Lot - Resources / Help

[hugues aroux 3,779]

OK OK ! thank you for this information !

[rsc204 21,806]

Can I add, one of the things so many users seem to neglect is the Plugin Manager tool. Rather than simply copying an existing lot using Save As in the Lot Editor, which can cause huge problems because it copies the properties of the lot's Buildings Exemplar. A better solution is to always make your own new Buildings Exemplar for every lot you create.

Frankly, this is one of those times when using a tool better designed for modding, PIM-X or the X-Tool, really comes into its own. I would personally advise everyone modding to ditch the inferior Maxis apps. But if you must continue to use them, understanding what a Buildings Exemplar is, how it affects the way lots work and making custom ones is something everyone should know. See here if you need a guide on that:

 

[hugues aroux 3,779]

The tutorial of MGB is interesting but a bit outdated about SC4PIM-X. No ?
You say to make your own Exemplar Building. You do that how. Should I make a copy of the file given as an example by MGB? ... there I am lost!

[rsc204 21,806]

56 minutes ago, hugues aroux said:

The tutorial of MGB is interesting but a bit outdated about SC4PIM-X. No ?

Not really outdated, since the User Manual for PIM-X is a far more complete resource, the guide is aimed at those who can't/won't use PIM-X. The intention being to cover the basics of making a lot in a similar method to PIM-X, i.e. by always starting with a custom Buildings Exemplar, which by default is setup for the lot you are making.

56 minutes ago, hugues aroux said:

You say to make your own Exemplar Building. You do that how. Should I make a copy of the file given as an example by MGB? ... there I am lost!

The tutorial covers what a Buildings Exemplar is, that's really a very important point to understand. Bear in mind, the blank model is included for convenience, but it's clearly stated in the tutorial that you only ever need one such model. Every new buildings exemplar will itself be unique, but link back to this default model.

P.s., I am MGB in case you hadn't noticed, I wrote the tutorial .

[hugues aroux 3,779]

Hello,
first thing ... sorry for the confusion between you and .. you! I did not know that you sign your SC4 activity with 2 nicks. And believe me that I did not want to be unkind.
Well, to be "practical" .. what do I do?
I understand the principle of Builgding Exemplar, it is always created when using PIM-X, inevitable anyway, because of the operation of the application. But what I do not get is: to create this Building Exemplar, for a Lot in Invisible Building, I use which base file?
I see that the "blanck" file provides only a minimum of properties, that PZ1x1_grass, it, attributes own properties to a park (!) With a property "parent-cohort" etc ... and following your message, I could also use your given file as an example that I should adapt to my production (?). Then I have, and it seems obvious to me, modify the properties of my future Lot in PIM-X partly and especially in Reader and other tools, to adapt my Lot to its future destination.

FYI, I made a test, to create a Lot with "Blanck" and with "PZ1x1 .." resulting in a malfunction of the Lot with "Blanck" in DAMN-manager, unlike that in "PZ1x1 ... ". So, I thought I was doing something wrong, or from the start the choice of "Blanck" was not good. Hence my question on this forum.

Another thing: in Maxis LotEditor you can change the building of a Lot, but if I'm not mistaken, it's not possible in PIM-X, is it?
Looking forward to reading you.

Best regards

[rsc204 21,806]

One of the real flaws or oversights with the Maxis Lot Editor is the fact that it insists you load an existing lot to make a new one (i.e. no "New Lot" option). So the basic steps here are:

1. Open PIM (That's the Maxis Plugin Manager).
2. Drag the blank model (right) to the appropriate category in the left pane.
3. Enter all properties you need.
   
   You should now have a new SC4Desc file, which contains your custom Buildings Exemplar.
    
4. Now we open the Lot Editor, as usual you must open an existing lot to begin.
5. However, rather than copy that "template" lot's Buildings Exemplar, we switch it for the one we previously made. In practise, this is done by changing the Building object that is present on the lot.

The building object on a lot = the Building Exemplar with that name. Or put another way, the building used determines the properties of the lot. In this sense the Building and Buildings Exemplar are one thing.

You can re-use the same model multiple times for different purposes, so you could link as many Buildings Exemplars, each with unique properties, to just one model. When you save the Lot itself, your Buildings Exemplar should be merged into the SC4Lot file. In short, the SC4Desc file is temporary and not required after saving the new lot. But it always pays to double-check the SC4Lot file with Reader before deleting them.

The tutorial itself shows how to do all this, step by step, in intricate detail. Whereas in PIM-X the whole process is much more intuitive, can all be done in one application, not to mention a ton of other useful features that make modding easier.

[hugues aroux 3,779]

... uh, sorry but ... All this is interesting for the users of these two apps and the understanding of the mechanisms involved, which I understand better now, but in my case, as I said before, my questions concern SC4PIM-X !

Regards

[hrobi2 20]

I wanted to know if there was a way to place fire, smoke, light as props so i can overlap them on objects. i was trying to place the small fireplace from here and it didnt have a fire or any lights on the lot unlike the others. I tryed to go into the lot editor to find if there were fire props and lights but there wasnt any and the lights were just cones and out of place. 

[CorinaMarie 29,574]

For the smoke you could look at PEG MTP Low Wealth Growable RES Cabins. The sixth paragraph there says:

Quote

The lots use random building & prop families so the cabins will always be different on each lot. The cabins also use a new feature, Random Smoke... so you will see smoke coming from their chimneys at different times of the day. (Bold added.)

I don't know if that's within the above download or a part of the PEG MTP Super Pack dependency, but you could investigate how it's done for them and perhaps find a way to use that to make smoke appear to rise from the fireplace.

[hrobi2 20]

33 minutes ago, CorinaMarie said:

For the smoke you could look at PEG MTP Low Wealth Growable RES Cabins. The sixth paragraph there says:

I don't know if that's within the above download or a part of the PEG MTP Super Pack dependency, but you could investigate how it's done for them and perhaps find a way to use that to make smoke appear to rise from the fireplace.

1) thxs ill see if that has smoke

2) how do you find this stuff lol

[CorinaMarie 29,574]

6 minutes ago, hrobi2 said:

2) how do you find this stuff lol

I typed this into Google: camp fire smoke site:simtropolis.com/files/ and I noticed that same paragraph popping up several times. So then I Googled: "The cabins also use a new feature, Random Smoke" site:simtropolis.com/files/ and found the one that text is really in.

 

I also found another that has some smoke vapor effects you could check out: M.U.L.E. (Mountain UtiLity Extension). Which has this sentence:

Quote

The lots have varying smoke and ‘vapour’ effects depending on what the utility is actually producing.

[Cyclone Boom 16,852]

Hi @hrobi2,

I've taken a look at the Tents set you linked and have made a few findings based on what I know about the Lot Editor. As Cori mentioned, I can confirm the glow effect prop used is contained within the MTP Super Pack which has the exemplar named: pegLite_FireGlow

Loading the "Camping Tents" variation in the LE and it shows up like so:
 

 

The green diamond for the fire prop is a standard Maxis effect used on the Beach lot.
There are two variants available to search from in the Props list:

• Effect_tinyfire
• Effect_tinyfire-night

(The former shows up all the time, while the other is only triggered in night mode irrespective of the game's internal clock.)

In the "Bonfire" lots which come in 1x1 and 2x2 sizes, I notice some of these are raised up slightly ranging from 0.5 to 4.9 metres above ground. With any prop selected including effects, this is possible to achieve in the Lot Editor by holding Ctrl and pressing the Up/Down arrow keys. Each press will raise/lower them by 0.1 metre increments at a time. Then to reach higher levels quicker, holding Shift+Ctrl increases this to 1 metres at once. Though this might not be useful for the purpose here at low altitudes. Maybe for lights atop tower blocks or transmission masts is where this would come in handy.

That seems like a technique worth using to recreate the desired effect for overlapping them on the Small Fire lot. It'll probably require a bit of trial and error to get the placement right from all 4 angles in the game, since the preview in the LE doesn't render effects and simply shows the green diamond.

One thing to note is the Tent set lots don't include a base texture. This means once you've added the props, to save them via the Maxis LE it will need one adding first. From this point it's possible to delete the responsible LotConfig property in Reader as this post explains to remove it. Alternatively I believe the PIM-X allows lots to be saved without a base texture, though there is a bit of a learning curve and that's not a tool I'm familiar with using myself.

With regards to the lots, I noticed that the light glow effect and the night-based "tinyfire" prop require a power supply. Otherwise I found they don't show up at all which might be something to consider. I was able to work around this by adding a power generation amount of 1 using the LEProp tool. Then they were able to supply themselves, allowing the props to display when plopped in the wilderness as likely the author intended here (especially for the camp site). Though there may well be a better method involving toggling the effects to appear regardless of whether a source of power is provided or not. I'm not familiar with the technicalities of such however.

So just a few observations from what I found. I hope this may help as a bit of additional guidance.

[hrobi2 20]

54 minutes ago, Cyclone Boom said:

Hi @hrobi2,

I've taken a look at the Tents set you linked and have made a few findings based on what I know about the Lot Editor. As Cori mentioned, I can confirm the glow effect prop used is contained within the MTP Super Pack which has the exemplar named: pegLite_FireGlow

Loading the "Camping Tents" variation in the LE and it shows up like so:
 

 

The green diamond for the fire prop is a standard Maxis effect used on the Beach lot.
There are two variants available to search from in the Props list:

• Effect_tinyfire
• Effect_tinyfire-night

(The former shows up all the time, while the other is only triggered in night mode irrespective of the game's internal clock.)

In the "Bonfire" lots which come in 1x1 and 2x2 sizes, I notice some of these are raised up slightly ranging from 0.5 to 4.9 metres above ground. With any prop selected including effects, this is possible to achieve in the Lot Editor by holding Ctrl and pressing the Up/Down arrow keys. Each press will raise/lower them by 0.1 metre increments at a time. Then to reach higher levels quicker, holding Shift+Ctrl increases this to 1 metres at once. Though this might not be useful for the purpose here at low altitudes. Maybe for lights atop tower blocks or transmission masts is where this would come in handy.

That seems like a technique worth using to recreate the desired effect for overlapping them on the Small Fire lot. It'll probably require a bit of trial and error to get the placement right from all 4 angles in the game, since the preview in the LE doesn't render effects and simply shows the green diamond.

One thing to note is the Tent set lots don't include a base texture. This means once you've added the props, to save them via the Maxis LE it will need one adding first. From this point it's possible to delete the responsible LotConfig property in Reader as this post explains to remove it. Alternatively I believe the PIM-X allows lots to be saved without a base texture, though there is a bit of a learning curve and that's not a tool I'm familiar with using myself.

With regards to the lots, I noticed that the light glow effect and the night-based "tinyfire" prop require a power supply. Otherwise I found they don't show up at all which might be something to consider. I was able to work around this by adding a power generation amount of 1 using the LEProp tool. Then they were able to supply themselves, allowing the props to display when plopped in the wilderness as likely the author intended here (especially for the camp site). Though there may well be a better method involving toggling the effects to appear regardless of whether a source of power is provided or not. I'm not familiar with the technicalities of such however.

So just a few observations from what I found. I hope may help as a bit of additional guidance.

wow thank you so much. i fixed my issue. i didnt know you can raise thinhs and that it needed power or whatever.

[philforhockey51 4,203]

I seem to have no descriptors when I open the PIM. I downloaded the PIM-X over on SC4D installed etc, and it has an issue running lacking a dll.  Am I missing some download somewhere?

I've been trying to make a simple lot park green with two overhanging parkgreen triangles to create a larger triangle shape overhang, seem to be having trouble with the second overhang prop appearing. Is this something I need handle somehow else or does it sound like a faulty prop?

[rsc204 21,806]

On 11/12/2018 at 3:33 AM, philforhockey51 said:

I seem to have no descriptors when I open the PIM. I downloaded the PIM-X over on SC4D installed etc, and it has an issue running lacking a dll.  Am I missing some download somewhere?

See the support thread, you need all the listed .dll's installed for PIM-X to work, those files should be located in the install dir of PIM-X to ensure it can find them. Try searching your HDD for them, most likely you have them, but they are not in the right place. In which case, make a copy of them into the PIM-X install dir. If you are still missing any, you'll need to find those online and install them.

Note that the Maxis PIM will only find files located in the root Plugins folder, it does not look in subfolders or anywhere else. So any models/descriptors needed must be placed here to use them with the application.

On 11/12/2018 at 3:33 AM, philforhockey51 said:

I've been trying to make a simple lot park green with two overhanging parkgreen triangles to create a larger triangle shape overhang, seem to be having trouble with the second overhang prop appearing. Is this something I need handle somehow else or does it sound like a faulty prop?

Offset props cause headaches often due to a game bug which messes with how they are displayed. I therefore prefer to approach of a single prop, which covers a whole tile, with the two half triangles (overhangs) as part of the same piece. I recently attached the same thing for Industrial Concrete for another user, the Grass variants are attached here. I'm pretty sure the "Large Triangle" will cover your needs.

:Edit 02/2019: Please find these props as part of this set (STEX):

These RTK0 (True 3D) props are more flexible than bat models, since you can override the textures on them. Eventually I will be releasing a complete set with lots.

[philforhockey51 4,203]

@rsc204   Thank you, I figured the descriptors might be in the wrong spot but wasn't sure what to look for.   Also thank you for the second answer, I had a feeling overhangs got tricky but since it was always the same prop I was worried it was one or the other. 

[PHBSD 37]

Does someone know what problem is this? Sometimes a base texture change automatically at some buildings like on the pictures below. 

[Raymond7cn 6,772]

36 minutes ago, PHBSD said:

Sometimes a base texture change automatically at some buildings like on the pictures below.

Hi PHBSD, I guess that it's because of losing some dependency of this Lot, May I know this building's name, Then we could check it out clearly.

Best,

-- Raymond

[PHBSD 37]

On 24/02/2020 at 4:23 PM, Raymond7cn said:

Hi PHBSD, I guess that it's because of losing some dependency of this Lot, May I know this building's name, Then we could check it out clearly.

Best,

-- Raymond

This is a custom building and the base textures I found on LotEditor. Do you know what dependency would fix this problem?

[Jasoncw 11,840]

@PHBSD If you have two base textures in the same spot, then they will overlap and sometimes one will show up and sometimes the other will show up. I'm guessing that you have the paver texture hidden beneath the grass texture.

[gwada971 1,891]

I think it's a layering problem. 2 base textures or base texture and overlay. You should check your lot in the LotEditor.

Oops not seeing Jasoncw's answer. Sorry

[Raymond7cn 6,772]

5 hours ago, PHBSD said:

This is a custom building and the base textures I found on LotEditor. Do you know what dependency would fix this problem?

Hi PHBSD, sorry for my rudeness, I think @Jasoncw and @gwada971 are right there, You'd better check out if there are two base textures overlapped each other with Loteditor.

Best Regards,

-- Raymond

[PHBSD 37]

Hi everyone. I'm having issues on rendering models shown on the picture below. Does someone know how to fix it?

[Jasoncw 11,840]

@PHBSD If you look in the lower right corner it says "Grid = 16.0" which means that each grid in the viewport above is 16 meters big. That means that your LODs are something like 400 x 430 meters big, which is way bigger than can be exported. I can't tell from the viewport if the building is actually supposed to be that big or if it's overscaled, but either way, there's a limit to how big a BAT can be, and the export will fail if it's too big.

Also, your LODs are very lose. You should make your LODs fit the building, including any parts where you want to be able to place props. So for example, if you have an L shaped building, you should have a snugly fitting L shaped LOD. For my own BATs, even when the buildings are boxy, it's rare that I use a generic box LOD.

The BAT recognizes LODs based on their name, so if you have an object named LOD5, it will be used as that LOD. Same for LOD4 and LOD3. So to make a custom LOD, model your new LOD, give it the right name, and then delete the old ones.

So try making a custom LOD and exporting again. If it's still too big you'll have to break the building into two parts, and I can give you advice on that if that's what needs to be done.

[PHBSD 37]

How can I create a custom LOD?

[Jasoncw 11,840]

@PHBSD A custom LOD is just like any other object, it's just named LOD5, etc. You can use whatever modeling method you prefer to make the LOD, and then rename it to LOD5, etc.

[PHBSD 37]

40 minutes ago, Jasoncw said:

@PHBSD A custom LOD is just like any other object, it's just named LOD5, etc. You can use whatever modeling method you prefer to make the LOD, and then rename it to LOD5, etc.

I think my models are too big to be rendered. How can I break the models?

[Jasoncw 11,840]

@PHBSD Can you post a preview render so that it's easier to see what the building looks like, to figure out how to break it down?

[PHBSD 37]

27 minutes ago, Jasoncw said:

@PHBSD Can you post a preview render so that it's easier to see what the building looks like, to figure out how to break it down?

Preview render:

[Jasoncw 11,840]

@PHBSD So my recommendation would be to divide the building into three parts. The main part would be the long middle part of the complex, with the tall tower on it. The second part would be the extension that has the short tower on it, and the third part would be the lowrise part at the very end of the complex.

You would make custom LODs for each parts of the building, but at any given time, only one set of LODs would have the correct names (LOD5, LOD4, and LOD3), you would give the other LODs temporary names so that they don't interfere with the LODs you want to be active at that time. But then you would go through and export each section of the building, each with its respective LODs. However, you wouldn't hide the different sections of the building when you export. The parts of the complex that aren't included in the LOD will be cut off, but the way those building sections will be cutoff will make it so that there's not a seam between all the different parts once you reassemble them in the lot editor. It also ensures that, for example, the buildings will all cast shadows on each other, and things like that.

Among my BATs, some examples of this are the marquee prop from Regal Theater, the season lighting scheme props from the Penobscot Building, and the US Bank sign prop from US Bank. You can look at this in the lot editor to see the weird way that they get cut off at the edges of the LOD. The Regal Theater marquee is the best example because someone might normally only think of exporting the marquee (with the rest of the building hidden), but I kept the rest of the building unhidden so that it would remain in the background behind the marquee and be included in it so that the prop would be seamless.