Natir

I really want to love this mod. My main gripe is the map editor. I cannot select a different starting point and have never been able to with this mod. You are maxed at 57 (or was it 59?) tiles so the fact that is says 81 tiles is very misleading since you cannot unlock 81 tiles. I just want a 49 tiles mod as that seems to be a nice number in terms of an even amount of tiles (7x7) which we know can be unlocked without too many issues. It would be nice to have a 49 tiles mod and then have an optional mod to go along with it that unlocked the tree/object limit. Whoever was working on the tree limit remover has taken the mod down.

That's what I'm getting from it. Although, I didn't think they did that either. I just thought that the resources were moved into a different place. I just tried it again to make sure and the resources stay where they are (outside of the UI shift if that still happens). Just wanted to point out the image is very misleading and people may think the mod actually increases the amount of resources on the map. Thank you Natir, I will fix the resources image. No problem.

That's what I'm getting from it. Although, I didn't think they did that either. I just thought that the resources were moved into a different place. I just tried it again to make sure and the resources stay where they are (outside of the UI shift if that still happens). Just wanted to point out the image is very misleading and people may think the mod actually increases the amount of resources on the map.

Only cosmetic and a couple UI mods work offline (like extended worker data, etc). I believe all mods that require offline only tell you as well. You will experience rollbacks if you try and play online with them if it states offline only. I believe that you meant only cosmetic and a couple UI mods work online sorry, but just wanted to clarify in case anyone got confused by your answer. Yeah, sorry.

In the Image 4 you guys linked, do resources get stretched/increased that much with what was in the ground? I didn't think it did that. Am I wrong in this?

Only cosmetic and a couple UI mods work offline (like extended worker data, etc). I believe all mods that require offline only tell you as well. You will experience rollbacks if you try and play online with them if it states offline only.

All mods go in the SimCityData folder. 2 scrips go into the packages folder if your mod needs it. It should be packaged with it or tell you if it does. Any mod that lists their entire mod goes into the UserData/Packages folder is outdated. Ignore it.

The White House - Landmark The Pentagon - Maybe provide something to do with police force? Not really sure... If nothing else, just a landmark Capital Building - Basically model this after any capital building each state has, etc. Landmark class I guess. This would basically be where "congress" would meet. Fort Meade/NSA - Either landmark or great work These are just a few "political" type buildings off the top of my head. I think it might be neat to build sorta like a "capital" area in your city with the town hall and maybe the capital buildings and whatnot. These buildings could also be considered educational buildings as well I suppose. Yes! I would love to have a zoo and have it be an attraction for tourists. Would go great next to an amusement park (next to a gnome, of course).

Well I will be dammed... Thanks for the info.. I gave up on that section of roads

You are not understanding what I am talking about with the dates. The dates in all the mod files are not being updated by your teams. They are still stuck on July. It is the middle of August now. Version numbers are also not changing as well after there have been countless changes to some mods. Some mods update the version number in the file name while some do not. If you need that information in for the mod managers (which I find it funny that SimCity 2013 is the ONLY game that needs it in the file name), it needs to be correct for those not using a mod manager. There also isn't a mod manager out yet so it is actually quite confusing why you guys keep referencing something that is needed for something else in development. Can you explain a bit more on why all the info for the mod manager is needed in the file name structure and not the file itself?

And that is how you guys come across. Literally, there is only a very "select" group of people who think the name of the mod should include as much info as it does... Naming scheme that includes tons of info - most of it seems pointless for what someone would really need to know. A lot of people don't seem to understand the actual need for all this info and the reasons do not add up. Feedback is wanted on the naming scheme even though 1 month prior, the naming scheme was already voted on - This was told to me by Xoxide. Seems kind of odd that the name was voted on prior to getting community feedback... Every time the issue is brought up, it is made out to be like the name cannot be changed due to future plans with the mod manager - not sure how that would have any bearing on the name. I have heavily modded FO:NV, Skyrim, SimCity 4, etc, and all of those mod names have been very short or very long, the mod manager didn't seem to care what the name is, so long as the install/load order is correct Versions/Dates do not get updated in current mods with that naming scheme - Dates literally have not changed since July and half the time, version numbers never change (Look at Akar for a perfect example). Some mod versions get updated in the file name while others do not - even when updates are constantly being done to these mods. Is this a new version of the mod or not? Was there a change, or not? There seems to be a lack of consistency even with the really long mod names. If the modders cannot stick to updating version numbers/dates, why are they there/why is there even a naming scheme? When people bring up naming scheme - it is told to them that you guys have made a final decision on the name and it would have to be brought up for a discussion and voted among the modders. This makes it seem like you guys really don't care and when a decision is made, it is final. How would anyone bring up / call for a vote with you guys since you guys seem to have blocked the thought of needing a new name change. Look at Xoxide's posts in this thread for perfect examples of how he switches the subject on why the mod names are standard. Here is an interesting tidbit I have found out from using mod managers. I can look at a Fallout NV mod and it has all the info in it for the mod manager. It has who made it, the date it was updated, version, etc. Everything you would need to know about the mod and yet the file name is literally the name of the mod... If other games can do it that way, you guys can as well, for example. When you include all sorts of information about the mod, etc, in the file, it just makes it a cluttered mess and makes it way more confusing that what it needs to be. The thing that worries me is that if this current system continues where mod versions don't change even when there are updates, dates don't change on the file name, names that are just a confusing mess, it feels like I am being forced to use a mod manager for something that looks like a very easy system. SimCity is fairly easy right now to mod and installing mods shouldn't be hard or complicated or even confusing when there is no installing of mods, just a load order which is already done for you with the current mods. I have said this before and I will say it again, this is my example. LoadOrder_ModName_Offline/Online_VersionNumber That would be all I would have. The offline/online is just a convenience. Load order is obvious as is mod name. Version is just there so people know which file they have installed. If you have a version number, the versions must change with every update, even if it is a small one! If you guys are still using 2.0, then it needs to be 2.01 or 2.02, and so on. Plaster the team name or the modder in a readme and/or on the mod description page. Plaster the kind of mod it is and what its purpose is in a readme or on the description page. This info is not needed for the mod file name.

The name of the mod should be simple. KISS should be followed (Keep it simple stupid). If you have to add arbitrary information in the file name, what is the point? I look at something like the team name and that means nothing to most, if not all people outside of who is actually modding it. No one has any clue what that means. The dates half the time never change, same thing with the version number. Dates are not even needed as the file itself keeps a date as to when the file was last updated. This is the same for mac/windows. What is needed would be as follows: load order, mod name, version number and that is it. I would prefer one without a version number but having that can be just as important... What irks me how difficult it seems the modders are to understand this. What I am having to read has just been a complete unwillingness to change, from the lead modder. This sort of scares me as it does not look well for the future. It seems as if even a simple change may take months or longer and getting anything accomplished would take a meeting and vote and you would need to get all members of the modding community together... Is this how getting new mods will be in the future? Will the SimCity 2013 modding community be run by a group and anything and everything needs to get approved from them? If so, that kind of ruins the modding community. I hope that this modding team doesn't try and take over the modding scene for this game and lets others do what they want. Seems off but I digress. That is what concerns me. It seems as if the modders will be the ones calling the shots for the community when they don't really seem to get it... There have been countless tries to explain, on different occasions, what needs fixing, etc, and it is like pulling teeth. Clearly there is a problem with something as simple as the mod names. Now, they say it is because of the "future" but we are not even there yet. Mod names can change when the management tools are in place. Until we are there, they should be changed. Plain and simple. Part of the problem you have is someone makes a mod, they use their own name, then it gets "transitioned" to a "team" and then the mod goes through a few different file names. Even still, the files are not updated. Even with Akar, the file name still doesn't match the version and the date. So, it can be very confusing as to what you are actually downloading and installing. Some mod files match what they should be, some do not. The naming scheme seems very confusing when not even modding team can stick to it half the time. That is the big one which I just listed. A lot of the mods dates and sometimes the versions do not match the mod file name. That is one of the biggest things that will keep users confused. Which, if it was just a simple name, it would be easier. With each version, you need to change the date and the version of the mod file and if it is on a new team or not. These changes do not seem to be happening most of the time. Not only that, there are so many numbers in every file name, it is so confusing to tell which is the version number versus the date versus something else. You have to understand that we need the current file naming system in order for oppie and others to create mod managers that will automatically update mods and do all sorts of other stuff. We want what's best for everyone. You are continuously trying to make us seem like people that just hate the players and hate anyone that or attempts to interfere with our work. That isn't true at all. I agree that the current naming of files is confusing. We, as a group, may begin working on giving files new names to help players when the time comes, but right now, we cannot because we are currently working on other things. Do not bash us repeatedly if you don't have a full understanding of what we're doing. I do have a full understanding of what you guys are doing, you all have stated it multiple times. The weird thing is even you guys admit the naming scheme is confusing... How is it that the modders and other people think the naming scheme is confusing yet nothing seems to be in the works to make it not as confusing? I get that you guys are working on mod managers but what doesn't make sense is how the naming scheme has anything to do with it... Can you break it down as to why each aspect of the naming scheme is needed for the mod managers to be made? Why can't the naming scheme be changed until the mod managers are done and then changed for the purpose of the mod managers. You guys also have to realize that not everyone is going to be using mod managers or should be forced to. You keep saying these names for for the future and for those mod managers. So are you saying that a mod manager will be required to make heads or tails of these mods in the future?

The name of the mod should be simple. KISS should be followed (Keep it simple stupid). If you have to add arbitrary information in the file name, what is the point? I look at something like the team name and that means nothing to most, if not all people outside of who is actually modding it. No one has any clue what that means. The dates half the time never change, same thing with the version number. Dates are not even needed as the file itself keeps a date as to when the file was last updated. This is the same for mac/windows. What is needed would be as follows: load order, mod name, version number and that is it. I would prefer one without a version number but having that can be just as important... What irks me how difficult it seems the modders are to understand this. What I am having to read has just been a complete unwillingness to change, from the lead modder. This sort of scares me as it does not look well for the future. It seems as if even a simple change may take months or longer and getting anything accomplished would take a meeting and vote and you would need to get all members of the modding community together... Is this how getting new mods will be in the future? Will the SimCity 2013 modding community be run by a group and anything and everything needs to get approved from them? If so, that kind of ruins the modding community. I hope that this modding team doesn't try and take over the modding scene for this game and lets others do what they want. Seems off but I digress. That is what concerns me. It seems as if the modders will be the ones calling the shots for the community when they don't really seem to get it... There have been countless tries to explain, on different occasions, what needs fixing, etc, and it is like pulling teeth. Clearly there is a problem with something as simple as the mod names. Now, they say it is because of the "future" but we are not even there yet. Mod names can change when the management tools are in place. Until we are there, they should be changed. Plain and simple. Part of the problem you have is someone makes a mod, they use their own name, then it gets "transitioned" to a "team" and then the mod goes through a few different file names. Even still, the files are not updated. Even with Akar, the file name still doesn't match the version and the date. So, it can be very confusing as to what you are actually downloading and installing. Some mod files match what they should be, some do not. The naming scheme seems very confusing when not even modding team can stick to it half the time. That is the big one which I just listed. A lot of the mods dates and sometimes the versions do not match the mod file name. That is one of the biggest things that will keep users confused. Which, if it was just a simple name, it would be easier. With each version, you need to change the date and the version of the mod file and if it is on a new team or not. These changes do not seem to be happening most of the time. Not only that, there are so many numbers in every file name, it is so confusing to tell which is the version number versus the date versus something else.

Except you guys had already voted on the permanent names 1 month prior.. so 2 months ago, now. So that thread where you looked for feedback, Xoxide, was not even worth it. Look guys, I know just how frustrating it can be to have useless information in the name of the mod file. Like the date and version number for instance. The date of the file last modified can be found by going to the properties of that file... It will also show you when it was last updated when you overwrite the file. Oh wait, you can't do that because with every new version, there is a new name for the mod file! With how much the mods are updating, it gets frustrating when the names of the mods continuously changes. The team name though, this is honestly useless. Completely useless. It only benefits the modders and anyone outside of who made the mod, the team means absolutely nothing. Most of the information is not needed but because the modders "felt" it needed to be included, it was. So, you guys want to change the names? Well, its pointless at this stage. You would have to call for a vote, get quorum at a meeting and make a motion. Someone would also have to second that motion and then there would be discussion on said motion. Then there would be a call for a vote when the discussion is over and I have a feeling any new change would get voted down. Yes, these modders follow strict roberts rules of order even for something as simple as a naming scheme. You guys have over-complicated something that should be seen as very easy. So complicated and so unneeded. The name of the file should be something simple and yet has the needed info to work (load order and name). That is all you need. Everything else can be found in the actual description of the mod... where most people would need to know that info. Just as easily as you guys randomly invited me to the team, I quickly left. I do not want to even help out the modders who seem so out of touch with... reality. Hmm I really don't understand your attitude. New naming scheme is needed yes! but to say the current one is useless and group name is utterly worthless is unfair. Not only do the modders deserve credit for there work it also helps to remember what user/grp creates the best mods that you might want to follow! Yes, it also seems to me that the naming scheme was already made up before feedback was requested witch is silly. About the modified info you get under the details tab actually helps to see if the file is newer, that and the file size ofc. If the name is change it wont really change the file size so... You should also be honor that you got invited somebody saw that you might contribute something to the community, obviously they where wrong. Modders do not "deserve" credit in the file name. If a modder cannot accept their name being plastered all over the mod description, then why are you even a modder? Do you really need it in the file name as well? If that is your only reason for it, you really need to evaluate why you are even a modder. If the modding team is that conceited, I do not know what to say to that. I got invited after I replied to a reddit thread where a modder was asking for help testing a mod... Why should I be honored that I got invited to your "exclusive" group? That is how you just made it sound. I randomly got invited. All I wanted was to test that one mod that was posted on reddit, you guys were the ones that took that out of context. Even if I did want to work with you guys, seeing how you do things, has completely turned me off to even wanting to work with you all. You guys make even the most mundane thing so complicated when it doesn't need to be.

Except you guys had already voted on the permanent names 1 month prior.. so 2 months ago, now. So that thread where you looked for feedback, Xoxide, was not even worth it. Look guys, I know just how frustrating it can be to have useless information in the name of the mod file. Like the date and version number for instance. The date of the file last modified can be found by going to the properties of that file... So, you guys want to change the names? Well, its pointless at this stage. You would have to call for a vote, get quorum at a meeting and make a motion. Someone would also have to second that motion and then there would be discussion on said motion. Then there would be a call for a vote when the discussion is over and I have a feeling any new change would get voted down. Yes, these modders follow strict roberts rules of order even for something as simple as a naming scheme. You guys have over-complicated something that should be seen as very easy. So complicated and so unneeded. The name of the file should be something simple and yet has the needed info to work (load order and name). That is all you need. Everything else can be found in the actual description of the mod... where most people would need to know that info. Just as easily as you guys randomly invited me to the team, I quickly left. I do not want to even help out the modders who seem so out of touch with... reality.

Try and connect a road to those roads and then hold ctrl and delete them. I was able to do it that way.

Try going back and downloading it again... could have been a problem with the site?

And the point I am saying is that your suggestion, along with Xoxide, etc, are way to long with information no one needs or wants. Maybe you modders want it and it makes sense to you but the file name is way too long for anyone to really care about. At the end of the day, the regular person using a mod doesn't care what the file name is called; so long as it makes sense and isn't a huge file name. Am I being blunt? Yes. I will reference the date again and why it is useless. Right click on a file and go to properties... A date is listed as to when it was last modified...Same thing with something like the team name... What is the point of listing the team name in the name of the mod file itself? Sorry but that is a little bit arrogant... If the modders are not happy with their names being plastered all over the mod description page, then why are they even modding? I specifically made mention to those two things because they are not needed for the file name itself. However, I get a very condescending reply in terms of adding dates to something like the download page versus the file name: Well great, because that helps just about no one when it comes to them looking at that download page... Is someone really going to be looking at both pages to verify which file was changed? Nope. Not even that though, it doesn't specifically list each individual download file that was modified all the time. That was the reasoning behind adding dates to the download page itself rather than the file name... Something once again, will change and it will only hurt people who don't use a mod manager. The bigger issue as to why I don't want a version number is simple, people want to just drag and drop the file in and have it overwrite the old one. If you include a mod version, it will obviously be changing. Since the mod manager we have is somewhat hard to use, most people will not use it so they will be manually installing the files. Which you have also listed. I'm not saying your idea is bad, I am just saying it provides information that is not needed and I explained why that information is not needed. Wouldn't you want to have an explanation as to why? I would. At the end of the day, it isn't about the modders, it is about changing the experience for the person installing the mod - for the better. Hate to break it to you all but that is how it should be and that is the attitude that needs to be changed. Making the mod is one thing, actually installing the mod is another. You are best to assume the person installing the mod knows absolutely nothing about it or how to use it. Directions need to be clear and concise - which sometimes they are not. SimTropolis is not NexusMods... It is about as unfriendly to people wanting to install mods as it can be... If you design your mod description page, mod downloads page, etc, as newb friendly as possible, things like a naming scheme mean little at the end of the day because the information you will need in the file name will be very little. That was also another reason why I said you all were putting too much time into the naming scheme of the files... Make it something very simple that makes sense and will overwrite the previous file. Boom, done! You don't need to be democratic about this... Make an executive decision on the naming scheme and be done with it...