Maxis Visit, thoughts and impressions

[NCGAIO 562]

Oh and despite all their hype this is not a Maxis game, it just a couple of old Maxis people rehired by EA, and the Maxis logo splashed about.

Huh? Kip and I have been at Maxis continuously for about 10 years, Ocean & Christian for about 15.

Well ... according to Dan you usurped two years of stay in Maxis of the mentioned "old" Ocean Quigley - 17 years.

Now to satisfy a curiosity! You do not think that limitations imposed for the new Simcity ( the reason for the various complaints ) has more to do with what is written bellow than with limitations for Glassbox.?.. especially " Deploy same gameplay across multiple devices"

Surely Willmott had the exact notion of what was possible to achieve when sought to have WhatYouSeeIsWhatYouSim for the new game.

And since that WhatYouSeeIsWhatYouSim reminded me a lot of WhatYouSeeIsWhatYouGet by Charles Simonyi ( Microsoft´s old man ) comes another curiosity... EA will also be worried about Microsoft's entry in the distribution market?

  Edited October 20, 2012 by NCGAIO  

[chimeran 208]

That leads us to the following idea: the online component is tied with the lack of development for modding tools. I don't see it as a minor problem. This is very important. Unless there is a totally offline component, there will be no modding. Yes, that's right. No modding support, even though Maxis says it's planned and they care about the community.

It's not that they're evil, it's just that it's impossible to fit extensive modding with their current business system. If there's modding support, it will have to go through an official Maxis/EA exchange, pre-approved by staff, and making purely visual enhancements or minor changes. Without it, the game balance/economy will be upset as soon as anyone finds a way to "game" the system to get more money, climb up the leaderboards or some other nonsense... and that's not something anyone there wants.

Now why am I saying all this?

Again, modding is VERY important. If unrestricted or at least extensive modding is allowed, I'm sure someone would find a way to solve the following complaints people have:

- Cartoony buildings and environment: New models and new textures modded in, whole sets of buildings gradually replacing the old ones, textures being improved upon.

- Small tile sets: Although Maxis itself could well eventually release a sort of "big maps" DLC or some such for people with computers able to run it, modders could implement this before them.

- Cities separated from one another, spread around the region: A wise modder could edit a region to eliminate this, given enough modding tools and editable game files.

- Lack of X, Y or Z (transport systems, subways, etc.): Modders could theoretically mess around and implement at least a makeshift version of these.

You could freely customize your game the way you want with mods. But because the game is focused on an always-online play mode, this kind of modding is impossible. Modding also interferes with DLC sales, it's obvious! Why would people buy the new "Police Station DLC" if they can get 20 different types for free say, here in Simtropolis.

I'm not totally against the online-only mode. I understand why they want it to be that way from a money-making perspective (they're not running a charity for needy SimCity fans), but that unfortunately locks out a LOT of wonderful possibilities the game could have.

I just hope that down the road this eventually changes, and when they finally start providing modding support, an offline component will also be provided. Until then, I'll sadly have to wait out and see what happens. "Sadly", because I'd be willing to spend a lot of money for something I could have full control for my personal customization purposes... but that's not the case Sorry Maxis... hope you reconsider it.

BETA EULA, Section 1.4, Paragraph 2

When you play this game offline, EA and its affiliates may collect and store non-personally identifiable data including your Internet Protocol Address as well as game play and software usage statistics. If and when you access online features and/or services (if any), this data may be transmitted to EA. EA may use this information to improve our products and services and may share anonymous data with third parties.

according to the beta there is an off-line component and modding can co-exist with an on-line feature if they (maxis/EA) follows the skyrim model. in skyrim, modders release their mods via steam and steam automatically updates the mods if changes are made by the mod author but slows down load time to make sure all the mods sync. and also in skyrim you have off-line mods that have no server support (skyrim nexus mod manager) this is all dependent on the folder structure naturally and there is a difference between skyrim and at least SC4. SC4 is drop and play but skyrim is far more complex when it comes to it's mods. you can drop and play w/the off-line mods but a mod manager can simplify the process greatly and this weekend i will have to redo all my mods for skyrim.

i can't remember if the the creation kit came out as soon as skyrim did and if not then once it did then the mods for skyrim were far more impressive and free vs. the DLC for skyrim. one of the DLC's is hearthfire which allows you to build a house but there are so many custom homes on steam that it's not necessary and sad to say the older mods conflict or will not work w/the DLC that is offered by Bethesda (dawnguard/hearthfire) then you have SKSE which offers more choice when it comes to mods both users and authors and now they have come out w/TESSEdit which will help clean out your mods but is only for extremely advanced mod users.

and i can play skyrim off-line and once i access the web it merely updates the info similar to the beta EULA for SC2K13 and in skyrim's case it sync's the save data so that i have back-up in the cloud. how SC2K13 will work i won't know until release since i'm obviously not being picked for the beta but these things happen. but then again skyrim is merely solo play not multi-player so perhaps not all the analogies will transfer correctly.

  Edited October 19, 2012 by chimeran  

[Plancus 17]

BETA EULA, Section 1.4, Paragraph 2

When you play this game offline, EA and its affiliates may collect and store non-personally identifiable data including your Internet Protocol Address as well as game play and software usage statistics. If and when you access online features and/or services (if any), this data may be transmitted to EA. EA may use this information to improve our products and services and may share anonymous data with third parties.

according to the beta there is an off-line component and modding can co-exist with an on-line feature if they (maxis/EA) follows the skyrim model. in skyrim, modders release their mods via steam and steam automatically updates the mods if changes are made by the mod author but slows down load time to make sure all the mods sync. and also in skyrim you have off-line mods that have no server support (skyrim nexus mod manager) this is all dependent on the folder structure naturally and there is a difference between skyrim and at least SC4. SC4 is drop and play but skyrim is far more complex when it comes to it's mods. you can drop and play w/the off-line mods but a mod manager can simplify the process greatly and this weekend i will have to redo all my mods for skyrim.

i can't remember if the the creation kit came out as soon as skyrim did and if not then once it did then the mods for skyrim were far more impressive and free vs. the DLC for skyrim. one of the DLC's is hearthfire which allows you to build a house but there are so many custom homes on steam that it's not necessary and sad to say the older mods conflict or will not work w/the DLC that is offered by Bethesda (dawnguard/hearthfire) then you have SKSE which offers more choice when it comes to mods both users and authors and now they have come out w/TESSEdit which will help clean out your mods but is only for extremely advanced mod users.

and i can play skyrim off-line and once i access the web it merely updates the info similar to the beta EULA for SC2K13 and in skyrim's case it sync's the save data so that i have back-up in the cloud. how SC2K13 will work i won't know until release since i'm obviously not being picked for the beta but these things happen.

But isn't Skyrim mainly a single-player campaign game, while in SimCity you'll be pretty much coerced to work in a region? Even with a mod manager, there would be differences.

For example, private regions reserved for individual play would basically be only a simulated offline experience, because you're just locking out other people from playing in your region, but it's still part of the SimWorld. If someone decides to mod in a super power plant that produces clean fusion energy that could be sold for anyone in the entire world, that would still mean modding is impossible (assuming the EULA bit you posted doesn't necessarily mean an offline component at release, and that it's just legal wording).

And I think the Skyrim DLC are more campaign oriented, introducing new dialogues/characters/mechanics, other than only 'horse armor' or some such However I could see it definitely happening in SimCity though with buildings instead of horse armor.

  Edited October 19, 2012 by Plancus  

[daybreak 312]

Thank you Dirktator for taking the time to go and report on something that is very important to us all.

I'm not sure what the final version will be like and will certainly not be the first in line to purchase. Thank God for sites like yours that give us honest feedback. Whatever is said on this site, after the release date, will determine my purchase.

Thanks for sharing

daybreak

  Edited October 20, 2012 by daybreak  

[chimeran 208]

But isn't Skyrim mainly a single-player campaign game, while in SimCity you'll be pretty much coerced to work in a region? Even with a mod manager, there would be differences.

For example, private regions reserved for individual play would basically be only a simulated offline experience, because you're just locking out other people from playing in your region, but it's still part of the SimWorld. If someone decides to mod in a super power plant that produces clean fusion energy that could be sold for anyone in the entire world, that would still mean modding is impossible (assuming the EULA bit you posted doesn't necessarily mean an offline component at release, and that it's just legal wording).

And I think the Skyrim DLC are more campaign oriented, introducing new dialogues/characters/mechanics, other than only 'horse armor' or some such However I could see it definitely happening in SimCity though with buildings instead of horse armor.

lol, the mods i have are for more powerful than horse armor. i have a mod that alters the very movement of the player and NPC's which was never released through Bethesda and there are quest mods that have voice actors which give some variety b/c there isn't much. the only major change in skyrim's game mechanics is horse mounted combat which was part of the game update and not the DLC and SKSE allows a total retrofit of the UI which is spectacular. then there is a google maps like mod that blows away anything that Bethesda released. and it was user created mods that altered the game mechanics as far as monsters, flora, fauna and NPC behavior not Bethesda DLC.

like i said i'm not sure exactly how user created mods will work in multi-player environment.in the case of the fusion plant it's theoretically possible to pull it off but will be a huge strain on the EA servers. simple scenario: maxis releases a creation kit that has all the tools necessary to influence behaviors for the agents even if that particular mod is not installed on another player's computer. since the mods will be cloud based they will have to interact w/the EA servers allowing proper handshakes between the user clients. even if you stroll through another player's city and can't see the fusion mod you described the behavior will still function between the player who doesn't have the mod installed but will be able to reap the benefits/consequences of that mod if the mods are cloud based and are being handled by the glassbox engine to handle the AI aspect.

the real trick of course comes with off-line mods that are not cloud based but will still have to interact in a multi-player setting. the mods may only target behavior in that particular user's region or cities but the behavior will not travel outside of it's designated zone meaning off-line mods would be purely cosmetic and offer advantages only to that specific player but in order to handshake w/other players and the simworld it will have to be uploaded to the EA servers to handle the handshakes.

perhaps the maxis person could shed some light on this

  Edited October 20, 2012 by chimeran  

[Epilef 57]

Unfortunately this visit only confirmed my disappointment.

  Edited October 20, 2012 by Epilef  

[Azurespecter 506]

Thanks for the review Dirk!

And thanks also to the Maxis team who are engaging the community... of which I am disappointed to say is being quite hostile. Don't get buried by negativity! I've seen too many Community Managers and PR peeps get destroyed by forums.

I feel so far that the game is limited and feature lacking. However, the potential of this reboot series is incredible... So it really comes down to whether or not Maxis decides to continue developing the game through expansions and modding tools.

If this is the case, I look forward to supporting SimCity and following its progression just as I did for Simcity 2000, 3k, and 4. In a few years I hope to have the best city-building game imaginable.

[Dirktator 2,324]

Thanks for the review Dirk!

And thanks also to the Maxis team who are engaging the community... of which I am disappointed to say is being quite hostile. Don't get buried by negativity! I've seen too many Community Managers and PR peeps get destroyed by forums.

I feel so far that the game is limited and feature lacking. However, the potential of this reboot series is incredible... So it really comes down to whether or not Maxis decides to continue developing the game through expansions and modding tools.

If this is the case, I look forward to supporting SimCity and following its progression just as I did for Simcity 2000, 3k, and 4. In a few years I hope to have the best city-building game imaginable.

Well put, and Maxis has pretty thick skin, and I believe they believe in their vision. There's lots of curiosity and excitement in the community. Let's remember we have not seen the whole picture yet. It's also easy to forget that many great games have always needed time to evolve into the state by which we most fondly remember them. Thanks, Guillaume for taking the time to answer our questions.

[baertooth 330]

Thanks for the review Dirk!

And thanks also to the Maxis team who are engaging the community... of which I am disappointed to say is being quite hostile. Don't get buried by negativity! I've seen too many Community Managers and PR peeps get destroyed by forums.

I feel so far that the game is limited and feature lacking. However, the potential of this reboot series is incredible... So it really comes down to whether or not Maxis decides to continue developing the game through expansions and modding tools.

If this is the case, I look forward to supporting SimCity and following its progression just as I did for Simcity 2000, 3k, and 4. In a few years I hope to have the best city-building game imaginable.

Well put, and Maxis has pretty thick skin, and I believe they believe in their vision. There's lots of curiosity and excitement in the community. Let's remember we have not seen the whole picture yet. It's also easy to forget that many great games have always needed time to evolve into the state by which we most fondly remember them. Thanks, Guillaume for taking the time to answer our questions.

I'm really curious about one thing if you wouldn't mind answering?

Do you think this is the game the Simcity 4 community has been waiting for as a replacement for Simcity 4?

[FLIPDUDE 16]

I am glad to see that maxis is reading these forums. We have many concerns and it's good to know that they're at least being read.

However, I am very very afraid of another "Cities XL". I was a member of the forum for a year and a half before the game was released, the developer team was a big part of the community, reading all the posts, making promises, taking suggestions (they had a whole sub-forum for what kind of public transport you'd want to see in the game) but then when the game was about to be released we started noticing that none of the things that really mattered to us were in the game (no public transport, no G.E.Ms, blocky and repetitive buildings) and most importantly - too much focus on online play, which is what eventually killed the game and bankrupted Monte Cristo.

I am feeling more and more disconnect between SC5 and the previous SC games. Yes, there are many new and interesting improvments(building modules), but things like online play, pre-determined lot sizes and densities, unrealistic transitions, city specialization and graphics that focus more on looking like toy models than on looking like you're building a big, colossal, realistic city(which, I think is what most people aim for when they play these games)... They worry me. They're things that hardcore simcity fans are screaming against, and hae been pleading against since the time of the Cities XL development phase.

I played cities XL a lot recently and I realized how similar the games are looking right now, big differences being that Cities XL lets you build whatever density you want on whatever road you want(which works well on areas that have a lot of traffic regardless of what buildings are on that actual road), and Simcity has non-square lots and specialized cities(specialized cities not being a good thing in my opinion). Other than that the games are so similar it's scary, most notably because Cities XL was a failure. It wasn't until after the company went belly-up and a new company bought, added new things to, and re-released the game as an offline one, that it became an okay game.

Please maxis, consider addressing at least some of the magor issues we're bringing up... Even if they are, as I said, magor. I obviously don't expect the whole online thing to be revisited in the next 4 months, but maybe at least the density thing, or some other sort of hardcore-fan-pleasing feature.

Thank you.

[Haljackey 17,355]

I'm really curious about one thing if you wouldn't mind answering?

Do you think this is the game the Simcity 4 community has been waiting for as a replacement for Simcity 4?

I think the answer from the vast majority of us is no. SimCity (2013) is in no way a squeal or successor to SimCity 4, and that's what many us have been hoping for for the past few years.

Maxis even openly admitted that that this game is a reboot to the series, starting from scratch to get away from some of the complexities SC4 had.

While I applaud some of these (example no water pipes), I disagree with many as well (highways are pre-set [at this moment], no subway or underground view, limited city size, no farms, etc.). Again, as I said earlier, it's all about balance for Maxis. They need to weigh their vision for the game against what the community wants and also what the company wants and must do it with limited resources and a deadline.

[VeritaScientia 150]

Do you think this is the game the Simcity 4 community has been waiting for as a replacement for Simcity 4?

That is the fatal flaw with many in the community.

They're looking for a replacement or a successor for SimCIty 4 when this game has been, since E3, confirmed as a reboot of the franchise.

I've found myself laughing at most people that have compared SimCity to SimCity 4, especially since most don't compare SimCity to straight vanilla SimCity 4 out of the box, but to SC4:Rush Hour with mods. That method ensures that SC13 will fail, and as such, it's been used primarily by the critics that have set out to smear SC13 at all costs.

A completely offline version of the current game would not work, just like an offline version of World of Warcraft wouldn't work, the extra code required to simulate an adequate economy would cause the system requirements to probably increase significantly.

[cirugo 1,889]

Do you think this is the game the Simcity 4 community has been waiting for as a replacement for Simcity 4?

That is the fatal flaw with many in the community.

They're looking for a replacement or a successor for SimCIty 4 when this game has been, since E3, confirmed as a reboot of the franchise.

I've found myself laughing at most people that have compared SimCity to SimCity 4, especially since most don't compare SimCity to straight vanilla SimCity 4 out of the box, but to SC4:Rush Hour with mods. That method ensures that SC13 will fail, and as such, it's been used primarily by the critics that have set out to smear SC13 at all costs.

A completely offline version of the current game would not work, just like an offline version of World of Warcraft wouldn't work, the extra code required to simulate an adequate economy would cause the system requirements to probably increase significantly.

then this experiment needs to fail

[VeritaScientia 150]

Do you think this is the game the Simcity 4 community has been waiting for as a replacement for Simcity 4?

That is the fatal flaw with many in the community.

They're looking for a replacement or a successor for SimCIty 4 when this game has been, since E3, confirmed as a reboot of the franchise.

I've found myself laughing at most people that have compared SimCity to SimCity 4, especially since most don't compare SimCity to straight vanilla SimCity 4 out of the box, but to SC4:Rush Hour with mods. That method ensures that SC13 will fail, and as such, it's been used primarily by the critics that have set out to smear SC13 at all costs.

A completely offline version of the current game would not work, just like an offline version of World of Warcraft wouldn't work, the extra code required to simulate an adequate economy would cause the system requirements to probably increase significantly.

then this experiment needs to fail

Why? just because you don't like the idea of a SimCity MMO?

I think, despite your wishes, this game will be a resounding success after a few enhancements.

[cirugo 1,889]

Do you think this is the game the Simcity 4 community has been waiting for as a replacement for Simcity 4?

That is the fatal flaw with many in the community.

They're looking for a replacement or a successor for SimCIty 4 when this game has been, since E3, confirmed as a reboot of the franchise.

I've found myself laughing at most people that have compared SimCity to SimCity 4, especially since most don't compare SimCity to straight vanilla SimCity 4 out of the box, but to SC4:Rush Hour with mods. That method ensures that SC13 will fail, and as such, it's been used primarily by the critics that have set out to smear SC13 at all costs.

A completely offline version of the current game would not work, just like an offline version of World of Warcraft wouldn't work, the extra code required to simulate an adequate economy would cause the system requirements to probably increase significantly.

then this experiment needs to fail

Why? just because you don't like the idea of a SimCity MMO?

I think, despite your wishes, this game will be a resounding success after a few enhancements.

I sincerely hope not. Taking away player options, creativity and the decision as to where and when they want to play the game is not a gameplay model that should be supported by anyone.

edit: and I'm not opposed to a SimCity MMO...I'm opposed to them trying to shoehorn EVERYONE into it. As you're so fond of pointing out, they called this SimCity...not SimCity MMO.

  Edited October 20, 2012 by cirugo  

[Azurespecter 506]

Thanks for the review Dirk!

And thanks also to the Maxis team who are engaging the community... of which I am disappointed to say is being quite hostile. Don't get buried by negativity! I've seen too many Community Managers and PR peeps get destroyed by forums.

I feel so far that the game is limited and feature lacking. However, the potential of this reboot series is incredible... So it really comes down to whether or not Maxis decides to continue developing the game through expansions and modding tools.

If this is the case, I look forward to supporting SimCity and following its progression just as I did for Simcity 2000, 3k, and 4. In a few years I hope to have the best city-building game imaginable.

Well put, and Maxis has pretty thick skin, and I believe they believe in their vision. There's lots of curiosity and excitement in the community. Let's remember we have not seen the whole picture yet. It's also easy to forget that many great games have always needed time to evolve into the state by which we most fondly remember them. Thanks, Guillaume for taking the time to answer our questions.

I'm really curious about one thing if you wouldn't mind answering?

Do you think this is the game the Simcity 4 community has been waiting for as a replacement for Simcity 4?

Not yet. But I believe that SimCity can become the game this community desires. Let's give it some time, and lots and lots of modding!

As an interesting background to my history, I played Simcity 4 when it was new... and hated it. Hated all the limits and lack of features and horrible buildings. I said I'd never play it again. A few years later I found Simtropolis somehow, got re-interested, and discovered an incredible game that catered to my creative needs. I now love Simcity 4.

This is why I'm such a big fan of Simtropolis and the people here like Tarkus on the NAM, RHW, and many other teams. I got frustrated and quit, they challenged themselves to improve, create, and overcome the obstacles in Simcity 4. Where would this game be if those people said "Simcity 4 has crappy, unrealistic highways. I'm not even going to bother."

especially since most don't compare SimCity to straight vanilla SimCity 4 out of the box, but to SC4:Rush Hour with mods.

^^ Nailed it.

[Cyclone Boom 17,016]

I really think we shouldn’t prejudge the game at this stage. Remember to start with, SimCity 4 didn't contain many of the features we now take for granted. People were complaining then about the lack of features in the original game, and how it didn’t seem refined enough. But when the Rush Hour was introduced 8 months later, there were refinements made and new features added. Here are some of the main ones:

- Various gameplay enhancements - changes to the RCI simulation, mayor rating, desirability, commuting model, data views & graphs

- Query enhancements - added route trip information, mark historical and abandonment info

- Added 3 levels of difficulty

- New transportation intersections

- Ground highways, avenues, one way roads, toll booths

- New bridge selection tool

- Monorail, elevated rail, ferries

- New building style control options & Euro set

- New civic reward buildings - e.g. deluxe police station, larger education facilities

- The U-Drive-It feature & My Sim Mode integration

- Signs and labels

- New disasters - e.g. UFO, Autosaurus Wrecks

- Support for BAT created custom content

I’m not ignoring that there are aspects of SimCity (2013) that not everyone likes or agrees with. This is indeed a reboot of the franchise, so certain features will be different from what we’ve been used to.

But like in SimCity 4, modding has been confirmed for post-release support, so the game’s mechanics will have to be changed in some form to incorporate with the multiplayer. If this means in the form of an expansion, then it is possible for changes and new features to be added later on.

[VeritaScientia 150]

Do you think this is the game the Simcity 4 community has been waiting for as a replacement for Simcity 4?

That is the fatal flaw with many in the community.

They're looking for a replacement or a successor for SimCIty 4 when this game has been, since E3, confirmed as a reboot of the franchise.

I've found myself laughing at most people that have compared SimCity to SimCity 4, especially since most don't compare SimCity to straight vanilla SimCity 4 out of the box, but to SC4:Rush Hour with mods. That method ensures that SC13 will fail, and as such, it's been used primarily by the critics that have set out to smear SC13 at all costs.

A completely offline version of the current game would not work, just like an offline version of World of Warcraft wouldn't work, the extra code required to simulate an adequate economy would cause the system requirements to probably increase significantly.

then this experiment needs to fail

Why? just because you don't like the idea of a SimCity MMO?

I think, despite your wishes, this game will be a resounding success after a few enhancements.

I sincerely hope not. Taking away player options, creativity and the decision as to where and when they want to play the game is not a gameplay model that should be supported by anyone.

edit: and I'm not opposed to a SimCity MMO...I'm opposed to them trying to shoehorn EVERYONE into it. As you're so fond of pointing out, they called this SimCity...not SimCity MMO.

They're giving us creativity in a different way.

Besides, like I said, the game isn't yet out, you don't know what's down the pipeline, so please, stop with the "OMG this game is wrong" bull, because this game requires a different type of player mindset.

[jacksunny 741]

I sincerely hope not. Taking away player options, creativity and the decision as to where and when they want to play the game is not a gameplay model that should be supported by anyone.

I wouldn't say they are taking away the decision as to where to play this game, it's more limiting it. We can still play almost anywhere there is internet.

[TheMentalist 9]

I couldn't agree with Dirktator more. And its good that similar opinion comes from someone like Dirk, because there is a chance Maxic can take some ideas under consideration.

Thank you for detailed review.

The most burning issues for me are:

- cartoon visual style

- unnatural spaces between buildings

- small city sizes

- no subway transportation system

- no modding (as for now).

I also hoped that some objects/buildings like parks, golf courses, amusements parks or airports could be modular.

[jacksunny 741]

I also hoped that some objects/buildings like parks, golf courses, amusements parks or airports could be modular.

Well, airports are one of the "Great Works" that all players work together to build, so it is sort of modular. Not much has been revealed about them though.

I'm not sure if this has been confirmed or denied yet, but modular parks would be nice. They could have the same effect as other services, as you make the park bigger, it affects a wider range of Sims and has a bigger effect on nearby Sims.

[MarjaSpaceOddity 14]

Well, airports are one of the "Great Works" that all players work together to build, so it is sort of modular. Not much has been revealed about them though.

I think the Great Work is an international airport, you can in fact have a national airport in your city. In the strategy video a plane icon is in the list of transport options when he chooses the train. It would make sense to be able to add runways, storage buildings and stuff like that just like you could with the hospital they showed in the live demo.

I'm not sure if this has been confirmed or denied yet, but modular parks would be nice. They could have the same effect as other services, as you make the park bigger, it affects a wider range of Sims and has a bigger effect on nearby Sims.

They haven't talked about the parks yet, but the disaster screenshots showed a few of them. Hard to tell whether they are modular, but I like your suggestion.

[jeje71 6]

Oh and despite all their hype this is not a Maxis game, it just a couple of old Maxis people rehired by EA, and the Maxis logo splashed about.

Huh? Kip and I have been at Maxis continuously for about 10 years, Ocean & Christian for about 15.

So, you want to tell us why, after we've been told that the compelling gameplay that forced you to take the game online-only is optional (you can play your own regions and not have to interact with others), you can't provide an offline mode? Particularly since this seems to be the stumbling block in the way of other issues that people aren't happy about? Since you're here answering questions about little things like intersection angles maybe you can give us some insight onto the elephant in the room?

i think it's safe to say that he can easily answer about some simple technical details but any large impact choice would have to go through all official channels and only pr people of ea would be at liberty of saying anything (meaningful) about it.

[Screwballl 196]

Another way to look at it is this is the original SimCity (the basic ones on DOS/Windows 3.X, or black and white Macs) brought into the 21st century... Not a continuation of the series... that means SimCity 8 they will be right back where we are now with SC4, just with better graphics.

We are limited to just building R, C, I, or the extras like power, parks and small stuff like that, the game chooses what is built on it, you don't.

Sound Familiar?

If I want to go backwards and play this type of SimCity, I will just find my old floppy drive and play it.

[grugor 60]

I couldn't agree with Dirktator more. And its good that similar opinion comes from someone like Dirk, because there is a chance Maxic can take some ideas under consideration.

Thank you for detailed review.

The most burning issues for me are:

- cartoon visual style

- unnatural spaces between buildings

- small city sizes

- no subway transportation system

- no modding (as for now).

I also hoped that some objects/buildings like parks, golf courses, amusements parks or airports could be modular.

Lets say that you are game dev who works for EA. Lets say there is another game in the stable called the sims that has sold millions of expansion packs.

Now you are to develope simcity (5) . Are you really going to include everything that is possible in the first instalment.

It sucks , but that the way the gaming business works. Im sure the the brass at EA are looking at the forums and letting you guys format all the DLCs for them.

Its a fine balance of course to include enough content in the first release to get enough customers to buy the numerous DLCs later.

Does anyone really think that they couldnt manage to get subways in if they wanted to?

[NCGAIO 562]

Thanks, Guillaume for taking the time to answer our questions.

I would also like to thank but unfortunately it seems i did not deserve answers .... even though he had entered shortly after I posted

A pity ... I would like to know a little more than "we're working on it"

  Edited October 20, 2012 by NCGAIO  

[VeritaScientia 150]

Another way to look at it is this is the original SimCity (the basic ones on DOS/Windows 3.X, or black and white Macs) brought into the 21st century... Not a continuation of the series... that means SimCity 8 they will be right back where we are now with SC4, just with better graphics.

We are limited to just building R, C, I, or the extras like power, parks and small stuff like that, the game chooses what is built on it, you don't.

Sound Familiar?

If I want to go backwards and play this type of SimCity, I will just find my old floppy drive and play it.

What.......the.......Hellman's Mayonnaise are you talking about?

Zoning has ALWAYS been a part of SimCity, if we had to plop every building, it'd get cumbersome.

[Screwballl 196]

What.......the.......Hellman's Mayonnaise are you talking about?

Zoning has ALWAYS been a part of SimCity, if we had to plop every building, it'd get cumbersome.

The point I am making is that they went completely backwards with this new one. They go from SC4 where we had all the options we wanted, we got to choose the density, had enough choices even with the initial release to be able to do what we want, when we want, even if it came back to bite us in the butt later. We had the freedom to learn from our failures.... to the new one with all of the choices and options and everything that made it great, all gone.

Want to put high density along a small short road close to the interstate/highway? Nope.

Want to create your own map? Nope.

Want to keep your game saves on your own PC? Nope

Want to build your own highways? Nope

Want to play a large map and make some 3 million+ megalopolis? Nope

So what we have is a VERY basic 21st century version of the original SimCity. No density options, just zone and hope. Plop a power plant and hope its enough, gone is the ability to turn down the funding if it breaks the bank. One city size with a few pre-created maps, no more terraforming. We get a 3D Simpsons cartoon city that is essentially Societies 2.

All the things that made the very name SimCity great (even if you take out the user mods or compare it to 2000 or 3000), is just gone.

[cirugo 1,889]

What.......the.......Hellman's Mayonnaise are you talking about?

Zoning has ALWAYS been a part of SimCity, if we had to plop every building, it'd get cumbersome.

The point I am making is that they went completely backwards with this new one. They go from SC4 where we had all the options we wanted, we got to choose the density, had enough choices even with the initial release to be able to do what we want, when we want, even if it came back to bite us in the butt later. We had the freedom to learn from our failures.... to the new one with all of the choices and options and everything that made it great, all gone.

Want to put high density along a small short road close to the interstate/highway? Nope.

Want to create your own map? Nope.

Want to keep your game saves on your own PC? Nope

Want to build your own highways? Nope

Want to play a large map and make some 3 million+ megalopolis? Nope

So what we have is a VERY basic 21st century version of the original SimCity. No density options, just zone and hope. Plop a power plant and hope its enough, gone is the ability to turn down the funding if it breaks the bank. One city size with a few pre-created maps, no more terraforming. We get a 3D Simpsons cartoon city that is essentially Societies 2.

All the things that made the very name SimCity great (even if you take out the user mods or compare it to 2000 or 3000), is just gone.

not true quite true...we can't play this one offline...

[JaceTwice 115]

Another way to look at it is this is the original SimCity (the basic ones on DOS/Windows 3.X, or black and white Macs) brought into the 21st century... Not a continuation of the series... that means SimCity 8 they will be right back where we are now with SC4, just with better graphics.

We are limited to just building R, C, I, or the extras like power, parks and small stuff like that, the game chooses what is built on it, you don't.

Sound Familiar?

If I want to go backwards and play this type of SimCity, I will just find my old floppy drive and play it.

I think this is a perfect way to look at it. Aside from the disappointed reaction.

A good game will often have one or two main "ideas" directing every decision that goes into making that game. Given all of the material that's been presented to us I'd like to believe that the big idea driving this new SimCity is something along the lines of "How would the Original SimCity have looked if it was made in 2012?" To answer that requires re-thinking how to simulate a city in the first place.

The glassbox engine is Maxis' answer to that exact question. The agent based simulation is fundamentally different from the statistic simulations we're all used to, leading to a fundamentally different game. This SimCity is an entirely new breed of city simulator because of the way it handles the simulation at it's basest level.

SimCity 4 was the product of years of iteration and refinement of what the original SimCity started. I'm sure that if the new SimCity is successful we'll have our missing feature list filled out in time. Baby steps. Glassbox & the global economy needs to prove itself before Maxis can reasonably re-introduce all of the features we come to know and love.

Personally I'm ecstatic to see most of the new changes being made to the game. It's not often that a developer will risk changing the fundamentals of a game, and I hope things like this are done more often. I'd love to see a Mario or Zelda game with this kind of thought put into it.