Problems with PIM-X and SC4Tool

[MushyMushy 3,618]

I have a question about each of these programs. I've used SC4Tool quite a bit but haven't used it in a while and since I've yet to learn PIM-X's complicated controls I've only used it for a few things. However, today I've run into a problem with both of them.

In SC4Tool's texture creator the program is not giving me my personal ID range. I've used it before to make textures (I've deleted all but one of them) but I have no idea what to do to make it work properly now. I've only used the first ID in my range (0xF8800000 to 0xF883FFFF). The range it incorrectly says is mine is 0xFC782DA0 to 0xFC783188. What do I do?

In PIM-X it's pretty straight forward. When I open its LE the "LE Tools" window never pops up. It used to but it doesn't anymore. I've used it before to find what dat texture files were in and I wanted to do that again but now I can't. I also want to learn how to use PIM-X since it's supposedly better than the Maxis LE but this another turnoff.

Any help with either of these issues would be greatly appreciated.

[Edvarz 1,985]

I wouldn't know about the textures issue since I've never made any, but maybe I can help with PIM-X.

Sometimes I've noticed that when you open the Lot Editor the "LE Tools" window opens but minimizes instantly, try hovering over the icon in windows' taskbar or pressing Alt+Tab to see what windows you have currently open, that's the only issue I've had so far.

Also, if you want to learn how to use the X-Tool better you may want to check the User's guide if you haven't already.

Hope this is helpful!

[nos.17 5,265]

If I can recall correctly, to change the texture range in SC4Tool, you need to go into the System folder and add a new text file called Range.txt . There you would paste your range in this form: 0xf8800000,0xf883ffff . However, I would recommend against using SC4Tool for textures. The interface is unwieldy (IMO) and to create overlays you need to actually create two textures (one for the alpha too). Personally, I prefer to use PngtoFshBatch. Adding textures to a dat takes two button clicks and it can automatically determine overlays from base textures based on transparency. As a recent convert from SC4Tool for textures, I have never looked back.

As for the PIMX, it is a little unclear to me what you mean by the "LE Tools" window. The Editor in PIMX will open two additional windows, so make sure they are not hanging off the edge of your screen. I use dual monitors, and I have had this issue a few times if I switch back and forth. As Edvarz also mentioned, the User Guide is extremely helpful to get started. I learned pretty much solely from that. It is really not too hard to pick up.

[rsc204 21,869]

On ‎18‎/‎07‎/‎2016 at 5:17 AM, nos.17 said:

and it can automatically determine overlays from base textures based on transparency

I'll take you up on that one. I like PNGtoFSH Batch, but for the longest time I could not decipher why every base texture appeared as an overlay when made using it. It's because it sets your FSH textures to DXT3 format by default, unless you tell it otherwise. Even if there is no transparency, it's adding an Alpha and telling the game there is. You can of course set it manually to DXT1 (no transparency), but you need to select every texture one at a time and change the setting for each. If you are making a small number of textures and using PNG format, I'd stick with PNGtoFSH Batch.

Update: In the interest of fairness, I hadn't realised this behaviour was unintended. Not for the first time either, but as soon as @Null 45 was aware of the problem, he's updated the application and this issue is no longer a problem. Thanks to Null 45 for his dedication to supporting this tool.

But if you start making lots of textures, I can't recommend GoFSH enough:

I know I harp on about it, but I make a lot of textures, my workflow has just been speeded up no end, as a result of the innovative features Rivit included. Have a massive texture you want sliced into many single SC4 textures? GoFSH can do that in a few clicks, it'll even work out the IDs for you. Want to colour correct 100 textures, a few clicks is all it takes. Working with Multi-FSH, GoFSH handles that, it can even create random multi-FSH textures from a few templates automatically!

That's before you even consider the automation possibilities available nowhere else. I really think this is one of the most underrated tools out there. Sure, it likes to work with BMPs and dedicated Alpha Channels, but actually having forced myself at first to switch how I was working, I'd never go back to PNGs. Even if that's too much to consider, the application can batch convert PNGs to BMPs keeping all the IDs in check. Honestly, it's the Swiss army knife of texturing for SC4.

On ‎18‎/‎07‎/‎2016 at 4:00 AM, MushyMushy said:

I've used it before to find what dat texture files were in

FSHxDAT (function of GoFSH) allows you to open a DAT file, see the contents visually, and select one, many or all to convert to BMP for working with. It even knows about the textures, as in if they are from BATs, Lots, S3D models etc. Again, I know of no simpler tool for this.

As for the issue with the LE window in PIM-X, almost certainly the window has opened, just off-screen where you can't see it. Here's one of the most handy shortcuts for anyone with multiple monitors. SHIFT+WINDOWS KEY+LEFT/RIGHT. Select any window/application, then press the three key combination. That window will move to the left or right by one screen at a time. Super handy when you need to switch things about a lot.

[MushyMushy 3,618]

@nos.17 - "LE Tools" is what the manual/guide calls one of those two windows that should pop up. The dual monitor thing might be my problem - I have a smaller second monitor but I only turn it on for BATing - so I'll have to try it later with both of my screens on.

@rsc204 -  I've looked at GoFSH before, and now you've convinced me to try it out. I'm particularly interested in the point that it can take a large image file and cut it up into the 128x128 pieces and make those into textures. I looked through the manual (which admittedly I didn't understand half of because of so many terms that were over my head - I've got a good understanding of computer hardware but software is another story) for that but a lot of the desired things it was explaining were more complex than what I want. I'm just looking to make a big texture file into a set of base textures, but the manual is talking about wealth effects and making transit textures easy. If it's just a few clicks like you said, would you perhaps mind telling me what those clicks might be?

[rsc204 21,869]

From the main windows open "Slice 'n Dice". The source image is the large texture to use, you should also set the destination folder for the output files. You just need to select the following options:

• Tile Size - Whether the textures should be SD or HD (128x128 or 256x256).
• Type - Are these textures for the LotEditor or Transit (NAM Models).
• Increment - Really just leave this as-is would be the best solution. The rc/cr options are meant for making Puzzle Pieces.

The first ID is taken from your personal texture ID range. So for example if I use a 7x2 texture image with ID F8344104, it will take the next 13 IDs in sequence ending in F8344149.

Note that this process will only spit out the requisite textures with correct IDs. It will create either BMP or PNG files. To place them in a DAT, I'd recommend the output is set to BMPs, then do the following in GoFSH:

• Click on the ... (file dialog) in the top left. Find and select one of your C0 Textures and click Open.
• Make sure Encode is selected. You can choose DXT options (1 = Base Texture / 3 = Overlay) and you should select "Make a scaled set of 5" to produce the MipMaps.
• Also ensure Reader InList is selected.
• Click GoFSH - i.e. RUN. This processes all the texture in the selected folder.
• This creates the FSH files. You can then use the FSHxDAT function / Create .dat from LoadList. The Reader InList should populate here automatically. Open it and select a name/location for your new dat.

[MushyMushy 3,618]

@rsc204 So I have a (10x13) texture now that I'm ready to do this to, but when I opened GoFSH, I couldn't find the Slice n' Dice bit on the GoFSH window, and according to the manual there's no menu structure so I'm stumped. Is it a hotkey or something? Since I'm already here asking this question, I looked ahead on the bullet points, I also saw LoadList. I don't see that in the GoFSH window either. Is that something in the Reader...? I flipped through all the menus there as well and didn't find anything.

Thanks in advance.

[rsc204 21,869]

Are you running the latest version? GoFSH has been in development for a long time and these features were only added recently. All the main options are buttons from the main interface, so should be very hard to miss.

[MushyMushy 3,618]

Hmm, it would appear that I'm running version 2.2... a bit behind on the times.  My bad. I had downloaded the installer a while ago and dug it out of my downloads archives to install it. I need to get out of this mode of thinking that the only thing I should ever look for updates on is the NAM...

[kschmidt 6,256]

SC4 Tool I have problems in Windows 8.1 ! Win 7 on other machine works flawlesly so now i have to move the files to that machine to examine dependecies. what maybe wrong ? Microsoft Netframework got to version 4.8 longway from 1.1 so that maybe the cause or any a Win 8 feature is blocking ? Some core files not right ? Lot Editor and other SC4 utilities aswell getting out of touch with present  OS something to do, as for now it there doing nothing. Some update may be necessary to bring it up to date with present operating systems, Windows XP compatibility is far out of date !

Sincerrely yours,

Kschmidt

[ncamferdam 1,525]

Sorry to resurrect this thread, but it was the only place where I could find my issue discussed in the past.

I'm having a similar issue with the LE Tools window not appearing when I open the Lot Editor in PIM-X. I've been using the LE for a long time and have never encountered this issue. LE Tools always opens within the overall LE window. It doesn't appear as an independent window that I can pull up from the task bar, so I don't think it's an issue if it being minimized or anything. And I don't have a second monitor, so it can't be hidden that way. It's just gone, with apparently no preamble.

Has anyone encountered this issue before? At this point the LE is basically unusable for me.

[ncamferdam 1,525]

As an update to this, I'm now experiencing crashes with PIM-X with seemingly increasing frequency. It often gets stuck occasionally, coming back online with this error:

Does anyone have any advice?

[rsc204 21,869]

On 14/04/2021 at 3:19 AM, ncamferdam said:

It doesn't appear as an independent window that I can pull up from the task bar, so I don't think it's an issue if it being minimized or anything. And I don't have a second monitor, so it can't be hidden that way. It's just gone, with apparently no preamble.

Windows is frankly, dumb as f* when it comes to multi-monitors (Apple isn't much better). I have a dual monitor setup, but one is on loan to my partner as she's working from home and a laptop screen is totally inappropriate for work and her multi-billion/year profit company, is too cheap to actually supply the equipment needed to do so. Thus occasionally I have a weekend/evening over the past year where I've needed my dual-monitors back for certain tasks, but I don't get to keep it very long.

I've had a slew of problems where apps or even worse, an app window (not the main app itself), ends up stuck on the second display, which isn't even plugged in. In the case of the SC4 PIM LE, once it's on another screen, it's not coming back, literally everything I could try didn't work until I plugged a second display in to see/move it. Of course you don't have a second display, but if it's a laptop you technically do (the external monitor connector acts suchlike), even if not, everything you describe suggests that's where that window must be. If you have another screen around, for example most TVs have HDMI inputs, plugging that in may be necessary to resolve things.

Every other such issue I encountered was resolved by selecting the app/window and using the shortcut Windows, Shift and Left/Right, which moves a Window between screens. Otherwise there is a way to move a window using the Left/Right Arrows, provided you can select it (which you can't in the case of the LE window). Note too, Windows 10 supports Virtual Desktops, have you checked that this window isn't appearing in such?

If all else fails, a System Restore to a point before the problem occurred should reset any settings that have moved this window. Which can occur if the window was closed when over half of it was off the main display and the system 'thinks' you have another display there. Uninstalling/Re-installing may work, but a System Restore is more reliable, since uninstalling may not remove the registry settings/data that's storing the setting. Honestly, if you've any way of hooking up a second display, if nothing else to rule it out, that's probably just much less work in the grand scheme of things. If the App couldn't bring the Window up, you'd expect an error message of some kind, so I'd have to presume it's actually there, but you can't see it.

On 15/04/2021 at 7:25 AM, ncamferdam said:

As an update to this, I'm now experiencing crashes with PIM-X with seemingly increasing frequency.

Check your security/permissions, either through 3rd party software or using the options built-in to Win10 (not set by default), which may restrict an app from accessing/writing files it needs to work. Make sure SC4PIM has Admin access, try disabling UAC (temporarily, not a good idea to do if you don't know what this does) and perhaps consider installing the app in a folder that isn't locked down, i.e. neither inside Program Files (x86) nor any other system/protected folder. You can also manually set folder permissions, but this is security risk. Again I must stress, a default Win10 install running as Admin simply works, so if you are having problems, it's usually a result of something you've set or added somewhere.

[ncamferdam 1,525]

Sorry, I completely forgot to post an update on this topic.

On 4/18/2021 at 10:18 AM, rsc204 said:

Check your security/permissions, either through 3rd party software or using the options built-in to Win10 (not set by default), which may restrict an app from accessing/writing files it needs to work. Make sure SC4PIM has Admin access, try disabling UAC (temporarily, not a good idea to do if you don't know what this does) and perhaps consider installing the app in a folder that isn't locked down, i.e. neither inside Program Files (x86) nor any other system/protected folder. You can also manually set folder permissions, but this is security risk. Again I must stress, a default Win10 install running as Admin simply works, so if you are having problems, it's usually a result of something you've set or added somewhere.

I tried doing this, as well as a system reboot, and that seemed to have fixed the problem for a while. Eventually though, I started encountering the same problem, with the LE Tools window no longer appearing.

I think what ended up being the problem was that certain subfolders within my Plugins folder got to be too large for PIM-X to handle. BSC props in particular seem to fill up their folder relatively quickly if you keep using the default file pathway during installation. I had actually done a reorganization of my Plugins folder around the same time that I originally posted on this thread, so it may have actually been that which solved my problem for a time. I'm sure the advice from @rsc204 helped, or would have helped, but I was already committing a pretty basic error in organizing my plugins.

In any case, I realized the problem after experimenting a bit with PIM-X. So long as I only loaded in small subfolders of props and textures, everything would be fine. Past some size threshold though, loading starts to take forever, and I think while the loading script is executing is when the errors creep in. I reorganized my Plugin folder again a few weeks ago, creating a more even distribution of files across a greater number of folders, and it's been smooth sailing ever since.

Again, obvious mistake on my part.

[rsc204 21,869]

4 hours ago, ncamferdam said:

In any case, I realized the problem after experimenting a bit with PIM-X. So long as I only loaded in small subfolders of props and textures, everything would be fine. Past some size threshold though, loading starts to take forever, and I think while the loading script is executing is when the errors creep in.

Unlike the Maxis LE, there is a limit on the amount of content PIM-X can load before it will simply run very slowly or fail to run correctly, this is noted in the documentation. Indeed it seems like this was the cause of your problems, the idea is to load only the specific folders needed for what you are lotting. It's generally acknowledged that lotting with only those dependencies you are using is best practise, regardless of which tool you use.

For example, many of those who like the LE precisely because it just loads everything (eventually), struggle to work out the actual dependencies their upload needs to work. Of course PIM-X has a neat little trick here, in that it can generate a dependency list for you. Even though there is a limit on Plugins, it's actually quite large in the grand scheme of things and indeed many large megapacks can easily bring you close to those limits.

[mallenuk 193]

I had the same issue and this was the resolution for anyone experiencing the same! I switch between using my laptop as a laptop and using it with a monitor at my desk, never knew this could be an issue before now.

On 4/18/2021 at 8:18 PM, rsc204 said:

I've had a slew of problems where apps or even worse, an app window (not the main app itself), ends up stuck on the second display, which isn't even plugged in. In the case of the SC4 PIM LE, once it's on another screen, it's not coming back, literally everything I could try didn't work until I plugged a second display in to see/move it.

 

[mallenuk 193]

Another insight on the LE Tools behavior. I have the found the following:

• The SC4 PIM window positioning can be made to save by making a save to a lot
• The window positioning is saved in relation to the top left hand corner of the 'main display'
• This means if your:
  • Second display is above your laptop display
    • Is configured to be the main display
    • And your SC4 PIM window positioning is to saved to the laptop screen
  • Second display is right of your laptop display
    • Is not configured to be the main display
    • And your SC4 PIM window positioning is to saved to it
  • Second display is below your laptop display
    • Is not configured to be the main display
    • And your SC4 PIM window positioning is to saved to it
  • Second display is left of your laptop display
    • Is configured to be the main display
    • And your SC4 PIM window positioning is to saved to the laptop screen
• When you return to using one monitor again the window positioning is going to be off the main display
• Note changing the position of your monitors in the Display Settings, Resolution and/or Zoom can all leave the window positioning off the main display

Understanding all of the above, I was able to open all the SC4 PIM windows into the top left hand corner of my main display (second monitor for me), make a lot save, then close, disconnect my second monitor and reopen SC4 PIM and all the windows appear in the top left hand corner of my laptop screen!  And it only took me 6 hours to figure out...