The end of planet offer

[Livin in Sim 83]

Originally posted by: mightygoose

I do think however we should be showing a little more decorum in here, and be grateful that there is a games developer out there giving our genre the time of day.

quote>

Hello, everyone.

Yes, please, let's act with some decorum; I like that word.  Google it if you need to.  I've read John's (mightygoose's) posts enough to know that he is certainly no stick in the mud.  Sure, crowing over other's misfortunes, or arguing about how right we were, scolding each other, or assuming we know each others intents or character (those on both sides, and MC included) can be fun at the time.  But it's the kind of fun I usually hate myself for later.  I don't think we are doing ourselves any favors by this.  We might actually be shooting ourselves in the foot if we have any hope of a developer taking our city building game interest into the future.  Maybe SC4 is the be all, end all, but I still like shiny new things.

--Liv

[pete1061 0]

What is sad is that this is all we have. City builders is a small genre, and very few developers want to take that risk.

That's probably why so many are so passionate here. In a way we are fighting over the scraps.

MC is doing what it needs to survive. I'm most happy about the end of the PO because it makes custom content more technically feasible and I really enjoy tinkering around with creating my own content. I didn't get much myself out of the PO. I only subscribed so I could trade between my own cities. I had greater hopes for the monthly content packs, but that fell short.

It's going to be some time before someone comes up with a good approach to multiplayer city builders. The PO was a failed experiment, not a scam.

We'll see what the future brings. MC could perfect CXL and future versions will be closer to what the community wants. Maybe this metropolis project will turn out to be something good, far too soon to say on that one. maxis could surprise us and make a decent sim city 5 some day, but I highly doubt that, especially since will wright has moved on to greener pastures and Maxis is not maxis anymore, just an extension of EA. Maybe a new developer will come out of the ether and surprise us all.

But until then we are stuck with what we have. If you think you can do better then do what the guy at the metropolis project is doing and take things into your own hands.

[optionsignature163 0]

Has anybody heard anything about the photography contest? Anyone submitted a support ticket on it? I would think that they already had those prizes in hand and have no reason for not seeing the photography contest through to the end.

And to stay on topic with the thread, I am agreeing with the majority here. I think this will end up being a good move (provided MC doesn't fold) and the game will progress, both with it's technical issues and the game content. Maybe the next city builder can learn from these mistakes and provide a good MMO experience.

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

YESSSSS!!!!!!!! finally i can get a game that i was looking forward to since they anounced CXL

[Nevets13 27]

Well now that the initial reaction to this has worn off. While I will still likely get this when it comes out, since my SP play isn't taken hostage by the PO game I still wonder if they will work on the real problem with this game.

The cities don't feel alive, I felt like I wasn't building cities, I was just putting buildings down. I need sounds of the city. I need to be able to click on citizens and get info on them so I can feel they are real people in my city not just eye candy. Cities need much more immersion.

I don't have much hope for this tho, it sounds like they are just going to take the PO game and package it into an SP game.

[cirugo 1,889]

"I really hope MC pulls through this though, and now I'm happy to support them financially via the purchase of add-ons and GEMs.  Now that they've regained focus, the sky's the limit for Cities XL!  (so long as MC keeps afloat) "

Same here.

My objection to the planet offer was never so much the money...it was being forced to interract with other people in order to be able to build MY city the way I wanted to.  It was the idea that, once unsubscribed, then poof...my city was gone.  The only reason I ever subscribed was to have access to the additional buildings and such.  I never once had a contract with another player.

I hope they are able to put out more content for the game...I will happily pay for it, as I would have if EA had continued coming out with addtional content for SC4.

[LivingInThePast 364]

I have mixed feelings about this already.

At first, I was like "HA! I knew this would happen!"

Then I was like, "Dang. I guess this would prove to everyone else city builders really don't work."

Then I was like, "But MC is still alive. Maybe they'll realize their mistakes, and help create an awesome city builder we wanted since they started the Cities Unlimited boards."

I'm sticking with that last comment.

[soltangris 42]

My point is while I do my victory lap, I was right.  The Planet Offer is a huge scam.  All the stuff you paid for is going to dissapear out of your game.  All your hard work is gone and your cities are going to dissapear.  I don't take joy from that, but I do take joy from being right when others told me I was wrong.

 

So you think the biggest effect caused by the end of PO is the dissapearance of our citie? Hm....  Out of all the changes coming, THIS one is the one that is most important??? And you say you can be a positive person? Again, hmmmmm......

Bountytaker, I see you've taken a lot of time and effort to analyse all MC's announcements and pull out everything that can be used against them. Have you considered being a lawyer? 

I don't understand what exactly are you criticizing, though. When I read in the first moment, it seems it's the 'lack of communication'; then, it seems it's their old business model (the exact one they're changing now); then it seems it's the lack direction, as you see it. Overall, it seems you're criticizing everything, point by point. I admire your efforts, especially since you joined us so recently  

Let me try to point out some things: ?

1. The Planet Offer cannot have been a 'scam' - a scam is something that is intended to fool someone into spending his money with as little effort, time and resources spent on the part of the scammer as possible. The scammer then dissapears with the money aquired.

The PO costed a lot of money, effort and time to maintain - your managers spend time and resources to inquire into the viability of the model, the programists spend time to code the thing into the game, then the support team spends time and effort to support it. And all costs money to the company. So, it's very probable that MC lost as much money as they got from PO subscripitons (maybe more) - not to mention the loads of criticism they drew. This is not a scam - it's a failed experiment.

2. MC are NOT lacking direction now - their direction is to turn CXL into a fully single player game. What is not clear is how long this process will take and how exactly their financial situation will support this transitional period - now that the PO money aren't going to come in anymore, and people won't buy more copies of the game until the new version is out. Hence the lack of exact dates, prices and so on.

3. I deem (personal opinion) that we can't decide what is MC's 'everything possible', in terms of the success/failure of the PO. For the thousandth time - they are a small company! They don't have loads of money! You need money for advertisement, you need people to support/patch/pump out new content in no time. You can of course speculate - and that's all we're doing here - what are the exact circumstances up there. And our speculations here never seem to be favourable to MC. USA_Pride likes pointing out that MC criticism is frowned upon in this forum, while pro-MC posts are favored, but if you make a sheer comparison between the two types I'm 90% sure that the first group will vastly outnumber the second. Even the moderatiors got tired of this at some point.

Finally (and risking again to be taken for MC employee) I will stress out that all this speculative negativism is not helping anyone. It's just aggravating further an already hard moment for the city-building genre, when one promising game is undergoing critical changes that could turn it into a far better product. Given the fact that a similar game hasn't been out for years, and that there are no plans for another one, I think we better allow MC some space to breeth, a chance to redeem themselves and continue working on the game in a way we'd like better. And not .... do what we're doing here..... again.

P.S. I realise some personal issues are being adressed here. Living in Sim, if you think I'm going too far, feel free to edit this post

[City Planner 121]

Originally posted by: gianthaiku

... as long as people continue to make buildings like those made by hundreds of people for SC4 then CXl will have a lifespan probably equivalent of Simcity 4.

(i doubt though!), and MC will have more reasons to upgrade CXL

quote>

This is very true.  Think what if EA/MAXIS had not given the ability for people to provide all the content that has been provided over the last x years.  Would Simcity 4 still be on the store shelves?  I honestly have to guess that it would not.

Now as single player MC has the opportunity to continue to sell Cities 2011 for years and years to come, but they've got to put out a solid product in 2011, and it's got to have extensive abilities to accept user created content.  Without either of those, it's just another product that is going to sit through the holiday season on the shelves and then disappear like City Life has all but disappeared.

I for one hope that they will really work hard on 2011 and fix it and add to it and offer us the abilities to add our own content to it the same as we've been doing to SC4 for all these years now.  It would certainly be a feather in their cap if they could show that 2011 is still selling well in 2019 and is still something that stores want to stock because it's still selling.

It's up to them now.  They can either take the easy road and put out a rebranded product with little to no improvements and no user created content abilities or they can do the opposite and have a product that is still ordered from them for the stores years to come.

I wait with anticipation to see which route they have decided to follow at this point.

[pcgamer2 0]

i never paid for Cities XL PO, i did free trail but i wanted to wait for the game to finish its teething stage, and join in when maybe the 2nd content pack comes in or so and the servers have matured. I used to hate SP and gave up on Cities XL all together until the patch that made onicorp a little more reasonable and realistic, i am now building cities again on this game. I am really disapointed that Monte Cristo is already throwing in the towel on this project. All they need was a little creativity in every aspect to grab attention. There is soo much they could of done with this. And to help support Monte Cristo with the future of Cities XL i will sub for its last month being alive.

This is like a ship wreck, people are cheering about this, but this is really just a killer. The constant evolving of the game that could make it live on for years and years is gone. All we will get now is a major patch in 2011 that will fill a bunch of the unfinished parts of the game and add final touches, like CL2008 did.

[DazzaDazza 29]

 The Planet Offer cannot have been a 'scam'

i have to 100% agree hear, PO can not be a scam, just because they had a  bad business plan that doesn’t mean the it is a scam,. I am shore that the majority of game company have made one or two fizzers in there time.  

There excuses that the miss read the market, I think is quite a valid one, MMO are popular now days so I can see why they tried it out “again” , but I can also see why it did work out. I wont go into them becuases most people know what they are.  I have to admit sometimes I think that MC are run by monkeys.  The game is a very good one, and I enjoy playing it, and I would gladly argue with people that say it not, But unfortunately I can’t say I would do the same for the people running the Cities XL, They have made some bad decisions and I not talking about PO. That was just badly executed.  But that’s in the past now, so we can all move on, except what is or is not going to happen, and continue playing CXL not matter what state MC are in. SC4 seem to do o.k. with out Maxis.               

[Bountytaker 0]

Originally posted by: soltangris

Bountytaker, I see you've taken a lot of time and effort to analyse all MC's announcements and pull out everything that can be used against them. Have you considered being a lawyer? 

I don't understand what exactly are you criticizing, though. When I read in the first moment, it seems it's the 'lack of communication'; then, it seems it's their old business model (the exact one they're changing now); then it seems it's the lack direction, as you see it. Overall, it seems you're criticizing everything, point by point. I admire your efforts, especially since you joined us so recently

 

quote>

I didn't attempt to pick out all the things that would make MC look bad.  I simply made three points, based on their announcement, that I thought were important...points no one else seemed to be making.  Unfortunately, making a simple negative critique isn't allowed here even if that negative critique is meant to HELP the company in the end. 

How do those critiques help, one might ask?  Well, lets take the criticism about the unclear communication about

CXL

2011.

As I recall, there was a pretty lenghty article floating around the

CXL

community about "unfullfilled expectations" that seemed to resonate with many players.  In it, the OP and others made a strong case for laying some of the fault of the poor reception of the game at the feet of the players...namely, those who were fans of

SC4

and those that participated in the early stages of the "open development" of the game.

The argument focused on how players took early communications from MC's development team and unfairly (for MC) treated them as promises, as opposed to possibilities.  Players, it seems, were unable to tell the difference between wishes/hopes and goals/reality.  Yes, some of the responsibility fell to MC as well, as it was pointed out that they made a few unclear statements in the long development cycle.  But, in the end, the "expectations" seemed to go "unfulfilled" because players read too much into poor, vague info, and therefore had a vision for a game that was never really being made.  Their anger over the "different" resulting product, it would appear, was unjustified as the true "expectations" were, in fact, fulfilled.

What does this have to do with yesterday's announcement?  Well, you have the same fans of the same genre watching/reading word coming out of MC, the "only company making a city builder right now".  And, when news comes out, FAQ included, about a possible solo-only game, you can be sure many of the same folks who "misunderstood" the intentions of the devs two years ago were listening...again.  Based on the argument that players hurt this last game because of reading into vague info incorrectly, and since its difficult to imagine all those players changing their ways, it would seem important for MC to be EXTRA CLEAR in their announcement of their solo game plans...or, at the very least, almost completely QUIET, until they needed to be EXTRA CLEAR.

Instead, they fall right into the same pattern (trap) and release a bunch of confusing info (2011, why 2011?) that IMMEDIATELY raises several questions...problematic questions.  Question they can't answer (which just adds fuel to the problems, right?)

So, I point that out in an effort to remind them that they are falling into the same trap....not because I like being negative, but because I saw no one else doing it (not even those who made that old expectations piece popular).  My "reward"....vague comments about my ill intents.

Don't know what else to say.  Sometimes, your buddy comes out of the bathroom with toilet paper trailing from his shoe.  If you point it out in front of your group of friends, it will be embarassing for him for a few minutes, for sure.  But, if you say nothing, for fear the negative comment will hurt his feelings, the result will likely be that your friend spends the night out with toilet paper following him everywere he goes, seen by everyone he meets.

Negative criticism is not a bad thing.  It CAN make you stronger.  Fans of this game may have to accept that...at least in the short term.  Otherwise, expect similar results.

Oh....and I don't need to practice law...my wife does, and she's better at it then I'd ever be

[Bountytaker 0]

Two extra points:

1)  I never called the PO a scam.  I would agree that it's a failed experiment.  Unfortunately, one that may cause no one else to ever try the experiment again.

2)  I put together a pretty comprehensive list of things, easy and hard, short term and long, that they COULD have done to try to improve the P.O, or draw in subscribers.  I have yet to see a list countering those, or even evidence that my examples were tried (in some way).  I was under the impression that statements need facts..otherwise its opinion.  I have facts that say they did NOT try everything to make the P.O. work (gain subscribers), including points about their failure to follow through with their OWN PLANS on managing the P.O. (wiping cities, stopping cheats, running events).

Is there anyone out there that disagrees that can actually give FACTS to support MC's claim...as opposed to opinions, and sometimes excuses.  I don't expect MC to back up their statement themselves, so will anyone else who did not see their opening comment as UNTRUE step up and support their case with FACTS?

If not, then I'm gonna have to take the +1 point on this one gang.

[Nevets13 27]

I wonder if they will open up the community forums again....I know we kind of became jerks in the end, but it could help.

[moaku 74]

Problem with PO is that what MC wanted with it was "the butter, the money for the butter, and the girl that sells the butter" in the same package (in french: Le beurre, l'argent du beurre et la cr

[DazzaDazza 29]

Ummm, well it hard to arguer with all that Bountytaker, you do speak the truth, that every one already know,  but you do sound like a bad ex-girlfriend that will stop at nothing to destroy your reputation.

i had a quick look on goggle, I goggled MMO’s games and it wasn't long before cities XL came up, I also goggled  city building and it came up right way away. So I guess they where do something weren’t they. There is only so much they can do I guess, there only so much advertising they can do. What did you wont from the there blood. Again the game is there on a lot of sites, saying cities XL a modern city builder, type MMO. If you won’t fact I guess the only facts are is that people weren’t interested in a CB MMO. MMO players didn’t wont to play city builders.  Guess to make the matter worse cities building fans did wont to play MMO game ether, it was the wrong game for MMO and the wrong game for cities building. this is what they ment by mis reading the market i guess Theses are the facts not what they could or should have done, because those efforts would have been futile as well.                    

[Garek Maxwell 1]

Now I'm just left wondering if Cities XL 2011 is going to be the Cities Unlimited from ancient lore I heard so much about. I recall old tales of great promises and hope for a new age...

Anyway, sure hope MC does well and succeeds with this new plan. As much as I never would have gone for the PO, I certainly wouldn't want MC to be hurt badly for such a mistake.

...Though I do think that their sudden change of plans was likely because they financially forecast running out of money for future development since subscriber numbers was probably low and not increasing. The seemingly hasty change was probably decided not long after December when subscribers didn't rise as expected and just looking at the numbers it could be determined in advanced that things weren't looking good. It was probably a better move to cut their loses now before it got really bad and then try to salvage what they can to garner more sales in the future.

[soltangris 42]

Really, you guys "tried everything"?

Did you try any of the ideas about how to make the P.O. work that were talked about on the old forums for two years before release?  Simple ideas, like creating "competition" or "cooperation", or limiting resources and citizens?

Did you implement ANY of the mmo suggestions presented from day one of open beta?  Even the easier ones, like reordering the maps, creating regions/countries/nations, making changes to transportation rules, or expanding the number of resources?

Did you try to do anything with the Blueprint system that players suggested, like making them "rarer" to earn, harrder to build, unique to planets, or giving them importance?

Did you try ANYTHING new with the avatar system to make it unique from the chat window?

Did you regualrly patch the game with unique content?  How about fixes for the MAJOR issues that were reported, like the memory bug that is STILL in the game.

Did the community events team ever get any "events" off the ground?  If so, did it get mentioned to any sites?

Did you keep contact with players regularly after you closed the official forums?  Did you make regular appearances to answer questions and promote the game on mmo forums?

Did you clamp down on the cheaters in a timely fashion?  Did you delete unused cities according to the plan you had in place?  Did you have a design document for content creation that you shared with players to give them an idea of when they may be able to make their own content, or even if they could, for the P.O.?

Is this the list you're talking about, Bountytaker? Let me see:

1. Two years before release.... I was under the impression that the PO idea didn't even exist at that time, but never mind (maybe I'm mistaken). As for: creating competition - they didn't have time to do that in 4 months. Creating cooperation - well, that was there all the time - via trading you could always cooperate. Limiting resources - 4 of the resources are map-dependend, i.e. limited. Limiting citizens...... ?????????????

2. Again, no time. The original system barely was fixed, and the PO ended. Implementing any of these things suggested required a lot of time and coding, not to mention balancing. Sorry, but I don't see them as 'easy'.

3. The Blueprint system worked fine, I've never heard anybody complain about it. There were much more pressing concerns to take care about.

4. I don't understand at all what are you suggesting here. The Avatar system was one of the more useless features for me anyway.

5. Yes, they regularly patched the game. As for fixes for the MAJOR issues, they were the hardest to fix, obviously, and thus AGAIN they didn't have enough time to fix them.

 

6. No, there were no events. Point for you here.

7. Well, it depends on what you call 'contact' and 'regularly'. As for the first, they always answered tickets submited to them. I don't know if you expect them to send regularly messages to random subscribers, only to appear to be making 

'contact'

As for 'regularly', they did appear in the forums once and a while. I don't follow other forums than Simtropolis, so I can't tell about them, but they usually answered the more pressing and relevant questions. That being said, they weren't keeping such a good communication about the future of the game as I would have liked. But again, the community tends to be a little paranoid.  

8. I haven't seen any 'cheaters' in the game. There were people exploiting the system, but I haven't seen cheaters. They deleted some unused cities in december, I remember that very well (there was a sudden drop then). We can't really know if they really deleted all trial cities, or only some of them. And, there was simply no time to delete the cities that were created from PO subscribers - they were supposd to be kept for 6 months, and PO is not even 5 months old.   

Again most of the above issues can be explained with the lack of personnel and money. I don't see why any company trying a new product would waste an opportunity to make it work, unless the attempt was too great for them. Especially if you're comparing to companies like EA and Blizzard. Consider:

- Advertising in any way costs money. You can always advertise cheaper, but that's not necessarily gonna produce the same effect. 

- Fixing things and creating new content involves programing. They have a limited number of programers that can only do so much work - either fixing stuff, or creating new content. We got new content , as well as fixes, although obvioulsy not at the rate you expected. 

- Implementing new features involves even more programing, as well as many hours of testing. Again, not enough people to do all that at the same time.  

Feel free to prove me wrong, though.

[Soviet779 1]

Awesome! About time they killed off that abomination of an "MMO". I hope they listen to what people want this time with cities XL 2011 instead of going for the pot o gold that is a successful MMO.

[DJ1 0]

Originally posted by: soltangris

Really, you guys "tried everything"?

Did you try any of the ideas about how to make the P.O. work that were talked about on the old forums for two years before release?

[morriswalters 16]

Soltangris I salute your dedication however I fear you may be flogging a dead horse.  Bountytaker and others who have shared his feelings on this issue have been vindicated, the market has spoken.  They may find that cold consolation as they look forward though.  What ever anyone thinks of CXL, to my knowledge they are the only commercial development house that attempted to move this genre forward.  It's easy to speculate why they did what they did, but it's pointless.  The only people who know aren't talking.

An interesting thing to think about, is to look at the possibilities going forward, in relation to what has already been done.  I see no clear path forward for SC4.  It's easy to argue that it's near a point where it's has become so complex that it's hard to see what could be done to take it to the next level.  There are certainly things that could be improved, graphics, including roads and buildings.  Improvement to the base simulation. traffic, routing, ect.  But none of these things bring any significant differentiation of the existing game.  CXL certainly had a superior presentation graphically, but it pointed out some of the limitations of the 3D game world.  To make the game available to the greatest range of hardware the developers had to except limitations of what they could do.  I suppose you could develop to 8 core processors and systems with dual graphics boards but you will price city builder players out of the market.

I certainly have my ideas about what could be done, however my point doesn't lie there.  It's this, if you believe that CXL 2011 will be the future, I believe you are going to be disappointed.  Considering what it took moneywise to get to this point, I can't see any major development.. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I don't think so.  Open source is one possibility, but there is no rally point.  Existing projects all started out as a one man project and went from there.  Again to my knowledge none started from scratch.  My belief is that if there is a community that is as passionate about city builders as people keep saying there are, then they better pull their heads out of wherever they are stuck and start thinking about this.

Reese

[roberto_valverde 0]

Hello every one,

I'm looking foward to the new version of cities XL and I hope this time they make a spanish translation version too. I had to buy my cities XL from England last time.

[biglower 0]

That's good news for solo fans. After giving up Cities XL last october like a lot of people who had followed the game development for 2 years like me, i now think that i'll get CXL 2011.

Thanks MC, we told you but you had to do the mistake by yourself, like a child learning. You took the chance, you lost. No hard feelings, now let's restart on good basis.

 City builder genre, i'm back ! 

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

roberto,

cities xl 2011 will be downloadable on their website, so you will not have to buy it from england again.  i dont know about the languages though...

[edcase2k4-thugangel1983 1]

wow..... just wow.

the PO has been pulled?

the game is being "made-over" into Cities 2011?

CXL (current form) will no longer be updated with any things they said (leading up to and after release) were in the pipeline?

this is so funny in a sad sort of way.... my change from having the biggest interest in CXL of almost anyone to having almost no interest whatsoever in the game's progress a while after its release means that i've missed all this.

it's not shocking though really is it. it's predictably funny, in a terrible messed up way to which i almost don't even know how to react anymore as my indifference about this game has been pretty deep-set now for many months.

i only checked in on the CXL forum here (and on the CXL website once in a blue moon) for a vague curiosity in what's going on with it right now. i did like a look of those historic european buildings (medieval and tudor styles, etc.), but whatever... right now i don't even have the time for SC4 anyway. in all honesty, city-builders are an extremely time-consuming genre of game for players who love the attention to detail when creating things and nabbing new content to improve upon it. it's almost takes over your life and i just can't fit that in with my lifestyle with present conditions that are likely to remain for the forseeable future.

the only games i really can play right now are ones you can pick up and put down over short periods of time, without prolonged commitment - instead just returning to them now and then inbetween other things in life.

i tell you what though. i'd love a new CXL official forum to go up (or Cities 2011). i mean, it probably won't happen - for the same reasons MC closed the previous forums at the end. but even though i don't think there's anything much new i could say - it would be nice to visit there and see some of the old faces... er, i mean fonts?!

[ScaryMonkey 0]

edcase- We're trying to get a similar discussion underway at Metropolis, if you're interested;  In fact, one of our members just let me know he has a cached copy of a lot of posts from the CU boards... I'm hoping we can figure out a way for people to access it without running into any copyright issues.

[bixel 1,224]

In some ways this could turn to be a good thing.. especially if they unlock LOT sizes so I can make content easier.. once that modding community starts going green light I suspect CXL sales to climb - I've been pretty piss poor latey so I haven't been able to get my copy yet..

Here's an idea for MC - enable Dedicated Server sites. Let the community host like they do with Counter Strike etc...

[DazzaDazza 29]

And the party of ex CXL.com people begins, or should I say CU.com.

[Bountytaker 0]

Not exactly a list of original proofs/facts, but better than anyone else has offered, so credit to you.

Originally posted by: soltangris

Is this the list you're talking about, Bountytaker? Let me see:

1. Two years before release.... I was under the impression that the PO idea didn't even exist at that time, but never mind (maybe I'm mistaken). As for: creating competition - they didn't have time to do that in 4 months. Creating cooperation - well, that was there all the time - via trading you could always cooperate. Limiting resources - 4 of the resources are map-dependend, i.e. limited. Limiting citizens...... ?????????????quote>

Well, technically, the P.O. existed from day one, as did the S.P.  They weren't announced at the same time, but they were developed simulatneously.

And, pre-announcement, there actually WAS discussion about how a mmo city building game would work.  Quite a bit actually.  (Brag:  My first thread was titled "Will this be an mmo?").  Most were against it, of course, and didn't believe it could work (prescient folks), but there were plenty who wrote ideas/designs/theories on what could/couldn't work.  There were polls on it too.  Even posts about how to make custom content work for single player while protecting multiplayer.  The discussion, and ideas, where there from very early on, and only increased after the announcement.  None of that stuff, as far as I can remember, was listened to.

As for creating competition...they had plenty of options.  They could have adjusted blueprints so they were rare, and not tradable between planets, making the hunt for them greater.  They could have implemented population caps (something they planned for "special planets") at the start.  For cooperation, they could have tied the bonuses/penalties to freight to a "nation" system, so that trade with your neighbors was more attractive.  Or, limited your ability to trade with your own cities, which basically makes the game single player.  Or, really made sure blueprint buildings weren't able to be built without help from other players cities.

2. Again, no time. The original system barely was fixed, and the PO ended. Implementing any of these things suggested required a lot of time and coding, not to mention balancing. Sorry, but I don't see them as 'easy'. quote>

Just as an example of how "easy" some of those were.  In beta, a bug appeared with a patch that caused "island" maps to appear in the middle of landmasses.  Basically, you clicked in the dead center of a continent not unlike asia, and got a map for Hawaii!!?!?!!?  Players pointed it out, and by the next day or so, all he maps had been moved outside of the continents into the water, and other maps replaced them.

Yes, in about two days, the devs moved maps.  Easily, and simply.  The request was to do the same with other maps to make a more realistic, and nation-like feel to the landmasses.  No go.

Or, how about the request to make the day/night cycle default to ON...so that mmo players actually saw time "moving" in the game, instead of assuming that it was perpetual day.

Or, the player request to have three or four types of agriculture tokens...to match the three or four types of farms already in the game..instead of treating them as all one type.  The work was half done in that one.

Minor stuff?  Yeah.  Adds to the mmo feel of the game?  A little.  Tried by MC?  No.

3. The Blueprint system worked fine, I've never heard anybody complain about it. There were much more pressing concerns to take care about. quote>

The blueprint system did not work fine.  It did not do what it was made to do...provide increased gameplay for P.O. subscribers.  There was a very LONG thread, in beta, describing the issues with blueprints.  Things like the lack of use they got after two weeks.  The trade issues with them.  The ability to build them with no help at higher levels.  The lack of interesting bonuses they offered.  Good, strong list.

I'll even give an example from personal experience.  Nearer the end of the beta, I demolished a city to start over with a new patch.  I name the new city, but do nothing to it, waiting instead for the new patch the next day.  Two days later, I load up my ZERO CITiZEN city, and what do I find?  Three megastructure blueprints!?!?!?  For what?  I have done NOTHING to earn them, no needs yet for them, and have NO MEANS of  building them.  But, there they are...along with the dozens of spammed requests to trade for them (some from other "planets"). 

I put that example in the thread, and, you know what, MC responded.  Said it didn't make sense, might be a bug (later found out it wasn't), and, lo and behold, they actually SHUT OFF the blueprint system two weeks or more before "launch" for retooling.  And, with held it for a month after launch for "retooling".

Then released the SAME EXACT SYSTEM.  The system that, after two weeks or so past launch, lost its lustre.  Just like in beta.

[knightrider 0]

I was a beta tester, and I hated the direction the game was taking so much that I never really looked back after the beta ended. When I got this notification in my email, I jumped out of my chair and laughed out loud.

So now they will attempt a single player game again. Except this time, they won't have the support of the vast majority of this community. Maybe they will turn it around and make it a decent game, but based on what I've seen of MC so far, I don't bet on it. Plus, I feel like giving them any money would be rewarding bad decisions. I can't have that on my conscience, you know? ; )