NAM: Requests - 2nd Edition

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

There are times when you can overload a project and cause it to collapse.  Outré texture sets may really turn out to be the straw that breaks the camel's back.  To get yet more textures to satisfy local cravings for special appearances might well mean giving up something else.  Perhaps one texture set could be designated as sacrificial and a kit prepared to replace this set with a custom set of the designer with the work to be done by the designer.  The kit could consist of the list of things that need to be done, but little else.

[fefenc 77]

I know that everything here is just ploppable, but it would be awesome if Roads/Avenues had textures like this T_T

 

[Ganaram Inukshuk 906]

I know that everything here is just ploppable, but it would be awesome if Roads/Avenues had textures like this T_T

Oddly enough, the road markings there are unrealistically spaced. The MUTCD (Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices, the holy grail of realism) states that the lines should be at a minimum of 10 feet long and the gap between each line be 30 feet. Since we're dealing with SC4 tiles, it has to be modified to 4 meters to 12 meters, or if you want to conform to the original Maxis textures, (which also don't comply to the MUTCD's standards but comply to a more Maxis-esque standard), you'd need to have 4 meter lines and 4 meter gaps.

[Haljackey 17,302]

Those are plops were created by Heblem, who lives in Mexico. They might be based off where he lives or be his own creation.

[MandelSoft 2,769]

There are times when you can overload a project and cause it to collapse.  Outré texture sets may really turn out to be the straw that breaks the camel's back.  To get yet more textures to satisfy local cravings for special appearances might well mean giving up something else.  Perhaps one texture set could be designated as sacrificial and a kit prepared to replace this set with a custom set of the designer with the work to be done by the designer.  The kit could consist of the list of things that need to be done, but little else.

There's always the Road Texture Database, available for everyone who wants to take a look at the standard textures and trying to make their own version of it.

Believe me, I've done some efforts to But so far, it hasn't been very fruitful. And if there's someone who wants to get some workload off his back, it's me. I'm currently responsible for 90% alternative texture sets in the NAM, and that's quite a burden to carry.

I haven't spared my efforts. The problem is that other people are not willing to pick up the job and persistently work on it until it's done. Persistence is what's lacking here, and that's why probably my efforts to set up a team working on such a project has failed...

I'm getting annoyed by the people who are requesting a lot of things from us (or practically only me, since I'm about the only one who does alternative textures) while not even spending any effort in realising their requests themselves. I've learned in this community that the quickest way to get some new content is to realise it yourself when you have gathered the knowledge you need. More people should consider this mindset. It would benefit the community so much!

So again, I ask people not to hesitate when trying to make alternative texture sets, we encourage that and we're always there to help you out. It may prevent us from being overloaded by requests we just can't realise in time. But don't complain that your requests will not be granted if you didn't even lifted a finger to realise your request...

Best,

Maarten

[APSMS 1,892]

There are a few things that complicate the development of a concrete texture set, or any other texture set including a different base colour.

 

- What filters to use and how to use them consistently?

- What to do with wealth texturing?

- What to do with cross-linkage, where a RHW network transitions or intesects with a non-RHW network? Especially rail crossings are a pain...

 

Remember, if you want to turn the entire RHW into a concrete network, we're talking about 5000 textures excluding MipMaps (which can be generated)...

 

Yeah, I'm aware of the scope, which is why I've refrained from actually requesting it.

 

But, interestingly, I wasn't planning on converting any of the at-grade networks, save for their elevated textures (or not, depending). Since I have no idea about creating new textures, I don't think I'll be done anytime soon (I have no idea how to get them in-game. Overriding the .dat files didn't seem to work, though I may not have done everything correctly; I'll probably have to open a thread.)

 

Samerton, those look great! though I'd have left the shoulders asphalt; I find it very rare to see concrete shoulders on concrete freeways, even on overpasses. And I live in the concrete freeway capital (probably). (CA, USA)

 

Also, what is the question of wealth texturing? wouldn't the default underlays work?

[Ganaram Inukshuk 906]

Also, what is the question of wealth texturing? wouldn't the default underlays work?

The only underlay to speak of is actually sidewalks. Most transit tiles that support wealthification actually have about 20 textures (5 zoom levels times 4 wealth levels), but RHW will have as much as 35 textures per tile (5 zoom levels times 7 wealth levels). RHW needs a lot of wealth textures to keep the sidewalks from showing. It gets complicated when you deal with a network that does have sidewalks. Per network, only about one texture is needed per wealth level, since the other four mipmaps can be generated by the tools we have, but if it has sidewalks, an extra "alpha" texture is needed to create the transparencies (think cookie cutters) needed for the sidewalks to show.

Sidewalks are independent of wealth grass and are also independent of the textures in question, but always show whenever something is zoned along a network tile that supports wealthification. Wealth grass is also independent of sidewalks but are literally embedded with the texture. Both follow a predictable pattern of wealth.

I hate to show this considering that I would end up being bombarded with requests (and that I tried this many times before but was too OCD over the fine details), but this is what it would look like for an RHW network without crossings:

And the aforementioned alphas:

Wealth IDs are referenced using the seventh digit: 0 for no wealth, with 1 to 3 for low to high wealth for low density, 4-6 for low to high wealth for high density, and 7 for farms. 0 will take over for wealth digits 4-7 if textures for those don't exist (which is the case with non-RHW networks).

[Samerton 833]

Samerton, those look great! though I'd have left the shoulders asphalt; I find it very rare to see concrete shoulders on concrete freeways, even on overpasses. And I live in the concrete freeway capital (probably). (CA, USA)

 

I've quickly added an asphalt shoulder, is this something you'd see more often? We don't have too many concrete roads here in the UK, so I don't have too much to go off..

[Durfsurn 539]

That actually seems kinda off to me. How does it compare to Tarkus's set that he was making?

[APSMS 1,892]

Interestingly, I can't stand the wealthification textures for RHW. Grass isn't really planted by the side of the highway in CA (but I'm sure you knew that), so I had thought that the wealth textures were an in-game limitation of the texture-based networks, not a consequence of the texture modding by the choice of the designer.

 

Theoretically, then, it would be possible to use the same texture (sans wealth base) for all of the Wealth IDs, and have no grass show up next to zones near RHW? Because that would solve that problem right away (for me, anyways). At any rate, I don't see why you couldn't just use the wealth textures already present and set them up behind the created texture, though of course this is more work and time to set everything up.

 

Samerton, those look great! though I'd have left the shoulders asphalt; I find it very rare to see concrete shoulders on concrete freeways, even on overpasses. And I live in the concrete freeway capital (probably). (CA, USA)

 

I've quickly added an asphalt shoulder, is this something you'd see more often? We don't have too many concrete roads here in the UK, so I don't have too much to go off..

<snip>

I'd say the asphalt needs to be darker, but otherwise that's about the tone of things. Of course, Google Maps over California (LA area is what I'm used to, so I'm slightly biased, but it's harder to find a higher concentration of concrete freeways) is a good place to look for references.

[MandelSoft 2,769]

Interestingly, I can't stand the wealthification textures for RHW. Grass isn't really planted by the side of the highway in CA (but I'm sure you knew that), so I had thought that the wealth textures were an in-game limitation of the texture-based networks, not a consequence of the texture modding by the choice of the designer.

 

Theoretically, then, it would be possible to use the same texture (sans wealth base) for all of the Wealth IDs, and have no grass show up next to zones near RHW? Because that would solve that problem right away (for me, anyways). At any rate, I don't see why you couldn't just use the wealth textures already present and set them up behind the created texture, though of course this is more work and time to set everything up.

Unfortunately, it's not that simple. If you leave out wealth texturing, this happens:

That's not pretty either. Basically, what wealth texturing does is eliminating the sidewalks to appear. It's a necessary evil in that way...

There is however another way: converting ALL textures into models, remove all textures ending with 0-4 and convert them to puzzle piece darkened textures in the A-E range. But you may get the idea that this would be a daunting task, but not impossible (I've applied it once or twice in NORO only with the main draggable parts of the RHW). Furthermore, the preview textures while dragging would cease to work, making the RHW less user-friendly.

Best,

Maarten

[Ganaram Inukshuk 906]

There is, if I may add, another way to get rid of sidewalks, for those who also hate sidewalks and wealth grass: Get rid of sidewalks. But (yes, it's gonna get complicated fast), every other network that isn't RHW will all lose their sidewalks. As I said, sidewalks are independent of wealth grass, but they're really easy to modify.

The only way to work around that is to not only modify the RHW textures such that no instances of grass exist, but to modify every other network texture such that they not only retain their grass, but also have their sidewalks. This makes it extremely complicated to create or install any sort of custom sidewalk texture, because instead of changing just three textures to change sidewalks, you have to change thousands.

Having wealth grass on the RHW is the only feasible and comfortable option there is without having to usurp anything that isn't RHW. It'd be like trying to dismantle a boat and reassembling it into a rocket ship just so you can use a microwave oven.

[Gurning_Chimp 398]

You know what's missing? A RHW-2 D1 Ramp that can be used as a T-Ramp. The current one faces outwards, I'm interested in one that faces TOWARDS the highway.

 

Seriously, there is no way to make a T-junction when making ramps with normal roads. Particularly if the road is elevated.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

 

There are times when you can overload a project and cause it to collapse.  Outré texture sets may really turn out to be the straw that breaks the camel's back.  To get yet more textures to satisfy local cravings for special appearances might well mean giving up something else.  Perhaps one texture set could be designated as sacrificial and a kit prepared to replace this set with a custom set of the designer with the work to be done by the designer.  The kit could consist of the list of things that need to be done, but little else.

There's always the Road Texture Database, available for everyone who wants to take a look at the standard textures and trying to make their own version of it.

Believe me, I've done some efforts to But so far, it hasn't been very fruitful. And if there's someone who wants to get some workload off his back, it's me. I'm currently responsible for 90% alternative texture sets in the NAM, and that's quite a burden to carry.

I haven't spared my efforts. The problem is that other people are not willing to pick up the job and persistently work on it until it's done. Persistence is what's lacking here, and that's why probably my efforts to set up a team working on such a project has failed...

I'm getting annoyed by the people who are requesting a lot of things from us (or practically only me, since I'm about the only one who does alternative textures) while not even spending any effort in realising their requests themselves. I've learned in this community that the quickest way to get some new content is to realise it yourself when you have gathered the knowledge you need. More people should consider this mindset. It would benefit the community so much!

So again, I ask people not to hesitate when trying to make alternative texture sets, we encourage that and we're always there to help you out. It may prevent us from being overloaded by requests we just can't realise in time. But don't complain that your requests will not be granted if you didn't even lifted a finger to realise your request...

Best,

Maarten

 

Well, Maarten, it was my intention to take some of the superfluous and frivolous load off of you.  I am sorry I can't join your effort, but retired is retired and I can't guarantee that I will be around at any given time.  If people want all these new or different things they need to be more conscious of their real need.

 

I hope everyone is aware of the kind of work that goes into the stuff produced by the NAM team.  The pay for it doubles annually, so if you want to get involved, I am sure Maarten would be more than happy to shift some of his burden on to your capable shoulders.  If you feel qualified to take this on, I add my voice to his and ask that you step up to the bar.

 

Kindest regards,

John.

[Pioneer 140]

 

Samerton, those look great! though I'd have left the shoulders asphalt; I find it very rare to see concrete shoulders on concrete freeways, even on overpasses. And I live in the concrete freeway capital (probably). (CA, USA)

 

I've quickly added an asphalt shoulder, is this something you'd see more often? We don't have too many concrete roads here in the UK, so I don't have too much to go off..

 

These might help you out:

http://goo.gl/maps/QogcV

http://goo.gl/maps/aJZIB

http://goo.gl/maps/L57px

http://goo.gl/maps/b6BzQ

http://goo.gl/maps/mNRp8

[Indiana Joe 1,750]

I like what you're doing so far Samerton.  The RHW definitely needs a concrete/light asphalt texture set.  I've been playing with photorealistic textures recently.

 

They are nice and realistic, but they do come off as very two-dimensional.  I think Bipin remains the king of concrete and asphalt textures.

 

[Ganaram Inukshuk 906]

They are nice and realistic, but they do come off as very two-dimensional.  I think Bipin remains the king of concrete and asphalt textures.

Considering that you're dealing with 128x128 textures, you're gonna have to sacrifice a lot of detail if you wish to implement textures the easiest way possible. I've tried with reflectors and rumble strips in the past, but when you're dealing with how the RHW diagonals work, you'll run into plenty of tessellation issues.

[MaxCheng95 5]

If memory serves, there was once an old version of traffic simulator config tool that can adjust the minimum and maximum length of railroad trains, el trains, and monorail trains back in 2007, I believe. If it's possible, can we incorporate this into future version of the config tool?

[z1 566]

It's possible.  It all comes down to a question of manpower.

[Lost Realist 762]

Sooooo... there's a really good chance that this is absolutely uninteresting to you guys and far from being anything close to a concern, but it's been bothering me for a while now that the default OWR-Roundabout filler you get when you put a road tile into it is that little fountain. When I'm using the road tile in the center of the roundabout I do so because I don't want a sidewalk around it and that exclusively happens when the roundabout is out of town and, say, used in a dumbbell or something similar where the sidewalk makes little to no sense. It's awesome that the option to plop a road tile in and not wealthify the roundabout exists, but the fountain looks really weird in the middle of a forest or whatever.

Maybe I'm the only one this really matters to, if so, screw it, I didn't say anything. ;D But I just find it would be nice if that filler weren't an artsy fountain and maybe just a dirt mound, some bushes, something that fits into an area where there is no other development around.

Again, if this is a stupid request and too unimportant I can totally understand that and I will learn to live with the way it is.

 

 

And another thing in the same vein would be a way to make stoplights at RoadxRoad crossings optional in some way. Rural crossings can only be done with RHW-2 as a workaround because roads will always get traffic lights and turning lanes are also impossible. Just some way to make turning lanes without sidewalks and stoplights so they'd fit in rural settings would be great.

[Pelipper 7]

I'd like to see GLR puzzle pieces for roads or streets that meet the end of an avenue, like this:

[Kuewr665 40]

I am not exactly sure of what you are asking. You mean Tram-Road pieces that meet Tram-Avenue? Those are already part of the Tram-Road pieces.

[Omehenk 9]

Sooooo... there's a really good chance that this is absolutely uninteresting to you guys and far from being anything close to a concern, but it's been bothering me for a while now that the default OWR-Roundabout filler you get when you put a road tile into it is that little fountain. When I'm using the road tile in the center of the roundabout I do so because I don't want a sidewalk around it and that exclusively happens when the roundabout is out of town and, say, used in a dumbbell or something similar where the sidewalk makes little to no sense. It's awesome that the option to plop a road tile in and not wealthify the roundabout exists, but the fountain looks really weird in the middle of a forest or whatever.

Maybe I'm the only one this really matters to, if so, screw it, I didn't say anything. ;D But I just find it would be nice if that filler weren't an artsy fountain and maybe just a dirt mound, some bushes, something that fits into an area where there is no other development around.

Again, if this is a stupid request and too unimportant I can totally understand that and I will learn to live with the way it is.

 

 

And another thing in the same vein would be a way to make stoplights at RoadxRoad crossings optional in some way. Rural crossings can only be done with RHW-2 as a workaround because roads will always get traffic lights and turning lanes are also impossible. Just some way to make turning lanes without sidewalks and stoplights so they'd fit in rural settings would be great.

 

Agree on your 2nd point. Although if you really want stoplightless crossings, i'm sure you get them without plugins and rh;)

[Xyloxadoria 1,099]

Is there a Dual OWR-2 to OWR-4 tranisition. I saw it in the NWM thread ages ago and never knew if it came to fruition or not 

If a  dual two lane to four lane transition was around for RHW, i could use that too, Im just looking for some kind of Dual 2 to 4 transition.

[Kuewr665 40]

Yes for both: for the one way roads you drag parallel OWR-2 onto an end of the OWR-4, but do not connect them. There is also the RHW-8 A2 ramp.

[Indiana Joe 1,750]

And another thing in the same vein would be a way to make stoplights at RoadxRoad crossings optional in some way. Rural crossings can only be done with RHW-2 as a workaround because roads will always get traffic lights and turning lanes are also impossible. Just some way to make turning lanes without sidewalks and stoplights so they'd fit in rural settings would be great.

 

The Rural Roads Plugin (an optional NAM component) comes with ploppable intersections that don't have stoplights.

 

TuLEPs will always use stoplights at road x road intersections, which is realistic.  If you use some NWM trickery to get street x road TuLEPs, those won't have stoplights.

[Lost Realist 762]

 

And another thing in the same vein would be a way to make stoplights at RoadxRoad crossings optional in some way. Rural crossings can only be done with RHW-2 as a workaround because roads will always get traffic lights and turning lanes are also impossible. Just some way to make turning lanes without sidewalks and stoplights so they'd fit in rural settings would be great.

 

The Rural Roads Plugin (an optional NAM component) comes with ploppable intersections that don't have stoplights.

 

TuLEPs will always use stoplights at road x road intersections, which is realistic.  If you use some NWM trickery to get street x road TuLEPs, those won't have stoplights.

 

 

I must have missed the ploppable intersections in the rural roads plugin, thanks for the info.

I guess it's understandable that TuLEPs are designed to be fit for urban settings only, it still is quite a loss to me though to not be able to create larger intersections in rural areas without sidewalks and lights. It doesn't have to be TuLEPs anyway, cosmetic pieces for ARHW-3 that give you left turn arrows on the inside lane would absolutely do the job as well although the transitions and the intersection behaviour are really weird with that network sometimes and I don't think it's possible to create something that comes close to what a TuLEP-intersection would look like, but it'd be a classic "nice to have".

[MandelSoft 2,769]

Maybe these new RHW-3 cosmetic pieces will be interesting to you:

Best,

MandelSoft

[UndercoverNinja12 176]

Nice job MandelSoft! For a new driver like me that's just about the easiest intersection to have.

[Lost Realist 762]

Maybe these new RHW-3 cosmetic pieces will be interesting to you:

Best,

MandelSoft

 

They certainly are, that's exactly what I was thinking of, good news. (: