Sim City + Pen&Paper RTS = Fun?

[NightlinerSGS 1]

(I don't know if this topic fits here so please move it if you don't think so)

Me and my friend, both SC4 players and Real Time Strategy (RTS) lovers, were playing together when we came up with this idea:

Combining Sim City with some kind of a Pen & Paper Game to a RTS game!

I wanted to present you this idea to know what you think about that.

The goal of this game is to destroy the other player (like every other RTS game).

However, having Sim City involved makes this much more complicated.

The Basics.

To destroy your enemy you need an army.

To build and support your army, you need resources.

To get resources you need Dirty Industry.

To get better units you need to do research.

To research you need High Tech Industry.

You need people who work in those Industries.

You need to feed your people. To do so, you need farm jobs and Manufacturing Industry.

We are simulating all those by giving points for the jobs you have in a region.

There are different kinds of points:

PP = Population points.

PPs show you how many people you can have in your region. There are 10000 free population points (Thats for the development at the beginning). You can get 20 population Points per Farm Job. One Farm job combined with one Manufacturing Job gets you 100 PP. Remaining Manufacturing gives you Develpoment Points.

DP = Development Points.

DPs show you how many units you can purchase and they are neede to purchase them. 1 Dirty Industry Job gets you 5 DP. 1 Dirty Industry Job combined with one of the remaining Manufacturing Jobs gets you 20 DP. If you have still Manufacturing Jobs remaining you can get Research Points for them.

RP = Research Points.

With RP you can build advanced units. You can spend your RP on technologies on a list you made with the other player. You also need RP to build them. One High Tech Industry Job gives you 5 RP. Combined with one of the remaining Manufacturing Jobs you get 10 RP. If you have even more Manufacturing remaining....... they are wasted and do nothing!

The behavior of Manufacturing Industry.

Manufacturing Industry is some kind of a joker. They can do everything if they are combined with another Job. But you cant choose what you want them to do, they do the first thing in the list above and only do the second if there are no more support jobs left. Same goes for the third.

Commercial.

Commercial is a placeholder for your population. You cant have a single person work in the Industry and be a soldier at the same time. But you can have people work at Commercial Zones and be soldiers at the same time! So its important to have much Commercial Zones too if you want to have a big army.

Unit and Technology List.

Those Lists are made by both players together before the game starts. I'll give an example for a simple Unit List (dont care about the names^^):

US Soldier

- Cost: 2PP + 4DP

- Stats: Atk 1 Def 1

- Specials: Gets +4 Def if the attacked City has only Residental and Commercial.

- Technologies: None

- Upgrades: M16/M203 Grenade Launcher - Allows Soldiers to deal more damage +1 Atk

M1A1 Abrahms Tank

- Cost: 4PP + 20DP

- Stats: Atk 6 Def 4

- Specials: Ground to Ground only

- Technologies: Tank Cannon

- Upgrades: Smoke Grenade Launcher - Allows Tanks to hide behind smoke +1 Def

MIM-104 Patriot

- Cost: 4PP + 25DP

- Stats: Atk 8 Def 1

- Specials: Ground to Air only

- Technologies: Ground to Air Missiles

- Upgrades: Advanced Radar - Patriots use Advanced Radar

F-18 Jet

- Cost: 4PP + 30DP

- Stats: Atk 6 Def 6

- Specials: Gets +4 Atk when fighting against Bombers (except stealth units), Air to Air only

- Technologies: Jet Engine, Air to Air Missiles, needs at least one Airport in your region

- Upgrades: Light Bombs - Allows Air to Ground combat at 3 Atk 4 Def

B-52 Stratofortress Bomber

- Cost: 10PP + 50DP

- Stats: Atk 14 Def 0

- Specials: Air to Ground only

- Technologies: Carpet Bombing, needs at least one Airport in your region

- Upgrades: Flares - A defense against Jets and AA Cannons +2 Def

B-2 Spirit Stealth Bomber

- Cost: 12PP + 75DP + 10RP

- Stats: Atk 16 Def 0

- Specials: Radar Stealth, only detectable with Advanced Radar, Air to Ground only

- Technologies: Radar Stealth, Precise Bombing, needs at least one Airport in your region

- Upgrades: None

Now a short example for a Technology list:

M16/M203 Grenade Launcher

- Cost: 2500RP

- Requires: Nothing

Tank Cannon

- Cost: 4500RP

- Requires: M16/M203 Grenade Launcher

Smoke Grenade Launcher

- Cost: 2000RP

- Requires: Tank Cannon

Light Bombs

- Cost: 10000RP

- Requires: Jet Engine

Carpet Bombing

- Cost: 12000RP

- Requires: Light Bombs

Precise Bombing

- Cost: 15000RP

- Requires: Light Bombs

Ground to Air Missiles

- Cost: 9000RP

- Requires: Nothing

Jet Engine

- Cost: 13000RP

- Requires: Nothing

Air to Air Missile

- Cost: 13000RP

- Requires: Jet Engine

Stealth Technology

- Cost: 25000RP

- Requires: Nothing

Advanced Radar

- Cost: 20000RP

- Requires: Stealth Technology or confirmed usage of Stealth Bombers by the enemy

These are the basic rules we used for our first game, but we are making new rules and correct old ones when we think something does not fit. There are also advanced rules since we wanted more tactical gameplay, but they are too long to post here now^^

Well, tell me what you think =P

 

[skinneej 0]

hey man if it's funf or you go for it. Personally I would just play C&C Red Alert or some such game, but to each their own.

[NightlinerSGS 1]

I think you got it wrong.

I don't want to create a new game or something like that, I just searched a way to play Sim City together with my friend. And thats what we came up with

[skinneej 0]

no no, I understood. It just seems like a lot of effort to transform a "sandbox" game in to a competitve match. Your list of rules and tallying points is staggering! But like I said, if it's fun for you, enjoy it

[matt_sbs 2]

sounds good tell maxis to develop simcity 5 with this stuff in it

[CDI_spy 6]

Wow that's a complex and intricate game and very-well thought out... I'm impressed!

[newyorkstate 6]

Wow very awesome yet somewhat complicated! Looks amazing!

[KoolSIM 2]

I like your detailed presentation. You seem to have put a lot to get this out. It's nice!!

[zzsim 3]

Sounds like an interesting game, but thats just a little too much number crunching for me .  I still thinks its a good idea, though, probaly the best method for a competetive SC4 experience I have ever seen.  Have fun with it!

[iquere 2]

I would definitely play that game if I could buy it. Interesting, yes...

[smago10 2]

sounds interesting to me.

also sounds kinda like Civ4 to me. do you play civ4 or any of the otehr Civ games?

[starrdarcy 4]

Well an interesting idea... i have been doing similar city-on-paper for many years now. I have developed a way of making a fully functional city just on paper. I call it mapproject, here are some picutre. Maybe t can give you soem ideas...

Some more pics can be found here: http://lionchild.squarespace.com/

[bixel 1,228]

WOw you guys are being VERY creative!, I think there is a way to do this. Theoretically, since the TB2Camera Handle scripts and the BAT4Max has been made by custom content creators it is essentially open source property. The rendering and exporting is there, now a script handler must be written to call for the placing of the bitmaps. Viola! Simcity OS (Open Source). Using some python, we can use hex map rules from old Avalon Hill game Panzerblitz for the combat system, integrated that graphically in isometric view just like SC4, but instead of hexes use squares like SC4.

Then! Write code using python for the game handler, adding more functionality to the known workings of SC4, we can create our own game with new objectives. We are so in tune with the workings of SC4 that if we knew good code, writing the new SC OS would not be very difficiult, just not very easy .

The render and creation of military BATs for use of play and the new rules can be done. Personally I do not know any Peer to Peer (Multplayer) code writing so someone would have to step in, but this is indeed possible.

[qurlix 20]

Well, in the meantime someone can make a UI script that displays point totals. With enough work it could even display what units and technologies are available, then store to a file which the user has purchased and deduct it from the total! The file could then be printed out, etc.

But I'm a little busy right now...anyone good at LUA around here?

-qurlix

[bixel 1,228]

I can code, but there is a lot to learn. I don't know lua, (some cbuild scripting and python and ruby) but I see no reason why we need it. Think of this, all the SC4.Model files are just files, the data is all there, we just need a way to read it and interpret it.

I normally do script work for NWN, like AI and encounters, so I don't know much code aout graphic applications, essentiallty we will have to write a template based on isometric view of 20 degrees (the SC4 assemblage) and then be able to read the data in the SC4 Model files, in fact if done properly all models and props in SC4 could be utilized.

[SC4Noobie 5]

This sounds like something big! I hope this will work out!

[Flumes 3]

Oh Yeah, I do the City on Paper all the time, your's is a lil more organized tho starrdarcy, probably b/c I always lack a ruler when I do it...

I have a ton of other pen+paper games, great for long car rides!!!

[Camaron 1]

Well I like to use pen and paper to plan regions, never considered using that concept to make a game. Cool idea.

[bixel 1,228]

Srry guys I am in no position to begin writing a game from scratch! I gotta pay rent ya know! Besides when NWN2 comes out I will devote all my coding time there.

[collgab 10]

thats incredible!!!, cool concept!!!

[hawkotaco 0]

Actually, on Warcraft III, there is a map called Sim City Wars. Pretty fun. Its pretty close. You research stuff on the side on the buildings. You need to build "research centers" in order to get "tech." You need to build commercial to get gold. And you need "tech" and gold to research. You only need gold to make the soldiers.

However, there are not to many players though...to many people are playing DOTA for all you warcraft fans.

[LivingInThePast 364]

Why not just make a P&P game where the goal is to...build a city. Think SimCity 4: Network Edition (like SC2K)

[offgreen 1]

I think I'll just go play Civ, but good luck!

[Krio 626]

Or Hearts of Iron 2: Doomsday.

[flame1396 9]

wow... bixel's idea would rock... if it were to end up web based... ST could host it.... and maybe even implement subscription account options so that they coulsd support it

[Zutnzeed 4]

You and your friend could get some these: http://www.mayfairgames.com/mfg-shop/ccgs/simcity/mfg-sc.html

[coolotter88 2]

I just want to tell you, this is a great idea but you will have to put a ton of effort into coding something like this, best to leave it to the professional game developers (or become one yourself so you can make your own games, like will wright) but if this is going to be a hobby...you'd better be retired or have a ton of free time on hand....and lots of dr. pepper

[antivert 0]

About programming. It seems like a lot of 'wasted' time will be spent on making something you enjoy, however, more time is wasted in thinking negatively about things you feel passionately about. Through the process of enjoying your creation you will learn things about yourself, things about your subject, and, most importantly, things about the process of creating. To put it in terms of productive time, if you negate every enjoyable thought you have because it "won't make money", you shut off a channel of learning. Focusing on 'work' and things that strictly make money in the short term cuts one off from extremely productive 'play' time. Through the process of enjoying yourself you'll have an explosion of ideas ; through the process of cutting yourself off from enjoyable activity you'll grind your ideas into a pithy sandstone of grit.