Road Top Mass Transit (RTMT) - Development and Support

[CorinaMarie 29,774]

10 hours ago, jeffryfisher said:

Sometimes the builder divides my zone, resulting in one slot with a no-road zot. When that happens, I ruthlessly de-zone and draw my double or triple wide zone again (rinse repeat as many times as necessary)...

While you have the wider zoned lot grown, this would be the ideal time to make that building historical so it can't sub divide.

[port0036 1]

On 10/1/2019 at 3:47 AM, rsc204 said:

@123asdf: From the sound of your posts, it very much looks like you've not correctly installed the v3.5 mod. Whilst it does have an installer, that is by no means the only step to installing RTMT. Since no items appear in the Misc Transit menu, almost certainly you don't have the actual lots installed, even though it appears you might have installed some of the Props for them.

Could it be that you only ran the installer "Install_RTMTV3_SingleProps_PropSet.exe" or "Install_RTMTV3_PropFamilies_PropSet.exe", but forgot to run "Install_RTMTV350.exe"? Note you should only ever install one of those first two, even then, it's likely you'll need to do some more work with the files to finish the setup. It is therefore imperative that you read the included Readme so you understand the process properly.

 

Waaaaaait a second. I'm having the same problem as @123asdf: I move the RTMTV3 folder into my Plugin folder with only the files listed in the example installations in the ReadMe. The installation ReadMe doesn't list an installer step and I don't see one in the full RTMTV3 folder I downloaded. 

Am I  missing the installer file? You say they are .exe files, but I'm on a Mac. Should I be installing a difference version or is RTMT not Mac friendly?

[CaptCity 4,868]

Hi @port0036

I'm not on a Mac, but I think you might have gotten the zip version rather than the installer version, so there won't be an installer file. I believe it takes something more to use the installer on a Mac (if even possible), so the zip is what you might need. In either case, it might be helpful to show an image of what is in your RTMT plugins folders. Just as a possible quick thing to check first, you might have left the MML lot in the plugins. This will prevent the regular lots from showing up until the MML lot is plopped. Other than that, it would help to know what you have installed.

[port0036 1]

Thank you for responding! I definitely have the zip version. 

Below I've uploaded screenshots of my RTMTV3 folder and the props folder within it, with are both sitting in my Plugins folder with the NAM/CAM (which seems to be working).

I also have one other lot, the Serenity Roundabout Subway Station, in my Plugins. It's also not showing up in my Misc. transport menu, so I must be doing something wrong very broadly.

[CaptCity 4,868]

Hmmm... That all looks pretty standard. I threw the same files in my plugins and all seemed to go as expected. I'm wondering if it is something Mac specific. There are a couple others who are more familiar with Macs who will hopefully be along. 

Not sure if it applies to your situation, but I did find this about installing on Macs (Link).

[port0036 1]

Awesome. I'll comb through this later today and see if it solves anything. I'll also look back at the Mac NAM instructions and see if there's any wisdom to be gleaned there.

[port0036 1]

Actually, that was easy. I don't have the "containers" folder listed on that post (either owing to differences in the current OS or because I bought the game through Steam).

My NAM/CAM folder is in the same plugins location as the RTMTV3 folder, which contains the things in the screenshots.

As shown in this screenshot, my plugins folder has the NAM/CAM, RTMTV3, a roundabout subway/bus stop I though would replace the road top stuff in terms of utility, and the texture pack that is a dependency of the roundabout.

The only thing in the folder that works is the NAM/CAM, which leads me to believe I'm doing something wrong that's not unique to RTMTV3.

 

[rsc204 21,836]

9 hours ago, port0036 said:

It's also not showing up in my Misc. transport menu, so I must be doing something wrong very broadly.

It would seem you've got all the relevant files in place for the RTMT lots to be present in the menus, including the props that appear on them. Otherwise, if you kept the MML component, you will need to place the "construction lot" before the main lots will appear. But I suspect you won't have it, for one it's not present in your screenshot, but the file is named RTMTV3__MML.dat, which you can remove if you prefer not to use the optional MML functionality.

46 minutes ago, port0036 said:

I don't have the "containers" folder listed on that post (either owing to differences in the current OS or because I bought the game through Steam)

Steam uses a different setup from the AppStore version, all Plugins should be inside your User folder under:

Documents\SimCity 4\Plugins

Provided you place any files within that folder or subfolders, it should get loaded when starting the game.

For example, the file RTMTV3_Lots_NonRoadTop_US.dat contains everything inside for it's three lots to appear. So I'm wondering if you really are using the right Plugins folder?

9 hours ago, port0036 said:

Am I  missing the installer file? You say they are .exe files, but I'm on a Mac. Should I be installing a difference version or is RTMT not Mac friendly?

There are two different versions of RTMT 3.50 on the STEX, the installer version, which is intended for Windows users and the .zip version, intended for Mac users. Not to mention, for a mod based on TE lots, it works without issue even on the latest 64-bit version of SC4. As such, it's about as Mac friendly as you can get.

If the readme or anyone refers to the installers, that's probably because most people are using Windows. But the .zip version is essentially the same files, but packaged differently so Mac users don't have to resort to 3rd party tools to extract them. So far as I can tell from downloading the .zip version, everything you need is contained within it to make it work. With the exception of any external dependencies needed for the Props used. In your example you'd need the DPMO Bus Shelter model, but the other props are either included or come from the base game/NAM.

RTMT 3.50 is actually out of date though, you should at least install the v3.60 update from here, optionally the Interim T-RAM Stations exist as an addon too. Since the 3.60 update works very differently, most of the files you have from the base 3.50 install will be replaced as part of the process. Therefore, I'd see if you are still experiencing problems after updating the lots. Honestly if the Plugins folder you are showing is the correct one, I can't easily explain what is preventing them from appearing.

I should note that looking at your Plugins folder, the NAM + CAM package for OSX is pretty old and since that time, the NAM installer is now multi-platform. Meaning it will run natively under MacOS, requiring Java to make this possible. Not that it's really connected to this problem, but is that folder not the Wineskin/resource for installing it?, which if you are running Catalina or later no longer works period. Or does it actually contain the files used by the NAM/CAM in-game?

[port0036 1]

You were absolutely right. The plugins were in the wrong folder. When I searched for the SimCity folder, one was nested in my iCloud documents, so I thought it was a copy. I stuck the NAM in the App Store folder when I installed it, and thought it had installed there and that it worked, but in fact it installed to the correct folder. Then I plunked all the other plugins in that folder, and none of the worked.

I don't think that's the Wineskin for the NAM. Installing it was a breeze, and it seems to work fine (I'm running BigSur).

  Edited March 25, 2021 by port0036  

[nycsc4 5,250]

My apologies if this has been answered before, I haven't seen it.  Is it possible to prevent trains from stopping at bus stops?  Would help cut down on transit backups like this one:

[APSMS 1,893]

@nycsc4
If this is a continual problem, the only suggestion I can make is a change to your automata plugin file, to change both the max length of your trams and also how many Sims per vehicle it generates.

Given that the visualization has zero impact on the underlying simulation (core gameplay), you can safely do this without worrying that you're screwing up your traffic network. The automata file should be in your NAM folder in your plugins under the Automata Controller folder. Use the reader tool to edit it, I believe the exemplars you want are Sims per Train Car and Commute Train Length.

Unfortunately these exemplars apply to both commuter trains and Light Rail/El-Rail/tram (if I'm remembering correctly), but they should still solve the issue of giant conga lines of trams running around

[Tyberius06 12,209]

1 minute ago, nycsc4 said:

My apologies if this has been answered before, I haven't seen it.  Is it possible to prevent trains from stopping at bus stops?  Would help cut down on transit backups like this one:

I just checked just in case. There should be GLR only and/or BUS only and Subway only stations for the Tram-in-Avenue (TIA) network in RTMT v3.6. Although there might be a game limitation and the automata will visually stop at the station anyway, but that doesn't mean that there would be any actual passanger exchange between different transit types. Automata would stop visually on a network enabled pass through LOT as well (like my Caribou Ramp Relots.), though it doesn't have actually station function. 

- Tyberius

[nycsc4 5,250]

6 minutes ago, APSMS said:

@nycsc4
If this is a continual problem, the only suggestion I can make is a change to your automata plugin file, to change both the max length of your trams and also how many Sims per vehicle it generates.

Given that the visualization has zero impact on the underlying simulation (core gameplay), you can safely do this without worrying that you're screwing up your traffic network. The automata file should be in your NAM folder in your plugins under the Automata Controller folder. Use the reader tool to edit it, I believe the exemplars you want are Sims per Train Car and Commute Train Length.

Unfortunately these exemplars apply to both commuter trains and Light Rail/El-Rail/tram (if I'm remembering correctly), but they should still solve the issue of giant conga lines of trams running around

Ah, thank you for this.  Being able to limit car length would be fantastic as they get so long right now.

Thank you both!  Seems to be a visual issue.

[Inowknowhow2fly 5]

Hello,

I really like the "bus/subway road top stations" under the NAM "road top elevated rail".

I installed RTMT  v3.50 and it works fine but when I copy over the files from RTMT v3.60, as per instruction, the RTMT buildings in the menu disappear.

I kept testing it and realized that as soon as I copy two files, "RTMTV3_Locales.dat" and "RTMTV3_Lots_US.dat", the RTMT buildings in the menu disappear.

 

What am I doing wrong?

 

Mind you when I installed RTMT v3.50 I selected:

- "Install the Roadtop Stations" only,

- Did not tick the "Install the Menu Management Lot",

- I have a right-hand-driving Installation,

- I use the Standard NAM Capacity Settings.

 

Thank you.

[Tyberius06 12,209]

1 hour ago, Inowknowhow2fly said:

Hello,

I really like the "bus/subway road top stations" under the NAM "road top elevated rail".

I installed RTMT  v3.50 and it works fine but when I copy over the files from RTMT v3.60, as per instruction, the RTMT buildings in the menu disappear.

I kept testing it and realized that as soon as I copy two files, "RTMTV3_Locales.dat" and "RTMTV3_Lots_US.dat", the RTMT buildings in the menu disappear.

 

What am I doing wrong?

 

Mind you when I installed RTMT v3.50 I selected:

- "Install the Roadtop Stations" only,

- Did not tick the "Install the Menu Management Lot",

- I have a right-hand-driving Installation,

- I use the Standard NAM Capacity Settings.

 

Thank you.

Hi,

If I remember correctly, within the RTMT v3.60 there should be two further ZIP/Folders: Core Add-On Pack and Optional Components. This second one is supposed to contain an updated version of the RTMTV3__MML.dat, that can cause the disappearance of the LOTs. The other reason can be that somehow those two files from the RTMT v3.6 got corrupted. Try redownloading the full pack again and replace the files in your RTMT folder with the files from the freshly downloaded pack. 

- Tyberius 

[rsc204 21,836]

11 hours ago, Inowknowhow2fly said:

I kept testing it and realized that as soon as I copy two files, "RTMTV3_Locales.dat" and "RTMTV3_Lots_US.dat", the RTMT buildings in the menu disappear.

The Locales.dat isn't a problem, it only includes translations/text for the RTMT content.

The file RTMTV3_Lots_US.dat contains the standard Road, Street, OWR and Avenue lots for RTMT, but it won't work unless you've the corresponding RTMTV3_Stations_NAMCapacity_XXX.dat file installed, since that's where the Buildings are, which contain all the properties that tell the game where to put items in the menus.

If you only want the NonRoadTop lots are before, just take whichever version of the RTMTV3_Lots_NonRoadTop_XXX.dat you want and install that.

Note that in both instances, you should be using the files contained in the v3.6 update, which overwrite those from the v3.5 install. However, nothing else is mandatory to be present for these lots to appear in the Misc Transit menu. Although to avoid problems you should ensure you have a full installation as per the readme files.

You should also ensure you do not have either the DAMN Menus folder nor any file named RTMTV3__MML.dat installed, which may give the impression that the RTMT items are missing. However both these optional components are designed to hide the RTMT lots until you want to use them, keeping your menus tidier.

[JeffSalisbury 59]

Quick question about RTMT: I've noticed that lots already developed that are only a single lot wide (1wide x Xdeep) will eventually redevelop into a multi-wide lot, which gets rid of the No Road Access zot. For some reason, if the lot isn't developed yet, I've noticed it never seems to get developed as a multi-width building. 

Anyone else experienced this, and has it resolved for you eventually? I've run things on cheetah speed for a decade and haven't seen any of them develop yet. 

[Lucario Boricua 7,031]

RTMT lots are transit lots, they aren't networks. Buildings can't develop from zones which only front transit lots, only from networks. You'll need to either make the zone bigger (such that it overlaps a network tile) or make the zones face a different direction (doable if the zone is next to an intersection). Then you'll see them develop as usual.

[JeffSalisbury 59]

But lots can combine to form a larger building even if they're two smaller lot sizes, yes? For example, if there's a 1x2 beside a 2x2, those can combine to form a 3x2, right?

[Lucario Boricua 7,031]

27 minutes ago, JeffSalisbury said:

But lots can combine to form a larger building even if they're two smaller lot sizes, yes? For example, if there's a 1x2 beside a 2x2, those can combine to form a 3x2, right?

Yes, that is true, but it isn't always reliable. You might need to demolish and re-zone in some cases if the 1x# zones don't end up joining to form a larger zone whose fronting straddles both the RTMT stop and the actual network.

[JeffSalisbury 59]

This is something I'll have to look into doing. 

Before I forget, this mod is absolutely fantastic! This is something they should have implemented in the original game. To have mass transit stops like busses and subways eating spots where development should happen was an insane decision by the designers back in the day. The only other thing I can figure is perhaps they considered having transit stops as something you could integrate into buildings, like you'd see in Toronto or other major metro cities. 

[junspud 1,066]

Does anyone else have trouble getting the 'Simfox GLR shelter road' prop from the interim t-ram package to show up? I have the model files and the prop file installed but I can't get it to show up. All of the other shelter options work.

I did notice the XML file in the 'RTMT_PropS_GLR_SimFox_Modern_Road.sc4desc' file includes this;

<PLUGIN ResKey="0x5ad0e817-0x599a9a13-0x00030000" File="SF_GLR_Shelter_HD-0x5ad0e817_0x599a9a13_0x30000.SC4Model">

Though this specific file doesn't exist.

[rsc204 21,836]

The file you need (model/dependency) is SimFox's GLR Station.SC4Model.

Reading data from the XML file isn't always helpful, many times the file names get spat out in testing, but it's common that the release files have changed. In fact, even the RKT1 or model ID has been altered from it's original (the Prop's) creation, that's why both XML and LD files should at the very least be viewed with suspicion.

[rsc204 21,836]

Wow it's been a long time since I had an update, it's only a small one but I think quite important though:

One of the issues with having around 400 unique lots in one mod has always been how to handle them in the Menus. Until now we've made do with MML and DAMN support to try and offer an easier solution, but now we can have submenus, this is clearly better.

One menu/Icon inside Misc. Transit now contains all the RTMT lots, this will be available with RTMT 4.

[Terring 6,476]

[AsimPika3172 1,145]

Waiting for next version of RTMT comes with submenus supported!