Let's write our own SC4 Building Styles

[Null 45 3,064]

20 minutes ago, TheMurderousCricket said:

Isn't it done through UI editor?

That is what I use, but it may also be possible to use the newer versions of the Reader.

[TheMurderousCricket 5,061]

Oh, okay, I get your point now. 

[matias93 7,535]

5 hours ago, Ulisse Wolf said:

There are many ideas here but I think we should start skimming all the ideas to get the 16 basic styles

So I made a second draft based on the geographical location and the history of the architecture

0x00002000 - Neoclassical (Chicago 1890)

0x00002001 - Art Deco (New York 1940)

0x00002002 - Postmodern (Houston 1990)

0x00002003 - European Contemporary (Euro-Contemporany)

0x00002004 - Mediterranean

0x00002005 - Art Nouveau

0x00002006 - Eastern Europe

0x00002007 - North Europe

0x00002008 - Middle East & Africa

0x00002009 - European W2W

0x0000200A - American W2W

0x0000200B - American Contemporany

0x0000200C - Tropical

0x0000200D - East Asia 

0x0000200E - East Asia Contemporary

0x0000200F - Futuristic

Probably 2002 should be Modern and 2003 Postmodern, to have those two categories (which probably include most of the custom buildings we have) in separate styles.

I'm with Girafarig on bundling Mediterranean and Middle Eastern in one style, seeing as they are both historically and environmentally very related, and probably the same applies to Northern and Eastern European styles, specially if everything from the socialist period is taken by the Modern (including Brutalist and pre-fabs) and Neoclassical (including Stalinist) styles. The only things that could be excepted from it would be very stylistically divergent buildings like Constructivist early soviet buildings or the works of the elder Saarinen, which still could be clumped into the Art Deco tileset.

I suspect, though, that we could advance this more easily if we were to try to classify some examples. I'm a bit short of time now, but I could try to collect some late this night.

[Gemeentekaart 72]

7 hours ago, matias93 said:

Probably 2002 should be Modern and 2003 Postmodern, to have those two categories (which probably include most of the custom buildings we have) in separate styles.

I'm with Girafarig on bundling Mediterranean and Middle Eastern in one style, seeing as they are both historically and environmentally very related, and probably the same applies to Northern and Eastern European styles,

I do agree. First of all, we need to leave the word Chicago, Houston, New York, and Euro from vanilla. Lets just say by the architecture style (neo classic, art deco, postmodern, and contemporary).

I like the plan of 2002-Modern and 2003-Postmodern, its just more chronological if you want to arrange them by style from 2001-2004.

Putting Mediterranean and Mid East in one style is a nice and wise choice, also the same with North Europe and East Europe.

I personally think both America and EU W2W buildings could be put on 2001-2004 or any 200X depends on what architecture style it used. Rather than put it on a 2 different styles each. Just like, how if East Asia style has W2W too? Why would they dont have East Asia W2W standalone?

Asia is huge, but if we have separate Mid East, there is only 2 more styles there, its Tropical and Oriental. Since the Central Asia region could be put into the same style with Soviet/ Eastern EU. With its Tropical and Oriental, both could have sub-style such as traditional and vernacular architecture, and maybe slums.

Just remember what Matias said earlier, man of culture 🙌

On 7/10/2024 at 9:47 AM, matias93 said:

We probably would have a good coverage of skyscrapers for most sets to be sure, but cities are mostly small-scale buildings, not CBDs,

 

[Wiimeiser 445]

17 hours ago, Null 45 said:

I had looked into this at one point based on this ST thread, and I didn't see anything obviously wrong with the game's code. But I may not have been looking in the right place. Quoting the technical part of my SC4E reply on this topic below:

It's entirely possible that it's reading the wrong value somewhere due to a coding error. This was very common in games of the time; so many N64 games had texture issues due to the faster development (a holdover from earlier eras) and inexperience with 3D art; and back then memory management was much less common (Creatures 3/Docking Station is the oldest game I know of that actually properly responds to exceeding an array size); without proper memory management you get stuff like sticks reading texture data from a non-texture file or a glitch character that gets its stats from a biker gang, with proper memory management you'd probably just get a crash.

[matias93 7,535]

5 hours ago, Gemeentekaart said:

I personally think both America and EU W2W buildings could be put on 2001-2004 or any 200X depends on what architecture style it used. Rather than put it on a 2 different styles each. Just like, how if East Asia style has W2W too? Why would they dont have East Asia W2W standalone?

The reason to have a separate style for W2W is to make it easier to build coherent neighbourhoods of continuous facades, and the main reason to separate them regionally is to avoid getting a Shibuya-style shop or a Manhattan brownstone terrace in the middle of a Hausmannian city centre.

[TheMurderousCricket 5,061]

5 hours ago, matias93 said:

The reason to have a separate style for W2W is to make it easier to build coherent neighbourhoods of continuous facades, and the main reason to separate them regionally is to avoid getting a Shibuya-style shop or a Manhattan brownstone terrace in the middle of a Hausmannian city centre.

Tell me about it! It's so annoying to have one building breaking up entire row housing!

[tez 37]

I think distinguishing styles only make sense if it is likely that they will exist within the same city, otherwise the players could just swap their plugin folder. For example I doubt someone wants to have a Mediterranean, Soviet, and a Japanese quarter in one city. Either a player will build an exclusively Mediterranean, Soviet, or Japanese city (and they can do that by swapping out their plugin folder, no styles needed) or they don't care about realism and just build everything at once (and thus won't need styles either).

The W2W idea I like a lot however, because it is very likely that a player wants to develop one part of the town with W2W bats, but disable them for the rest of the town, which will be easy to do with styles. And I would expand on that idea by suggesting that in addition to a W2W style, there should be a style for Diagonal overhanging bats, and maybe even for Fractional Angle overhanging bats (though I'm not sure such bats exist yet).

Another thing I would like to see is a medieval, or "pre-industrial" style. That would allow players to for example build an old city center with only that style enabled, then they can make all those buildings historical, switch to contemporary styles and continue building a modern city around the old city center. This "medieval/pre-industrial" style wouldn't even need to be from a specific region (e.g. Europe) since a Japanese player could use it just as well for old Japanese city centers in modern Japanese cities. The decision if the buildings are European or Japanese is probably a city-wide decision for most players and could be done with the plugin folder, while the decision if the buildings are new or old will be made within a city and therefore should be done with styles. 

So I would suggest these styles: 

- several styles separated by time (e.g. pre-1500, Renaissance, Modernism, Contemporary)

- W2W styles (maybe again several styles separated by time)

- Diagonal bats style(s)

- (FA style)

- leave one unspecified style that players can experiment with themselves 

- ofc the 4 original Maxis styles remain unchanged for backwards compatibility

TL;DR: If we can expect it to coexist within the same city, it should be a style. If it will be the same within the whole city, then it should be a matter of swapping plugin-folders.

[TheMurderousCricket 5,061]

5 hours ago, tez said:

I think distinguishing styles only make sense if it is likely that they will exist within the same city, otherwise the players could just swap their plugin folder. For example I doubt someone wants to have a Mediterranean, Soviet, and a Japanese quarter in one city. Either a player will build an exclusively Mediterranean, Soviet, or Japanese city (and they can do that by swapping out their plugin folder, no styles needed) or they don't care about realism and just build everything at once (and thus won't need styles either).

This is a very good point and to expand on what I said earlier, it would be more practical to have, say, a Mediterranean folder and have seven, eight Mediterranean building styles for that one folder so the game can choose items from several building groups. These same-folder building styles could then, of course, be sorted into historical periods of the given region / environment.

[Cyclone Boom 17,016]

On 11/07/2024 at 11:52 PM, CorinaMarie said:

@Cyclone Boom already extended the size of it: [Image]

And is willing to share that as well as help edit it. Also, it's quite likely the template idea you've mentioned could work well by copying the code as text, doing a search and replace, and then putting it back in Reader. (Or does Reader already have that ability? I've forgotten a lot in the past two years.)

Additionally, we are perfectly willing to share the lots and textures we created.

To follow-up on this, here's a zip containing our modified test UI for expanded tilesets:

Building Styles Tests by CoriBoom v1a.zip

As Cori said, I'm happy to assist with editing the UI to incorporate with the new community tilesets initiative. I've a bit of experience with UI stuff, so let me know if you'd like help on that front. It sure can be quite fiddly to edit UI panels, and Reader 1.5.4 has a pesky habit of corrupting the data sometimes. Editing it manually in Notepad++ and pasting into Reader's text-based view can be beneficial (since the game's UI is XML based).

Here it is in this raw form:

Spoiler

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      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x0000200A area=(55,270,275,288) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x200A - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,2829adf4} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x0000200B area=(55,295,275,313) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x200B - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,e7fee3b1} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x0000200C area=(55,320,275,338) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x200C - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,e3f8368d} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x0000200D area=(55,345,275,363) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x200D - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,599f5622} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x0000200E area=(55,370,275,386) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x200E - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,635afbc2} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x0000200F area=(55,395,275,413) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x200F - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,76dcae46} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002010 area=(55,420,275,438) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2010 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,8cf89cd5} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002011 area=(55,445,275,461) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2011 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,d2e32bc4} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002012 area=(280,120,500,138) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2012 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,52f5cf21} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002013 area=(280,145,500,163) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2013 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,d142116c} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002014 area=(280,170,500,186) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2014 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,7a9c5ce3} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002015 area=(280,195,500,211) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2015 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,0b8deb39} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002016 area=(280,220,500,238) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2016 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,9adfad03} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002017 area=(280,245,500,263) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2017 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,4687aa7f} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002018 area=(280,270,500,288) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2018 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,e50eac31} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x00002019 area=(280,295,500,313) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x2019 - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,42c16148} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x0000201A area=(280,320,500,338) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x201A - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,a8e957cd} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
      <LEGACY clsid=GZWinBtn iid=IGZWinBtn id=0x0000201B area=(280,345,500,363) fillcolor=(192,192,192) caption="0x201B - CoriBoom" captionres={6a231eaa,23e3d1dc} winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=yes winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=yes winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,144161ea} font=Default colorfontnormal=(63,73,103) colorfontdisabled=(102,102,102) colorfonthilited=(255,255,255) colorfontnormalbkg=(0,0,0) colorfontdisabledbkg=(0,0,0) colorfonthilitedbkg=(0,0,0) toggle=off triggerondown=off showcaption=yes fill=yes autosize=no wrapcaption=no shiftcaption=no tips=no tipsdelay=no tipstimeout=no style=radiocheck gutters=(2,0,2,0) tiptext="" tipoffsets=(0,0) tipflag=0x01000000 align=center btnclicksnd={ca4d1943,2a5c322b} winflag_enable=no >
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            <LEGACY clsid=GZWinSpinner iid=IGZWinSpinner id=0xabc61550 area=(52,3,67,21) fillcolor=(187,187,187) caption="$70" winflag_visible=yes winflag_enabled=yes winflag_moveable=no winflag_sizeable=no winflag_sortable=no winflag_pbuff=no winflag_pbufftrans=yes winflag_pbufferase=yes winflag_pbuffvid=no winflag_alphablend=yes winflag_acceptfocus=no winflag_mousetrans=no winflag_ignoremouse=no image={46a006b0,82b99d9d} outline=no fill=yes autonumber=yes autonumbercomma=no autonumbercurrency=yes initvalue=70 minmax=(0,200) stepsize=1 coloroutlinel=(0,0,0) coloroutlinet=(0,0,0) coloroutliner=(0,0,0) coloroutlineb=(0,0,0) digits=no align=right colorfontnormal=(187,187,187) colorfontdisabled=(187,187,187) colorfonthilited=(187,187,187) gutters=(4,1) >
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The zip also includes the test lots we used when using the exemplar based method for custom tileset control.

Preview:

If worth blocking Maxis R$ lots, we made this little mod:
CoriBoom's Block All R$ with 0x0000.dat

As the name goes, this sets an OccupantGroup of zero.

I seem to recall we made this because some other Maxis blockers set a different ID (which could end up clashing with a custom tileset).

-CB & Cori

  Edited July 23, 2024 by Cyclone Boom  
Update to add new v1a file, which fixes a minor LText IID reference bug in the UI code.

[Cyclone Boom 17,016]

[Placeholder Post]

[TheMurderousCricket 5,061]

15 hours ago, Cyclone Boom said:

To follow-up on this, here's a zip containing our modified test UI for expanded tilesets:

Building Styles Tests by CoriBoom v1.zip

Finally it is here! I can't wait to assign some of my latest downloads to these custom "building families", test it out in practice and get a rainbow of buildings in each city! 

All I really need now is to learn how to change names to something meaningful. Doing it through UI editor never did the trick - I was always left with whichever name was copied into the new checkbox.

Forget it, easy.  Just editing the LTEXT dat. Thank you!

[TheMurderousCricket 5,061]

Playing about with the names of all different "styles" that will be introduced in my cities. Like I said before, these will still contain mostly generic buildings, just grouped together.  Perhaps I'll add some specific families (Mediterranean, Socrealist) yet. Of course, there will be some W2W sets which, as some users have correctly pointed out, can be specifically used to create uniform strips of buildings which are designed to be W2Ws.

[CorinaMarie 29,775]

1 minute ago, TheMurderousCricket said:

Playing about ...

A big question we have: Do the checkboxes work now? (The DLL wasn't written while we were experimenting.)

[Null 45 3,064]

8 hours ago, CorinaMarie said:

Do the checkboxes work now?

Yes they do. The following image was created using the lots and building style UI that @Cyclone Boom posted above:

8 hours ago, CorinaMarie said:

(The DLL wasn't written while we were experimenting.)

Reading that topic is what made me look into the hardcoded restrictions in the EXE, and writing a DLL to bypass them. 

[TheMurderousCricket 5,061]

16 hours ago, CorinaMarie said:

A big question we have: Do the checkboxes work now? (The DLL wasn't written while we were experimenting.)

 

7 hours ago, Null 45 said:

Yes they do. The following image was created using the lots and building style UI that @Cyclone Boom posted above:

Indeed. I just made a test in which I unchecked all building styles except for the "auxiliary" 0x00002007 which (for now) only contains a 5x4 and 6x6 Carrefour BAT.

It grew almost instantly into the lots provided. What is interesting too is that this BAT almost never appeared as a 6x6 lot when it was a part of default building styles... Which gives some credence to my previous opinion that this new tool may give us a chance to obtain better diversity as far as growables go.

In that vein, there are some interesting questions to ponder on...

1. Should buildings belong to more than one style or should they only have a single style assigned? The more styles a BAT uses, the more chance there is it will interfere with other buildings assigned to a given style.

2. How should styles be managed in-game to obtain both diversity and use the most of growables in one's collection?

   a) By keeping all building styles on, all the time...?
   b) Through a "rotational system"? (One plays with e.g. six building styles during their gaming session. Upon finishing, they uncheck one of the styles and turn another on for the next play).

EDIT: For some reason it seems I am unable to edit the name for the 0x2010 checkbox. It always reverts to CoriBoom's default.  Why does it happen?

[CorinaMarie 29,775]

2 hours ago, TheMurderousCricket said:

EDIT: For some reason it seems I am unable to edit the name for the 0x2010 checkbox. It always reverts to CoriBoom's default.  Why does it happen?

I see a tiny bug in the 0x00002010 line: captionres={6a231eaa8cf89cd5} should be captionres={6a231eaa,8cf89cd5}

Notice the missing comma.

[Kel9509 1,475]

8 hours ago, TheMurderousCricket said:

1. Should buildings belong to more than one style or should they only have a single style assigned? The more styles a BAT uses, the more chance there is it will interfere with other buildings assigned to a given style.

2. How should styles be managed in-game to obtain both diversity and use the most of growables in one's collection?

I think you're on the right track. I long suspected that larger lots wouldn't grow if they were part of a broader building set that had lots of diverse lot sizes and capacities.  That's why in particular I think the Hong Kong larger sets by bixel and the Hong Kong BAT team should probably be in their own style.  

I also wondered if various suburban sets should be in their own style, but I'm still not sure if it makes sense given that lower-density sets can be controlled by the densities in the game. 

[Cyclone Boom 17,016]

Great to see it works with the UI panel and the DLL now.

This really is more flexible than editing the exemplar each time and reloading the game to change tilesets.

 

9 hours ago, CorinaMarie said:

I see a tiny bug in the 0x00002010 line: captionres={6a231eaa8cf89cd5} should be captionres={6a231eaa,8cf89cd5}

Notice the missing comma.

I've fixed this now with a new v1a file in my above post (also updated the code in the spoiler too). Thankfully this wouldn't have implications in terms of crashing the game or anything, because it only meant an invalid IID reference. Without that "captionres" being valid, it reverts to the defined name in the UI code (instead of from the LText file). It's one of those bugs which stands out now with seeing it, yet was sat there all along undetected.

Good catch there, and thanks @TheMurderousCricket for the heads up!

[Kel9509 1,475]

I wanted to ask the community if, when reporting building styles in the RCI query (from my RCI DLL Query Upgrade Mod), there is enough room to show all of them, or perhaps too much room?  If you select the building in the query, using @Null 45's DLL mods it will report the building styles applicable to that building.  Initially I edited the query to provide a lot of extra space, but I'm wondering if it's too much.  After all, how many buildings will really use all 4+ Maxis styles, and the 12+ community styles, AND the custom styles?   Let me know if it's too much space or not, from the latest version I'm working on (this was done to incorporate the display of a building lot growth stage, above the make historical checkbox):

   

[CorinaMarie 29,775]

The extra space is fine IMO. It's good to be prepared.

I presume you have it set so if there are a dozen building styles they will all display? I do agree it's not likely to be in that many as I expect we'll be seeing a majority have only one building style.

[Kel9509 1,475]

1 minute ago, CorinaMarie said:

I presume you have it set so if there are a dozen building styles they will all display? I do agree it's not likely to be in that many as I expect we'll be seeing a majority have only one building style.

It uses @Null 45's DLL functionality, so of COURSE it displays them all!  As an example, I have a growable version of the NYBT Tudor City apartments.  So just now in response to your question, I edited its building exemplar to apply to all of the building styles from my previous UI test:

  

And here's how it looks in-game:

[Null 45 3,064]

44 minutes ago, Kel9509 said:

so of COURSE it displays them all! 

Looking at the query style DLL code I just noticed a bug, the optional auto historical checkbox will be treated as a building style. The query DLL currently uses its own copy of the style name gathering code, and I forgot to update it after adding that feature to the more building style DLL.

I plan to fix that by adding a GZCOM class to the more building style DLL that other DLLs can call to get the style names. This would make the query DLL have an optional dependency on the building style DLL, but users that are working with custom building styles would already have that installed. If the building style DLL is not installed, I would print the names of the 4 Maxis styles and the numbers of any custom styles.

[TheMurderousCricket 5,061]

I've done some thinking and consulted SimCity Building Index. I realized that in order to make the most of the variety that new tilesets offer, we need to strike certain balance with regards to what we put into any given style.

1. Specifically, at least these basic values should be taken into account:

     a) Varied footprints
     b) Varied occupant numbers
     c) Varied wealth levels for each footprint and occupant number

2. The data available in SimCity Building Index asserts that:

     a) There are 50 to 70 Residential buildings in each vanilla style (all footprints and densities)
     b) There are around 40 Commercial (90 in Chicago set) buildings in each vanilla style (all footprints and densities)

The bottom line is - we need to have similar numbers of residential and commercial buildings available in each of the additional styles and we should also make sure that while creating additional tilesets, considerations presented in point 1 are taken into account.

This way, we can have building styles which contain 3-4 single-family housing buildings, 3-4 shopping malls, 3-4 boutiques etc., etc.

The number of buildings in each "breed" (small house, petrol station, small office block etc.) should still be relatively small or else we are back to the problem of some buildings being prevalent and others being pushed away and never appearing in the game. It's a question of balance, as always. While we can tell a difference between architecture of one building or the next, the game doesn't recognize visuals and takes growth stage and occupant numbers into consideration - we need to take it into account.

But even by having 2-3 grocery markets in each of your 32 tilesets, you still end up with between 60 to 100 grocery market possibilities available in the gameplay!

Of course, planning like this requires some sort of control or tracking chart so one knows how many buildings of each type are already in the set. I am working on something like this, though have to determine a methodology yet. 

 

[TheMurderousCricket 5,061]

Below, please find attached a series of charts which can be used to track how many buildings with specific footprints and occupant capacities one has in each of the 32 buildings styles made available by the combined efforts of CoriBoom and Null.

It might be most helpful to people like me who, rather than download prêt-à-porter building sets, find BATs they like and then form a building set from them.

The idea is simple (if somewhat tedious) - each time you download a BAT and assign it to a certain building set, you then go to the chart and enter a number into an appropriate field which is a meeting point of the vertical axis (most likely lot sizes) and the horizontal axis (occupant number brackets).

Of course, in order to have a truly diverse tileset, it is best to also keep track of how much BATs of a given developer type one has. The charts also offers a way to keep track of at least basic devs - R, CS and CO.

If you feel like doing all this accounting for yourselves (or the community, perhaps?) feel free to grab these templates. I am open to any comments or ideas that you may have. I understand that my methodology might not suit everyone's tastes and needs but I still consider it good for many reasons and in many situations.

 

Footprint-capacity chart per tileset (example).doc

[nathkel 31]

I would love to be able to see either a mixing of styles, as you would have in any large city, as well as a sequential set of styles, so that as the city evolves the style of the buildings changes ever so slightly. That way you could go from primitive to futuristic over a few hundred — or maybe a few thousand — years.

Would it then be possible to have two separate exemplars depending upon the type of style appearance you want to see (mixed or sequential)?

[Ulisse Wolf 4,426]

Here is the third draft of styles.  In bold are the styles where agreement has been reached while the others are still being decided. If we want to make the UI mod available to the public (By placing the mod in the STEX and SC4E) we need to decide as soon as possible on the community styles to be included. 

0x00002000 - Neoclassical (Chicago 1890)

0x00002001 - Art Deco (New York 1940)

0x00002002 - Postmodern (Houston 1990)

0x00002003 - European Contemporary (Euro-Contemporany)

0x00002004 - Mediterranean

0x00002005 - Art Nouveau

0x00002006 - Eastern Europe

0x00002007 - North Europe

0x00002008 - Middle East & Africa

0x00002009 - European W2W

0x0000200A - American W2W

0x0000200B - American Contemporany

0x0000200C - Tropical

0x0000200D - East Asia 

0x0000200E - East Asia Contemporary

0x0000200F - Futuristic

[shoptroll 20]

Throwing 2 simoleons into the mix here, and this is largely because Pegasus's MTP theme always seemed a bit cumbersome to setup, but I think a "Rural" category might not be a bad option to have.

[Kel9509 1,475]

On 7/21/2024 at 5:59 PM, Cyclone Boom said:

As Cori said, I'm happy to assist with editing the UI to incorporate with the new community tilesets initiative. I've a bit of experience with UI stuff, so let me know if you'd like help on that front. It sure can be quite fiddly to edit UI panels, and Reader 1.5.4 has a pesky habit of corrupting the data sometimes. Editing it manually in Notepad++ and pasting into Reader's text-based view can be beneficial (since the game's UI is XML based).

@Cyclone Boom, the Allow More Building Styles Mod now supports an optional check box to automatically mark new growable residential and commercial buildings as historical when they grow (not sure why this wouldn't apply to Industrial, though I've asked @Null 45).  As noted in the Allow More Building Styles mod:

Quote

Auto-Historical Check Box

The DLL supports an optional check box that will automatically mark new growable residential and commercial lots as historical when SC4 creates them.
This check box uses the reserved id value: 0x9476D8DA

I was beginning to edit your version of the UI to incorporate this new feature, but it wouldn't load in the UIEditor I have (version 0.5).  You must've made it in Reader 1.5.4, right?  I can try editing your UI to add this feature, but given that I'm not so familiar with 1.5.4, I'm hopeful your offer to assist still stands.  

Would it be possible for you to edit your UI to incorporate this feature? 

As I see things, the checkbox might appear next to the "Build All Styles at Once" selection, in a column aligned above the year selection.  That's the only space available in the UI, as far as I can see, but it seems to fill a hole anyway.  

Also, I was wondering overall the status of this project and the standard Community styles.  Has there been enough time for some consensus? 

[CorinaMarie 29,775]

7 hours ago, Kel9509 said:

You must've made it in Reader 1.5.4, right?

I can answer this as Yes. And he also often copies out the text version and tweaks it in Notepad++ too to then put back in Reader.

 

7 hours ago, Kel9509 said:

I'm hopeful your offer to assist still stands.

I'm absolutely certain it does. I expect CB'll be back to active posting possibly as early as Friday or within a few days of it.

 

7 hours ago, Kel9509 said:

As I see things, the checkbox might appear next to the "Build All Styles at Once" selection, in a column aligned above the year selection.  That's the only space available in the UI, as far as I can see, but it seems to fill a hole anyway.

I'm sure we'll be able to visualize this once having it open on screen, but if you have a chance a mock up picture would go a long way to making it feel more intuitive when CB's ready to do the actual tweaking.