Struggling to increase Industrial demand in city

[MasterSim 24]

I had one city that I was going to make the industrial hub next to the water, with functional seaports. I’m having a hard time getting any industrial demand though.

In the beginning of the game I started with some dirty industry to get the game going, but afterwards I’m not getting any. I have my sims educated and on mid residential too, even with this I am not even getting anymore manufacturing or hi-tech either. I have two neighboring cities connected with low and mid residential sims hoping to bring in industrial cap, but nada.

I am trying to get the neighboring cuties to just be residential and commercial focuses, like the Rob’s red hot spot regional play tutorial. Those cities are demanding industry, but I am not giving them any. I thought their demand for industry would move over to the main city I was going to make the industry hub, but that’s not working.

Does anyone know what I can do about it? I can provide pictures or more information too.

Thanks!

[CorinaMarie 29,856]

2 hours ago, MasterSim said:

I thought their demand for industry would move over to the main city I was going to make the industry hub, but that’s not working.

Are the city tiles with the residential connected via some sort of transportation network to the one where you want to grow the industrial?

 

2 hours ago, MasterSim said:

I can provide pictures or more information too.

Pics are always helpful.

[MasterSim 24]

1 hour ago, CorinaMarie said:

Are the city tiles with the residential connected via some sort of transportation network to the one where you want to grow the industrial?

 

Pics are always helpful.

I have connected the adjacent cities with roads, avenues, and even rails.

I added some pictures to show my cities here: https://imgur.com/a/zachGVu

Hopefully, this helps! 

[CorinaMarie 29,856]

Looks good in the pics.

Ok, how about zipping up you region and I can see if that helps me with troubleshooting? You can use the free option at WeTransfer.Com if it's too large to attach to your post here. No need for your plugins as this'll be a preliminary investigation.

[MasterSim 24]

Thank you so much for looking into this! I attached the zipped file of my region: https://we.tl/t-kAEjvR3jip

Let me know if that works.

[CorinaMarie 29,856]

Got it. Turns out I'll need to know which functional Seaport you are using since Smog Town crashes when loading. The other two load with noted plugins missing (as expected).

[MasterSim 24]

33 minutes ago, CorinaMarie said:

Got it. Turns out I'll need to know which functional Seaport you are using since Smog Town crashes when loading. The other two load with noted plugins missing (as expected).

Ahh I see, so the functional seaports that I used were  https://www.sc4devotion.com/csxlex/lex_filedesc.php?lotGET=1663

[CorinaMarie 29,856]

I've used selective taxes to discourage R$$ and R$$$ somewhat (10.6% and 10.3% respectively) then grew a bunch of R$ Sims and tossed in a Large Elementary School.

Here's the demands now:

 

The EQ drop was significant from the influx of new Sims, but it's back to 88 atm:

 

So, I'm going to conclude there is no inherent problem and you simply need more Sims to push the industrial demand. NKO is, ofc, highly recommended so you need not see all your R$ Sims chased out of town.

[MasterSim 24]

Thank you so much for checking into this!  I really appreciate it! 

So all I had to do was just keep getting more R$ sims in? I did add more R$ sims right next to the industrial allotted area, thinking it would be the main workforce, but that didn't work out either. Also, do sims need an elementary education to require a Dirty Industry demand?

Would you be able to tell me what MOD you use, to get all that information from the town hall? That looks very useful! 

16 minutes ago, CorinaMarie said:

NKO

What does this mean btw?

[Cyclone Boom 17,031]

While @CorinaMarie answers your city specific questions (Cori tells me she's composing her reply now), I'll just say about the other two things...

 

21 minutes ago, MasterSim said:

Would you be able to tell me what MOD you use, to get all that information from the town hall? That looks very useful!

This is from our City Hall Package as made for ModPacc Zero (which is a prospective set of core fixes and files we hope to release someday).

See this topic for more info about the info panel and City Hall improvements:

 

21 minutes ago, MasterSim said:

38 minutes ago, CorinaMarie said:

NKO

What does this mean btw?

NKO = No KickOut (Lower Wealth)

In summary it's a mod which toggles a developer simulator property, for preventing lower wealth Sims from being replaced with higher wealth levels. This way one can have R$ within a city for longer, and then if worthwhile selected areas can be bulldozed and redeveloped. It provides finer control over how development takes place.

The following topic goes into detail about NKO and the benefits it brings:

 

[CorinaMarie 29,856]

1 hour ago, MasterSim said:

So all I had to do was just keep getting more R$ sims in?

Yes, prolly.

To be more specific about what I did was first loaded Jitney Junction, tweaked things because of the mods I use (like needing more power and water since I use the Industry Doubler), ran some time to be sure it was stable, saved that, then loaded Pleasantville and did the same. Each time saving a city tile it propagates the current city info to any others adjacent which are connected by a transportation network and that includes via natural rivers and lakes. This ensured that Smog Town knew all about the other two city tiles for their population and education levels.

Next I loaded Smog Town, tweaked for power and water, adjusted taxes to thwart R$$ and R$$$ Sims, and then grew the extra R$ Sims. You should be able to do the same for growing more of them and see the industrial demands go up. The key part is all buildings with jobs have a percentage needed for each wealth and education level (tho there is some doubt if the individual Sim's EQ actually matters for them taking a job). Overall you'll need something like 50 to 80% R$ to keep those employers extra happy.

As overall EQ increases, that is a deterrent to Dirty Industrial demand. This can be countered tho via propagation. If you have enough lower educated Sims throughout you region (and said data is propagated) then the local EQ driven demand will be adjusted by those regional forces. So, the benefit here is you need not have the 50 to 80% RS throughout your region, but just a large batch somewhere which the current city knows about.

 

1 hour ago, MasterSim said:

Also, do sims need an elementary education to require a Dirty Industry demand?

No. They can be dumber than a box of rocks at zero EQ and their mere presence (in quantity) will drive dirty industrial demand. Manufacturing needs around 80 EQ and High Tech needs around 160 minimum. This is pro-rated by the number of Sims with said education. (Like you could have only a dozen Sims at 200 EQ and that still would do very little to encourage IHT.)

The info about population at each EQ threshold is also propagated from other connected city tiles. This can be chained throughout your region, but each city tile needs opened and saved in sequence for it to get updated to the city tiles at the end of the chain. Think of it like a relay race passing the baton. If you are curious about propagation details, I made a post for that long ago which CB can dig up.

One thing about taxes (which goes against 99% of what you'll prolly read elsewhere) is that when you wish to discourage a type and wealth from growing, it's best to incrementally increase their tax rate while running time until you see them just slip slightly to negative. Setting their taxes to 20% will indeed discourage them, but it has other subtle repercussions especially if it's residential or commercial. For industry, it's mostly manufacturing and high tech where it's bad to way over tax. Dirty and Ag are more resilient. 

[MasterSim 24]

@CorinaMarie & @Cyclone Boom I really appreciate your help!

Not going to lie, but this was a lot more information than I ever expected haha. Like I took a college-level class in SimCity 4 city building! I love it!

I will try to have more R$ to get my dirty industry up and then eventually get the requirement for Manufacturing and Hi-Tech as well. I will keep switching between the other tiles too constantly to keep them all updated. 

Again I really appreciate you taking your time to help me out with this issue. I recently got back into SimCity 4 and I am going hard, so all this information really helps! 

One last question though: Do you recommend using the Industry Doubler mod and the similar mods for commercial and residential?

Thanks! 

[CorinaMarie 29,856]

35 minutes ago, MasterSim said:

Do you recommend using the Industry Doubler mod and the similar mods for commercial and residential?

I was skeptical of the Industry Doubler at first, but as I really got into region play and larger populations I felt the existing industry took up way more room than seemed right to me so I got the doubler and haven't looked back since. Now with my farm region in the 3 million pop range, I'm likely to consider the 4x version. Ofc, this also means that industrial demand happens slower because each grown building will eat up more of it. That's no problem as long as you take things slow while you learn the ropes. Keep things in balance and it'll feel natural.

I'm guessing you are using the IRM from the way some existing industrial growth had textures overhanging the roads since I don't have the same plugins. If that's correct, then the Doubler might cause trouble with all of that careful plugin setup.

The only reason to use the Doubler is if you want your industry to take up less space within the city.

[MasterSim 24]

59 minutes ago, CorinaMarie said:

I'm guessing you are using the IRM

I am actually. I will give the Doubler a try and see how it all works out!

Thanks again for all the help! 

[CorinaMarie 29,856]

13 hours ago, MasterSim said:

I am actually. I will give the Doubler a try and see how it all works out!

Yikes! I mean since you are using IRM, the Doubler might interfere. Do be careful if testing that way. (I'd personally skip the doubler in this case.)

[rsc204 21,857]

One important thing to note is that the base IRM mod only contains LotConfig Exemplars, not the Buildings Exemplars which are where the capacities are contained. This means that IRM will work automatically with any override of the Maxis Buildings Exemplars for Industrial, in other words exactly how the doubler and quadrupler mods work. For the addons, since these don't override the Maxis Lots, the option exists to install either a regular set or one compatible with the Quadrupler mod, or 4x the number of jobs. But none exist for the doubler, although you can use the 4x ones just fine.

I used the doubler mod (with IRM) for years because I felt early on Ind just needed too much space and had too few jobs. I changed to the quadrupler mod maybe 18 months ago and I wish I had done it sooner, in conjunction with IRM I personally find it a great balance for the amount of my region that is then taken up by industrial.