access to the exchange (known as the LEX).  If I remember correctly, you won't be able to use the same username / password combination for both (or at least I couldn't when I signed up).

[CorinaMarie 29,605]

16 minutes ago, twalsh102 said:

Just so you are prepared, you will need to apply for membership to the site, and then apply separately for access to the exchange (known as the LEX).

I don't know about now-a-days, but back when I signed up I just did the LEX only. I'm still not a member of Devotion's site itself. And last I checked a couple of days ago, I can still access their LEX just fine.

That's not to say don't join Devotion as it's a wonderful site. Just saying it's not necessary in order to access their file exchange.

[simchey 20]

Thank you all for the downloads advice! Quite a bit to get into there...

One thing I'm unsure of is the degree to which neighbouring cities interact. I've got a bustling little city going right now (Bonaventure) with a population just shy of 200k. I decided to expand out to a neighbouring tile, the first connection, that could act as a suburb (Fort Real). The latent demand absolutely exploded Fort Real, which shot to about 60k population in under a year. Fort Real is almost entirely residential, save for a small strip of commercial along its main drag, so the vast majority of its population commutes into Bonaventure.

The only connection between the two cities is a subway line, running along the main drag of FR, through an industrial park in Bonaventure then all along that city's core until it reaches another industrial park on the other side. FR sims either walk or take the bus to the subway, then ride that into the main city. FR's traffic report says that 15k are taking that subway.

And yet, the subway in Bonaventure shows no increase in ridership whatsoever, and the portion of track leading out into FR is entirely disused. Do commuter sims just take the train to "somewhere" as opposed to actually commuting to work in a specific city?

[twalsh102 1,601]

Network traffic of any kind does not cross over city boundaries.  Sims commuting to jobs in other cities are considered to have arrived at those jobs as soon as they hit the city boundary.  Sims commuting to another city to look for jobs, either find them if they are available upon hitting the city boundary, or return home and display the no-job zot if jobs cannot be found any place else.  There is no reverse rush hour for commuters as the simulation simply doesn't keep track such information.  As there are likely no jobs in FR for any commuters from Bonaventure, there is no traffic generated.  Understand that the only real traffic generated in the game is that necessary for Sims to get from home to work, and to get from work to home (if they live in the city where they work.

This all comes down to what the Prima Guide calls the Regional Play Time Warp.  Consider that since only one city can be played at a time, the clock for all other cities are stopped as soon as you exit them.  Because of this, depending on how many other connected cities you have, how often you play other cities, and how long you play them before changing to another city,  no two cities will have the exact same time (unless you use the Extra Cheats to manually sync times for cosmetic purposes).  So how could traffic move between cities than might possibly be tens or hundreds of years apart according to each cities clock.

Similarly, when a city is not being played, no financial transactions of any kind take place:  no taxes are being collected; none of the costs necessary to maintain the city are being paid; revenues from business deals are not being collected; costs for Buy Neighbor Deals are not being expended, and revenues from Sell Neighbor Deals are not collected. 

On the other hand, Growth extrapolation, and how demand is shared between connected cities, and exported to connected cities is a book by itself, and I won't try and explain that here.  Thankfully, there is a book that does a pretty good job of explaining it:  Prima's Official Strategy Guide for SimCity 4 Deluxe Edition.  If haven't already acquired a copy, it is highly recommended if you want to gain a better understanding of many of the mechanics of the game.  If you haven't acquired a copy yet, it is available for free download here:

https://ia600202.us.archive.org/25/items/SimCity_4_Rush_Hour_Prima_Official_eGuide/SimCity_4_Rush_Hour_Prima_Official_eGuide.pdf

 

[jeffryfisher 2,176]

19 hours ago, simchey said:

the subway in Bonaventure shows no increase in ridership

How much time did you run off of Bonaventure's clock after starting it with FR's commuters expected? I find that the traffic simulator needs about 6 months at turtle speed before incoming commuters get plotted to jobs (or further connections).

If you haven't run the clock, you won't see the new commuters coming in (I think that's what @TWalsh102 was trying to say with "Network traffic of any kind does not cross over city boundaries". They can't go further while the origin city is running, but job-seekers do wait in limbo until the neighbor is opened and its clock runs. Then the workers find jobs and return routes back to the connections that brought them in (which is why one-way roads can't make connections; every passenger connection absolutely requires two-way traffic).

Freight, garbage etc do not reappear from limbo, only job-seekers. Freight and garbage are considered delivered just by reaching the outbound connection (or seaport) where they vanish into the void.

 

[simchey 20]

Thanks for the explanations! I'm digging into that guide now, twalsh. On a related note, do cities within a region affect one another if they aren't connected (like if I started a tile on the other side of the region)?

And on an unrelated note, I downloaded Equinox's RCI Query Mod and am not sure where to install it, the readme says: c:\program files\maxis\SimCity 4\Plugins. My directories are all a little different because I got the game via Steam, but is that the installation folder or the normal plugin folder?

[twalsh102 1,601]

Only cities that are connected, "affect" each other.  You could place two city squares right next to each other.  If there are no connections between them, there is no way for them to affect each other.

Reference where to put the RCi Query Mod:  the location referenced in the readme is the installation folder.  However, note that this mod was released in 2004.  In the intervening years, the common wisdom is that all added Plugins (with one caveat) should be placed in the "normal" Plugins folder (also commonly known as your My Documents Plugin folder).  The one caveat is .dll files (there are really only a few of these).  Common wisdom is that .dll files should be placed in your Installation Plugins folder.