Sgt Pepper's BATs

[Sgt Pepper 864]

Gn_leugim- That's very sweet of you to say, thank you.

Ferrariguy1000- That's certainly an idea! What I'd give just to see that in real life when it happened! Thank you so much as well. To answer your question, the North Tower, or One World Trade Center had the TV Mast. I haven't started on the North Tower's roof yet. I'm all focused on the South Tower first but it will come soon enough.

I haven't done much I guess, the roof still isn't done but it's getting there.

The colors remind me of the World Trade Center in SimCity 3000. I miss those days. And of course I miss the real buildings themselves. Roof still needs some detailing but it's almost done.

[Susaji 523]

Nice :D

[Ion_Cannon 677]

Looks great so far

[Gn_leugim 858]

shhhhh!!! don't say that loud or people might get the wrong idea XD

the roof is looking so nice, you are pulling this through just nice

[Sciurus 323]

OMG the WTC. It's wonderful, the details are

Guillaume.

[Jasoncw 11,949]

The roof is coming along well.

[mattb325 28,891]

Very nice - I like how the window reflections are still visible behind the concrete at Z4....very good

[Susaji 523]

fantastic.

[Sgt Pepper 864]

Well guys, simply but cryptically put I had an... eventfully awful day today and really almost lost it. It gave me a little more peace of mind to see that you all appreciate what I'm doing here with this recreation. Thank you.

Hazani Pratama- Thank you!

Ion_Cannon- Thank you friend!

Gn_legium- xD But "Secrets secrets are no fun. Secrets secrets will hurt someone!" And of course thank you again.

Sciurus/Guillaume- I really appreciate that statement thank you!

Jasoncw- Thank you Jason! Nice of you to pop by again too.

mattb325- Thank you Matt! I'm glad they're still visible as well. I feel like it's been working out quite well. I'm glad my textures suffice.

I have about several pictures to show you. The completed roof as well as the night scene.

NOTE: These pictures aren't the same one divided.

Before I show the night scene, does the roof look sufficient enough? It's done unless there's something anyone feels should be desperately fixed. Oh how does the security fence below the observation deck look? Does it look safe enough? Should I make it bigger or wider? If I made it wider it will probably touch the Window Washer, but from what I've seen of the roof it looked like it pretty much touched the fence. Maybe there was a gate on that security fence that opened to the window washer?

Oh and the lobby. It's basically done, though I feel like I should add something like some banners in there. I believe one both towers had some like banners on the inside that were mounted along the "trees" of the base on the inside. I may look up a picture to see this.

And onto the night view. Any tips and tricks or suggestions on the lights of the lobby as well as the roof are more than welcome here because I'm having trouble getting that right...

For the roof I'm using a Direct something like Target Direct I think. I know the lobby lights are choppy right now but I'm going to fix that. I just wanted to see if the way the floors were lit up would be the right direction or not. Those are target spots for the lobby.

[Gn_leugim 858]

I will be honest with you, I don't like that lightning. that map looks nice in most of the bats you did, but on this particular, the details of lightning map are way overscaled in relation to the building. and there is something else I can't really tell what is :|

Now the lobby light looks good

[AlexandrosB13 184]

I think lobby and the roof looks great. Maybe add some kind of pipe or wires on the roof, it looks great but i still think it needs something. Or it could be my idea. The only thing that looks wrong is the wall texture. You can see the same pattern over and over again, especially at zoom 4. Otherwise i think it looks great

[harishna 847]

I like your model and I think you are doing great progress but I am with Gn_leugim I think you need to do something about the night-lights, I know that I have mentioned before that I don't particularly like the map you use but now I have also notice that some of the spots or shades in your texture consistently come at an oblique angle that also makes it look odd.

At the end It is up to you and you seem to very fond with this texture, but it may be worth it trying something slightly different for a change, at least try to get an opinion from more experienced batters.

[Vlasky 1,803]

Great job on WTC. Such a shame you're not doing it in Max, it'd be good to see one version of WTC done in Max. Towers separately could even be used as single buildings

[art128 4,622]

Some nice works going on in there, Sgt Pepper!

[Sgt Pepper 864]

Gn_leugim- Ah I see, well I changed the night map. I know night maps aren't exactly preferred nowadays, and Cockatoo's method he taught me a page or two ago would look great on here, but I'm not sure about individually or hand-making each of those target spots for each window to be lit up. There's quite a lot of windows. Hopefully I can do an acceptable night map.

AlexandrosB13- I think most of what would be "roof junk" is located in the mechanical floors of the tower. I could perhaps add a wire or two but I personally think this is it when I looked at a picture of the South Tower's roof. As for the wall texture, well the tiling isn't really noticeable, it only is on the sides. I don't really know what to do about it... I don't really know how to make a texture from scratch either.

harishna- Thank you, I did change the night map. I figured that those oblique patterns would make it look like there was something on the inside there but I suppose I was wrong. It's different now but I don't know exactly how to make my own night map. We'll see what you or everyone else thinks of this one though.

Vlasky- Thank you! I wouldn't call it a shame that it's not in MAX though. I think it looks fine enough in Gmax. I do prefer Gmax, that's just a personal preference however. And of course the Towers will in fact be separate. I'm not lotting a huge one lot complex with these. If I decide to make a complex for it though the buildings and plaza will all be separate.

art128- Thanks friend! I haven't seen you posting in a while, so let me say welcome back!

Here's some medium quality renders of the night view now. I changed the night maps to the default beige... I'm bracing myself for some scolding here unless everyone thinks it's acceptable.

How does it look now? Would this be okay?

Oh and here's the lobby at night, fixed it up.

I'm not sure what else to add to the lobby besides some banners. I don't even know what to make the banners look like either.

[GuerrilaWarfare 39]

You can put some national flags if anything. But I simply looked up WTC lobby and found this if it'll help. http://static.flickr.com/85/249362061_9ca82d1883_o.jpg

[Cockatoo 2,257]

Here's my input for this project so far:

What you've got here is nice. It's essentially a rehash of what the BSC guys did back in 2004; it looks to be about the same quality with similar techniques used to achieve similar results.

But this isn't 2004, and we've all moved on since then. Nice doesn't cut it anymore. While I understand your personal motivations for doing this, there is an unspoken rule in this community that goes a little like this: if it's already been done, either do it better or don't do it at all.

You need to start getting innovative with your BATing, and here I go again: Gmax is the only thing that's holding you back.

I just don't feel like doing this in Max. I'm stubborn like that simply put. I don't really have the means to get Max, and I don't care enough to get it.

You do have the means to get Max, your computer will run it and you are eligible for the student edition... but we've already been through that a million times and in the back of your mind you do know what the facts are.

I do prefer Gmax, that's just a personal preference however.

I've never tried French Champaign, but I have tried $4 wine from a box. Therefore if only makes sense that I prefer the box wine.

You stress that this is just a 'casual' hobby of yours, but it's not, is it? You update your BAT thread(s) with a regularity that suggests you spend a considerable amount of your free time BATing. To me at least, all this 'I don't care' rhetoric seems superficial at best. I'm going to list the benefits of Max one more time, and then I promise to never mention it again if you still can't see things from me (our) point of view.

1. Despite being a much larger program, Max will render considerably faster than Gmax on any PC from the last decade.

2. You'll actually be able to complete a z5 preview of a building of this magnitude. You haven’t mentioned it yet, but you still have no idea how you're ever going to export this sucker from Gmax... for all you know it could take weeks.

3. You'll be able to utilise various techniques (modelling, materials and in particular night lighting) that will save you many hours of work. This is a biggie.

4. You'll see a dramatic improvement in the quality your renders.

5. You'll give yourself the opportunity to learn many new and exciting things.

6. File corruption will be a thing of the past.

7. You won't have someone harping at you to get Max in every second post of your thread.

And probably the biggest incentive of all:

8. You'll enjoy yourself more. Fewer problems = more fun.

Right now, as you read this for the first time, you're probably thinking more than ever that you're never going to use Max. You probably feel as if I and everyone else here are just trying to bully you into conforming to what we want. This couldn't be further from the truth. I used Gmax for years... I was in your position. Stop being so stubborn, stop making your life hard, just take my advice as someone who's been there and done that. Get Max.

And hey... if it doesn't work for you (which it will, by the way)... what have you got to lose?

[harishna 847]

I am with Cockatoo with this gmax-max debate, just give it a go and see if you like it or no!

My previous computer had 3.5 Gb of ram and I was able to run max with no problem, I only had a few problem with big scenes that included high quality trees and complex night lights. But after trying max I never thought about going back to gmax...

I don't mind so much that you had a pattern in your night maps, I think it has to do more with the angle, maybe it could be as simple as rotating your image...

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

looks great Keep it up.

I am Cockatoo to, I add a 2 Gb Ram computer in 2009 an it ran 3ds max perfectly.

[Sgt Pepper 864]

I really...really did not want to continue this debate because it simply bothers me. But fine. Since I apparently suck with Gmax and can't make anything good with it fine I'll try and get 3ds. Max... Happy?

Now how would I import my gmax scenes into Max once I get it? And I swear if I can't I'm going to be incredibly pissed. Just saying.

Edit: I still consider it just a casual hobby. I may update my BAT threads regularly but that's because I have nothing better to do to be honest. I do love this hobby but that's all it is to me. A hobby. I'm no architecture student nor do I ever plan to be.

  Edited September 8, 2012 by Sgt Pepper  

[Vlasky 1,803]

YES!!! This is a great new Brandon! Listen to me, you don't suck. THAT IS THE POINT everyone was trying to make. You have amazing skills, and you're very talented, look how good your models look in gmax. But the program itself is what limited the quality of your BATs. It really is.

In fact, there is a way of importing your gmax model into the max. Aaron did it, and I'm sure as soon as he sees this message he'll be sending you one with instructions how to do it.

And I'm really excited about your transition, honestly, this only means that we're gaining another excellent BATer who produces stunning content instead of good content. If you don't trust me, trust someone as Cockatoo who's one of the best batters around. He pointed out all the great thing that will happen to you.

And trust me, and I will finish with this, adjusting to max might take some time (very minimal because as soon as you start using it you'll feel like you've been working in it for as long as you have batted) but it is worth it. I am very excited to see your great BATs becoming outstanding ones.

[Cockatoo 2,257]

Since I apparently suck with Gmax and can't make anything good with it fine I'll try and get 3ds. Max... Happy?

Yep, I am. +1.

Now head over to Autodesk, make an account and download 3dsMax Design 2013 (32-bit version for you). As you can see, the system requirements for the 32-bit version only require 2GB of ram. Let me know when you've installed it and then we can go through BAT4Max.

[Sgt Pepper 864]

Oh geez. I already downloaded 2011 instead of 2013... Um... I didn't think it really mattered. Is BAT4MAX still compatible with that though? Or do I have to download 2013?

2011 is already installed for me btw... which took a very long time. Can I just use this?

  Edited September 8, 2012 by Sgt Pepper  

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

To import Gmax models in to 3ds max you will need Deep exportation, do not worry about looking for it, I will post you a link to you once I have found it on my other computer. You will all so need MD3 Export, you will need to put the file in the C:\gmax\plugins Path. To export the model go to export and select Quake III (*.MD3) and name it.

Yeah it can work with 3ds Max 11.

Download Link to Deep Exportation and the ExportMD3.dle file.

Let me know when you have it.

http://www.mediafire...0gvblg1yibjxpry

You have 30 days to use the software it's a trial.

Here's my video on Youtube I have uploaded last year.

  Edited September 8, 2012 by Aaron Graham  

[Sgt Pepper 864]

Um I'm very confused here. This is honestly a major reason why I didn't want MAX. I'm very, very stupid and ignornat I don't understand what's going on here. Or what this program even is or what anything on it is or what anything is supposed to be or how to change views or whatever...

Oh and I downloaded BAT4MAX5 but it's a file I cannot run or open... what's a MZP?

  Edited September 8, 2012 by Sgt Pepper  

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

A .mzp file is a file to install the BAT4 Max in to 3ds max, it's almost like a zip, rar, type of file, SimFox made it in to an installer for 3ds Max by coding it to install to max, how I know is because I like taking things apart ans I found all the files in it. You do not need rar to open it, 3ds max can open it for you. Have you went to MAXscript on the tool bar on the top right hand corner and then run and look for the file and it should install.

  Edited September 8, 2012 by Aaron Graham  

[Sgt Pepper 864]

I have no earthly clue what you are talking about.

Uh something just doesn't feel right or correct about this program. Well here's an image of where I am with it, if anyone can point anything out...basically everything because I don't know what this stuff is, please do.

My easily befuddled state of being is why I had no wish or desire to use MAX.

EDIT: Why are the files here called "drawings?" .....

....

I downloaded the wrong program didn't I?

  Edited September 8, 2012 by Sgt Pepper  

[harishna 847]

That is Autocad not 3dsMax maybe that is why it looks so unfamiliar

[gutterclub 2,729]

Yeah, you've downloaded Autocad, it says it as the program. Installing Max is no different than installing GMAX, or any application. I would use the link that Cockatoo posted for you, follow the instructions on installing Max, then following the instructions in the BAT4MAX thread, they are straight forward.

[Sgt Pepper 864]

Urgggghhadsjflasjdflkajfdsklfjklaj I clicked the link in the forum to get MAX free legally and that's what I was brought to...

Prepare for an irrational rant, if you please.

I've been doing a lot of thinking, not about this about a lot about many things.

I'm an easily stressed person. Every little thing stresses me out and worries me. I'm scared of everything. I can't fully understand anything. I'm rather irrational about life. Thousands of little things stress me out, but the big things kill me.

BATing, like my other hobbies like writing stories or poetry, and drawing pictures or cartoons are my escape from Reality. I suffer from extreme clinical depression and anxiety so I find my hobbies help me cope when nothing else works. BATing became one of those hobbies a few years back. Drawing used to be the only thing, since I drew since I was 4 years old. I didn't pick up BATing till I was...let's see around 15 or 16 or maybe late 14. I'm 18 now. Or 112 I think if you look at my birthday I put on Simptropolis. Whichever you prefer to reference it makes no difference to me. Anyway I didn't want to take BATing so seriously because when I take things too seriously they stress me out. Drawing became something I took so seriously soon enough so I do a little less of it sometimes. I picked up writing and now I take that very seriously so that stresses me out every once in a while. BATing, same thing began to happen. Now, it's stressing me out more than ever.

When I first started BATing I used Sketchup. No one liked that, but I still made buildings with it and released them so people stopped caring what I used. They would subtly recommend me at least switching to Gmax, which I politely declined. Then, after a while I decided to give Gmax ago. It was pretty easy to stack a bunch of simple shapes or primitives around to look like a building so that became my new method and technique. People were happy to see that. No one bothered me about it.

But now, I'm getting, rather slightly harrassed to get 3ds. Max. I don't like being pressured to do anything. When I'm pressured it scares me. It worries me. It makes me feel so anxious. You may not see it as harassment but in someone that every little thing can easily trouble or worry it is...

It really bothers me now that no one really likes anything I made in Gmax... It hurts. I get told, "Oh it just looks 'okay' but you can make it look great for us by getting MAX." MAX this, MAX that, sharper renders this, sharper renders that. Reflective glass this reflective glass that. I didn't want to take this so seriously and now here I am ranting away because it's too late the pressure of you guys got to me and now I'm conforming because you all hurt my feelings with this indirect or implied "You suck, get MAX and you won't suck." That's how I read it. I'm very pessimistic in case you didn't notice, my outlook isn't very desired. Why does it have to matter that I don't have MAX? Why does it even matter to begin with? Am I really that awful at BATing just because it's Gmax?

I usually never like conformity of any kind. I usually loathe it. Now people want me to conform to MAX. Someone like me hates conformity. You think you can just easily sway me like that? I guess it's biased. But what human being isn't biased about something? Or hypocritical about something? It's human nature.

Now I can't even figure out this program just for a game, and it's stressing me out.

I guess I had it coming with this stubborness for Gmax. It would become, and is now...gee what's a metaphorical way of putting this. Giving an old doll to a girl that wants a phone. Giving a toy car to a boy that wants an Xbox.

I guess another way of seeing switching to this MAX version is like this to me. I draw on paper with pencils and sharpies and rarely pens. Someone comes up to me with a computer and shows me a program that lets me draw on a touch screen. Digitally. I've been drawing for years with pencils and paper and now someone is harassing me to do it on a computer. No.. no... I don't want that.

Now, I feel like all that time I put into BATing(which I for some reason discredit as not a lot of time at all) is all in vain. Just because I didn't use MAX in the past and wouldn't use it now. People just don't like what I make. It's not great. It's not good enough and this became a hobby I love and now I've almost reached a stage where I hate it because of this harassment and debate.

So, conclusively all I can think of doing right now in my illogical state of being is just to withdraw from here. I guess I'll just stop posting BAT progress because I don't see the use of it anymore... I'll most likely lurk around just for the STEX since I don't see myself putting SimCity 4 to a halt in my free time. I'll probably continue making BATs, just not posting progress on them. Maybe after a few weeks, or even a month or more I may release anything I've made...that is if I get the willpower to make finish something. But I'm done with this BAT Open Discussion leading to MAX debates. I can't stand it anymore.

Now, I do sincerely apologize for many of you will see this response as absurd. I'm truly sorry. But I'm trying to just avoid too much stress. But I guess I take a lot of life too seriously, or take things seriously that I actually shouldn't. But like I said I'm trying to avoid too much stress because with enough stress I get to the point of contemplating...I better stop there.

Again I'm sorry guys. I'm just losing it, any stress I get builds up and then it becomes a ticking time bomb and it blows up somewhere. It did yesterday, or the day before on the 6th.

I'd like perhaps a mod to go ahead and lock this. If anyone wants to discuss this further you can just PM me I suppose. Or, you can just post here if a mod won't lock this. It makes no difference to me.

I'm very apologetic. So again, for perhaps the I believe 4th or 5th time in this post... I'm sorry.

-End Rant

EDIT: Took out a foul word sorry about that.

  Edited September 8, 2012 by Sgt Pepper