NAM: Development

[frimi2 0]

Ah, and after you red the documentation, you had copied the

....\NetworkAddonMod_Beta_072505\ModFiles\1.0 OPTIONAL PLUGINS\

AvenueTurningLanes_Plugin_File\NetworkAddonMod_Avenue_Turning_Lane_Plugin_Beta.dat

 

to the NAM-folder, I'm sure.

[Dr. Neitchskrimfrauwnmoya 7]

Thanks for the replies!

Date: 7/27/2005 7:26:59 AM Author: Tropod

Dr. Neitchskrimfrauwnmoya

When Maxis released the game, I don't recall every intersection possibility & type documented in booklet provided . We were basically left to our own devices to figure it all out for ourselves, what was & was not possible. And that is (suppose to be) part of the fun of playing the game; to explore.

hehehe, yeah, you got a point on this, I never pictured it that way. But my exploration of the game is finished. What I want to say is that when I first played SC4, I had no idea what was possible and what wasn't, so I tried everything. Just like you said, I've explored the game and yes, it was fun. Now after almost two years, I know the limits of the game. There are things that I thought would be never ever possible, like having a cool Y avenue junction or a road junction in an avenue corner. So I would never try it and probably would not know about it until I see it in some CJ or somewhere else. Just remember, like one year ago or so, everyone was saying that diagonal streets would be impossible. Just look at what we have now. I don't know if you understand what I tried to say.

I'm sure it would be a lot more rewarding to see a lot people using your stuff (new intersections), because for now only a certain number of people may found out the new possibilities. A lot of people never go on the forums and just download the NAM. I'm sure those (who representents over 50% of the downloads) have no ideas about these new intersections. I'm often checking this forum and was aware of some of the new stuff coming, like for example in the texture request thread. But even with that in head, I've missed a lot of the other good stuff.



Maybe it wasn't clear enough in my previous post, but, in fact, what worried me the most was the new intersections. As for the new path, drawing &/or graphical bug fixes and visual improvements I was reffering to in my other post, I'm not saying in any way to have a complete listing of these. I was only suggesting to give maybe a couple of examples just to give a rough idea of the changes. For exemple, in the visual imporvements, it could be said : darkened puzzled pieces, monorail-elevated highway overpass improved and maybe one or two more things. That's all, just 4-5 examples.

Date: 7/27/2005 7:26:59 AM Author: Tropod

If you would really like to help contribute ; take a look at the Networks: Custom Content: How To's & Sample Pics  thread. And feel free to post some 'how to's' of the newer intersections (even if it is just showing them in a blank area with nothing around them), being sure to follow a similar posting format to existing posts in the thread.

No problems, I've seen this thread yesterday. I'll start taking screenshots and when I'll have a lot of them, I'll put them together in this thread. 

Date: 7/27/2005 7:26:59 AM Author: Tropod

As for those two avenue<>onewayroad transitions;

-Diagonal Avenue with curved end into OneWayRoad orthogonal transition

The diagonal avenue transitions into orthogonal onewayroad on *one* side of the diagonal avenue only.

 

-Diagonal Avenue into OneWayRoad Orthogonal/Orthogonal Forked Transition

The diagonal avenue transitions into orthogonal onewayroad on *both* sides of the diagonal avenue, hence the 'forked' transition. So there'll effectively be onewayroad going into one side of the avenue, & another onewayroad comming out of the avenue.

Thanks! So that's just what it meant? Okay so it was pretty simple finally...

[Tropod 144]

Dr. Neitchskrimfrauwnmoya

No problem. I will see about perhaps adding some sort of list of some kind in the next verion.

Wealth-Dependant Models

I've taken a closer look at this. Unfortunately, the initial findings on Wealth-dependant Models look to be incorrect or rather half-correct.

Upon further examination it *seems* that Wealth-Dependant Models solely relies on the actual network itself & whether the network is generally a Textured-Referenced Network or Modelled-Referenced Network. The only reason Wealth-Dependant Models appears to have worked with current tests is because of the files used to carry out the tests (which has & hasn't helped, depending on how one sees it), which initally lead me to believe Wealth-Dependant Models work (in general) when in fact they may not (sorry folks). This isn't the first time I've seen something like this occur, where something is reliant on specific network. The IntersectionOrdering RUL is not capable of referencing Textures only, it must reference Exemplar>Model for a given network tile. So if the network checktype being used is a road-based network, Wealth-Dependant Models will work as the IntersectionOrdering references the Exemplar>Model, & the existance of the textures being present is valid as the road network is generally considered a textured network. The same/similar seems to apply in principle to the other networks. So basically it was by chance that this was picked up really, as it probably won't work for most cases.

Swamper

So this is probably why you may not of been able to get one of those items working using the methods posted. The method seems to only be valid for certain networks. It wasn't until I took a closer look at this did this become apparent.

On a slightly related note (most info is already known);

Textures, Wealths, Densities & others.

For Network Textured Tiles
Texture InstanceID Format
0x######KZ

K (previously labelled W) = Surrounding tile Key applier/verifier. Table below.
Z = Zoom level.

K Key Applier/Verifier Table:
Table applies in the case where all textures in the InstanceID range 0x######0# to 0x######F# exist.

Can take on different Wealth & Density Zones, &/or other types.
0 = No Wealth. No building. Nothing.
1 = Low Wealth.
2 = Medium Wealth.
3 = High Wealth.
4 = Undeveloped Medium/High Density Residential or Commercial.
5 = Medium Density Residential or Commercial.
6 = High Density Residential or Commercial.
7 = Agricultural or Landfill.
8 > F = currently unknown. So may or may not serve a purpose.

EDIT: I've noted some oddities in some cases.

I've attached a zip file containing numbered textures from 0 > F (for anyone interested in doing any testing at all with them). It will override the orthogonal road Texture piece (assuming installation is done properly), but InstanceIDs can be changed for other tiles as they're only textures. So as you might be able to tell, I originally did have them as the one tile road but figured changing it to orthogonal road was more likely to pickup a difference.

[prince_of_sims 0]

https://www.simtropolis.com/stex/details.cfm?id=3310

 

i think these underpasses are a lot better than the ones that you can build with the NAM..... could these be made functional and UDI enabled? i don't know how hard it'd be to create custom SC4PATH files for these lots and integrate them into the NAM, but i think they would be a worthy addition

[Tropod 144]

It is something that both myself & Redlotus have tried doing. But as far as we're aware; making something like that as a true network item is not possible *graphically*, because of how the models are handled/made.

[prince_of_sims 0]

oh well..... we can't have everything we want.... maybe SimCity 5, if it ever comes out....

excellent job on the NAM Tropod! i've been an ass and not read the readme properly.... that's why i couldn't get the ATL to work properly!

 

EDIT: does the ATL use wealth-dependent textures?

[Swamper77 90]

Prince of Sims,

I have answered this over in the NAM Requests Thread

Tropod,

You might want to look over there as well and follow the link I provided.

-Swamper77

[fishstix001 0]

yea I did

 

[Shadow Assassin 336]

It is something that both myself & Redlotus have tried doing. But as far as we're aware; making something like that as a true network item is not possible *graphically*, because of how the models are handled/made.
***

Not if you had the original gmax models...

[buddybud 63]

hi guys i have a question....i've been developing some lots with overhanging props to go under nam pieces and bridges.....everything was going peachy keen when i ran into a snag....my props have worked fine in conjunction with all ingame models up till now...for some reason the cylinderical supports under the elevated roads and avenues dont seem to like my props...weirdly enough only one half seems to be effected...heres a picture...

 

as you can see the back pillar dissapears while there is a  prop underneith...though the front pillar is fine...if we rotate the view....

 

 

 

 

we see that the lower half of the same pillar (now in the front) dissappears while the other seems to do what its supposed to do....again i must stress this seems to be the only model to respond like this so far..well half a model ....i know you guys probably didn't have what i'm doing in mind when you started doing this so no prob if theres no fix for this...... but it's really annoying me....

 

my question is...is there a way to accomadate this or is it just the way it is....noooooo

worst comes to worst ill design a prop to cover up this prob

anyways any answers would be appreciated...love everything you guys do...

[Tropod 144]

I honestly couldn't say off-hand why that would be occuring. I was initially thinking because they (the puzzlepiece items) are real 3D Models, but that doesn't make sense why it'd only occur with that item & not others. It could very well be a setting on the model itself, the Exemplar file or something else. Most likely would have to be looked into. You say it's only this it has occured on though? How many & what other puzzlepiece-based items have you tried this with?

 

[Shadow Assassin 336]

Well, it could be they way the LODs are designed... but since this is a 3D model, there isn't a LOD like on BATs.

[buddybud 63]

heres a couple more witha a 'peg rtk3 rec' overhanging prop and a 'morrast embankment' o.h. prop, 

just to show it ain't my lods or my sanity ......

youll note the same problem occurs.. the pillar appears when the rtk prop is below ground level...that could be a clue.

...anyways heres the photos

https://www.simtropolis.com/idealbb/files//Snaggle01.jpg align=baseline>

https://www.simtropolis.com/idealbb/files//Snaggle02.jpg align=baseline>

 

 

tropod asked..... How many & what other puzzlepiece-based items have you tried this with?

 

the answer is that ive tried to find any pieces that would work...anything to fill the space under a bridge or nam piece.....so all the peg stuff meant fur under monorail or elevated rail.....theres not much out there and thats why im doing what im doing...filling a gap

i've fiddled with this stuff for about a month now...this is the first problem of this kind..ive placed them under bridges...highways...nampieces.....i obviously failed to use the road pieces...but i think ive tried almost everything else....a lot of which can be seen here underbridge scenery  thread

 

edit....the post under the diagnal elevated road bits reacts exactly the same as this...(same model?)

[smoncrie 43]

I noticed this problem with one of the two columns when I first started making puzzle pieces, and I corrected it in my pieces.  The problem is in the S3D model's vertex data.  If you like, I could fix these columns in my next NAM Cosmetic mod.

[GoaSkin 2]

Do you know a way to fix the models of my avenue exit? Because the cloned Maxis model does only show a mess in iLive, all the other persons who tried to fix the model didn't had success on it.

[smoncrie 43]

GoaSkin, I assume you mean this piece. A first pass on the orthogonal piece using a spreadsheet on the vertex data, gives this:

 

I have attached the changed models to this post.

 

 

Edit:  The two sides look different because of the viewing angle

 

 

 

By the way I think that it would be better to change the description to something like:

Elevated Highway to Elevated Avenue Connector Puzzle Piece

[GoaSkin 2]

This is the one I mean:

[buddybud 63]

smoncrie said If you like, I could fix these columns in my next NAM Cosmetic mod.

yes please smoncrie that would be wonderful...i want to release my lots and this would help alot....(pun)

much appreciated....thanx

[smoncrie 43]

Attached to this post is my patch for this puzzle piece.

I think that this piece needs a LOT more work, but I am not volunteering to do it at this time.

[GoaSkin 2]

Thanks for your modifications! I will test it.

It would be an advance if it's possible to force the models to be illustrated well in iLive because then, other people can fix it easier.

[bratzo 0]

align=baseline>

I

[Tropod 144]

This is just the development thread. An item or something posted in this thread doesn't necessarily constitute that it's in the NAM.

 

EDIT: At the moment, as far as I'm aware, no one has/is taken on doing them.

 

EDIT: GoaSkin: sometimes if you use original Maxis S3D Models, some of them do not show up properly or at all in the Reader, especially if you try to modify them in any way. Because of this, that is why some times original Maxis models should not be used &/or modified (unless you hex edit them).

[GoaSkin 2]

see next posting!

[GoaSkin 2]

I found out that the following constants are valid for the Highway Intersection RUL file (some of them are possible nowhere used):



PieceType
Piece
ResetPieces
StepOffsets
CellLayout
ConsLayout
CheckType
CopyFrom
Transpose
Rotate
ReplacementIntersection
ConvertQueryID
PlaceQueryID
HandleOffset
PreviewEffect
Costs
AutoTileBase
AutoPathBase
Translate
AutoPlace
OneWayDir

RotationRing
AddTypes
AllowedOverrides

[mcarch 15]

It would be nice to have the ramps the same color as the avenue.

[GoaSkin 2]

There is a road color MOD somewhere what makes all the types of roads and highways have the same (darker) color. It is not NAM-dependant and attached to a forum thread somewhere here.

[ardecila 124]

It has been long enough since we had some REAL development in here... mostly just technical and GLR stuff.



There you go. It's not quite finished- there are still some texturing errors.

All ramps are two-lane, because they have to handle the total volume of the incoming highway. I also chose to take the trumpet to the left because that's how they build them around here.

BTW, Teirusu - you'll be interested to know that this is based off of the interchange between 355 and 55 out in Bolingbrook there.

[GoaSkin 2]

I am currently creating dual-network puzzle pieces with el-rail over streets:




The following things are currently undeclared for me:

- how do I replace the static base texture with the wealth-dependant ones?
- how do I replace the signals with stop signs?
- what is the instance ID range of the T-intersection (straight street, dead-end road)?

[Dexter 40]

Date: 8/22/2005 2:21:34 PM Author: ardecila It has been long enough since we had some REAL development in here...&nbsp; mostly just technical and GLR stuff.&nbsp; width=524> There you go.&nbsp; It's not quite finished-&nbsp; there are still some texturing errors. All ramps are two-lane, because they have to handle the total volume of the incoming highway.&nbsp; I also chose to take the trumpet to the left because that's how they build them around here.

quote>

Great! I look forward to seeing that ingame. One thing thr game needs more is interchanges

[Duke87 1,070]

Date: 8/22/2005 2:21:34 PM Author: ardecila It has been long enough since we had some REAL development in here...&nbsp; mostly just technical and GLR stuff.&nbsp;   There you go.&nbsp; It's not quite finished-&nbsp; there are still some texturing errors. All ramps are two-lane, because they have to handle the total volume of the incoming highway.&nbsp; I also chose to take the trumpet to the left because that's how they build them around here. BTW, Teirusu - you'll be interested to know that this is based off of the interchange between 355 and 55 out in Bolingbrook there.

quote>

Well, even if they build them that way wherever you live, that interchange would be more efficeine in terms of space and distance with the trumpet going the other way. So maybe we need two versions....