(Mod) AMPS Development Thread

[Kloudkicker 4,561]

GREENVILLE, SC USA 300 Garlington Road Greenville, SC 29615 USA

"This is the largest gas turbine manufacturing plant with the most powerful off-grid gas turbine validation facility in the world. GE rigorously tests gas turbines here prior to field installation. The service center also offers on-site inspection, repair, and engineering."

"Did you know? Within 10 minutes of dispatch, one GE 7F.05 gas turbine can generate enough energy to power 225,000 homes."

https://www.ge.com/power/services/service-centers/greenville-south-carolina-usa

[Map Link]

 

The Sim Gideon Power Plant is a 620 megawatt (MW), natural gas fired power plant located near Bastrop, Texas in Bastrop County, Texas. It is owned and operated by the Lower Colorado River Authority. The Sim Gideon Power Plant consists of three generating units that operate via simple cycle combustion turbine utilizing natural gas. The plant, along with Lost Pines Power Project 1, is part of the Lost Pines Power Park.

Three generating units compose the Sim Gideon Power Plant:

• Unit 1, completed in 1965, with a generating capacity of 140 MW
• Unit 2, completed in 1968, with a generating capacity of 140 MW
• Unit 3, completed in 1971, with a generating capacity of 340 MW

Cooling water is provided by Lake Bastrop, a 900-acre (360 ha) freshwater reservoir.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sim_Gideon_Power_Plant

@Simmer2 This is the site you want for the pictures. https://albraden.photoshelter.com/gallery/Sim-Gideon-NG-Plant/G0000CMnp_8X9RVY/C0000KSoR6wjNIs8 

Edit: More info here https://amp.en.google-info.cn/3343942/1/sim-gideon-power-plant.html

 

 

https://www.powermag.com/old-plant-new-mission/

2nd EDIT: A few more. Is this enough for you @Simmer2?

 

Duke Energy Center (moved to bat request, https://community.simtropolis.com/forums/topic/30082-bat-request-thread/?do=findComment&comment=1750716)

 

  Edited March 21, 2021 by Kloudkicker  
Added more, moved part to BAT request

[Simmer2 23,785]

@Kloudkicker Not even close but I may be able to concoct something based on the main blue building. It will be a gas power plant such as the one you have shown.

I'm preparing the invoice. Lets see..uhmm 45 hours times $80 per hour equal to....

[Propfam 2,286]

4 hours ago, Kloudkicker said:

GREENVILLE, SC USA 300 Garlington Road Greenville, SC 29615 USA

"This is the largest gas turbine manufacturing plant with the most powerful off-grid gas turbine validation facility in the world. GE rigorously tests gas turbines here prior to field installation. The service center also offers on-site inspection, repair, and engineering."

"Did you know? Within 10 minutes of dispatch, one GE 7F.05 gas turbine can generate enough energy to power 225,000 homes."

https://www.ge.com/power/services/service-centers/greenville-south-carolina-usa

[Map Link]

 

The Sim Gideon Power Plant is a 620 megawatt (MW), natural gas fired power plant located near Bastrop, Texas in Bastrop County, Texas. It is owned and operated by the Lower Colorado River Authority. The Sim Gideon Power Plant consists of three generating units that operate via simple cycle combustion turbine utilizing natural gas. The plant, along with Lost Pines Power Project 1, is part of the Lost Pines Power Park.

Three generating units compose the Sim Gideon Power Plant:

• Unit 1, completed in 1965, with a generating capacity of 140 MW
• Unit 2, completed in 1968, with a generating capacity of 140 MW
• Unit 3, completed in 1971, with a generating capacity of 340 MW

Cooling water is provided by Lake Bastrop, a 900-acre (360 ha) freshwater reservoir.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sim_Gideon_Power_Plant

@Simmer2 This is the site you want for the pictures. https://albraden.photoshelter.com/gallery/Sim-Gideon-NG-Plant/G0000CMnp_8X9RVY/C0000KSoR6wjNIs8 

Edit: More info here https://amp.en.google-info.cn/3343942/1/sim-gideon-power-plant.html

 

 

https://www.powermag.com/old-plant-new-mission/

2nd EDIT: A few more. Is this enough for you @Simmer2?

 

Duke Energy Center in Charlotte NC

  

The Duke Energy Center is a 786-foot tall, 48-floor skyscraper in Charlotte, North Carolina. When completed in 2010, it was the largest building in Charlotte, second tallest building in Charlotte, 63rd tallest building in the United States, and the tallest in the world to use precast double tees.

Wikipedia Address: 550 S Tryon St, Charlotte, NC 28202
Height: 786
CTBUH Floors: 48
Floor area: 1,558,883 sq ft (144,825.0 m2)

But why the design is somewhat similar to one of Hudson Yards buildings? The roof is one prominent feature where the similarity almost exist. Also, the same building also has Bank of China-esque design.

By the way, the height, the floor count, and the floor count is almost same as Wisma 46. The difference is in the placement. I think the Duke Energy Tower is placed right by the street. While the Wisma 46 is placed in a complex, a common practice amongst Indonesian towers for some reasons.

[RobertaME 1,376]

7 hours ago, Simmer2 said:

I charge $80 USD an hour....

Do you take IOUs? :^Þ

7 hours ago, Simmer2 said:

@RobertaME I would need a location for that building. I need to 3d Google map the crap out of it before I make a decision.

6100 Neil Rd, Reno, NV 89511

Seriously though, there's no rush on any of this. I'm still trying to hammer out the wrinkles of the mod's queries for the buildings already covered, let alone adding any new buildings and even larger queries. I've got most of them working well, but I ran into a weirdness yesterday afternoon.

I had placed several 25, 250, and 500 kVA transformers along with a 240 MW generator, an Inverter, a few PV Panel Sets, and the Wind Farm Maintenance Facility, to test their new queries. The WFMF and Inverter queries didn't come up at all, the query of one 250 kVA was showing it as a 500 kVA, and two of the 500 kVAs wouldn't query either. (even though the others would) I bulldozed the wonky 250 kVA and replaced it, and it started working OK... so I tried to bulldoze the faulty 500 kVAs and they wouldn't bulldoze. The game was also not counting them as present, even though it was counting 4 other 500 kVAs just fine.

At this point I have no idea what happened. The stats for the 500 kVA are all derived from a main Cohort file, so they should all have identical stats and functionality. None of them should act any different than any others.

I think I broke it! :^/

I've since re-written the queries, so I'll test things out and see if it breaks again.

::fingers crossed::

Quote

@Kloudkicker Not even close but I may be able to concoct something based on the main blue building. It will be a gas power plant such as the one you have shown.

I'm preparing the invoice. Lets see..uhmm 45 hours times $80 per hour equal to....

Having a larger NG plant WOULD come in handy. As it stands, the largest being 6.5 MW is kinda dinky.

This game has always needed larger power facilities. Most are less than 45,000 ft²... which is TINY for a power plant.

 

 

[Kloudkicker 4,561]

23 minutes ago, chfzdn said:

But why the design is somewhat similar to one of Hudson Yards buildings? The roof is one prominent feature where the similarity almost exist. Also, the same building also has Bank of China-esque design.

By the way, the height, the floor count, and the floor count is almost same as Wisma 46. The difference is in the placement. I think the Duke Energy Tower is placed right by the street. While the Wisma 46 is placed in a complex, a common practice amongst Indonesian towers for some reasons.

Not trying to copy anything made already. I am just throwing ideas out there. If these are made already or something close, then please post a link. I am only pulling these off google and the web. Not even looked on here, TBH.

 

9 minutes ago, RobertaME said:

::fingers crossed::

We have faith in you.

My city so far with the new "SPA" mod. I have almost 20,000 and 6,500 next door with only 175 jobs with most working here. I am at 67 years and just received the 6MVA Industrial Transformers. Nothing real exciting to tell about. Slow going starting anew.

  Edited March 4, 2021 by Kloudkicker  

[RobertaME 1,376]

34 minutes ago, Kloudkicker said:

We have faith in you.

Certainly more than I have in myself. Thanks!

35 minutes ago, Kloudkicker said:

My city so far with the new "SPA" mod.

OK... I think I see why you were having so much money trouble. You're using a LOT of generators, Wind Turbines, and a W2E plant. They're all REALLY expensive to maintain. Way more expensive than an equal power capacity of other Power Plants, Substations, and Transformers.

I'm going to need to throw in an advisor message from Jonas to "push" the player toward full scale power plants by explaining the cost difference. Wind Turbines in particular are VERY expensive if you only are using a few of them. That's due to the flat cost of the Wind Farm Maintenance Facility... it adds a lot of upkeep to the Wind Turbines on a per megawatt basis. I know the Wind Turbine was the "go to" power plant for early development in vanilla SC4, but under the SPA it's just not viable for small towns. Too much overhead for small deployments. Those two Wind Turbines are costing you a TON in upkeep, whereas in a large array of 20+ Turbines the cost of the WFMF is negligible.

Try dropping the Turbines and WFMF for now, build up some transformer capacity, then some distribution capacity, then build some small power plants to take the place of all those generators I see around your city. Maybe the 4.5 MW Oil Power Plant. It's cheaper than generators, less polluting, still gives Peak power, can replace almost all your smaller generators, and you don't need Transmission Substations to build it. Just an idea.

Thanks SO much for doing this testing! I'd love to do more, but I'm wrapped up in getting the rest of the mod working and non-SC4 stuff... I haven't even had a chance to play with my own mod yet! :,^(

[Propfam 2,286]

1 hour ago, Kloudkicker said:

Not trying to copy anything made already. I am just throwing ideas out there. If these are made already or something close, then please post a link. I am only pulling these off google and the web. Not even looked on here, TBH.

 

We have faith in you.

My city so far with the new "SPA" mod. I have almost 20,000 and 6,500 next door with only 175 jobs with most working here. I am at 67 years and just received the 6MVA Industrial Transformers. Nothing real exciting to tell about. Slow going starting anew.

Sorry, I'm not intend to hurt you and your selection. I'm fine with your choice of towers. I just criticized the towers as they're standing and not because your choice. I'm sorry. I'm not intend to make some drama here.

[Kloudkicker 4,561]

6 minutes ago, RobertaME said:

Those two Wind Turbines are costing you a TON in upkeep, whereas in a large array of 20+ Turbines the cost of the WFMF is negligible.

Try dropping the Turbines and WFMF for now, build up some transformer capacity, then some distribution capacity, then build some small power plants to take the place of all those generators I see around your city. Maybe the 4.5 MW Oil Power Plant. It's cheaper than generators, less polluting, still gives Peak power, can replace almost all your smaller generators, and you don't need Transmission Substations to build it. Just an idea.

Thanks for the info. I have not looked into the budget for anything really. Just be adding more and more. I have only removed two wind turbines so far. I had shifted the civic services to the center while upgrading them and reducing the budget by removing the smaller buildings of multiples. I have a few generators that at at the end of their life. and will be starting a project to replace them, like you mentioned. That's a good plan and sounds logical to me.

After I get that under control, then I will upgrade the zone densities and pack in those taxes paying sims in. All that should make up the $4,000 budget shortfall, ATM. But they love me, +90 MR, EQ  +185, HQ +95

 

15 minutes ago, chfzdn said:

I'm not intend to make some drama here.

None taken my friend. Were all good 

 

18 minutes ago, chfzdn said:

I just criticized the towers as they're standing

(I still don't understand you though. Is this not a good thing,  LOL, sorry, me make a funny! )

I really don't understand what you are trying to say, sorry. But I did find this

Not bad looking, I think the night scene looks better than the day, IMO. But I've never used it before.

[Kloudkicker 4,561]

Really amazing job you have done @RobertaME . I am happy with the way everything has been going. Just seems like a few too many of the smaller buildings needed. Maybe it's me thou as you pointed out earlier. I do have to admit, it is kind of like a newer game. Having a ton of new options in the power menu is a bit much, but not bad. I know this is something that will be changed with progress made by on the mods that are involved. It's fun to have a new goal in the game to work toward. There's at least one happy tester so far, me. 

[Simmer2 23,785]

@Kloudkicker....

[RobertaME 1,376]

1 hour ago, Simmer2 said:

@Kloudkicker....

 

Why do I have a certain song running through my head now? ;^)

That is awesome, @Simmer2! Is it a static model or can it drive around? If we can get it as a dynamic model that drives around, even if it never stops to "check the lines" as you show here, that would add just the right touch to this mod! Cool either way!

Edit: Oh! I just had a thought! If we can get this as a driving automata, we can create "utilities" U-drive-it missions! "Drive around to 3-5 transformers and check them out." etc.

Thoughts?

Edit 2: On second thought... that may be a little grandiose for this little mod. Maybe sometime in the future... when things are more settled and WORKING right!

  Edited March 4, 2021 by RobertaME  
Brainstorm... or not

[Kloudkicker 4,561]

39 minutes ago, Simmer2 said:

@Kloudkicker....

Sublime!

[Kloudkicker 4,561]

1 hour ago, RobertaME said:

That is awesome, @Simmer2! Is it a static model or can it drive around? If we can get it as a dynamic model that drives around, even if it never stops to "check the lines" as you show here, that would add just the right touch to this mod! Cool either way!

Edit: Oh! I just had a thought! If we can get this as a driving automata, we can create "utilities" U-drive-it missions! "Drive around to 3-5 transformers and check them out." etc.

I wonder if someone could take the models @Simmer2 made of those really neat and kicka@@ trucks, and do the automating of them. Maybe slip up the work. I would if I knew how.

  Edited March 4, 2021 by Kloudkicker  

[RobertaME 1,376]

4 hours ago, Kloudkicker said:

I wonder if someone could take the models @Simmer2 made of those really neat and kicka@@ trucks, and do the automating of them. Maybe slip up the work. I would if I knew how.

Let's hold that thought for now. At the moment, I'm still getting things nailed down for the next update.

Speaking of which, here's the latest development:

As you can see, I've gotten the Queries up and running. In case anyone's wondering, I was able to build more Distribution Substations than my current Transformer load allows due to the lack of instant updating on reward lot limits, but I was able to figure out a way to limit capacity anyway. That way if you build a bunch of transformers, then substations, if you later bulldoze the transformers and don't replace them, you can't actually USE the distribution capacity until your transformer rating is back up to equal the distribution rating. Pretty slick, huh? :^)

I'm still having oddities with a few of the Commercial Transformers. The listed Transformer capacity should be 1,000 kVA higher than it is and two of the 500 kVA Commercial Transformers aren't showing up in the Utilities budget window. I haven't isolated WHICH ones are causing the trouble. I'm going to have to selectively go through and just use ONE at a time in a new city to test which ones don't show in the budget and transformer capacity totals.

Opinions on the new query data style welcome. I'd like to see what other people think before I use that style on the rest of the power lots.

[Propfam 2,286]

3 minutes ago, RobertaME said:

Let's hold that thought for now. At the moment, I'm still getting things nailed down for the next update.

Speaking of which, here's the latest development:

As you can see, I've gotten the Queries up and running. I'm still having oddities with a few of the Commercial Transformers. The listed Transformer capacity should be 1,000 kVA higher than it is and two of the 500 kVA Commercial Transformers aren't showing up in the Utilities budget window. I haven't isolated WHICH ones are causing the trouble. I'm going to have to selectively go through and just use ONE at a time in a new city to test which ones don't show in the budget and transformer capacity totals.

Opinions on the new query data style welcome. I'd like to see what other people think before I use that style on the rest of the power lots.

Ah yes, the number of fuses blown. Same as the golf score of Country Green or the civil score of City Hall or the number of uninvited guests of Mayor House of the number of pigeon nest of mayor statues.

[RobertaME 1,376]

2 hours ago, chfzdn said:

Ah yes, the number of fuses blown. Same as the golf score of Country Green or the civil score of City Hall or the number of uninvited guests of Mayor House of the number of pigeon nest of mayor statues.

ALL of the power lots now have a "goofy stat". The difference is that these are actually random. The "goofy stat" native to the game are not... I think they're just a variant way to show the Mayor Rating. Mine are using the math.random() function of LUA, so they change EVERY time you query the lot... even with no time passing. Not only that, they include a factor that adjusts the value based on what the stat is... so the more PV panels you build, the more "Shaded Panels" you can have. It's still just a meaningless fluff data point, but it's a PROPORTIONAL one! ;^)

Edit: I put WAY too much thought into this part! :^Þ

Edit 2: Update:

So I did my testing and it turns out it's two of the 500 kVA transformers that are not reading right... but they are SOMETIMES. ::shrug::

The last two in the menu list, TGI 6534284A-A8FBD372-6D309E86 and TGI 6534284A-07BDDF1C-ED30A01E are both only registering with the game partially, and I can't find a pattern to it. If I place 6 of each, only 2-3 will register as present in the query for transformers present.

Here I started a new city, built one short street, a 240 kW Generator, and 6 500 kVA Commercial Transformers of TGI ED30A01E. After two months the query for the transformers only shows 1,00 kVA instead of 3,000. (500 x 6 = 3000)

Here it shows 6 Commercial transformers in the budget...

...and here after I bulldozed them, the "missing 4" transformers are still in the budget, as though I didn't bulldoze them.

It's weird and inconsistent. Sometimes (rarely) all will register as present and no phantom transformers remain after bulldozing. Sometimes all 6 will be "phantom lots" that show in the budget but don't count, and if I bulldoze them all 6 remain in the budget.

If anyone has a clue as to what might cause this kind of behavior, PLEASE let me know! Thanks! :^)

  Edited March 4, 2021 by RobertaME  
Update

[Simmer2 23,785]

11 hours ago, RobertaME said:

Why do I have a certain song running through my head now? ;^)

That is awesome, @Simmer2! Is it a static model or can it drive around? If we can get it as a dynamic model that drives around, even if it never stops to "check the lines" as you show here, that would add just the right touch to this mod! Cool either way!

Edit: Oh! I just had a thought! If we can get this as a driving automata, we can create "utilities" U-drive-it missions! "Drive around to 3-5 transformers and check them out." etc.

Thoughts?

Edit 2: On second thought... that may be a little grandiose for this little mod. Maybe sometime in the future... when things are more settled and WORKING right!

That's just a scene I made to showcase a new line of props for an upcoming lot I'm making. (I have been known to make a "scene" once in a while lol)

Tbh I have never done automata so for now I will skip the process

[Kloudkicker 4,561]

7 hours ago, RobertaME said:

Edit 2: Update:

So I did my testing and it turns out it's two of the 500 kVA transformers that are not reading right... but they are SOMETIMES. ::shrug::

The last two in the menu list, TGI 6534284A-A8FBD372-6D309E86 and TGI 6534284A-07BDDF1C-ED30A01E are both only registering with the game partially, and I can't find a pattern to it. If I place 6 of each, only 2-3 will register as present in the query for transformers present.

Here I started a new city, built one short street, a 240 kW Generator, and 6 500 kVA Commercial Transformers of TGI ED30A01E. After two months the query for the transformers only shows 1,00 kVA instead of 3,000. (500 x 6 = 3000)

Here it shows 6 Commercial transformers in the budget...

...and here after I bulldozed them, the "missing 4" transformers are still in the budget, as though I didn't bulldoze them.

It's weird and inconsistent. Sometimes (rarely) all will register as present and no phantom transformers remain after bulldozing. Sometimes all 6 will be "phantom lots" that show in the budget but don't count, and if I bulldoze them all 6 remain in the budget.

If anyone has a clue as to what might cause this kind of behavior, PLEASE let me know! Thanks! :^)

@RobertaME FYI

This is strange. I have noticed when placing two of those styles, and could be them 2 but not sure. But when ploping sometimes I would hear the noise of the plop and a noise of improper placement(placement not allowed) following directly afterwards. But only seems to be happening in this group of lots and maybe only two of them. I thought it was the MMP bug thing, but maybe it's more than that. 

Maybe related, maybe not?

I almost missed your update!

[RobertaME 1,376]

37 minutes ago, Kloudkicker said:

This is strange. I have noticed when placing two of those styles, and could be them 2 but not sure. But when ploping sometimes I would hear the noise of the plop and a noise of improper placement(placement not allowed) following directly afterwards. But only seems to be happening in this group of lots and maybe only two of them.

These two?

 

Those are the ones causing the issue in my Alpha-2 working version.

40 minutes ago, Kloudkicker said:

I thought it was the MMP bug thing, but maybe it's more than that.

Sorry... I don't think I know that bug. Can you provide a reference link?

 

41 minutes ago, Kloudkicker said:

I almost missed your update!

Sorry! I tend to just edit my post if it's the most recent post in a thread. Old habit from years of being on forums that frown on "spam posting" one after another of your own posts without comment from other posters. I have no idea if that's "frowned upon" here... but it's an ingrained habit now and I don't see myself changing it anytime soon! :^Þ

Hope you like what you see! (still WIP... I need to get the query to identify the creator of the lot for proper crediting... I already have "Created by..." in the lot descriptions, but I want it in the query too... and it's being difficult!)

[rivit 3,391]

8 hours ago, RobertaME said:

Opinions on the new query data style welcome. I'd like to see what other people think before I use that style on the rest of the power lots.

Style looks fine to me. Looking at these examples I see you present data for the unit and data for the whole network in some cases - if you could separate those with something (even a little extra space would do) it would potentially make the query info less confusing. (But I appreciate that's my preference for absorbing info.)

[Cyclone Boom 16,852]

21 minutes ago, RobertaME said:

Old habit from years of being on forums that frown on "spam posting" one after another of your own posts without comment from other posters. I have no idea if that's "frowned upon" here... but it's an ingrained habit now and I don't see myself changing it anytime soon!

We absolutely understand this too how there's a common rule about this on some forums.

Here at Simtropolis, Cori and I have aimed to relax the hard stance about this, and so we encourage double posts for this purpose. That way it informs others when new info is added, since edits can so easily go unnoticed. Of course, to make corrections and editing is the best way, but significantly new info goes well in a new reply. Alternatively if preferring to edit rather than post in succession, it could be worth editing an @ mention to the person replying to, since that way they'll be beeped (notified) of the edit made.

Sometimes we do merge posts using our moderator tools, and this is done to consolidate like-for-like posts to keep them grouped. We'll take care of this side of things, and no worries about it when that seems to be worthwhile doing. The aim in those cases being to help the flow of a thread for people reading.

Meanwhile, great job with your power project. It's coming along well indeed!

[RobertaME 1,376]

7 minutes ago, rivit said:

if you could separate those with something (even a little extra space would do) it would potentially make the query info less confusing.

I can certainly do that! I'll work it into the finalized version. (it's good for people that want to see the separation in data sets and is harmless for people that don't need the visual separation, so no reason to NOT do it! :^)

11 minutes ago, Cyclone Boom said:

Here at Simtropolis, Cori and I have aimed to relax the hard stance about this, and so we encourage double posts for this purpose.

I see. I will make an effort then to suppress my habit of editing the last post if I have new details. No promises, but I'll give it my best!

And TY for the kudos!

UPDATE!!!!

I was talking with another person via PM and realized I never fully explained how the final version will work in regards to what other things you have installed.

Originally, I was going to break up the install into chunks that would be installed if you had the corresponding lot installed. That process has now taken a back seat to the NEW process. Observe...

This is about the middle of my build menu with my SPA Alpha-2 working version installed, along with @Kloudkicker's Wind Farm Maintenance Facility, and @Simmer2's Tesla Powerpack lots and Modular PV Panels. (along with other lots, both supported and unsupported by the SPA)

Now I exit the game, go to my plugins folder, and all I do is move the "SM2 Tesla Power Storage Pack" folder to my desktop... nothing else. Then I re-load the game and...

The Alpha-2 version DYNAMICALLY detects what's installed and only works with those lots that are actually installed, without making any other changes.

So, that means ONE install process will work, regardless of what supported content the player has installed, and the only hard dependencies will be the bare-minimum lots necessary to build with... transformers, the WFMF, @Simmer2's substations, and at least ONE generator. (three options available) Of course, it works BETTER with more supported lots installed, but now the requirement for getting the mod is SIGNIFICANTLY easier to get into, and doesn't require any action on the part of the player when they want to add SPA-supported content... other than installing the supported lot(s).

Thoughts welcome!

[Kloudkicker 4,561]

52 minutes ago, RobertaME said:

Sorry... I don't think I know that bug. Can you provide a reference link?

My noticed issue slightly resembles this. As if its being clicked twice.

[Kiwiwriter47 472]

A lot of cool stuff on this thread. I have to come here more often.

So...what is THE BEST combination for power from both a budgetary and effectiveness point of view?

Here in New Jersey, we're shutting down Oyster Creek Nuclear Power Plant, and New York is telling everyone that Indian Point is perfectly safe...but being shut down anyway. Figure that one out.

[RobertaME 1,376]

23 minutes ago, Kloudkicker said:

My noticed issue slightly resembles this. As if its being clicked twice.

Read through it. It may be similar, but since I run Win7Ultimate it's extremely unlikely to be the same root cause. (double-clicking) Also the issue is isolated to those two lots. I ran the test against all other lots and none exhibited the same behavior. Neither did any other lot. (I tested them all, just in case)

For the time being, I've added a patch to the SPA that disables these two lots until we can isolate the cause.

Since the two lots share all Building Exemplar Properties via the Parent Cohort other than the "Exemplar Name", "Item Icon" and "Lot Resource Key" Properties, it has to be one of those three things that's causing it. I changed the Lot Resource Key to one of the known-good ones and the issue went away...

So... there's something in the Lot Exemplar that's borking in runtime. Since my knowledge of Lot Exemplars is extremely limited, I'll have to leave it up to someone more qualified to diagnose. Until then those lots are disabled in the SPA. (they seem to work fine with the SPA removed... so it's got to be some sort of compatibility issue)

[RobertaME 1,376]

1 hour ago, Kiwiwriter47 said:

A lot of cool stuff on this thread. I have to come here more often.

Dive on in!

1 hour ago, Kiwiwriter47 said:

So...what is THE BEST combination for power from both a budgetary and effectiveness point of view?

Within the rules of the SPA, If you're just talking money, 60% Coal and 40% Oil... the largest you can afford and use. They're both cheap and effective. You might get a FEW complaints from the Environmental advisor... and getting High-tech Industry to take root in your city might be a TAD difficult... but it's cheap! Hey... that's the reason there's so many coal plants still running around the world. It's cheap and it works. Throw in Oil and Natural Gas to cover Peak loads and you're golden. (whichever is cheaper depends on the price of a barrel of oil and the price of NG... so flip a coin)

Of course, there's OTHER considerations... remember... NO POLITICS! Let's be civil, people... ;^)

Solar, Wind and Geothermal are all more expensive options, but they have no pollution to deal with. Nuclear is clean as well, and cheaper than Solar and Wind, but Geothermal is cheaper than all of them... but then Geothermal is VERY expensive to build and can only compete if you're not using any other Base Load power sources. (it's how I limited its use... I couldn't limit it to certain geological areas, so I limited it economically)

Nuclear now comes in three sizes (small, large, and ridiculously monstrous) and two types: Inland and Coastal. Inland plants suck down HUGE amounts of water... 24,000 to 1.2 million m³ per month... because that's realistic. That's why we build most nuclear power plants near a natural water source as Coastal plants. It takes 1.5 m³ of water per megawatt of generated electricity... both IRL and in the SPA.

Wind only gets even close to competitive if you build a LOT of them... 20+ at LEAST. That means most small towns can't use a wind turbine as their first and only power source under the SPA... it's simply too expensive to deploy in less than dozens.

Solar is like the middle-ground. Not only do you have Solar Thermal like the Maxis solar plant, but several options of photovoltaic (PV) solar that are available right from day 1. They're cheaper over the long haul than Wind, but expensive to build in the short term. They're the only really viable Intermediate power source for a small town... but it can only fulfill 40% of demand. The other 60% has to come from something more reliable.

Natural Gas is the fill-in for when Oil plants either produce too much power to effectively use or pollution reduction is more important than Simolians. It only comes in Small Power Plant sizes and is more expensive to run. It also needs a certain degree of Manufacturing or High-tech Industry to get any but the smallest plants. They drive the demand for NG power.

Waste to Energy gets rid of a problem... by creating another one... at a premium price. It's one of the more expensive ways to get power. The pollution it generates is the problem it creates. Of course, if you have sufficient High-tech industry you can try for a CLEAN Waste to Energy Plant... but that 's trading clean air and no garbage for a money pit. It's one of the most expensive ways to get power... other than a Wind Farm of 4 or fewer turbines!

Speaking of Clean, if you have the high-tech industry and sufficient power demands, you can go for Clean Coal. Less polluting than Natural Gas of the same output, and cheaper than NG as well, like regular Coal plants it can only meet 60% of your power demand, so you're STILL going to need something else to fill the gaps.

Fusion, if you can get there, is the ultimate. Clean, (relatively) cheap, and meets all power needs. That's why we've spent TRILLIONS trying to get it to work for the last 50 years. In the SPA all you need is sufficient High-tech population, power demand, and transmission capacity and bingo! Cheap clean power!

Then you have add-ons, like @Simmer2's Tesla Powerpack lots. They can turn Intermediate power sources like Wind or Solar into Peak power that can meet ALL power needs. But you're going to PAY for it! Expensive and requires high-tech industry to get them.

But that's just the back-end of power management. Generation is only one step. You need Transmission Substations to have any plant of 8 MW or more, plus sufficient Distribution Substations to move the power around cities, then a crank-ton of Transformers to turn that into usable power for homes and businesses. All this needs balanced against cost, impact, (people don't like living near buzzing substations and giant transformers) and power demand.

Does that answer your question? ;^) ::giggle::

 

[RobertaME 1,376]

Must... not... edit... last... post.... Gah!

I actually had to stop myself TWICE from posting and not editing an existing post. This is HARD! :^Þ

@rivit

Let me know if this is what you're talking about, please.

Is that sufficient or should it specify that the lower stats are global, not specific to this lot.

Input appreciated!

[rivit 3,391]

That will do the trick. A "--- Network Stats ---"  label would probably be even better but space is always at a premium and you probably wont always display global stats as well. 

  Edited March 5, 2021 by rivit  
completed thought

[RobertaME 1,376]

24 minutes ago, rivit said:

A "--- Network Stats ---"  label would probably be even better but space is always at a premium

Not an issue. There's enough room there to put a centered text in there. Here's a quick preview:

I just threw that together in Paint.net using a similar font size and type... but it should look something like that.

Will that work?

Edit: Or...

Maybe Regional instead of Global would be better...

Edit 2: OR....

OK... Regional sounds wrong... it might confuse people. City-wide?

  Edited March 5, 2021 by RobertaME  
Or...

[rivit 3,391]

Yes that looks great - just Power Network would be sufficient