Francis90Bats

[Francis90b 748]

Remodelling H8-2 26w38th.

I took the opportunity to experiment a bit with glass.

There's an interior (just three planes for walls, ceilings and floors), curtains (planes with a bump, behind glass panels), glass planes and a cylinder around the building, depicting a street view from a similar environment where this building should be.

I think glass should be slightly more reflective.

If i am to follow my path, can i still use glass as a self-illuminating material or should i introduce some lights inside the building?

  Edited May 21, 2012 by Francis90b  

[Evillions 552]

Awesome BAT!

I like the facade a lot, very detailed.

EDIT: How do you get that brick textured look in your models? I apply a brick texture to my models and it does not look brick-like.

  Edited May 21, 2012 by Evillions  

[simlink 1,098]

Can't help you with the lighting situation - out of my expertise - however the building itself looks awesome.

[gutterclub 2,729]

You can still use self illuminating, you just fake the interior scene with the night bitmap..but if you are modelling an interior it might be better to physically light it?

I do think you need to raise the reflectivity and maybe make the glass a little thicker as the ones without blinds look like they are open

Keep it up, absolutely love this little building, it's wonderful!

[zahrul3 472]

If i am to follow my path, can i still use glass as a self-illuminating material or should i introduce some lights inside the building?

This

Glass doesn't need anymore reflection, too much would cause it too look out of form compared to other NY style buildings

[Jasoncw 11,949]

You can do it either way with the lighting. You can also model a new self illuminated plane just behind the curtains you modeled, so that the curtains will stay consistent between night and day. If you use actual lights to light up the inside, be mindful of how bright they are and what color they are (looking at a glance at zoom 4 it should be similar to if you had used a self illuminating material). If you use actual lights I would model more of an interior though.

[Francis90b 748]

It's not good to post things that are far from being completed, but i felt a bit alone, so...

From left to right:

H1-8 22 john street; H2-8 34w38th; H2 36w38th.

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

.

[zahrul3 472]

.

  Edited May 29, 2012 by zahrul3  

[T Wrecks 10,210]

Well, it may be far from complete, but what's complete is also looking good so far.

[Toothless Stitch 2,901]

.

[Francis90b 748]

My first upload:

...

  Edited June 3, 2012 by Francis90b  

[T Wrecks 10,210]

Congratulations! I cannot believe this is your first STEX upload - probably because all the recent models you've showcased here look so absolutely un-newbish and totally professional.

In any case, I hope this isn't the last the STEX has seen of you!

[Vlasky 1,803]

Congratulations on outstanding first upload Fran! I will be looking forward to seeing more of them on Stex!

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

Looks great and I'm ready for more uploads from you buddy.

[zahrul3 472]

You seem to forget about the roof junk(exhaust fans, etc) and it looks a bit 'cartoonish' and it sticks out too much, even with NYBT and BSP BATs. Lotting is quite decent though, for a 3ds user that is. I think the roof texture and the almost stucco-like brick wall might be the issue here.

[gutterclub 2,729]

Lotting is quite decent though, for a 3ds user that is.

Hi,

Can you just elaborate on this please?

[T Wrecks 10,210]

Yes, I'd also like to know more.

[Francis90b 748]

Stair study.Everything is in early stages, or tentative:

A step is slightly offset to show the system of nails and mortises that will connect the treads to the carriages.Risers will be nailed to the treads, linking them one to each other, providing more support for them.

Balaustrade design:

EDIT:

Balaustrade, definitve design:

  Edited June 6, 2012 by Francis90b  

[Francis90b 748]

You seem to forget about the roof junk(exhaust fans, etc) and it looks a bit 'cartoonish' and it sticks out too much, even with NYBT and BSP BATs. Lotting is quite decent though, for a 3ds user that is. I think the roof texture and the almost stucco-like brick wall might be the issue here.

Maxis setting - just the tutorial city, though.

CP's, Spa's, Nofunk's, Yctimic's and JB Simio's stuff appearing there:

Nofunk's and Jasoncw's stuff:

Other Nofunk's stuff -similar colour buildings:

NYBT stuff...well, i don't currently have too much of it except for some AG and ABBT stuff...but let's try with some AG:

As for roof junk - Exaust vents are often too much recessed in ventilation shafts in order to be visible for above.The only exception i know to this is a ventilation building located in NYC's Kips bay neighborhood, along the FDR highway.

But, most of ventilation buildings have some kind of other roof equipment.It's amount might change, buildings having roof access are more cluttered with it, the ones without are less, and some don't have any stuff.

You can take a look at some ventilation buildings i know of, so i'd suggest the shafts above NYC's tunnels, plus the ones above the Sumner tunnel in Boston, plus the Alameda and Caldecott tunnels in Oakland, CA, the ones above the Detroit-Windsor tunnel and the ones above the Squirrell hill tunnel in Pittsburgh.

Since i wasn't too sure about what exactly to add on the roof of a building without an easy roof access (no penthouse or anything) - i decided to leave it without anything, my decision being supported by the Brooklyn shaft, that had nothing on it's dark, tar roof.

I hope i haven't forgot any of your points, Zahrul3.

  Edited June 6, 2012 by Francis90b  

[harishna 847]

Francis I have to go with Zahrul on this one, I think that the textures for both the bricks and the roof are over saturated, I guess that is what he ment to say anyway.

cheers

[Sgt Pepper 864]

I don't really see why the saturation matters. It looks fine to me. Besides it's done now, and nothing really needs to be changed with it and no use in really pointing things out with it.

Good work Francis.

[Francis90b 748]

During summer i did some more BATing, but then i realized that most of what i did looked underscaled or overscaled if compared with some other stuff, even though i modelled things more or less to RL, if not slightly bigger - e.g. converting a 25ft or 7,62 mt wide building to 8 mtrs.And yeah, it really pissed me off.

But, some people down there made my desire to bat come back, because of what they do (Aaron Graham, Nofunk and Frex, to name a few), so here i am, battered but not dead yet.

Those are in the very beginning, though.

[Sciurus 323]

It looks good, I wait for more!

Guillaume

[gutterclub 2,729]

Looking good and glad to see you still batting.

Funny you mention inspiration as your small NYC buildings you were making inspired me. Are you still planning on working on them? Also, are they the buildings you were talking about being underscaled? Can you show some pics alongside other buildings? Were they scaled up along the z axis before comparing? I think most batters use RL dimensions so can't see why they wouldn't work..it might just be that small buildings look small???

Keep up the good work

[Ceafus 88 1,895]

Those are looking extraordinary! I am glad you are BATting again, your stuff always was an inspiration to me just like Aaron's and the rest of NYBT.

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

Welcome back!!! Please tell me you are going to finish the other bats?

[Sgt Pepper 864]

I understand if scaling can piss you off. Proportions and scaling annoys me so much. Especially when I do the RL dimensions to something but I can't get window or door or other detail proportions right with it.

But this new building looks great so far, very interested to see where else it'll go.

[Francis90b 748]

Well, actually it's quite incorrect to say that most people model things to RL dimensions.IRL very few things in reality are 8, or 16, or 32 mtrs wide, and while some might get close to those dimensions, if you want to model them then you need to do them slightly bigger or smaller (e.g. the 7,62 to 8,0 mtrs situations - which, in a BAT, meant 0,15 mtrs more floor height - not much, but you can still feel it somehow).

Sometimes, also, you need to compare your stuff also with stuff that had been done before, maybe by someone who wasn't as faithful to model to RL dimensions, or at least try to, but you can't really do anything about it, 'cause it would require you to offer an alternative to dozens or hundreds of BATs.

So, the problem is about having to mediate between three different "realities" at once - it doesn't always turn out nice, does it? But i had some stuff already done, so one thing is realizing something's not right when you've just begun, and another is realizing it when you have passed that moment.

My overscaling problems were about the NYC commercial buildings i did.The ones i've shown in my thread usually looked overscaled if compared to AG BATs, slightly bigger if compared with some BSP BATs like the Knoll, and ok to slightly bigger if compared to some Smalltown BATs (i talk about the stuff i usually use, of course).

They were usually modelled according to the 25ft to 8mtrs rule, while proportions were retained.

Speaking about those specific models, i could model them to their exact dimensions, gaining a better visual comparison with other stuff, but losing 8 mtrs full widht, that made them usable in game and functional to my aims.

I would have two possibilities:

First, introduce other sizes, 7,6 or whatever needed, and model things to exact rl dimensions.But it would make my work more difficult cause it's harder to fill a SC4 lot with them, and therefore estabilishing a system from them - and estabilishing a system means to make them being useable aside from their specific lot and small universe, that's why i did elaborate a system in first place.

Also, there's a point about integration with SC4 environment - it's quite easy to see how an 8 mtrs building could fit into a game that was built on 16 mtrs - maybe someone split their parcel, or maybe SC4 tiles covers two 8 mtrs parcels, and the base parcel was of 8 mtrs even if Maxis didn't told us ? - you see, it's easy to invent a tale to make it fit into the system.

"Make sure what you do fits with what had been done before, for there is widsom and greatness" - mine is an exaggerated and negative way to look at this way of reasoning, yet i think in this case it might be the most valid path.

Second, model things according to their sizes, and then doing some modifications that could enlarge them so that they could fit the whole 8 mtrs widht (e.g. adding another row of windows to a building) - i would need to take each building, analyze it and then design a modification that could work - this is time and energy expensive, and also it's not certain at all it could be successful - if you modify a boulding, you need to be very careful about what you do, and it's quite easy to alter it beyond it's nature or what made it look particular or nice (e.g. what would it happen if you added another 80 floors to the empire state building, or chopped the cupola off the US capitol?) .So, that's a very tricky path as well.

Will i work again on them? I don't grant anything, the roads i've shown are very tricky.Other than this, i think it would be nice finishing what i've shown, plus other things on my HD that encountered similar issues.

I'd say there's a 75% possibility that what i've done won't be released - and if the other 25% happens to be the future, then redesigning efforts to 50-75% of the models might not be successful.

[gutterclub 2,729]

I think you may look into things a little too much

Joking aside, you should only work a way you feel comfortable and if you aren't getting the right results move on.