mipro Barry Sanders Project

[Jasoncw 11,840]

Actually, I just searched for a picture of it in relation to Comerica Tower, and the picture I found was an arial that showed the roof! The picture was taken by Allan from ontop of the Guardian Building.

[sparkythepenguin 90]

That's too bad. I hope someone will step up and save Michigan Central. Detroit's all ready lost Hudson's, and may lose the Lennox-Madison. At least there seems to be a growing preservationist movement out there.

I can't remember what they replaced Hudson's with, but I've seen it. It really doesn't make up for the loss of the old building. To me, it looks like there is a huge hole where something important used to be, but is replaced by cheesy slab architecture.

I haven't been to any of the Detroit journals documenting these older buildings in a long time. I'll have to look up the Vinton, but I'm sure that Jason's captured it perfectly!

[Jasoncw 11,840]

The Hudsons block is still empty, except for a little bit of underground parking for whatever will be built there in the future, and part of the lot has a little bit of the Compuware HQ on it, which is probably what you're thinking of. http://www.emporis.com/en/il/pc/?id=100476&aid=8
I think that if the Hudsons Building wasn't imploded that it might have been renovated with lofts, or might have in a few years. But the building is really big, and I think dividing the insides with lofts would be unatractive because the units would be really deep with windows on only one side, and it might have the same problem with hotel rooms. Offices might not mind that, but the building is too big for offices (Compuware isn't a small company but their world HQ isn't that big) and then you'd need to bulldoze something else for a big parking deck, which would be neccecary. Plus then Compuware might not have been built, and I'm predicting that what will go into the Hudsons block will look nice.

I think that the US needs more deparment stores like Hudsons. I've heard stories about Hudsons, and today's department store aren't the same, even if they are both department stores anyway. I think Hudsons was the tallest department store on earth when it got bulldozed, and I think it was also the tallest implosion when it got taken down. It was also the largest Department store after Macy's (New York) and Marshall Fields (Chicago), and of course now all Hudsons are named Marshal Fields, which is really annoying. I still call it Hudsons anyways...

Another historic building that got torn down was the Stalter Hotel (http://www.emporis.com/en/il/pc/?id=118508&aid=. It was mentioned in a Sherlock Holmes story once. But it was appearantly impractical to do anything with the building, so it got bulldozed. I personally don't like that kind of hotel architecture except for the style of the bottom few floors. I would have liked it if they would have at least kept the bottom, but I guess you do what you have to do.

So that's my tangent about that.



Here's progress on my two BSP buildings. I'm able to work on the Detroit Free Press Building mostly because I cut the polygon count from 174,000 to 59,000 by converting everything to an editible polygon. The small building on the top of the roof on the Vinton Building needs to be smaller. I'm hoping that the funny zig zag effect on the industrial sliding doors on the Free Press Building will be fixed with a high quality render instead of a low quality preview. Also, on the Free Press Building, I won't be adding too much more roof junk. The current picture I have of the roof shows alot of stuff, especially on the top roof. I'll be putting some stuff on the lowest roof, but the middle roof will only have some vent things and that's about it. It's going to be a CO$$$ anyways, so I guess there shouldn't be too much roof junk in the first place.

And there are flag poles on the towers to the right and left on the front of the building, but should I put them there?

As always, any suggestions would be helpful.

And Merry Christmas!

[sparkythepenguin 90]

Date: 12/23/2005 9:42:44 PM
Author: Jasoncw

And there are flag poles on the 'towers' to the right and left on the front of the building, but should I put them there?

quote>

Well, in my experience, adding flagpoles is only worth the effort if you're adding the flags in. In some cultures, empty flagpoles symbolize that the building is empty or abandoned.

Flags are a sort of double-edged sword... If you strive for accuracy add them, but I now tend to be considerate of non-US users by including an identical version, but without flags. It's up to you if you want to export two different versions of the same building for such a minor detail.

[T Wrecks 10,209]

OMG, this stuff is SO beautiful! Can't wait to get these buildings in game...

As for the flagpole problem, why don't you just cut out the LOD in a way that it's possible to place props on all four towers? It should be possible to use PEG's One Flag - Many Nations mod to put flagpole props on top of the towers. This way, all people who have this mod see the flag they selected - be it American, Canadian, French, Dutch, Brazilian or whatever.

And you would have to export only once; alternative versions with and without PEG's flagpole props could be done at LE stage within seconds.

The LOD shape required to do so would look like a cube (with the top side having the height of the tower rooftops* and a narrow block in the middle to accommodate for the middle section.

*if the LOD needs to be at the height of the walls around the tower roof section, simply add a little foundation block for the flagpole with the exact same height as the walls around teh roof, so that it ends directly under the top side of the LOD shell. This way, it ought to be possible to avoid a displaced look of the flagpoles which will occur if there's some space between the top of the structure and the top of the LOD.

I hope I made sense...


EDIT

Here's a little picture I tried to draw to make it clearer.
White = current LOD shape (estimated)
yellow = required LOD shape
red = flagpole props possible

[JBSimio 152]

Looks great Jason!  I wish I had the skills to BAT and be a little bit more helpful... but alas, I don't.  Thank goodness there are people in this project who can!  Merry Christmas, everyone!

 

JB

[wolverine 12]

ignore, see post below.

[wolverine 12]

Wow, awesome work Jason! I'm sure former Lion, Robert Porcher would appreciate you work since he's redeveloping the building.

I just wanted to let you all know I'm working on Hudsons again since I got 3D studio 7 now. It's going to take awhile though because it's such a massive building.


I also have this Detroit building in the works:




For those wondering about Ford Field, that one is still on hold until I can effectively get it into 3D studio without it importing all messed up. The same goes for the Dime Building.

[rbdetsport 0]

By the way sparkythepenguin, the Madison-Lenox has already been demolished(illegally). Robert Porcher would love that because he is teaming up with some people from the Detroityes forum to renovate it.

[wolverine 12]

Yes, I'm afraid our friend the Madison-Lennox didn't quite make it.

[Jasoncw 11,840]

Any suggestions before rendering?

[ardecila 124]

Date: 12/23/2005 9:42:44 PM
Author: Jasoncw
It was also the largest Department store after Macy's (New York) and Marshall Fields (Chicago), and of course now all Hudsons are named Marshall Fields, which is really annoying. I still call it Hudsons anyways...

quote>

Not anymore... Now all Marshall Field's are changing their names to Macy's. And we lose another great old name from retail....

20 years from now, people will have no friggin clue who Marshall Field was, except that his company used to own the Macy's on State Street.

Anyways, some great work going on here! I especially like that latest shot of the 6-story building. Buildings like that are useful everywhere.

[Andreas Roth 607]

Date: 1/10/2006 4:48:31 PM Author: Jasoncw

Any suggestions before rendering?

quote>

 

It's wonderful - just go ahead and render it!

[T Wrecks 10,209]

Date: 1/11/2006 2:19:19 AM
Author: Andreas Roth

It's wonderful - just go ahead and render it!

quote>

I second that.

[Valiko87 0]

Gotta go with Andreas and T Wrecks here...it looks great, and you should render it. My lust to have it in-game is nearly incontainable.

Also, if anyone's interested, I've pretty much got the Ambassador model finished...need to texture it. I wanted to grab direct photos from the bridge, but I don't think I'm going to get a chance to head to the D this month, so I'll have to figure something out. I'm kinda worried that I might have to entirely re-make it...I've been following a couple threads on custom bridges, and it sounds like if you want a custom draggable bridge, you have to render it in 1 x 2 or 1 x 4 sections for every piece of roadway =\

[Jasoncw 11,840]

ok, it's being rendered right now, wish it luck

I was just thinking today, that we need to decide how downtown gets grided out in the game. So that everything fits together once it gets made.

That sucks to hear about Macy's. Although I do like the name Macy's better than Marshall Feilds.

Valiko87: Can't you just seperate the parts of the bridge so that you can render them seperately? How do the cables fit on the bridge if it's only 4 tiles long? Hopefully you can get it to work ok. It would be cool to have the Ambassador bridge in my cities.

[Valiko87 0]

In answer to your bit about the bridge being 4 tiles long, Jason: The bridge actually isn't 4 long, it's four wide (from cable to cable) at the moment, so it has two center tiles to match the highway, and then the other two for the cables and suspension towers. I have no idea how many tiles long it is at the moment, I need to get around to figuring just how long it needs to be so as to nearest match the length of the actual Ambassador.

The somewhat circular layout of some of the streets downtown is going to be hard to do in SC, with its grid-based system...I imagine Circus Park is going to look a bit odd in-game, but I'm sure the minds on this project will be able to figure out how to make it workable.

Any idea when the Free Press Building will be on the STEX?

[nofunk 1,933]

Jason, are you using gmax for that?! Wow ...

[sparkythepenguin 90]

Date: 12/24/2005 2:05:36 PM
Author: wolverine
Yes, I'm afraid our friend the Madison-Lennox didn't quite make it.

quote>



That is awful! A total crime in my book. You guys ought to have that mayor recalled! Thank goodness a lot of Urban Explorers got into it and took tons of pics before it went under.

Maybe this will galvanize people into action like when they got rid of the old Penn Station in NYC. Please, please, please don't let this happen to Michigan Central Station or the Book Cadillac!

[Jasoncw 11,840]

I think we could make new overlay textures that form a quater circle. Woodward would be a normal avenue, and the two parks (made individually) would go on each side. Adams (I think that's what it is) would be a normal road and wouldn't be included on the lot. The lot would be transit enabled to connect with the roads that spiral out of it. It wouldn't be possible to make the lot curved, but it is possible to make the buildings hang over into the lot, and since those roads coming out of the park are diagonal anyway, the buildings would already be hanging over, so we'd just make them hang over slightly differently to make them fit into the park. That would take alot of work though, and I don't think anyone is doing any of the buildings on the semicircle itself right now. This would all be alot of work, but it would probably be very popular because wow! curved roads! and because semicircle parks are popular all across the world. I think I might try gridding out as much of the city as I can in Sim City later today. Some of it just plain won't work, but it's important to have a plan for the areas that will work.

I don't know when the DFP will be on the STEX. I didn't actually render it yesterday, I had forgotten to do some of the nightlights, but I didn't have enough time before going to class (which was when I was going to render it). I might render it before I go to class today, and hopefully it'll be done when I get back so I can use my computer. After it's done it depends on what else T Wrecks has on his hands, but from what I can tell this should be an easy thing to mod. I'm not sure how the custom querry is being organized, so that might slow down the process.

and I am using Gmax for that, but I wouldn't mind using something else *wink wink* -nudge nudge-

The Book-Cadillac, from what I can tell, is going to be rennovated. Everything is in place, so it will be done unless it falls through within a month or two. They've secured all their funds, I think. It's going to be a hotel with condos on the top few floors, and the public space at the bottom of the building is going to be enlarged for more kitchen space and some other things (which is interesting that they're not only renovating it, but expanding it). Right now there isn't any luxury hotels in the city for the autoshow guests, and I'm guessing that after a year or two of autoshow guests staying there the B-C will be an important part of the autoshow, since I'm sure it will be packed with prestigous people, and they'll be having a bunch of parties and stuff.

*whew* long post.

[JBSimio 152]

Hi All,

The buildings look great guys!  I just got the request to make the query for the Free Press building from Jason.  Before I start I wanted to check if anyone has an opinion on what type of form these should take.  Personally, I would like to see something somewhat uniform with a BSP look to it... whatever that means.

 

My idea is to have a short description of the real world building at the top of each one followed by the usual information specific to that building in the game.  For instance, when it was built, who designed it, and some tidbit of history to go with it.  Then follow with the jobs, crime rate, etc... or whatever.  I don't know if we want graphics or not... but I also thought that a shot of the mitten with a marker to show where the building comes from might make a cool background.

 

Any thoughts?  I plan to start on this tonight.  It might be slow as I learn... but I'll post some pics when I get something worth showing.

 

JB

[JBSimio 152]

Alright guys... here is what I came up with so far. It's only the very humble beginnings and probably won't look much like this once I'm done... but this is the first one of these I've ever done and I'm definately still learning. Consider this merely proof that I'm getting somewhere! I tacked it onto the Joe Louis fist just to test it ingame, so don't let that throw you off. Anyway... here it is.

[JBSimio 152]

Here are a couple examples of what I came up with so far using the standard SC4 boxes.  I'm still playing with the style from my above post... there's a couple things I don't like about it now that it's full sized and all.  Any suggestions?

http://www.imgcity.net/server/primary/BSP1.jpg align=baseline>

 

http://www.imgcity.net/server/primary/BSP4.jpg align=baseline>

 

JB

[GangstadanDT 0]

The Freep Bldg. looks great!

When is it going be available for download?

 

BTW Wolverine, are the renovations on the Palace done? I would LOVE to have that in my city

 

 

[Jasoncw 11,840]

Well, T Wrecks (who will be modding the Detroit Free Press Building) won't have the internet for about a week, or maybe more, so he can't work on it untill then. JBSimio has worked more on the querries, and he'll be making a poll with a few different choices within a few days or so.

So before, I was telling people that it would be done at the end of January, but now it looks like the begining of February. There will be a 4x3 and a 4x4. I'll try to have T Wrecks make the 4x3 the ploppable, if you want to make a spot for it in your city. Hopefully it'll be done in time for the superbowl, lol.

And to give an estimate, the Vinton Building might be out around mid or late March.

[JBSimio 152]

Hi All,

I decided to just gather feedback here.  I didn't want to make a separate thread just to poll query boxes... so here are the front running examples.  Personally, I think I like number 4  (bottom right) best, but it looks pretty crappy with a residential header... so I might switch back to a standard blue like my above post for any type of lot.  I'm also toying with the idea of making the logo act as the close button to eliminate the crowded look, but the graphics are slowing me down at the moment.

 

Anyway, please offer some feedback.  We would like to come up with a standard template for any BSP projects I am involved in hencforth (or from now on... whichever you prefer!)  So you all are deciding on the future look of our projects.  My, don't you feel important now???

 

https://www.simtropolis.com/idealbb/files//BSP%20Poll.JPG align=baseline>

 

JB

 

 

[Jasoncw 11,840]

Can you make the pictures bigger?

[Andreas Roth 607]

Actually, I'd prefer the version you posted a few days earlier; the bright blue doesn't look that great in my opinion. In addition, you should try to make the query UIs as generic as possible, since every graphic, regardless of its size, will consume precious memory resources. A BSP logo is fine, but when you include individual pictures in every UI, you should keep them as small as possible - and in this case, you rather should remove the watermark graphics. Try to make the frame around the image more anti-aliased, so it doesn't show those ugly pixels. Also, please keep in mind that Make historical should have enough room, since it's called Unter Denkmalschutz stellen in German, so the caption would probably be cut off in your layout (this is a common issue with custom queries in general, they are only laid out for English versions of the game and look odd in other languages). If you really want to go with the blue, tone it down a bit, and maybe change the text to white, in order to make it easier to read.

[canuck3360 14]

I like the look of Number 4 Kinda Honolulu Blue with the Lower Penisula in the Backround.

[Jasoncw 11,840]

I prefer #1, except with the horizontal line inbetween the stats and the description returned from the earlier preview.

It's funny how sometimes things get really long or short after they get translated. I guess it should be moved to underneath the description?