Discussion about City Tile Size

[SoftcoreGamer 352]

Shuddering stuff indeed... Even in faux-3D SC4's region view looked and felt far superior, simply because the tiles were seamless and contiguous, and connections and terraforming were allowed. At least then we had tile size OPTION, region size OPTION, and tile cutting OPTION.

Maxis was right to label these so-called city plots "towns" earlier. I also agree with other users who said it doesn't even qualify as a typical realistic town. Putting skyscrapers and huge stadiums on a town-size tile just makes it look even faker.

Pinewood Mesa with towers sprouting among low-rise flat land is like town-planning gone wrong from corrupt city hall. Bramble Overlook with half a map unbuildable and uneditable looks even more absurd.

Here's another pic without towers to indicate how the fixed-size tile barely qualify as a town. See the town border as indicated by white dotted lines...

[Frode789 70]

I will max out that tile in a matter of days, and I don't like making tight grid cities. I want it spaced out. And if you are unlucky enough to have a river/mountain in your tile?

[MegaCitySim 68]

Man, this is....devolution. There are no towns, just mini suburbs with weird nothingness in between. How to build a two train station network inside that guitar town? What is the point anyway there's not enough distance to justify train network?

What kind of bridges are allowed, I mean, how to justify a proper suspension bridge inside that? The only kind of bridges possible inside that guitar town is sims3 mini cartoon bridges...

I understand they are appealing to cityville players with the manageable small size, but what is the reason to prohibit expert city simmers from having map and tile options?

[Skyrunner27 23]

Shuddering stuff indeed... Even in faux-3D SC4's region view looked and felt far superior, simply because the tiles were seamless and contiguous, and connections and terraforming were allowed. At least then we had tile size OPTION, region size OPTION, and tile cutting OPTION.

Maxis was right to label these so-called city plots "towns" earlier. I also agree with other users who said it doesn't even qualify as a typical realistic town. Putting skyscrapers and huge stadiums on a town-size tile just makes it look even faker.

Pinewood Mesa with towers sprouting among low-rise flat land is like town-planning gone wrong from corrupt city hall. Bramble Overlook with half a map unbuildable and uneditable looks even more absurd.

Here's another pic without towers to indicate how the fixed-size tile barely qualify as a town. See the town border as indicated by white dotted lines...

Where is that image from? Not to sound mean or anything but I think we have seen larger cities.

Sorry I saw the vid now.

[Bookitty 63]

http://www.simcity.c...ional-airport

You have to be signed up.

Next to last Paragraph!

You’re going to need something to help get them in and around. Those highways are looking pretty crowded already. And your attractions have gotten awfully crowded. You’re going to need a much bigger city…

[glazert 89]

A "bigger city" is ambiguous. It could mean a larger tile size - in which case why is that not made explicit? Or it could mean a city with a bigger population. Giving out ambigous "information", does not clarify anything.

[Exe19 22]

I don't believe that cities will expand horizontally. I think "bigger" means "bigger vertically" = higher population density.

[kwetzel345 101]

I would have to agree with everyone else here as well. I could not see them adding the ability to expand horizontally, like making the tile larger, but rather expand vertically. Like building out on any of the little bit of room you have left on your tile and using skyscrapers to "expand" your city size. Mainly by population That my thought, but it sure would be nice if I was wrong. I don't think that is the case tho.

[DestructionPancake 25]

New video from Amazon.com confirming projected map size, relative distance of so-called cities from each other, the looks and feel of the "region" view, and the implication of preset highway/freeway connections between so-called cities.

http://www.amazon.co...ocId=1000856141

That is absolutely ghastly!

If that's the type of regional map we can expect for the life of this game then, sad to say, count me out.

[Bookitty 63]

I don't believe that cities will expand horizontally. I think "bigger" means "bigger vertically" = higher population density.

A "bigger city" is ambiguous. It could mean a larger tile size - in which case why is that not made explicit? Or it could mean a city with a bigger population. Giving out ambigous "information", does not clarify anything.

And it's "ambiguous" to say it's population density (No offensive to anyone). I guess why I bring it up because... If your roads and highways are crowded, the airport is over capacity, where else are you going to expand? It's interesting he calls one item an attraction, when I think of something like that, Stadiums and casinos come to mind. If there "full", like what the article says, How would you build more to support the tourists, one way is out and not up.

They may be doing stages like Spore.

Your city travels through different stages of growth, with new challenges and opportunities for expansions at each stage. Maybe there are such large open spaces between the cities to make room for borderline expansion in each stage of growth?

It "might" be possible?

I would have to agree with everyone else here as well. I could not see them adding the ability to expand horizontally,

The Glassbox engine makes this game almost freeform; I wouldn't see why not tiles could be curved in some areas.

Now, it's not a tile anymore, but a free forming boarder line.

[Ocram's Razr 964]

Well, Glass BOX only allows for BOX shaped simulation areas. Therefore, cities with curved borders would have wasted space. Once I found out that all cities were 2x2 km in size and were separated by wasted space, I knew that all news after that would be good by comparison. I held out hope for a while because the Glass Box engine theoretically allows for "BOXES" of any arbitrary size if what those early demo videos were in the least bit accurate/trustworthy/truthful, which I believe are.

--Ocram

[Bookitty 63]

The Glassbox engine makes this game almost freeform; I wouldn't see why not tiles could be curved in some areas.

Now, it's not a tile anymore, but a free forming boarder line.

Glassbox engine may allow any shape imaginable. It allows curved roads in any direction you want, bridges can be stack on top of each other. Good for future modding capabilities.

Another interesting quote...

Large jumbo jets will bring in bellyfuls and bellyfuls of tourists. Far more tourists then your (formerly) small city can handle.

I wonder what he means by “formerly”. Also, If it was population density, how would it fix highway and airport congestion?

http://www.simcity.com/en_US/insider/blog/article/how-it-works-%28great%29-international-airport%20%20

[Netuno 97]

Well, Glass BOX only allows for BOX shaped simulation areas. Therefore, cities with curved borders would have wasted space. Once I found out that all cities were 2x2 km in size and were separated by wasted space, I knew that all news after that would be good by comparison. I held out hope for a while because the Glass Box engine theoretically allows for "BOXES" of any arbitrary size if what those early demo videos were in the least bit accurate/trustworthy/truthful, which I believe are.

--Ocram

The video clearly shows that there is an empty space between the cities that can't be tweaked and/or edited.

[Mizari 23]

Well, Glass BOX only allows for BOX shaped simulation areas. Therefore, cities with curved borders would have wasted space. Once I found out that all cities were 2x2 km in size and were separated by wasted space, I knew that all news after that would be good by comparison. I held out hope for a while because the Glass Box engine theoretically allows for "BOXES" of any arbitrary size if what those early demo videos were in the least bit accurate/trustworthy/truthful, which I believe are.

--Ocram

The video clearly shows that there is an empty space between the cities that can't be tweaked and/or edited.

Which has nothing to do with the simulation engine itself necessarily, but rather with the necessities for even borders as relates to multi-player.

[Dijego 66]

I feel like I am in some kind of horror future where game developers don't care about the quality of the games they create anymore and just release games founded on the success of the original game developers. I mean some limitations force more creativity, but there are limits to that too. A small canvas results in small paintings and since we're not all Leonardo Da Vince, I guess we won't be getting many masterpieces. Especially when you're painting is surrounded by some awkward void of wasted space.

I still believe they forgot that they are competing with SimCity 4... Currently available for like $5 dollars or something.. I mean $60 (I expect this) for a small canvas or $5 dollars for a really large one without voids and terraforming? + That I already bought SimCity 4.. so for me it's $0 against whatever this new thing will cost. They'll have to compensate whatever it costs more than $0 with better gameplay.

These kind of map sizes make me sad.

[CXLMachine 17]

I hope theyre just holding off on telling us what theyre really going to do about these tile sizes. They also really have to dump the terrains they have shown us as no city would really be built on or within that horrifying canyon of a landscape. CXL gave us some really crappy maps to build cities on. I wouldnt build a city on a crater, it isnt "cool" as they claim. Its crazy stupid. I have high hope for this game still. just hurry up and get it released with connected town tiles. In our own region we can lay our own connecting roads throughout the tiles while in a shared region they are already placed. Or we can edit our own region and then decide to share it. It can be done right, its just a question on if they will actually do it that way...

[Urban Cartographer 601]

I must agree. We all are living in that horror future. Look at what happened to a certain video game that made $500M on its first day (and similar figures were made by earlier games in that series each year as well). It is an unfortunate fact of life that sales > quality for many video game developers. SimCity will not be an exception (except with more modest sales figures).

Yes, I want larger city sizes as well. Much larger. I also want large-scale terraforming as well.

[DestructionPancake 25]

Thank you, this post helped me to understand what the actual intention of this game may be.

But I'll say this, while specialization can be fun, real cities largely do not work that way. Certainly, when you get out into rural areas you may have towns that are dominated by a single industry, mining, logging, oil or whatever. But this only happens in very small towns in the middle of nowhere.

In large cities, which is where most people live and what most people can relate to, there will be a tourism industry, a manufacturing industry, commercial industry, shipping industry and so on and so forth. All these things are present in varying degrees in the metropolitan area. So it's natural that people try to approximate this in a game that is nominally about building a "city."

I understand no game could have a 1:1 scale for something like that, but it just seems like we've lost capability from SC4.

[SoftcoreGamer 352]

I feel like I am in some kind of horror future where game developers don't care about the quality of the games they create anymore and just release games founded on the success of the original game developers. I mean some limitations force more creativity, but there are limits to that too. A small canvas results in small paintings and since we're not all Leonardo Da Vince, I guess we won't be getting many masterpieces. Especially when you're painting is surrounded by some awkward void of wasted space.

This canvas analogy keeps coming back again and again, but of course. Anyone who'd played any version of SimCity knows it's a first and foremost a SANDBOX game.

We are already watching the horror trailers showing how a sandbox CITY simulation is - one feature at a time - being turned into a mini "do it right disaster god won't destroy your mini TOWNs" preset mission game in the veins of CityVille with all external transport connections pre-positioned on the map by the game.

No matter how detailed the car and sim simulation, I will not care about a god game no more, nor will I invest my time in a CITY simulation game with NO MAP EDITOR. They need to rethink their region level design, and make it a SC4 God Mode equivalent as a pure sandbox complete with plot size cutting option and terraform, which will overcome all upsets mentioned in this topic.

I still believe they forgot that they are competing with SimCity 4...

These kind of map sizes make me sad.

Indeed. They are probably pitting SC13 head on against CityVille, or decided it is too challenging to compete with SC4 + customization + generous communities. I have been detached for a month since I figured out why almost every new feature they announced is anti legacy SimCity traits - ESPECIALLY MAP DESIGN. So my reaction to another new rude shock is more amusement.

[jdenm8 362]

I remember them saying they didn't want to evoke feelings of every city ending up like New York... Then why do these new Screenshots remind me of Tycoon City: New York?

Onto tiles... That's... Eh... Your Standard RHW Interchange would take up a quarter of it very easily.

[MegaCitySim 68]

I hope theyre just holding off on telling us what theyre really going to do about these tile sizes. They also really have to dump the terrains they have shown us as no city would really be built on or within that horrifying canyon of a landscape. CXL gave us some really crappy maps to build cities on.

I had issues with cxl giving us prefab maps with limited resource allocations too, until mods and custom map came on the scene. But this is far far worse! Prefab maps with pre-baked resources and on top of that prefab suburbs in fixed spots, with fixed regional network laid out for you. Seriously, what kind of prefab city sim is this?

[Machinimator 40]

Shuddering stuff indeed... Even in faux-3D SC4's region view looked and felt far superior, simply because the tiles were seamless and contiguous, and connections and terraforming were allowed. At least then we had tile size OPTION, region size OPTION, and tile cutting OPTION.

Maxis was right to label these so-called city plots "towns" earlier. I also agree with other users who said it doesn't even qualify as a typical realistic town. Putting skyscrapers and huge stadiums on a town-size tile just makes it look even faker.

Pinewood Mesa with towers sprouting among low-rise flat land is like town-planning gone wrong from corrupt city hall. Bramble Overlook with half a map unbuildable and uneditable looks even more absurd.

Here's another pic without towers to indicate how the fixed-size tile barely qualify as a town. See the town border as indicated by white dotted lines...

You have got to be kidding me. That is not a town! I can't even fit a sports complex in that little tile!

What makes them think core fans will accept THIS?

[Bookitty 63]

You have got to be kidding me. That is not a town! I can't even fit a sports complex in that little tile!

What makes them think core fans will accept THIS?

The giant circular building in the upper right corner "is" the sports complex.

And for me (a so called core fan), Tile size won't be a problem.

They may be doing stages like Spore. Your city travels through different stages of growth, with new challenges and opportunities for expansions at each stage. Maybe there are such large open spaces between the cities to make room for borderline expansion in each stage of growth?

[jdenm8 362]

They may be doing stages like Spore.

Here's my problem with that... A lot of people called a lot of those stages Boring.

Also, another guitar city??? And that looks to be largely on a 45° angle...

If you really want a crappy city that looks like a guitar, you'll be able to do it painlessly with the next NAM. The things we're doing with it and the things we've made to make certain things easier is just amazing and a real joy to use.

[Screwballl 196]

The city size itself is not the problem... the problem is that cities are all spaced out so it is no longer "city borders another city"... This wasn't that big of a problem in CXL with 10x10km city sizes... but 2x2 with spaced cities... just asinine to me.

This video shows it nicely (around 1:25 and just how small each city size is around 1:36)...

http://www.amazon.co...ocId=1000856141

It is just the whole combination of factors that is making us long time hardcore SC fans shy away from this game.... Their videos show we get 5 or 6 high rises before the edge of the map... just way too small....

[Dijego 66]

I somewhat agree, I have never filled a complete region of SC4, which is a good thing I'd say. (Means I had enough space to work with) So basically if the region/city system was the same as in SC4, I'd be more than happy on that aspect of the game.

I actually believe it is smarter with the new glassbox simulation engine that represents things on a 1:1 scale. It is just less appealing because some good parts were replaced by lesser parts or parts were just left out. I do really doubt I can release my creative me on a small 'canvas' like the current one they are providing, especially when there is already something painted on there.

[Bookitty 63]

Here's my problem with that... A lot of people called a lot of those stages Boring.

You don't need to get "smart", if you know what I mean?

But SimCity would be growth stages, different than those from spore. I didn't say to have a direct copy, but something influenced by it. All the developers have already said Spore was an inspiration for this game. So, it wouldn't be a bad idea to think some parts of this game are Spore inspired. That's why I compare the two, Almost every Sim game Maxis has made are all in this one game.

I don't want to sound like speculation, but I'm just trying to “interpret” what information we have seen.

[The_City_Builder 299]

Shuddering stuff indeed... Even in faux-3D SC4's region view looked and felt far superior, simply because the tiles were seamless and contiguous, and connections and terraforming were allowed. At least then we had tile size OPTION, region size OPTION, and tile cutting OPTION.

Maxis was right to label these so-called city plots "towns" earlier. I also agree with other users who said it doesn't even qualify as a typical realistic town. Putting skyscrapers and huge stadiums on a town-size tile just makes it look even faker.

Pinewood Mesa with towers sprouting among low-rise flat land is like town-planning gone wrong from corrupt city hall. Bramble Overlook with half a map unbuildable and uneditable looks even more absurd.

Here's another pic without towers to indicate how the fixed-size tile barely qualify as a town. See the town border as indicated by white dotted lines...

That awkward moment when you realize that a Sims 3 map tile is larger then that.

Meh. I don't really care about tile size as long as I can create a living and breathing (virtual, of course) community, which I can. I love the simulation aspect of city-building games more then sheer size, and Glassbox is going to make that happen.

It would be nice if EA added a FREE (Yes EA, FREE ) update or DLC that added larger tile sizes, but who knows.

[CXLMachine 17]

I hope theyre just holding off on telling us what theyre really going to do about these tile sizes. They also really have to dump the terrains they have shown us as no city would really be built on or within that horrifying canyon of a landscape. CXL gave us some really crappy maps to build cities on.

I had issues with cxl giving us prefab maps with limited resource allocations too, until mods and custom map came on the scene. But this is far far worse! Prefab maps with pre-baked resources and on top of that prefab suburbs in fixed spots, with fixed regional network laid out for you. Seriously, what kind of prefab city sim is this?

What got me twisted up were the crater maps and mountain maps where the mountain was the centerpiece....Where is the city supposed to be?

[nathanthemayor 1,263]

IMO I kind of like the size they made it. If it was larger, the game could be a little slower even for powerful computers, but maybe if we wait until the game is modable, then maybe we might get larger cities....