Simcity 2013 or simcity 4

[GenXisT 127]

Normally I don't troll around on the SC 2013 forum but it's a slow day at work.  I'm suprised that in this forum there isn't more peeps in support of the new game.  I could see all the negativity on the SC4 forum, but if this was a poll, I bet 95% of the peeps are for SC4.  I have not played the new game myself, because the computer I play on isn't hooked up to the internet so I couldn't play even if I wanted to.  But I have been playing SC4 for only about 6-7 months now and I have probably years to go before I get tired of it, or the cd wears out .  I only started used custom content just a few months ago and it's like a whole new game to me.  Even before the custom content I loved the game, it was even somewhat more challenging because without NAM it's not easy to find jobs for your little sims to work at, so I had a lot more NJZs than now.  When I get a NJZ now it's because I literally have no jobs for them.  Anyway, getting back to the subject at hand, IF they ever made the new SC playable on line and IF there was custom content for the game I would try it, but till then I'm sticking with SC4...

 

I think you've answered your own question as to why "more peeps in this forum don't support the new game."  The new game is REALLY bad by comparison.

About the only ones that do have outright support for  SC2013 are by and large new to the SC2013 franchise, which is sad.

It's like missing out on great players like Gretzky in the NHL or Jordan in the NBA or Michael Jackson in the music industry and then being left with "1 Direction" as the banner carrier for pop music, lol... 

Needless to say, it's easy to see why us old-school players prefer SC4 (and any of the previous versions) to this.

 

Until the quit being so anal about everything with the no local save crap and now openly allowing modding, this game will continue to falter.

After all, SC4 was great, then they came out with Rush Hour... but it didn't really excel till the NAM and all the modding made it fantastic... 10 years.... that's why it's still playable  today like it's a brand new game!

[MINIggy03 227]

Most of the people that were supportive and enjoy the game left because this place became an anti-simcity fan club.  

[nthooze 13]

SC4 without question.  I have not played the new game.  I have watched a fare amount of walk through vid's though.  The new game is disaster on so many levels I can't even get into it.  I have zero faith that EA will ever allow Maxis to build a game for us, the real fans of simcity ever again.  Our game series is held captive and I fear it will never be set free.

[Sfletcher 1]

 I have played SimCity 2013 on and off since its release. I'm not going to rehash that mess, but I think my complaints would stream along the same lines as most folks. I hate the small maps, the ton of dead space, the failure to all terraforming etc. This morning while my son was sleeping I had enough quite time to go back into SimCity 4. Updated my NAM, download a few buildings, strolled down the streets of some of my larger cities like Great Harbor or the old capital of the Republic of Maxis Kingswood and realized how much I still love SimCity 4. I'm pretty sure in ten years I will still be playing this game, as long as their is modding out there. I'm can't modd, I'm not a tech genius like that, but I love the work that people put up here its amazing and with this kind of content there is no way I could fall in love with SimCity 2013. EA has been a disappointment for a long time now, they really need to do a lot of work before I could write a glowing review of SimCity 2013. So my vote is SimCity 4, now, tomorrow, forever.

[Radioactive Chicken 10]

Most of the people that were supportive and enjoy the game left because this place became an anti-simcity fan club.  

Pretty much this, in every thread.  It gets tedious quick. 

 

But for what it's worth I think SimCity2013 is fun but it does not have the long term appeal of SC4.  Maybe they can change that around but I doubt it tbh.  They don't necessarily need or want to make a product with a 10 year life span.  If we enjoy the game for a year or two they've got their money and they probably think we got our money's worth so that's good enough for them.  It's only because we personally wanted it to be something that would be good enough to replace SC4 but with upgraded graphics that it's come unstuck for game veterans. 

 

Simcity has two different levels of gameplay. There the first stage when you get to grips with the simulation, the game and try to use those mechanics to create the city that you want but after a while you want to move on and be more creative with the game and that's where it comes unstuck for me. 

We want something that we can pour all our time into and tweak and carve into our own creation and with SC13 you just can't.  Not really.  You just don't have the same level of control. 

It's all about working with the land as it comes which is interesting in one way, making it work for you but then if you want to recreate something in particular you are out of luck.  Our creativity is stifled.  Creativity is what takes the game from something to beat to something we want to keep as a hobby.  SC2013 is the former SC4 the latter. 

[macscfan 117]

 

 

But for what it's worth I think SimCity2013 is fun but it does not have the long term appeal of SC4.  Maybe they can change that around but I doubt it tbh.  They don't necessarily need or want to make a product with a 10 year life span.  

 

I disagree.  From their comments, and the direction EA as a company is moving, they absolutely want SC to actively be around for years to come.  They are seriously pursuing the angle of "software as a service" that Adobe and others are embracing, and SimCity falls right into this, and I believe some of the things like always-on and keeping our cities tied to online servers are a small part of that.

 

There is something like $400-500 worth of DLC for The Sims. That's like buying The Sims 10 times over.  They want that for SC.  They have stated many times that their future is big on micro-transactions and DLC.

 

By tying us down to their online servers and Origin, they have the chance to advertise the DLC and make it easy to get, and if it's easy to get, a lot of people will purchase it on a whim.  Because it's going through Origin, EA gets 100% of the revenue (and only like 66% through Amazon).

 

The problem is modding - will EA truly allow us the same level of modding we had with SC4?  I do not believe so, because it would have the potential to disrupt said DLC, and I doubt they'll allow us to modify too much in the way of game files.

 

The problem is that we have certain expectations as SC4 players that do not match with SC2013 and EA's stated goals.   

 

A lot of us, myself include, keep asking how EA could be so dumb in regards to certain decisions they made about SC2013, and yet ultimately it's not really "dumb" because a lot of those decisions are very deliberate, and had a specific purpose in mind that concerned SC's future.  

 

Arguably, we who are still playing SC4 here in 2013 are not SC2013's target audience either.  Their target audience doesn't care about modding, they'll happily drop money on all kinds of DLC, and they aren't concerned with city sizes or forced multiplayer/online, or the lack of backing up/saving cities offline.

[Akerbeltz 33]

 

 

 

But for what it's worth I think SimCity2013 is fun but it does not have the long term appeal of SC4.  Maybe they can change that around but I doubt it tbh.  They don't necessarily need or want to make a product with a 10 year life span.  

 

I disagree.  From their comments, and the direction EA as a company is moving, they absolutely want SC to actively be around for years to come.  They are seriously pursuing the angle of "software as a service" that Adobe and others are embracing, and SimCity falls right into this, and I believe some of the things like always-on and keeping our cities tied to online servers are a small part of that.

 

There is something like $400-500 worth of DLC for The Sims. That's like buying The Sims 10 times over.  They want that for SC.  They have stated many times that their future is big on micro-transactions and DLC.

 

By tying us down to their online servers and Origin, they have the chance to advertise the DLC and make it easy to get, and if it's easy to get, a lot of people will purchase it on a whim.  Because it's going through Origin, EA gets 100% of the revenue (and only like 66% through Amazon).

 

The problem is modding - will EA truly allow us the same level of modding we had with SC4?  I do not believe so, because it would have the potential to disrupt said DLC, and I doubt they'll allow us to modify too much in the way of game files.

 

The problem is that we have certain expectations as SC4 players that do not match with SC2013 and EA's stated goals.   

 

A lot of us, myself include, keep asking how EA could be so dumb in regards to certain decisions they made about SC2013, and yet ultimately it's not really "dumb" because a lot of those decisions are very deliberate, and had a specific purpose in mind that concerned SC's future.  

 

Arguably, we who are still playing SC4 here in 2013 are not SC2013's target audience either.  Their target audience doesn't care about modding, they'll happily drop money on all kinds of DLC, and they aren't concerned with city sizes or forced multiplayer/online, or the lack of backing up/saving cities offline.

 

 

I see where you're coming from and I agree that EA/Mixim initially envisioned SC2013 as a long-run journey where DLC content was meant to be their main income source. Problem is the final product is too simple and lackluster to guarantee enough longevity.

 

Firstly, SC2013 is not a simulator, you cannot apply city-simulation logic to this game and it lacks the features and functionality to be so. In essence, its design is closer to an arcade, casual MMO where the drag to play is focus on personal achievements and making money - no need to explain how alien is this concept to proper city simulation. Also, this design vision is contrary to city-simulation fans - in other words: SC all time fans -, as it's been made abundantly clear in these forums.

 

So, EA/Maxim have opted for a design that's completely alien to its traditional and loyal fans, the ones that've been playing SC4 for more than a decade. First BIG problem. But it's not the only one.

 

Thing is they pretended to make income on the long-run thanks to the "casual market". Problem here is that "long-run" and "casual" don't stick together. Casuals don't have commitment, neither are characterized for a long attention span: They are the kind of public that play the "Next-Big-Thing" for 2-3 months and then move on. Casuals are not bothered by simplistic designs and it's true that they are quite easy to hype up, BUT they are not loyal.

 

In conclusion: Maxim/EA have generated a perfect lose-lose scenario.

[number3737355 1]

SC4 > 2013

 

After what ea did to battlefield and seeing what was new with this game, i knew that it was going to be a flop. Still needs alot of work and after that i might consider a free trial.

[GenXisT 127]

Most of the people that were supportive and enjoy the game left because this place became an anti-simcity fan club.  

 

it's not an "anti-simcity fan club".  They called the game "Sim City."  there are expectations with such things.  Demands even.

If someone was meant to sell you a Ferrari, you'd expect a Ferrari, not something markedly less than that.

This game isn't  The Sims, its fan base isn't Sims players.  People keep on justifying this massive debacle to curb the ridicule that is rightly deserved by attempting to make a 25 year old game into something it was never going to be.

 

I don't think any of us would complain if Maxis said "you know what, we screwed this one up.  Please wait for the actual release of a real Sim City game in the coming future"

This game is NOT Sim City.  It's something other than.  A Yugo is NOT a Ferrari, no matter how you slice, dice and excuse.

 

I see where you're coming from and I agree that EA/Mixim initially envisioned SC2013 as a long-run journey where DLC content was meant to be their main income source. Problem is the final product is too simple and lackluster to guarantee enough longevity.

 

Firstly, SC2013 is not a simulator, you cannot apply city-simulation logic to this game and it lacks the features and functionality to be so. In essence, its design is closer to an arcade, casual MMO where the drag to play is focus on personal achievements and making money - no need to explain how alien is this concept to proper city simulation. Also, this design vision is contrary to city-simulation fans - in other words: SC all time fans -, as it's been made abundantly clear in these forums.

 

So, EA/Maxim have opted for a design that's completely alien to its traditional and loyal fans, the ones that've been playing SC4 for more than a decade. First BIG problem. But it's not the only one.

 

Thing is they pretended to make income on the long-run thanks to the "casual market". Problem here is that "long-run" and "casual" don't stick together. Casuals don't have commitment, neither are characterized for a long attention span: They are the kind of public that play the "Next-Big-Thing" for 2-3 months and then move on. Casuals are not bothered by simplistic designs and it's true that they are quite easy to hype up, BUT they are not loyal.

 

In conclusion: Maxim/EA have generated a perfect lose-lose scenario.

 

 

Excellent! +1

[Snugies 91]

free hand roads, traffic simulation, 3d visuals, agent simulation, specializations, additions to buildings, emergency service vehicles, always online so bugs get handled quicker, ...uh maybe uh GRAPHICS

Do I need to continue?

They will increase map size eventually people. the agent simulation is the base code they've built all new simcities will run off of this. As computers get faster(hopefully) we will obviously get larger maps.

SimCity 2013 is a great start to a new era of SimCity. So go out and buy more copies of the game so it is profitable for EA to build predecessors.

Instead of complaining all the time. Ya I even liked SimCity societies. if your a true SimCity fan you will like all versions of the game.

[The Avatar 1,089]

Haven't there already been half a million threads about this? Oh well, I'll throw in my two cents.

 

What I've experienced with the new SimCity thus far has given me mixed impressions, but overall, SC4 is still superior in my opinion. And this is why: SC'13 has the potential to be a good game - a true successor to SC4, but the problems with launch, small map size, and the fact that my computer crashes every single time I open my city, even after buying a new processor all leave a bad taste in my mouth after playing it for a while. At it's core, it doesn't feel like the simulation most of us wanted. It feels kind of like a child's toy, with the saturated graphics (yes, which can be made more realistic with filters), scaling of building size to map size, lack of transportation tools, the fact that you can make a rollercoaster with roads, etc. It just feels too different from SC4, which was fun to play and made even better with mods. All of this is not to say that it isn't fun to play. The simulation has become more dynamic, 3D graphics let us see our cities at any angle, the new specialization element adds a new level of depth to playing, and we finally have true curved roads - but all of this is the end seems to come with restrictions, which I guess is my point. Playing SC4 felt like painting on a canvas, while playing SC'13 feels like painting on a canvas when EA has given you a small canvas and only a few paintbrushes and colors. It's not bad, in fact the new gameplay elements have brought the franchise into the modern gaming world. This would all be great if the creators hadn't compromised some of the things we love about SimCity for a new consumer base in the process. The new SimCity still feels like a city simulator; it just needs more "city". For these reasons, I have to go with SC4. It's old, the simulation is static, as are the data layers, the graphics are outdated (but I still love 'em), etc., but I have many good memories building roads, zoning whatever density of zone I desire, planning expansive cities, all while listening to the great, memorable music and feeling like I was tinkering with a detailed miniature city. I don't get that same feeling with SC'13, and I have more memories of waiting hopelessly for my city to load than of actually playing the game. Thanks, EA.

[Cyclone Boom 17,031]

Basically, SimCity was an accumulation of poor design decisions, that could easily have been avoided. The high sales figures are misleading, as many sales were due to anticipation of a successor to SimCity 4. But as we know, it's a reboot, and the end result is far from being the ideal successor. In my opinion, SC4 will always be superior to this game, mainly because of the freedom it allows, and the ability to be greater customised to the player's requirements.

 

It's a great shame that a completely separate game has potentially tarnished the reputation of the series. For a person new to the series, whenever the name SimCity is mentioned, the bad aspects of this game will immediately spring to mind, not the positives from earlier games in the franchise.

 

Lasting impressions do count. So in my mind, unless these mistakes are learnt from, SC4 will always be the true city-building simulator.

[Numpty Dumpty 17]

Asking this question in a SC4 heavy community that would probably been unhappy with anything not SC4.5 is an exercise in pointlessness.

[cirugo 1,889]

Basically, SimCity was an accumulation of poor design decisions, that could easily have been avoided. The high sales figures are misleading, as many sales were due to anticipation of a successor to SimCity 4. But as we know, it's a reboot, and the end result is far from being the ideal successor. In my opinion, SC4 will always be superior to this game, mainly because of the freedom it allows, and the ability to be greater customised to the player's requirements.

 

It's a great shame that a completely separate game has potentially tarnished the reputation of the series. For a person new to the series, whenever the name SimCity is mentioned, the bad aspects of this game will immediately spring to mind, not the positives from earlier games in the franchise.

 

Lasting impressions do count. So in my mind, unless these mistakes are learnt from, SC4 will always be the true city-building simulator.

not only that but how many of those "sales" being counted are actually sitting on store or warehouse shelves unpurchased by end-users?  you know they count all those as well...

[cheeryO 0]

I'm basically a Sims 3 addict on hiatus, so definitely not cognizant of the more nuanced arguments pro or con, but from the way I understand things, EA removed the god tools.  To me, nothing is more boring than a city building game where I can't alter the terrain or grab an awesome new user-made map during my coffeebreak, so for me the argument ends right there.   But to make matters even worse,  no mods are possible if I'm understanding how that cloud server thing works.  No new buildings or props or textures, and no new hacks from players who actually play the game and respond to whatever is lacking.  Seriously, no god tools and no mods, EVER!!  For how long do people expect to be interested in playing the same ole terrain with no mods?   Get serious, seems like many players would be bored in a week, a month at most. 

Anyway, as someone who IS a Sims 3 addict on break, I was extremely shocked to learn that an online game like SimCity does not require a monthly subscription in order to offset the server costs of a very profit-driven company.  Because of that, and the boredom factor, I would expect EA to be rolling out a SimCity Store like they did for The Sims, where every little thing costs and costs and costs.  And if that's the case, players should be prepared to spend a $1,000 -- that's not a typo -- on Store items over the next few years in order to feel like they have a complete game.   And if their friends don't have the exact same Store items as they do, then they won't be able to play together (if someone had wanted that social aspect).

Ah, just realized this was the new SimCity forum.  Hope everyone enjoys their game!  Maybe it'll turn out to be better than I'm currently expecting. 

[Screwballl 196]

Now that time has passed and other people have had a chance to play with it and put the game to use... I still refuse to buy the new one. Sadly I am tired of all the current city games so I have been playing other games now.

[BravoGreenONE 120]

Now that time has passed and other people have had a chance to play with it and put the game to use... I still refuse to buy the new one. Sadly I am tired of all the current city games so I have been playing other games now.

Yeah sadly im with you on that one. Before I buy 2013 the map size has to increase AND the price has to drop.

Looking foward to Rome 2 by creative assembly. Those guys know how to make a game and the mods are usually rediculosly awesome. Its just too bad the simcity development is run by a bunch of clowns.

[Snorp09 5]

must of us here like sc4 more I guess sc4 win unless someone else want to say sc2013

[SweetSugarHigh 0]

Sim city 4 all the way!

[NBAFAN1 28]

Sim City is garbage, do not buy it.

[annlou 8]

Think I'll stick with SC4. The new game doesn't appeal to me at all.

[Ltw 401]

I think it is a little bit too soon to tell which one is better. Simcity 4 is much better at the moment. But this is all possible thanks to all the content that is offered at sites like Simtropolis. Simcity 2013 is a brand-new game, we could be judging this game already but the fact is that it is too soon. My honest opinion about Simcity 4 is that it wasn't very good at the beginning, a lot of bugs and not many different options in building style/infrastructure. This got a little bit better when Rush Hour was released. However the traffic-simulator was bugged and the UDI-mode is a mess. The game became extremely good when the NAM was released and other mods and lots were downloadable and implementable in Simcity 4. This was the moment that I really started playing it and really enjoyed building different cities with different styles and different problems to solve.

 

For as far as Simcity 2013 goes, I don't want to buy it today. Mainly because of the price but also because I think that games like these are good in combination with mods and other downloadable content. When the price dropped and there is more custom content available I will definitely buy it.

[rbro125 16]

Normally I don't troll around on the SC 2013 forum but it's a slow day at work.  I'm suprised that in this forum there isn't more peeps in support of the new game.  I could see all the negativity on the SC4 forum, but if this was a poll, I bet 95% of the peeps are for SC4.  I have not played the new game myself, because the computer I play on isn't hooked up to the internet so I couldn't play even if I wanted to.  But I have been playing SC4 for only about 6-7 months now and I have probably years to go before I get tired of it, or the cd wears out .  I only started used custom content just a few months ago and it's like a whole new game to me.  Even before the custom content I loved the game, it was even somewhat more challenging because without NAM it's not easy to find jobs for your little sims to work at, so I had a lot more NJZs than now.  When I get a NJZ now it's because I literally have no jobs for them.  Anyway, getting back to the subject at hand, IF they ever made the new SC playable on line and IF there was custom content for the game I would try it, but till then I'm sticking with SC4...

 

ME:

-->

With the massive amount of extra content provided on STEX for SC4 it would almost be silly to buy any new SimCity game at first anyways.... even without the new online only game-play. The STEX has given me a new-found love for the game and I knew the new game had A LOT to live up to. The problem is that Maxis seemingly ignored the fact that Not every gamer likes to or haS ACCESS to the internet at all times when playing. Also, they HAD to have known that SimTropolis is the primary reason SC4 was promoted to Legendary status... therefore they should have appealed to the target market.... the people STILL playing SC4!!!!   

 

I really think that Maxis believed this would be a bigger, better, faster and stronger Sim City. . . . but they seemed to have lost their roots a bit. I really believe they should have focused more on the realism in graphics while at the same time keeping the game-play commands similar  and familiar to an SC4 or SC 3000 player.

 

What do you think?

[rbro125 16]

Dear Maxis,

 

Your target market has Spoken.... We want a game that is NOT dependant on a server, whether it's relaible or not. We want a game that is able to be modded giving the user more control with the game, not the company. If we are going to buy your pricey game, we want say in how we play it. We want to be able to add our own buildings that we design. We want our custom stadiums. We want our many transit and road options. We want a game that was designed for us and not for a 6-10 year old who has never played a SimCity game in their life.

 

If you haven't noticed, the people who play your City games have gotten a litter older or at least more creative and specific on what we truly want. Please go back to the drawing board and give us something that WE as players can be proud of and intrigued by... not something that Your company can tout as the future yet as it's unwrapped reveals your lost vision and reason for the series.

[surfer_brett 2]

Dear Maxis,

 

Your target market has Spoken.... 

 

 

If you haven't noticed, the people who play your City games have gotten a litter older or at least more creative and specific on what we truly want.

 

 

The target market hasn't spoken.  The target market isn't the users of this forum.  The target market wasn't alive when SC2K came out, and probably never played SC4.  We're just loyal (or not) customers who add to sales.  The target market for SC2K through SC4 is shrinking; The SimCity brand won't survive if they market to us.

[CorpusDei 69]

Although I think SC4 is, by far the better game (especially with 10 years of community development behind it) ... I am going to stick my head over the parapet a little and say that SC2013 does have some nice features.

 

1: Curved roads - though this is mostly rectified by the NAM in SC4 the native implementation in SC2013 is fairly well done.

 

2: Modular buildings - often in the real world (well, the UK anyway) buildings aren't torn down and new ones put up but they evolve and expand over time; you end up with hospitals with a mix of Victorian red brick through to 60's concrete and beyond. OK, there's a lot more that could be done with it in SC2013 - but it is a nice idea.

 

3: More variety in some of the ploppable items, like a mix of Casinos, Trading Depots/Ports and so on ... all of which are modular.

 

4: Resources - OK, the water resource is pretty much BS, it seems to assume that it never rains in SCLand - but I quite like the Oil, Coal and Ore resources; it's just another way that you can evolve your city over time - look at the developments that happened in Dubai and those that were canned when the oil ran out.

 

 

The problem is, these are all largely periphery - for the core game, the SimCity aspect of it, SC4 is better in almost every way.

[Ltw 401]

 

Dear Maxis,

 

Your target market has Spoken.... 

 

 

If you haven't noticed, the people who play your City games have gotten a litter older or at least more creative and specific on what we truly want.

 

 

The target market hasn't spoken.  The target market isn't the users of this forum.  The target market wasn't alive when SC2K came out, and probably never played SC4.  We're just loyal (or not) customers who add to sales.  The target market for SC2K through SC4 is shrinking; The SimCity brand won't survive if they market to us.

 

 

 

The great thing about Simcity as a brand is the great variety it has. Hardcore players shouldn't be ignored, while the developer should also listen to the main audience. It should be a game with easy access for the casual gamer but also a game with limitless possibilities for the more experienced gamer. This is possible with the use of plugins and custom downloads and the possibilities are even bigger when you've got skills in 3dsmax. Plugins are relatively easy to implement in the game, the developer doesn't have to design the buildings, they have to take care of compatibility issues that might occur. But after that you've got a game that is sort of self-sustaining and guarantees sells for at least five years.

[sas12601 0]

Simcity 4 is better... Trust me.

I bought SC5 and it had soooooo many bugs and the city size is tiny...

[simcopops 37]

If the new simcity had bigger maps, more clever AI and more transport options it would win but right now it is sc4

[ghosty12 13]

(The below is just my opinion and just that..)

 

Something some will have to think about is this.. How many modern city sim type games since SC4 have there been not that many the only ones that I can think of are Cities XL / XL 2011, City Life / City Life 2008, the Tropico Series and Cities in Motion (sort of since it is more about transport than city building)..

 

Out of those as far as I know only Tropico and CIM did any good since Tropico got 4 iterations of the game.  As most would know Cities XL could have done well if the dev of the first one didn't stuff it with what they did, the dev for XL 2011 tried to save that game but well who knows.. And well City Life as far as I know just faded into obscurity..

 

As you can see from that small list there were not that many city building games made and even though to some SC2013 is what it is we are lucky to have any dev even think about making a city building game.. Since it is all about making money devs will go where the money is, and at the moment it is either MMO's, FPS's and so on..

 

So if you look around you probably wont be seeing many devs working on any city building games in the vein of SC4 as I doubt the market is there for them to warrant doing one, (especially with the reception SC2013 got, since what was done to the game didn't help it..)