"Build all tilesets at the same time" command does not work

[11241036 5,093]

I have discovered a strange issue in the game  that I'd like to start a discussion about. However, I'm not really sure if this issue is unique to my copy of SimCity 4 Deluxe (I purchased a digital copy from Amazon since I switched to Windows 10 and the CD version doesn't work anymore), because I've already discovered another strange issue that I never had a year ago when I was playing on the CD version of SC4. In case you want to test it on your own, I've attached the relevant testing files to this post, but please read first.

The issue: In the game menu's building style subsection, there is a command whhich would allow the player to let all building styles be grown at the same time (I'm playing SC4 in German, therefore, I don't know the proper English name). Please see the second screenshot below. My assumption is that in my game, this command does not work at all and the game still shifts to another building style in regular intervals which are defined by the command "Change building style every ... years". To get some evidence about this, I started a series of experiments like this:

 

External preparations:

I had not been entirely sure if this issue is being caused by a plugin or if it is an in-game bug, therefore, I've made two serieses of experiments, one on an already developed Plugins folder and one without any plugins (except a building blocker and the testlots).

To make sure that 1. I can control which buildings will grow, 2. I will be able to recognize them according to their building style, and 3. all building styles have the same chance of being grown, I did the following:

• I downloaded and installed a building blocker plugin (this one, to be exact) and customized it in a way that it would prevent all default Maxis residentials from growing but would still allow all industrials and commercials to be grown.
• I removed all residentials from my Plugins folder.
• I developed 4 residential lots (R$, 1x2, Stage 1, low density) with identical stats and completely devoid of props that just had two differences: Each one onlw grows under one tileset, the tileset being different for each one; and they had different base textures so that I could easily recognize them. BTW, these testlots are attached to this post; you are free to download and use them, if you want.

 

In-game preparations:

I started a new region and created a scene with the following properties:

• Only 1x2 low-density residential zones have been laid out. They are supplied with power and water, and a few commercial and industrial zones, as well as agricultural zones, have been laid out as well.
• Only about 25% of the residential zones have road access. The reason: I want to be able to demonstrate the visual results if my assumption was correct. After 1 year has passed, I'll connect another 25% of the residential zones to a street.

• The settings in the building style menu:

 

The results:

After 1 year (at Dec 31st, 00):

After 2 years:

After 3 years:

After 4 years:

 

After this 4 years period, the game just starts again with the buildings shown in the year of 00. BTW, the order in which the building styles are growing is: Chicago, New York, Houston, Euro.

I repeated this testing series with a completely empty Plugins folder (aside from the Maxis buildings blockers and the testing lots, of course). The results were the same.

This could still be a coincidence, but imo this is really unlikely. I assume that in this case the command "Build all tilesets at the same time" doesn't work at all, for whatever reason.

 

Questions:

I've been playing Sim Sity 4: Deluxe for about 7 years now. I've frequently been wondering why sometimes certain buildings just don't want to grow, and sometimes the game just grows the same building all over my cities. But during years of roaming Simtropolis Exchange and sc4devotion, I've never stumbled about a thread or even one single post mentioning a bug like this. Am I the first one to discover a bug that has went undiscovered all the time? Or is it just me and there's something wrong with the digital copy I purchased? Or is there another in-game setting that I'm not aware of that could cause such a behavior of the game?

Is this malfunction actually known, at all? Has it already been discovered and I just never heard about it?

In case someone else has reason to assume that their copy of SC4 would suffer from the same malfunction: I'd highly appreciate if at least some people would download and install the testing lots attached to this post, make the same experiments (they don't require external dependencies), and report the results here.

Testing Lots for Building Styles.zip

[rsc204 21,804]

Interesting results, I''m fairly sure the feature is working with my version, since I do use it to have greater control over what grows.

What is odd here, if I think about the Maxis Small terrace houses, they grow one type every 4-5 game years. Put another way, the cycle I see takes that long. So if you are seeing the cycle every year, that behaviour is not similar to my experience.

I guess the question is how random is random? Perhaps whilst all tilesets can grow, the game is once more switching between those that are active, trying to mix things up. If you select only individual tilesets, I'm assuming you would have full control over what does appear? In which case this is probably more down to the fact that having the option of more than one, doesn't necessarily mean the game will select between them at any given moment. Anything random in SC4 is based off the internal game clock, it wouldn't surprise me if it was just a more efficient use of resources to switch between tilesets at set periods, rather than continually. However since over time you still get a randomised appearance, unless you grow everything at once, you probably wouldn't notice the behaviour.

[CorinaMarie 29,556]

On 4/29/2017 at 8:44 PM, 11241036 said:

I downloaded and installed a building blocker plugin (this one, to be exact) and customized it in a way that it would prevent all default Maxis residentials from growing but would still allow all industrials and commercials to be grown.

Ok. I got that and by customize, I presume you mean to use only these 3 files:

1. TSB_BlockAll_R$$$.dat
2. TSB_BlockAll_R$$.dat
3. TSB_BlockAll_R$.dat

(Tho for this early city testing I'd guess I only needed the R$ one.)

My test is the disc based game patched to 1.1.640.0 running on XP Pro. My total plugins were then those 3 and your 2 files.

 

On 4/29/2017 at 8:44 PM, 11241036 said:

I'd highly appreciate if at least some people would download and install the testing lots attached to this post, make the same experiments (they don't require external dependencies), and report the results here.

Here's my starting scene. Each of the 4 building styles are enabled:

 

I connected a new residential section on December 31 of each year. Here it is after 4 years:

^ The slight in-fill of other styles was due to them not completely filling up in their one year segment. (I have yearly pics showing those undeveloped rather than the expected mix as the game ran.)

 

So then I started again and selected to change building style every zero years.

 

Again, connecting a new res section each Dec 31. And after 4 years:

 

On 4/29/2017 at 9:55 PM, rsc204 said:

Anything random in SC4 is based off the internal game clock, it wouldn't surprise me if it was just a more efficient use of resources to switch between tilesets at set periods, rather than continually.

This appears to be the correct answer and those set periods are 1 year intervals regardless of the settings selected for sooner than that. Going the other direction as in every 2 or 5 or such years does what one would expect.

 

Here's a further test of your (@11241036's) theory:

You'll notice the Change building style every x year option is NOT checked, but with it set to two years and Build all at once, it then changes only each 2 years. (New res was connected Dec 31 each year as before.)

So, that implies if I'd set the every zero year, but use the all-at-once we'd get the results we wanted. Right? Nope. It then still does the once per year as in the original tests.

 

On 4/29/2017 at 8:44 PM, 11241036 said:

My assumption is that in my game, this command does not work at all and the game still shifts to another building style in regular intervals which are defined by the command "Change building style every ... years".

That is my conclusion too. The Build all styles at once is merely eye candy and does absolutely nothing whether or not it is enabled.

 

[SimCoug 5,972]

Haha, Maxis, you dirty so-and-so.  I always wondered why checking the 'build all styles at once' never actually accomplished that.  I remember playing around with the tileset options a long time ago and I never actually saw a wild building variety... at least after I pushed play and saw a bunch of buildings propagate.   After playing for some time I did notice other tilesets popping up, so I guess I just figured it took time.  Turns out, it takes a year. 

Looks like @11241036 found another feature that was never actually implemented by Maxis (huge surprise).  Nice find. 

In any case, the building tileset function is still a powerful tool, especially if you want to carefully curate what buildings will grow and when.  I use it all the time to carefully craft my towns and cities exactly how I want.  It all starts by assigning the building .desc files to specific tilesets (accomplished easily using iLives Reader, SC4 PIM, and other editing tools).
Checking and deselecting the 4 building tilesets does work, so at least maxis got that feature right.  

[CorinaMarie 29,556]

I'm sure you are aware you can add all four Styles to each lot's OccupantGroups:

 

Which then does give the All-at-once:

During the first year of game play.

[11241036 5,093]

@CorinaMarie Thank you very much for testing it as well. I guess resorting to your technique of adding all four styles to a growable's Occupant Groups would do the job if we want to completely randomize the building growth in a city, while restricting a building to one style, as mentioned by @SimCoug , would give us more control about what will grow. Useful techniques.

[CorinaMarie 29,556]

2 minutes ago, 11241036 said:

I guess resorting to your technique of adding all four styles to a growable's Occupant Groups would do the job if we want to completely randomize the building growth in a city, while restricting a building to one style, as mentioned by @SimCoug , would give us more control about what will grow. Useful techniques.

Personally, I'd go with that latter option cause 1 year in between, or rather 4 years for the full cycle, really isn't that big of a deal IMO. Being able to selectively turn on or off specific style sets would allow more options overall. I recall reading somewhere that peeps have complained about some of the CC where the author did put them in all 4 Style Groups and they found that a wee bit annoying cause there was no easy way to exclude them.

[T Wrecks 10,209]

Yes, I wouldn't activate all buildings for all tilesets just to bypass the one-year cycle. Myself, I don't even activate more than two tilesets at once usually. For other players, going through the one-year cycle is probably much less of a hassle than changing everything to grow in all tilesets and then lose control in case you want it.

 

Paging @simmaster07 to check if this might be a candidate for DLL modding. Because occasionally I'd sure like to have the option of growing a combination of tilesets simultaneously.

[His Divine Hand 244]

Huh, it's funny, but I had noticed this several years back, but had just assumed it was common knowledge.

Good job 11241036 for noticing this, testing it, and getting the word out.  And props to CorinaMarie for replicating his results to put it beyond question.  Hopefully now this will be common knowledge.