SPAs Urbanist BAT Thread

[nofunk 1,933]

Have to agree with the Mightygoose and Jason on this. First option.

[T Wrecks 10,209]

Just imagine Mr. Leigh Zee from across the street started to paint his fence, but got tired and decided not to finish his job.

Seriously, I think both options are fine - remember that we are talking about stuff 95% of all players would probably never have noticed. And remember, too, that you are not making this for a game with perfect graphics. Chances are that in any urban context, the picture will be so full of details and imperfections (Maxis doesn't have ANY shaded props!) that the tiny differences we're discussing here willbe rendered irrelevant in the bigger picture. This is not to say that I don't value and respect your quest for perfection, but I think we have reached a point where any choice is a good choice and can be made without headache and worry.

[spa 968]

Mightygoose: First option it is. It was actually pretty unanimous

Jason:  I actually don't know precisely how Cycledogg made shaded props. My guess, if memory serves, is that he made the models as normal, but then added a transparent object to the scene. The transparent object is invisible to the eye of course, but it still casts a shadow. With the transparent object appropriate placed, Cycledogg could have shaded one side of his props creating shaded versions. They're great on the whole, but I wish he had been consistent about including a shaded and unshaded version. His flowers, for example, can look pretty repetitive, but it's hard to rotate them because it throws the shadows off. Shaded props do have their drawbacks!

Nofunk: Duly noted

T Wrecks: Man sometimes I feel like Mr. Leigh Zee At the end of the day you're absolutely right. Every scene in SC4 is going to have some blemishes. I went with Leigh Zee solution. It was the clear favourite.

So I'm finally getting around to updating my thread. I have been picking away at a bat of the Elmwood Apartments, my current Halifax address. Since it has been so long since I have posted, here's the real life picture of the building to refresh everyone's memory:

Beautiful old place isn’t she? The Elmwood sits at the corner of Barrington and South Street overlooking Cornwallis Park. It was built in 1890 and actually started out as the Elmwood Hotel. I even found an old photograph from that era showing how it looked back then.

The grounds were certainly better kept and at some point over the years the porch was rebuilt and the main entrance moved to the Barrington Street side. Other than that though, it’s pretty much the same as it was back in 1890. The Elmwood, along with Victoria Hall and a tenement on South Street are pretty much the only large wooden buildings left in Halifax. Halifax has a lot of old wooden buildings, but most of them are houses. Large multi-unit wooden buildings like the Elmwood have actually become quite rare. The Elmwood may look a little ratty on the outside, but it still has really good bones. Hopefully developers won’t be tempted into knocking it down to get its prime location.

Anyway, enough rambling, this is what I have.

I did take a little liberty with the side chimney. It looked silly ending before the roofline so I extended it all the way up. Not quite like the real thing, but probably closer to how it was back in the day. At this point the modelling is pretty much done. The only thing I have left to add is the junk on the balcony (chairs, some potted plants, a bbq). Obviously textures are still to come as well. Besides the yellow, I’m planning on including a few other colour variations. I’m leaving for Italy for 5 weeks on Saturday so my set of old wooden buildings will have to wait until August.

[edmonton_stinks 5]

Great idea to SC4-ize such a beautiful building. Within the context of the game, it could potentially work quite well as a hotel, particularly in resort towns.

[Silur 3,304]

Hi, SPA - You have unique artist line - excellent for me. Thank You

[Simbourgeois 139]

Oh, I'm sure this will be yet another masterpiece!

Looks great so far!

Best regards,

Simbourgeois

Mayor of Belleville

[spa 968]

Edmonton: Thanks. Although I'm beginning to think I should stop adding buildings that I live in to the game because when I do I end up having to move very shortly afterwords!

Silur: Thanks

Simbourgeois: Thanks. Slowly but surely I'm making wooden buildings a little more common in SC4 

Well it's been a while since I have posted in here. After 30 days away I'm back from Italy. I'll post some pictures when I get them sorted, but for now suffice it to say my wife and I had a good time. Saw Florence, Rome, Venice, the Cinque Terre, Lucca and San Gimignano. While I was away, my house also closed (a Halifax Box of my own) so I'll be moving shortly. A bit of a hectic summer! I did take this weekend though just to relax and shake off the jet lag so I spent some time finalizing the Elmwood Apartments. Below is how it turned out.

Not a whole lot to say about it. I'm generally pleased with how it turned out. Elmwood will grow on a corner and provide housing for R$$. Like with all my corner bats, I'll mirror the whole thing so that there will be a version for both left and right corners. I'll probably also try out a few other colour variations for the sake of variety.

Anyway, with Elmwood nearing the finish I'm finally almost done my batch of residentials.

[SimHoTToDDy 2,938]

Lovely. I think this less blue "white" trim is far more appropriate than that used on the Victoria Hall. The small windows don't really look like they are pressed into the facade at all (that my be an illusion from the trim), but it might be worth adjusting. Otherwise, I think it looks great.

[1ajs 49]

Originally posted by: spa

1ajs: Not to get you too excited or anything but is this a picture of your building?

If so it's in my folders along with a ton of other potential buildings (457 which is more than I could ever do before sim city 5 is relased in the next two or three years) and might get done someday.

quote>

just went through all 44 pages and found this from 4yrs ago! good god how did i miss this anyhow

no its not my grandmas building

this one is though

http://www.google.ca/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=51.0305,-114.068821&spn=0.00081,0.00239&z=19&layer=c&cbll=51.030491,-114.068635&panoid=O5hADwbQ3urPlTOA7jBsQA&cbp=12,132.58,,0,-28.74

[spa 968]

Todd: Thanks. To my eye the trim is practically the same, but if you think this trim is more appealing, so much the better About the windows, you're right there really isn't any large setback into the wall, but the windows on the real thing sit practically flush with the wall too. All of them anyway except the one attic window at the very top right side. At this point, I'm done with wooden residentials and I'm ready to move on

1Ajs: Wow 44 pages. I guess that's the sum total of several years of batting. I find it funny to look back at my old stuff now as my technique and ideas have changed over time. I do remember that building from my years in Calgary. Since moving back East I haven't really made anything from Calgary... although every now and then I think the Hudsons Bay Company should come to Sim City and there is no finer HBC store than the one on Stephen Avenue in Downtown Calgary Maybe after my next batch of Government of Canada Buildings are done I'll tackle it!

So life is settling down a bit (finally) in this busy summer. I'm all moved into my new house and it's even feeling like home these days. I still have a long "to do" list, but I get the sense that when you own a home, it's no longer a list you ever get to the end of it, it's now just a list of competing priorities! On the Sim City front, Elmwood Apartments is now packed up and in the BSC internal testing process. I don't anticipate any problems, so I would say watch the STEX next week With my batch of old wooden residentials pretty much wrapped up (after a year and a half!), I'm switching gears. I have started a batch of Government of Canada Buildings from around Atlantic Canada. The first is Marine House in Downtown Dartmouth (other side of Halifax Harbour). Below is a picture of the real thing.

Marine House sits on a prominent corner in Downtown Dartmouth at the corner of Portland Street and Alderney Drive and is one of Downtown Dartmouth's larger buildings. It was built in the 1980s by a private developer and started out as the Dartmouth Medical Centre. It was never a hospital, but was one of those places where a ton of doctors end up with their offices. In the early 2000s the Government of Canada purchased the building and converted it into goverment offices. The building now houses the regional offices for the Department of Fisheries and Oceans, hence the name Marine House. Not a whole lot else to say about it, below is my version.

The modelling is done, but I obviously haven't started to texture yet. I might be able to polish off the texturing this weekend since the building is a lot simpler then all those wooden structures I have been making lately! No superflous detailing, just straight modernist lines. After Marine House, I'll wander over to Saint John for one of its government office buildings.

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

WOW!!! this looks great, you have your little details and all, I'm ready to see the textures on it.

[Jasoncw 11,840]

I'm glad your life is settling down and you're back in action.

The new building is looking good, especially the roof junk.

[T Wrecks 10,209]

^ What Jason said. ^ 

[spa 968]

Aaron Graham: Thanks. I'm a big believer in that each little detail by itself doesn't add a whole lot, but the sum total matters. A small light, doorknob, sign etc can turn out to be quite important in adding realism.

Jason: Thanks. I'm really liking Bing for getting a view of what's in the backyards of buildings and what's on the roofs. What's on Marine House is a close approximation (close as I can tell from the bing pixels) of what's actually up there, which is probably why it works.

TWrecks: Thanks

Well the weekend is done and I have some textures on Marine House. Didn't get as far as I wanted to but what else is new Below is how it's shaping up.

I scaled it down just slightly as I have a tendency to make things too big when I'm modelling. I'm quite pleased with it so far, especially the windows, which were once my achilles heel

As a sneak peak at what else is in store for my federal government buildings of Atlantic Canada set (Simdad you might recognize these) we have the Customs Building from Saint John, New Brunswick

Ugly isn't it! Maybe I'm weird, but it has a very strange kind of charm to me, even if it is ugly. Not everything the government has built to house office workers is quite so brutal though. Vintage 1950s, the Federal Building from Fredericton, New Brunswick is also on my list.

These will be the first 3 of 7. Hopefully it won't take me quite long this time to finish!

[spa 968]

Just a quick note. As you've probably seen, I'm releasing my files this week. In the Victoria Apartments that I uploaded yesterday, there was, unfortunately, a small error. One of the two lots included was accidentally set to grow on low density, which of course the Victoria Apartments are a little too big for. I have corrected the problem and updated the upload. Any of the 500 or so people who have downloaded it already (stex + lex), if you don't want to see them popping up on low density, should download the fixed version. Sorry for any inconvenience, but I too err now and then

[spa 968]

Just a quick note. As you've probably seen, I'm releasing my files this week. In the Victoria Apartments that I uploaded yesterday, there was, unfortunately, a small error. One of the two lots included was accidentally set to grow on low density, which of course the Victoria Apartments are a little too big for. I have corrected the problem and updated the upload. Any of the 500 or so people who have downloaded it already (stex + lex), if you don't want to see them popping up on low density, should download the fixed version. Sorry for any inconvenience, but I too err now and then

[nofunk 1,933]

Nice to see you working on some businesses and offices! I love your residential work, but I also really appreciate your commercial BATs, because they fill the small / mid-sized gap really nicely.

Can't wait to see more! Congrats on your new place!

[nofunk 1,933]

Nice to see you working on some businesses and offices! I love your residential work, but I also really appreciate your commercial BATs, because they fill the small / mid-sized gap really nicely.

Can't wait to see more! Congrats on your new place!

[madhatter106 3,903]

I love the roof junk on the new building - very interesting configuration.

This week, it's been a joy to see all your great BATs trickling into the proverbial stream of the river STEX...

[Simbourgeois 139]

Oh, you made my day! After a while, I visited STEX and saw all those charming old buidlings - Victoria Hall, Elmwood Apartments, Dundas Terrace, Victoria Apartments, Church Street Apartments... Can't wait to see them all in Belleville!

Great work on all these, indeed!!!

And, well, I'm sure that your latest projects will turn out amazing as well

Yours sincerely,

Simbourgeois

Mayor of Belleville

[citiesxlfan42 27]

Spa, I love your work! I love all of the wooden structures. I like what your current project is, but I wish there were more of the wooden buildings. I loved them, and now a chunk of the norhtern area of my Downtown is a district full of the buildings and your other work, giving a rustic feel. Great job!

[spa 968]

Nofunk: Thanks. Residentials are great, but I'm ready to switch back to offices for a bit. I'm glad my mid-rises fill a void in your cities. I know the whole BSP's stuff really makes the historic areas of my city pop! Just all part of the ongoing collective process of building the game into more than it was before.

Madhattar: Thanks. I saved them up for a while there. I won't wait so long next time

Simbourgeois: Thanks. I look forward to seeing them in Belleville.

Citiesxlfan: Glad you like them. Don't worry though, I have plans for more wooden buildings. I would like to eventually make Halifax Boxes with bay windows (another common Halifax style) and Halifax Big Houses. I also have plans for an historic mansion set based on Halifax's Young Avenue (big old wooden houses). There will be more wooden buildings after this batch of office buildings.

First off, I have some bad news to report, the error that Rushman caught with Victoria Apartments... well it's a little bigger. I'm sorry everyone, but Victoria Hall will grow on low density, as will the larger lots of the Halifax Boxes and the B&B lots for Dundas Terrace. All three files were updated last night with fixed versions (no problems with Church Street Apartments, Knightsbridge or Elmwood Apartments). I believe the error occurred as a result of creating lots in the maxis lot editor and then running them through pim-x. At some point, some of the lots were reset to allow low density (they didn't start out that way). It's obviously something that I'll have to watch in future since it affected 4 of my uploads. In the mean time, I would suggest that anyone who downloaded Victoria Hall, the Halifax Boxes or Dundas Terrace before late on Sept 6 or Victoria Apartments before Sept 1, delete them and download the fixed version... unless of course you don't mind them popping up on low density now and then!

In happier news, Marine House is rendered and in game. Below is how it turned out.

And a night shot.

Next up, the Saint John Customs Building.

[SimHoTToDDy 2,938]

Holy mother of hue, those night windows are over saturated!!! I was scrolling down the images and was thinking to myself "why, isn't this a wonderfully well balanced pallet of colo... OH MY LORD!!!"

Lets just say it is a little shocking. The rest of the building is great, fantastic even, but that is a serious buzz kill I think. I'd still use it in my city because I don't look at the night views very much, but it would be rather jolting to see something so saturated yellow when everything else is relatively balanced.

I don't think this window bitmap is much or any different then the ones used in your previous models, however the lack of dense mullions makes it very stark as opposed to "diffused" (I'm looking at that Halifax box in the bottom left). Normally post export adjustments are little nitpicks that don't change much, but I think this is a situation where it would be very beneficial to the look of the building.

[SimFox 802]

It looks good, but I would suggest to go little lighter on yellow... it is totally oversaturated. Your whites (inside) are intensely yellow. And they can't be.White means very bright. Very bright always means low saturation. The only time when it could be like that is when you have very colored glass. and you don't have such a glass (if blinds are nay indicators and they should be) on this building.

Otherwise it look great.

Thre is a ibt of a problem with lot... Well not a problem, really just a feeling that building is sort of backward... That feeling is created by the fact that much "grander" entrance is in the back of the lot.

[T Wrecks 10,209]

Great work once again! I really love the building, and I also like the lot design very much. It's unobtrusive and yet very refined.

Speaking of errors/bugs, I went on a downloading spree last night and grabbed all of your recent uploads. I don't know if I have the recent fixes, but this doesn't matter much to me because I tweak every download to fit into my personal plugins system anyway.  However, things may be different for others, so hats off to you for fixing and updating the files so quickly!

By the way, I discovered another interesting phenomenon: While the installers allow me to specify an installation path, they will not do what I tell them in most cases. Either the path is completely ignored and the files are installed into the default folder anyway, or the installers create the specified folder, but leave it totally empty and place the files in the default folder. This is just another reason why I prefer ZIPs: they give you control and reliable results, whereas in installers the actual file placement is a black-box process whose outcome is unreliable and unpredictable.

Once again, it doesn't really matter because I throw away the installers as soon as I can get rid of them, and they are just a minor nuisance to me, whereas I guess they help you (and others) to reduce support queries considerably. In this way, they really are more of a service for uploaders than for downloaders, but hey, that's ok. No need to change that - I just thought I'd inform you about the aforementioned phenomenon.

What's inside those download packages, though, is really top-notch. I quickly plopped everything into a test city last night, and I liked each and every building. I can't wait to play around with them and finally see them grow in my cities. Thanks for all the superb work you did!

[spa 968]

Todd: Message received. I actually don't use windows bitmaps. Since I'm stuck with gmax and its limitations, I model the floors,  texture them and shine lights on them with attentuation parameters set so that nothing else lights up. So in this case, to change the lighting actually meant desaturating the yellowish floor texture!

Simfox: Thanks, I have adjusted the lighting. It's a little more white now. I don't really try to duplicate reality since it's really not possible in gmax. An approximation is good enough for me. You and Todd were right about the lighting on this one though. On the entrance, the real building actually fills an entire city block. The Portland Street entrance (the front of my bat) is the main one, but the Canal Street side (the back) also has an entrance for employees. Since each side faces a street in reality, that's probably why you're getting that feeling. To try and counteract that effect, I made sure to put a "street" of sorts going back to the rear of the lot.

TWrecks: Thanks. I actually do the same thing. Everything I download gets checked and tweaked to fit my play style. Usually that means adjusting the setbacks (2 maxis pavement tiles), switching the base textures to the Maxis sidewalks and removing any seasonal trees (I only go for semi-seasonal). Sorry about the installer, I actually don't prepare them. I know this problem has cropped up before so I'll ask about it. I think it appears when the installer tries to install folders of files to directories that aren't the default. For people in the know, installers are really unnecessary, but for some people who aren't as organized they can be a life saver.

Small update today, I redid the nightlighting based on Todd and Simfox's feedback. It's a little less yellow now and more white. I'm pretty much ready to declare this final now.

[metasmurf 705]

I like this building. Looks like a generic civic building. Could easily have been found in my hometown. Will certainly download it once released

[SimHoTToDDy 2,938]

Hah! So I wasn't the only one who did nightlighting like that! My first few buildings (I don't think I ever released any of them) were done like that.

Looks much better. I second your motion to start a petition to requisition a declaration of completion of the aforementioned digital recreation.

[T Wrecks 10,209]

Haha, it's funny that you edit everything to adjust the setback to 2 tiles. I edit everything US to a setback of 1 tile and everything European to a setback of 2 tiles. It's quite a mess, but on our exchange at simcitykurier.de, we try to stick to this rule of thumb as good as we can in order to ensure the best possible "compatibility" of W2W downloads. However, you never get it all perfect; it's really a fight against windmills sometimes.

On another note, meanwhile I have added all of your recent uploads to my plugins folder, and I look forward to whenever I'll have some time on my hands to start the suburbs and see all your great stuff together with CP's and JBSimio's.

Going through the files, I discovered some more things:

Halifax Boxes: 

• I noticed that the props did not cast any shadows; all prop exemplar had "is ground model" set to "false".
• While tweaking this, I saw in the Reader that they also had "Light" set to "false", so it could be that they don't show their wonderfully subtle and realistic night lights, but I didn't confirm that in game.
• Unless I goofed up somewhere, there was only one desc for all lots with multiple buildings, no matter whether there were four, six, seven, or eight buildings on the lot. So I added the ones I needed and referenced them in the lot file. Now the occupant numbers are different.

Dundas Terrace:

• From the names of the files, it looks like you had intended to make this one a corner building. However, all lots contained in the download turned out to be made for straight roads. Did you change your opinion, or was this unintentional? (I left the lots as they were because I think either orientation looks good, and after all, straight lots can also grow on corners).

As soon as I have something worth showing, I'll see if I can get a nice screenshot posted here. Thanks again for all these buildings in so many variations; it must have been an insane amount of work.

[Jack_wilds 550]

Originally posted by: T Wrecks

Thanks again for all these buildings in so many variations; it must have been an insane amount of work.quote>

I also extend a real thanks as the combinations aree wonderfull, making for an unlimited nieghborhood variations...