AndisArt's BAT cookery

[Fantozzi 4,068]

On 27.1.2018 at 1:24 PM, T Wrecks said:

Why does this always happen to content creators?

Rendering. It's like jogging. At a certain age with old artery it's no good for your health.

 

19 minutes ago, andisart said:

What are you thoughts in comparison to the previous version?

Very good. To me it looks closer to the original this way with less white (reflections) - as far as I can tell from the pictures. Quite a bean pole ... if it was a woman, not a building, I would say she's anorexic, so tall and slim. Or ... more politely ... very elegant. And if anorexic girls wear black dresses they look even worse. I mean - more elegant.

Apart from silly jokes - I'm happy to see the progress and it gained appeal with the last update.

 

 

[T Wrecks 10,210]

YES! YES! YES!    <= Those are my first and predominant three thoughts on the comparison to the previous versions. And also: YES!

IMO it looks spot on now.

[AndisArt 2,068]

4 hours ago, matias93 said:

It looks certainly closer to the real one, but the first appears to me as matching better the game. I guess the final say will depend on how they look already lotted

Yes possible, since it's quite dark altogether now, it's not the standard SC4 coloration and will stick out. Question is will it stick out in a negative way or in a good way that fits.

Here is a comparison to the previous version:

(open for fullsize zoom 5)

What do you guys think?  I think the frame could be a little tad brighter. Even though it would be less like the original, it would make it fit more into the tile set.

 

4 hours ago, Fantozzi said:

Very good. To me it looks closer to the original this way with less white (reflections) - as far as I can tell from the pictures. Quite a bean pole ... if it was a woman, not a building, I would say she's anorexic, so tall and slim. Or ... more politely ... very elegant. And if anorexic girls wear black dresses they look even worse. I mean - more elegant.

Apart from silly jokes - I'm happy to see the progress and it gained appeal with the last update.

Ok good, thx for the feedback. And for the first part, haha, that's a comparison I havent thought of before...

Tower Verre, or as it is also called 53W53, is much broader from the side, so it really depends on the angle. Not sure if SC4's four-angle view creates a good impression of the real appearance in this regard. This is how the model looks from the side just for comparison:

So, not that slim at all like from the front. It's a slice! They forgot the rest!

This tower is part of the strong trend in New York to build super-slim supertalls. Real estate is extremly expensive, so it has become more lucrative to build higher (luxurious project anyway). Personally I really like this trend as it has already changed NYs skyline in a very short time and will continue to do so going forward.

A good overview over the recent or under construction (UC) super-slim supertalls in NY can be found here:

http://skyscraper.org/EXHIBITIONS/TEN_TOPS/slender.php

It introduces 17 of them.

Particluarly impressive is the area south of Central Park in Midtown, here is a high concentration of these buildings being errected, view on the park is driving the prices I assume.

In this area being built now:

 

This one on the right is Steinway Tower,  1,438 ft / 438 m, completion this year:

It has a beautiful art-deco facaden AND is being built on top of an old building (consider me speechless):

(photo by by NyConstructionPhoto, on Flickr)

 

Even taller will be Central Park Tower, 1,569 ft / 478 m, completion next year:

 

The NY skyline by 2020:

 

To me it looks futuristic and I love that. It has this Coruscant vibe from Star Wars, lots of slim structures:

 

4 hours ago, T Wrecks said:

YES! YES! YES!    <= Those are my first and predominant three thoughts on the comparison to the previous versions. And also: YES!

IMO it looks spot on now.

Ok, I think what you are saying, is yes... yes? ;D

[Fantozzi 4,068]

Thanks and yes - together those new buildings, the skyline, looks pretty cool. So ... maybe ... you should do all of them?

@matias93 and you are right imho, the second version looks pretty dark ingame - now I noticed the vertical lines on the top are clearer in the first version and get a little lost in the second version.

[MillionSeven 48]

Think the same. Last one is more realistic, but I prefeer the first version, more light and shine.

[T Wrecks 10,210]

Well, the new version IS rather dark. How does it compare to other dark buildings, though? Think of Maxis' Hancock Center, for example. In any case, brightening it a little might be worth a shot. The initial version makes the building look too cluttered IMO. The sweet spot may be somewhere inbetween.

Some interesting NY visualisations there! Not sure I'm into those 'French Fry' skyscrapers, but once there's enough of those, the awkward effect that a single one of them has kinda fades a little, I guess. Oh well, that's not for me to decide anyway, and I have my personal Manhattan photo with good old ESB as the focal point, so why should I care?

[AndisArt 2,068]

@Fantozzi I'm very tempted to do Steinway Tower!

Comparison with the two ingame dark buildings:

I'm not sure what to do. I will experiment. Maybe dark frame and lighter blueish windows (keeping the more realistic reflections)

Any suggestions what to try?

[ABV75 2]

28 minutes ago, andisart said:

@Fantozzi I'm very tempted to do Steinway Tower!

Comparison with the two ingame dark buildings:

I'm not sure what to do. I will experiment. Maybe dark frame and lighter blueish windows (keeping the more realistic reflections)

Any suggestions what to try?

I really really like this new version, seems to represent the tower as it will be! But maybe you can experiment with blue glasses, as seen in the following picture. It should work too! 

[Fantozzi 4,068]

Hm. Now, next to Hancook Center, it doesn't look THAT dark to me. Doesnn't seem to me there's much to correct. Indeed, to my experience, it can help to add contrast by adding slightly complementary colors. Means f.e. adding for the metal a very slight brown touch and to add to the glass a very slight blue touch- warm and cold colours to pronounce different parts of the structure ...

... color can add depth, a 3 dimensional effect on flat things,  working more with hue rather than brightness. On all stuff consisting of pixel, color adds shaprness - but also in RL these things are linked. When evening comes and sun goes down things loose their color, they loose saturation as if hour by hour they become more gray. But the same contour, outlines begin to blur, things become less sharp. The same happens on very bright light - everything is bleeched out and the same it looses contrast and the same looses sharpness. When taking pictures from clouds you often have this problem, that in bright light, they loose their shape and depth and just look like some spots without structure.

So color and contrast and sharpness are aligned with each other. And when colors are very close there is not much contrast and therefore not much shape/depth,.

So maybe to shift colors a little bit against each other may help.  

 

But those were many words and I don't know, if I would change much. 

 

SC4 isn't able, like 3d games, to calculate reflections depending on light sources. Shure, when suns falls in the direction you get the strong reflection you have on this picture. But this is only a moment in the constant movement on earth and most of the time the building in RL will be that dark as you made it.

But if you look on the lower part, where the windows are covered by shadows, one can notice, they arent all plain, they are light blue on the bottom but darker gray on the upper.

@JP Schriefer often makes the windows this way, with some colored angle in each window. But also on yours there are these 'reflection spots' or 'color spots' on the glas. Me, personally, I zjink - they must be brought out just a little bit again, those brighter blueish parts on the glass - and that's all to do.

Hope my words weren't confusing but gave some inspiration for your experiments.

[AndisArt 2,068]

@ABV75  Yes I was going for blue windows in the beginning of experimenting and it would look good, just not what the actual building will look like, especially from the top-down angle that SC4 has. (When looking up sykscrapers or from the side also they will often appear blue because the sky is reflected) So I think I want to make the dark version work better.

@Fantozzi Thank you, very helpful suggestion! Using the complementary color contrast is what they did in Hancock Center very effectively. I also looked into @JP Schriefer 's BATs and what you described with different colored windows (I believe this is an effect of blinds behind the windows changing the appearance of the glas, correct me if I'm wrong JP). What both have in common is they are used on buildings that dont have a prominent glass front like Tower Verre. I'm unsure it would work, since like @T Wrecks has also pointed out, it looked too cluttered before when there was too much going on in the windows, since they cover most of the surface. So I think the windows need to remain looking relatively clear. That leaves not much room for more prominent contrast.

I implemented your tip in a different way: more subtle color contrast and more brightness contrast between steel frame. 

The difference is subtle, but the building pops out more:

If I change the colors even more it will start to look not like the real one anymore. Question is, is it good now like this or does it need further changing.

[matias93 7,535]

I think that's perfect for release, it blends perfectly now!

[MillionSeven 48]

Better

 

[T Wrecks 10,210]

I think that did the trick!

[Fantozzi 4,068]

Hey, wow. Yes, the finer structures/lines pop out again this way, it simply looks sharper, more detailed . Looks perfect to me.

Thank you. It's a delight. Great work.

[AndisArt 2,068]

Ok great thanks for your help and feedback!

I finetuned the above approach a bit more and brought out more contrast still, this is the final update. Rendering now, release hopefully this weekend ^^

 

[bladeberkman 720]

Super in love with this building. Hoping to make a “dark”-themed downtown at some point and think the darker, less-overtly reflective versions look best. They blend well with other dark-themed custom towers on the STEX, too. 

Wonderful work! 

[elavery 1,013]

Awesome work on this. All of these new buildings in Manhattan are cool from an architectural standpoint, but I must say they are changing the feel of NYC. Many apartments, particularly on lower floors are receiving very limited natural light due to giant towers going up all around them. Also, many long-term restaurants, businesses are being forced out by developers and their million-dollar apartments. The lively midtown feel is being replaced with the more austere feel of downtown. I fear that eventually Manhattan will just be a Citibank and Starbucks on every corner with no independent stores whatsoever. The inevitable price of gentrification I guess. Anyhow, I digress, great work Andisart!

[Terring 6,476]

Surprisingly, it looks very cyberpunk and badass. Brilliant work!

[AndisArt 2,068]

thanks for your lovely comments

The rendered file shows aliasing on the edges in game :-/

Also visible in zoom 5:

I rendered with Max 2011, so not sure why this is happening. I thought this issue is only happening with newer versions of Max?

I already pasted the scene in a clean file before.

Any suggestions?

________________________________________________________________________

EDIT:  upon examination of the other buildings in the game, I notice that all edges of buildings which are not orthogonal have some form of aliasing. So is this normal? Nothing I can do about it maybe. Or it is down to my display settings, not sure. 

[Jasoncw 11,949]

Yeah I think it's just showing up more because it's a diagonal surface, and the building is really dark and the road behind it is dark, and the render background is grey. If you make the background a color that matches the building facade it should look much better. 

[AndisArt 2,068]

58 minutes ago, Jasoncw said:

Yeah I think it's just showing up more because it's a diagonal surface, and the building is really dark and the road behind it is dark, and the render background is grey. If you make the background a color that matches the building facade it should look much better. 

Ok sounds like I should definitely give that a shot. Can you point to where I can change the background color? You don't mean in the Environment window right? Cause that is always set to black.

_________________________________________________

EDIT:  found it, mr Sky from Environment tab, Ground color value, right?

[Jasoncw 11,949]

I think so, yeah.

[AndisArt 2,068]

@Jasoncw Yes! That was it, solved: aliasing much less prominent when edge is grey :-)

[JP Schriefer 5,591]

You are doing a great job here! BTW that's one of a few modern buildings I really like in NYC

On 2/1/2018 at 1:08 PM, andisart said:

@JP Schriefer 's BATs and what you described with different colored windows (I believe this is an effect of blinds behind the windows changing the appearance of the glas, correct me if I'm wrong JP).

Yeah I do that to simulate blinds indeed.

[AndisArt 2,068]

Tower Verre - 53W53 released!

 

 

 

 

 

Next in my BAT kitchen will be a visit back to a very much Dubai cuisine.... Stay tuned!

 

[Glenni 1,447]

Just thought i'd drop by and say you did an absolutely outstanding job on this. My favourite is the artsy multicoloured panels that light up at night at the base, I love that look. 

[JP Schriefer 5,591]

The final product became a piece of art! Great job

[Hanson784 165]

Great work on this NYC supertall! The modeling and textures are superb; it will be interesting to see its impact on the skyline of SimCity when I plop it down in my New York recreation.

Agree with Elavery though about how the tall towers are turning Manhattan into Coruscant and changing the character of city in RL.... mostly built for multi-millionaire/ billionaire tenants. Developers have gone a bit overboard with how many they're building IMO. Though, I've grown to accept 432 Park Avenue and One 57 as a part of the skyline, despite being opposed to them when they were initially built.

[rsc204 21,866]

Even with the hideous render times, you still took the effort to make both MN/DN renders, which is cool. But, all that aside, thanks for bringing us a really great new skyscraper to play with. Just catching up with the last few pages shows a tenacious effort to perfect everything and the end results are the fruits of that labour. I'm not a prolific user of such tall buildings, but I can sure appreciate top notch work when I see it.

[AndisArt 2,068]

@Glenni thanks very much, very kind, glad you enjoy it that much!

@JP Schriefer thanks my friend, you flatter me

@Hanson784 thanks! well by the sound of it you might grow accustomed to the new towers as well. you live in the city?

@rsc204 very welcome and thanks very much

 

here's a preview on the next dish being cooked: