Discussion about Always-On Connection to Origin

[pyanodon 218]

(...) And I'm confident that you will still be able to develop cities on your own, without friends. Maxis will certainly take into account people like myself who don't have any friends to play with!(...)

They said when you play without friends, your progress WILL BE LIMITED.

[Romaq 18]

Yay! Spam/ ADD ME! threads in forums so you can be 'friends' with a bajillion people you don't know or care about, never talk to, will never hear from again. And you can get to hope like hell they don't screw you over, nor have means to do so.

Sure sounds like fun to me!

[mapboy 106]

(...) And I'm confident that you will still be able to develop cities on your own, without friends. Maxis will certainly take into account people like myself who don't have any friends to play with!(...)

They said when you play without friends, your progress WILL BE LIMITED.

To be honest, the quote (that was "play alone, and you'll only get so far", if I'm recalling correctly) could be interpreted to mean that may a single city in a region all by yourself, and you will only get so far. This is identical to SC4 in this way. I can't see how the system can differentiate between cities of other people and your other cities in the region.

[Selphy 69]

(...) And I'm confident that you will still be able to develop cities on your own, without friends. Maxis will certainly take into account people like myself who don't have any friends to play with!(...)

They said when you play without friends, your progress WILL BE LIMITED.

To be honest, the quote (that was "play alone, and you'll only get so far", if I'm recalling correctly) could be interpreted to mean that may a single city in a region all by yourself, and you will only get so far. This is identical to SC4 in this way. I can't see how the system can differentiate between cities of other people and your other cities in the region.

THIS A MILLION TIMES.

Yes, your single city will plateau. But isn't that the case in SC4. If you don't want your city to plateau, you just simply need to make another neighboring city. Make a region, lock it so that it is yours. Then play the game and create each city.

[pyanodon 218]

Yes, your single city will plateau. But isn't that the case in SC4. If you don't want your city to plateau, you just simply need to make another neighboring city. Make a region, lock it so that it is yours. Then play the game and create each city.

Ok, but put that into a "pre-defined style of city" such as industrial one. Does it make any sense since each themed city will have it´s own plateau? In SC4, we built neighboring cities to improve the development of our big main city...to get big skycrappers, big unlocks like hitech centers and big hospitals etc, so how far you can develop your industrial city?

[Romaq 18]

SC4 plateau, SC:MMO plateau, whatever.

1) What control do we have over the interaction of other people in our online region we invited or were invited into, and what control do we have over the interaction with other regions within the world that run counter to our own interests, whatever our interests may be?

2) EA/ Maxis abandoned the SimCity franchise for a decade following Rush Hour. We have EA's history to know both the good and the bad of EA keeping game servers alive. SimTrop has been very good about keeping SimCity 4 a vibrant new 'game' in the decade since the franchise was abandoned by EA/ Maxis. How can we expect this to play out with SimCity:MMO?

We can keep talking about how the game might plateau without the benefit of other players, finding other players in ADD ME! spam boards, it is just my opinion they are side tracks from point #1 of controlling negative aspects of forced online play we do not yet have details on. Point #2 is rather serious in my mind also.

[cirugo 1,889]

http://www.pcgamer.com/2012/07/16/maxis-on-simcity-ea-investing-quite-a-bit-in-making-always-online-work/

ouch, they're getting the crap kicked out of them in the comments...

[Selphy 69]

Yes, your single city will plateau. But isn't that the case in SC4. If you don't want your city to plateau, you just simply need to make another neighboring city. Make a region, lock it so that it is yours. Then play the game and create each city.

Ok, but put that into a "pre-defined style of city" such as industrial one. Does it make any sense since each themed city will have it´s own plateau? In SC4, we built neighboring cities to improve the development of our big main city...to get big skycrappers, big unlocks like hitech centers and big hospitals etc, so how far you can develop your industrial city?

I can't say with 100% certainty but I think each city will be viable and serve a function in an overall healthy region. You say that an industrial city will eventually have a plateau. I don't think so. I want to believe that Maxis is designing the game in a way that each style of city works with each other city.

So in the case of the industrial city, it will have a plateau until you develop other city styles. For example:

You build a huge industrial city. But there is no one to work in the factories and it has plateaued. So you build a large residential city to supply workers.

But eventually, your sims will get smarter, live longer and will want a better lifestyle that an industrial job can't provide alongside the fact that your industrial city is now stagnant because because it produces materials that are distributed in your cities but hasn't grown beyond that. They have both plateaued.

So now you build that fancy hi-tech city and the smart sims start to work there providing them jobs. The industrial city now has a new place to offload goods and materials and because production has increased, more workers are needed. Now your sims are working, they have both hi tech and industrial jobs, and both sectors are developing and providing goods to your cities. But sims aren't happy, they have nowhere to have fun nor to buy the goods. They all have plateaued.

So finally you build commercial city designed to have attractions, malls, stores and whatnot. It employs more sims causing you to either develop a new residential city or expand your first. It brings in goods from both the hi tech and industrial cities so you need to expand/grow those. Then they all go stagnant. This is where the international airport and other great works come into play. They breathe new life into your cities and force you to expand again, and again, and again.

Now I could be wrong. Maxis could have a different vision for what SimCity 2013 will be. But from everything I've read and seen, this is what I imagine the game will be like. Each city you build, everything you do, is met with new challenges and problems for you to face either alone or as a group of players.

Every sim will need a job and when you provide that job that factory will need a place to offload their goods at and that store will need a sim working there and that sim will need a place to have fun and that place to have fun will need goods which come from a factory that employs sims and those sims need houses and those sims will want this and you will do that.

This game shouldn't be called SimCity but rather SimRegion or SimNation or SimWorld because if what I think is true and what they said is true, everything you do will impact one facet of your region and you will have to respond. When something plateaus, that means there is a need to be met.

The only way I see this plateauing is if you either A.) Build one city and never another or B.) You fill in every allocated city space in your region.

And to answer the person asking about how other players interact with you, it's pretty much what I said above plus all the little problems. You could build the best residential city ever but they need jobs. So a friend could build that industrial city to provide you jobs. That is how you interact. The only other problem is the spillover of issues like pollution, crime and whatnot. At which point you tell your friend or playmate "Hey, regulate your pollution!" and this is where the social aspect comes in. If you're lucky enough to have good friends or playmates, you will work towards building a wonderful, living, breathing region. But if you find yourself playing with jerks you maybe end up having to fix their issues which spill into your city.

But the glorious thing is, you can lock the region and do everything by yourself!

I can be dead wrong but I want to believe. This game seems to have the opportunity to be the SimCity game that I have always wanted. I want to believe Maxis will do right. I want to believe.

  Edited July 16, 2012 by Selphy  

[pyanodon 218]

(...)

And to answer the person asking about how other players interact with you, it's pretty much what I said above plus all the little problems. You could build the best residential city ever but they need jobs. So a friend could build that industrial city to provide you jobs. That is how you interact. The only other problem is the spillover of issues like pollution, crime and whatnot. At which point you tell your friend or playmate "Hey, regulate your pollution!" and this is where the social aspect comes in. If you're lucky enough to have good friends or playmates, you will work towards building a wonderful, living, breathing region. But if you find yourself playing with jerks you maybe end up having to fix their issues which spill into your city.

But the glorious thing is, you can lock the region and do everything by yourself!

I can be dead wrong but I want to believe. This game seems to have the opportunity to be the SimCity game that I have always wanted. I want to believe Maxis will do right. I want to believe.

OK, nice arguments here. Just few considerations. First: If i dont wanna be social, they said my development will be limited...that´s a BAD thing. And second: I´d like a big city with all that "sectors" together instead a specialized cities linked by roads. You know...like real cities.

Remember on SC4, you built dirty industrial areas and when the game develops, you face the air pollution problem..so you need to find a way to make it fit in your city. IN the new Simcity, you can just leave the polluted industrial city sink with smog because it wont affect you beauty tourism city in the other side. So..where´s the challenge? Im not talking there won´t have challenges (like, low resources, low income etc), but that make the game way more easier....almost dull. Maybe it was planned ehehhee. Oh...and the limited resources! I will be FORCED to ask for resources from an online jerk because even if im playing by my own, that resources will end. That´s what i call single-player plateau! And probably that one of the things they reffer when they say :" single-player will be limited". ;/

[Ocram's Razr 964]

Your tourism city would have to be pretty far away from your industrial city to avoid pollution. Also, most people would put residents in the same city as tourists and entertainment.

[Selphy 69]

I don't believe they said that playing alone would limit you. Or rather, my interpretation was different. I'm going to have to dig through all the articles again but from what I've read and what I take from what they said, the only thing that limits you if playing one single city. Not being social and playing alone limits you as much as playing with different people but not working together.

If you build multiple cities, they will all work together. The limit only comes from working on a single city because once you have it running like clockwork and everything is fine and dandy, there will be no new sims coming in to town nor will there be any exporting of goods that your industry creates.

You mention that you want one large city with each sector existing all at once but I don't see that happening in SC4 without a ton of mods. I might be wrong, I might be a terrible player but I don't think you can build a city that has both hi-tech industry and dirty industry, has skyscraper skyline and small businesses, has high-end housing and tall apartment buildings.

Each thing phases something out. Dirty industry gets phased out for clean, hi-tech industry. Small businesses get phased out for corporate skyscrapers. Single family housing gets phased out for high-end lofts or huge hotel buildings.

What I see the new SimCity doing is making each thing viable. Dirty industry will never be phased out because you will need some form of manufacturing for your hi-tech industry etc. And that isn't to say that you stick your industrial city in a corner and it won't affect anything. They keep saying how pollution will spread throughout the region if left unchecked. This time, it seems like you can't just stick dirty industry in a corner of your city, put some trees and parks around it and call it a day. Your dirty industrial city will affect everything if you don't plan according/enact ordinances/do something.

I can't say for certain, but I have a feeling that global trading of resources isn't going to be a 1-to-1 thing outside your region. Within the region, if you play with friends, it seems you trade from city to city. If you play alone you can probably give it away to which city needs it.

I imagine whatever global trading exists, it will be with the server. I can see them taking data from each region on the server and calculating a price based on how many units of X gets sent to the server through the international airport. So the more coal that gets shuffled into the market, the lower the prices will be. The less water that gets shuffled into the market, the higher the price will be. And so when you need more resources you probably strike a deal with the server. The deal will probably be like in the current SimCity games where you buy on a monthly basis. So outside of your region you will be dealing with the computer like in SC2 and SC3. When you connected a power line or water pipe to your borders, a random mayor will ask if you want to strike up a deal.

[alex macnamara 139]

So..where´s the challenge?

good point ! I want to think and plan about pollution problems and jobs and traffic. Not the game telling me how to do it and when to do it. They are trying to make the game play more like "you have to build this , this , and this and that order"

so this rules out us building the city of our dreams, now we must build the city of Maxis' dreams

---

Each thing phases something out. Dirty industry gets phased out for clean, hi-tech industry. Small businesses get phased out for corporate skyscrapers. Single family housing gets phased out for high-end lofts or huge hotel buildings.

I disagree with this section. Stuff just doesn't phase out. Learn and read up on "suburban spawl" . Downtowns for example dont get phased out , they get preserved as "old downtown district" and the modern skyscrapers just get built in the next district. Housing near CBD stay housing. Dirty industry stays where it always was. Sometimes they happened to be in a suburb. Does that mean they keep rebuilding dirty industry farther out everything the metro grows another 50,000? I don't think so. Realistically that is an expensive way to go about. The main core of the city is never specialized but some of the outlying suburbs can be.

  Edited July 18, 2012 by Blue Lightning  
Merged posts

[Selphy 69]

So..where´s the challenge?

good point ! I want to think and plan about pollution problems and jobs and traffic. Not the game telling me how to do it and when to do it. They are trying to make the game play more like "you have to build this , this , and this and that order"

so this rules out us building the city of our dreams, now we must build the city of Maxis' dreams

No one is saying you don't have to plan for any of that. In fact, I think you have to plan around pollution more now because it affects your entire region. You can't just plant it in a corner and forget about it bothering other cities in your region.

Also, I can't just zone industry and hopes something happens. There has always been a skeleton of order. You need to zone residential so you get sims in the city. Then you need to zone industry so they'll have some type of a job. This new game is exactly that except it seems they're making it more of a point. Each action you do will have a reaction. You will need to deal with that reaction if you want to keep growing. You can zone residential but eventually your sims will want jobs. How you respond is up to you. You can say "screw this, I'm not zoning industry," but that is going to limit the growth of your city.

Also, you were always within the confines of Maxis's grand design in city building. My dream is to build an entire city on boats and sea-faring vessels connected by planks and bridges. When needed it could sever ties and disperse. There would be large ships that house all the industry and commercial aspects of a city while smaller ships would function as houses. I can't do that in SimCity. The city of your dreams is the city of your dreams within the confines of Maxis's sandbox. You can't honestly tell me that when you played SimCity, you never wished that you could do this instead of that? You adjusted your dream city to work within the game. And it seems you might have to do it again this time but I really feel like they're adding more than they may be taking away in this new game.

Also, it's too soon to even know how things will actually work out. We haven't even seen a real building gameplay video yet.

[pyanodon 218]

And What about the resources cap for single player´s gamer? With no forced trades with people, the resources will end and your game will be a mess until you loose. So...you will be forced to be social until they take down the servers.

[Selphy 69]

And What about the resources cap for single player´s gamer? With no forced trades with people, the resources will end and your game will be a mess until you loose. So...you will be forced to be social until they take down the servers.

This is all pure conjecture but I can see this being a possibility.

I imagine the constant online connection is so that you're constantly connected to some sort of global trade network. Once you get an international airport up and running, you sims will be moving on an "international" level. At this point, I don't think they've said that regions are connected or directly interact with each other so all the sims coming from that airport as well as those resources are projected based on the number of sims that exist on the server which come from the data they gather from your region. Since resources and whatnot will be moved on that same level, I imagine the data they take will be the number of resources moved from everyone's regions. With that data in hand, their server will run the data through some formula and will spit out some pricing. The more that resource exists on the server, the less the prices will be. The less that is on the server, the higher the price will be.

Like in SC2 and SC3 when you connected to a neighbor and bought electricity or water or trash dumping space, you will connect to the server and buy resources based on their projected economy and pricing.

Simply put, build intl' airport, trade with the server like you traded with a neighbor in SC2/SC3 with pricing being determined on a global supply and demand.

Once again, pure conjecture but it makes sense.

[Herdervriend 46]

I myself do not mind online play. But I do mind Origin or any other kind of weird download program.

Though, for the price you have to pay for this game. I rather buy a real version, not a digital one.

Also, because I am having a seriously bad internet provider (no limit, but I should have 20 MBPS, I get barely 4. And it's down a lot of times). I do seriously want to have a game I can play in the times when the stupid internet is down again.

[Ocram's Razr 964]

I think that biofuel should be a reasonable alternative to fossil fuels when those run out.

[iuri99 48]

EA destroyed my dream of conurbation. =/

Why they will control the city boundaries? I though we could send a Accept/Reject option to the neighbour city, and we together create our connections. Control just resources and not control the city/region destroy the city planning objective. Create a little agricultural city, or sprawl the metropolis to another boundaries in our own way are stucked on the MAXIS 'municipal master plan'.

  Edited July 19, 2012 by iuri99  

[NCGAIO 562]

Watch a good explanation of the importance of maintaining the requirement of Origin for the EA.:

  Edited July 22, 2012 by NCGAIO  

[brynhyfryd 222]

http://www.ea.com/1/service-updates

expect Simcity to be added to this list a year or so after release.

[Bipin 3,403]

http://www.ea.com/1/service-updates

expect Simcity to be added to this list a year or so after release.

It's appalling how true this statement really is...

[cirugo 1,889]

http://www.gameplane...choice---Maxis/

"SimCitys-always-online-requirement-will-give-gamers-choice"

up is down...

  Edited July 20, 2012 by cirugo  

[Essex 322]

How can a corporation have the power to not let you play a game where you already paid full bucks for it and some rip off DLC decide for you that you can not play your rightfully owned game? This is sick, demented and completely outrageous and anyone defending these greed monsters should question themselves.

Never will I buy a game from EA ever again.

[NCGAIO 562]

My dear ... In fact she has no power.... we give them so we buy their products.

Just reflect a little about what difference will it make in your life or not play certain games.

The main focus against these traps would be one organized movement which would oblige to all ditribuidores of incorporating quite clear and visible this terms in the sales advertising ...

"You are paying for a LICENSE to use a product that requires internet connection for your use be authorized and that only worked while our servers are on-line on internet. Your rights are described in our EULA, which should be read ( here ) before any transaction "

Who is willing to buy after being told conditions then really need to reassess their needs for the life.

It's always good to remember that.... " Once curls up on the cobweb the fly does not escape the bite of the spider "

  Edited July 20, 2012 by NCGAIO  

[Jim14409 448]

Seems to me the always on connection to play gives some control back to EA, which seems to be lost with SC4. EA sees dollars lost and perhaps don't want to see that happen again. They are setting SC5 up for CONTROL. Control of play and control of mods and new material.

I have played SC since SC2 more hours than is decent to admit to but as it stands now I will not be buying the new version. What I've seen looks out of scale, not even as realistic as SC4 looks. To me it appears more "Disney" looking which I dislike since I'm not a child nor looking for a cartoon. As for the required internet connection, which I don't like, that alone stops me even if I liked the new stuff I've seen. I live in a rural area and my choices are dial-up or satellite. I have satellite but have strict download limits and MMO's don't work, and if they do only for a few minutes before one's download allotment is used up and connection is cut to dial-up speeds or less for twenty-four hours. (EA, we don't all live in a metropolisis.)

With satellite when a storm comes up or heavy snow, connection is lost and one would be unable to play then which is a perfect time to play since TV is on satellite as well and also out. I guess one could always sit and twiddle their thumbs like in the old days huh? EA doesn't care.

Frankly, I wish EVERYONE would boycott this game until EA does it right. I think this SC5 will just be another Sim City Societies, overhyped and rather quickly simply over. SC4 had a magic about it that kept players over the years but I have yet to see any hint of such in SC5. Hopefully I am wrong.

EA can't take my SC4 disk and the great content so many have given, nor can they tell me when or how to play SC4. Thanks to all of you who have created and given so much, I can yet play for years.

I'm very disappointed but there are other fine games out there and more in the pipeline. Look around folks and let EA play with themselves because they don't deserve your money after how they have done. You made Sim City great, not EA. Go where you will be appreciated. There are other companies who dream of having such a loyal following.

[Selphy 69]

My dear ... In fact she has no power.... we give them so we buy their products.

Just reflect a little about what difference will it make in your life or not play certain games.

The main focus against these traps would be one organized movement which would oblige to all ditribuidores of incorporating quite clear and visible this terms in the sales advertising ...

"You are paying for a LICENSE to use a product that requires internet connection for your use be authorized and that only worked while our servers are on-line on internet. Your rights are described in our EULA, which should be read ( here ) before any transaction "

Who is willing to buy after being told conditions then really need to reassess their needs for the life.

It's always good to remember that.... "After the fly falls in the cobweb is hard to escape of the spider"

Tell that to the MILLIONS of players of any MMOs such as ToR, WoW, TERA, etc.

[cirugo 1,889]

My dear ... In fact she has no power.... we give them so we buy their products.

Just reflect a little about what difference will it make in your life or not play certain games.

The main focus against these traps would be one organized movement which would oblige to all ditribuidores of incorporating quite clear and visible this terms in the sales advertising ...

"You are paying for a LICENSE to use a product that requires internet connection for your use be authorized and that only worked while our servers are on-line on internet. Your rights are described in our EULA, which should be read ( here ) before any transaction "

Who is willing to buy after being told conditions then really need to reassess their needs for the life.

It's always good to remember that.... "After the fly falls in the cobweb is hard to escape of the spider"

Tell that to the MILLIONS of players of any MMOs such as ToR, WoW, TERA, etc.

No one is complaining about MMOs...we're complaining about being forced to play a single player game online.

[Azurespecter 506]

Tell that to the MILLIONS of players of any MMOs such as ToR, WoW, TERA, etc.

No one is complaining about MMOs...we're complaining about being forced to play a single player game online.

SimCity is no longer a single player game. You gotta stop thinking that this new game is a sequel to SC4. It's a complete reboot: new engine, new purpose, new plan, new gameplay, new functionality. We hope it will end up with gameplay as incredible as our SC4 series, but for right now it's probably going to be more similar to the original Simcity than it will to SC4.

  Edited July 22, 2012 by Blue Lightning  
Cleaned up quote stack

[cirugo 1,889]

SimCity is no longer a single player game. You gotta stop thinking that this new game is a sequel to SC4. It's a complete reboot: new engine, new purpose, new plan, new gameplay, new functionality. We hope it will end up with gameplay as incredible as our SC4 series, but for right now it's probably going to be more similar to the original Simcity than it will to SC4.

In that case, I will do whatever is in my power to make sure it fails. And the original SimCity wasn't online either.

  Edited July 22, 2012 by Blue Lightning  
Cleaned up quote stack

[NCGAIO 562]

SimCity is no longer a single player game. You gotta stop thinking that this new game is a sequel to SC4. It's a complete reboot: new engine, new purpose, new plan, new gameplay, new functionality. We hope it will end up with gameplay as incredible as our SC4 series, but for right now it's probably going to be more similar to the original Simcity than it will to SC4.

Exactly, it's all new. So there should be no appeal to old fan base for pre purchase the game.

The issue here is not what the game will be as it became clear in the interviews and images published. What about the EA want to carry the huge fan base for their platform services ( ORIGIN ) based on the unusual success of SC4.

Everything is being done with this and other titles based on the deployment of this new business model that turns the customer and not just the game in product.

can read about it:..

No longer is it online that only enhance more dissatisfaction and cancellations. Concern is expressed now with this new nonsense of official site about hear the basis of the fans if it will not change anything in the final product.

AS CANCEL PRE-ORDER

Go to http://www.ea.com/profile and log in, click on the order and hit the "customer support" link. Then click "contact us" which is located on the right side of the page.

Then select the Product, Category, and Platform. If wanted to vent to someone chose "Call Me" option

SOURCE: Just called EA and cancelled my preorder

  Edited July 30, 2012 by CaptCity