Putin threaten's to aim Missles at Europe

[BurroDiablo 222]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/6719507.stm

Ah... you can take Russia out the Cold war, but you can't take the Cold War out of Russia. He's being a little over paranoid but I do belive the US' interests should lie WITHIN its own borders, not in poorer, Eastern European Governments who will do anything for an extra bit of cash.

Anywho... discuss... think this will lead to anything?

[coolotter88 2]

I read slashdot too.

yes, well, on with the discussion

Putin is an idiot...yeah, that's about it.

the missile defense is only really built for anything fired from the tehran area (in other words, IRAN)

[Pixelrage 34]

In a way, I can't say I disagree with Putin, although it's unfortunate that Europe is getting dragged into this. The US has completely surrounded Russia with missile sites for whatever its true purpose is, there was a map of it on BBC's site. Needless to say, I'd be nervous about it if I were him. Especially since the US Gov't is so wreckless and unpredictable...I just hope the next election brings something better than this (since it can't possibly get worse).

[Goldfish4209 9]

Title should read Bush threatens to aim missles all over the place.

Seriously, don't you think that it would make Russia nervous with where you're placing your system, regardless of your real intent? Set it up in Iraq. Then you don't need to waste money on long distance missiles. Just fire them next door.

EDIT: Of course nato condemns it. What about all the nukes the US has aimed at russia and everyone else?

[Micah 16]

I think there are two views here that need to be presented:

1) America didn't like it when the Soviet Union was going to put nuclear missiles in Cuba, so why should Russia like America puting missiles next to them?

2) America is going to put the missiles there not because they want to put missiles throughout the world but because the Eastern Europeans requested them because of the Russian threat.

My take: I can understand both sides of the arguement. But, either way, this Putin guy worries me and he definitely worries the Eastern Europeans. Not Bush (in my opinion), but Putin is provoking the next Cold War. It wasn't America, but Russia who has developed a new ballistic missile. Now, why in the world would Russia do that? All I'm saying is that we need to keep a closer eye on Russia. I have a feeling Russia will make an alliance with Iran. Just wait...

[BurroDiablo 222]

I agree Goldfish... America is on the Defensive, why can't Russia be on the defensive too? Putin said 'New Targets in Europe'... he obviously meant the 'Missile Defense' stations and not Major Cities. Russia obviously still see's America as a threat even though the Cold War is pretty much over.

Whats strange to me is this-

I've marked Iran and North Korea in red... now look, both Iran and NK's firing lines are thousands of miles from the actual Missile Defence sites, if they COULD hit America they could hit pretty much anywhere on the East Coast without hinderance! If America wants to protect its self, it needs to forget about Europe and focus on the East coast because thats the real 'Hole in the Defence's'

Just seems like a reason to Pen Russia in if you ask me... I can see an Age of Paranoia unrivaled to the Cold War coming into play...

[ilikehotdogsalot 311]

just get rid of the missiles, they only do bad things

[Filasimo 1]

You got a very good point Micah but if you ask me Id not only would worry about Putin but also worry about Bush as well.....

[BurroDiablo 222]

Originally posted by: ilikehotdogsalot just get rid of the missiles, they only do bad things quote>

Its the only thing holding back another World War in my oppinion... its only a stalemate untill somebody flips the board out of frustration

[Amerikaner 42]

To say putin is retarded is probably the most retared remark yet, the man himself is a genius, hes literaly brought back Communist russia under the eyes of America, because he owns the largest oil company in the country, he is able to black mail his citizens by the vote for me, ill give you oil( or gas dont remember), dont vote for me, you'll get none. with this he is able to get votes over and over agian even if the people dont belive in what is going on

this in turn has FREAKED OUT eastern european countries, afriad that russians will do anything to have there heat in the cheapest form ( its the oil or gas not sure which that is so important because its cheaper than coal) so they are have brought the US over there side, this in turn has FREAKED out russia, like it freaked us out when they brought weapons to cuba, the problem though is that most of europe also depends on Putins company for heat, so quite frankly he has taken control of areas that arent even in russia, because there to afriad to fight back, and get the pipelines cut off

just my 2c

[BurroDiablo 222]

Gas is cheaper than Oil I think. I lived in a house with old Oil fired heaters in it and they cost a fortune to keep running.

The Czech Republic has nothing gain out of this endevour apart from maybe a little money... but what more important, money or keeping the Russian's happy? I guess you'd need to be Czech to answer that question correctly... lol.

[Amerikaner 42]

yeah im pretty sure its gas

[Micah 16]

I wish some Russians would post their views about this event. I'm always welcome to opposing viewpoints!

[A Nonny Moose 8,263]

Here we go again.  A new king of the hill game.  When will the world get tired of all this?

Bush and Putin should be forced to watch consecutive screenings of Seven Days in May and Dr. Strangelove for a month chained together.

[Yoman3 5]

Originally posted by: ilikehotdogsalot just get rid of the missiles, they only do bad things quote>

I disagree, while the use of them would just totally suck, their strategic value in my eyes has kept the superpowers from going at each other's throats for the past 60 years. A missile shield would take away that strategic value leaving the playing field open for overly ambitious people with power.

But what really scares me about this topic is its strikingly similar to the storyline in the game Tom Clancy's Endwar, which predicts another WWIII around 2020. Read up on the storyline and you'll find yourself shocked at how similar this is to it.

[DanWalker8 3]

from what i gather, a cold war is not a pleasurable experience. I think it will be avoided.

[Viscount 0]

Some annotation has to be made with regard to the energy market:

Well, under common circumstances (i.e. if the market would determine the price, without political influence) gas would indeed be cheaper than oil, but due to the fact that (at least here in Western Europe) the price customers have to pay for gas is closely tied to the oil price level (this is called "Oelpreisbindung" here in Germany), Russian gas producers are able to realise huge profit margins resulting from this price difference.

But what's really alarming is how Russia draws the trumps:

The Russians have learnt their lesson from the downfall of Communism; they shall not again be inept enough to think that their force of arms will pave the way back to a super power, they came to understand (with some delay, admittedly) that economic means are much more powerful to achieve this goal.

Remember: The end does NOT justify the means, but the means tell the truth about the end!

[Silur 3,309]

I'm from Russia and I think - this is some game before elections in Russia ...

Our Boss must collect all "patriot's" and communist's votes for him or his successor ...

Crazy history with Estonia some weeks ago - and now with East Europe - no new ...

Our High commanders strongly worry for the their armchairs and their gas and oil money now ...

This is no finish .....  - waiting more .....

[Uumke 0]

I hate Bush so much!

He's pretetending that freedom is a big value, because the US were once a colonial area, under pressure of the UK, France etc.

We may never forget all the victims of the 2nd world war, but Bush is now doing idiot.

The state dept is growing, he's making war everywhere that seems to turn out like nothing; he's waisting money.

I'm already angry that the Netherlands are spending

[JanYpe 17]

Big yawn. That ex-KGB thug can beat his chest all he want. Fact of the matter is that the Bear has lost its claws. What's he going to shoot with, those ICBM's that have been 'maintained' by underfed, underpaid conscripts for the past 15 years? His only real trump cards are Russia's oil and natural gas resources.

I'm from Russia and I think - this is some game before elections in Russia ...

Our Boss must collect all "patriot's" and communist's votes for him or his successor ...quote>

But...but Putin told us he wouldn't pass a law to allow him a third term. He wouldn't lie, right? Right?. I think it was just priceless that he described himself as the only real democratic leader in the world a few days ago. What a joke. Putin needs to worry more about keeping his country running, and less about trying to restore its image as a superpower.

1) America didn't like it when the Soviet Union was going to put nuclear missiles in Cuba, so why should Russia like America puting missiles next to them? quote>

Am I the only spotting a slight difference between "defensive system" and "city killing medium range ballistic missiles"? Gosh, I know it seems like nitpicking about semantics but I do think we should keep the difference in mind.

Oh, congratulations on turning this into a Bush-fest, Goldfish. On the fourth post no less. I'll sit back and wait for someone to Godwin this thread.

[getdown11 0]

I don't understand why the Russian have their panties all in a wad. Today Bush even invited Russian generals and scientist to come look at the system? Seriously does anyone actually believe the US and Europe would actually try to invade Russia?

Lets not forget that the Cold War arms race was what eventually bankrupt Russia in the first place. I have serious doubts that they would really want to travel down that road again.

I think this is just Putin trying to keep Russia relevant in todays geopolitical climate.

[bearmans 0]

So once again its another possible conflict brought about by oil! My personal viewpoint is America should keep its missiles within its own country. In the Cuban missile crisis America came within a few minutes of launching their missiles on Russia. Is it really surprising that Russian are making threats should America place missiles on their borders? As for the talk of possible missiles coming from Iran or North Korea:

a) There is no evidence to suggest Iran has nuclear weapons yet

b) North Korea may have a primative weapon but lacks the ability to launch it especially for delivery in the USA by an ICMB say.

c) Even if Iran or North Korea launched a weapon at America the amount of military hardware and warheads the USA they could easily annihilate either or both of the countries so it would make little sense for them to do so.

What is more likely is that, should either of these countries wish to hit the USA, they will do so covertly perhapes by a suitcase bomb or similar. The only serious threat for nuclear attack comes from Russia and China and a threat from Russia is unlikely unless it is antagonised as in this case. If we don't put missiles on their borders they have no reason to show aggression towards us. Everyone knows that the only reason one country won't launch against another is the threat of retaliation. If one country launches then so does everyone else so nuclear weapons play an important part in the prevention of nuclear war however this antaganism is making the situation far worse. We should enjoy a comfortable and safe planet without the risk of leaders egos and the wish to show power and might to the world.

[LivingInThePast 364]

I think Putin's henchmen killed Alexander Litvinenko, the reporter lady who hated Putin, and Boris Yeltsin.

[Silur 3,309]

Hi, LivingInThePast ...

My mind about Eltsin - don't worry - this is real death, because this is true ...

I don't know about Litvinenko and Politkovskaja death - MI6 and FBI may be show us about this ....

KGB never more ...

And about our Boss - my mind - this is like GOBLIN before election and they must all power in their hands ....

[Barbarossa 51]

If I remember correctly, all US attempts at a missile defense system has irked the Russians (think Star Wars and Reagan), so this isn't really anything new. I suspect it is just another p*ssing contest. But I guess we will just have to see who drank more beer.

On another note, people should not compare this issue with the Cuban Missile Crisis. They are completely different. Defense vs offense.

While I think it is over-reactive, I do believe this defense system is an elbow-jerk reaction by the more skittish fundies running American government. Paranoid politics at its best. Of course, I do not know anything about extraneous factors.

Barbarossa

[Pixelrage 34]

The part that scares me the most is that the Bush administration is pushing for democracy in Russia (and Iran, and North Korea). Here we go again.

[crazyyaya 4]

And Cold War II: Russian Revenge begins

This is what happens when you put a man with no real military experience in change of the U.S

And you put a former Soviet KGB agent in change of another world power.