SC4 and MacOS Sierra / High Sierra

[pgxpgx 398]

Hello,

I'm on the way to upgrade my Mac from a Macbook Pro (Maverick) to an Imac 21,5 (Sierra or High Sierra). Before doing an expensive mistake, I have a very simple question:

Is SC4 running properly under MacOS Sierra or High Sierra ? Please no speculations or advise to run it with some Windows emulator, I'd like to get a feedback from gamers owning a Mac with Sierra or High Sierra and playing SC4 on it. Thank you for your answers.

[CorinaMarie 29,894]

I shan't speculate since I'm not a Mac user, however, there might be something of interest in this thread: Apple Phasing Out Support for 32-bit Applications in 2018; SC4, SC2013 Likely Affected

[pgxpgx 398]

3 minutes ago, CorinaMarie said:

I shan't speculate since I'm not a Mac user, however, there might be something of interest in this thread: Apple Phasing Out Support for 32-bit Applications in 2018; SC4, SC2013 Likely Affected

Thank you for the link. I was aware of that, and that's exactly the point for me: if I have to change from my current Macbook to a new Imac, I have to do it NOW, because for a few weeks I still have a chance to buy somewhere an Imac with Sierra or High Sierra installed (32 bits), next year it will be Mojave (64 bits) everywhere and SC4 will not work on it ! Most of tech shops in France are already selling Apple computers with Mojave installed. I hope some Mac users will post a specific answer, because I have to decide quick.

[CorinaMarie 29,894]

1 minute ago, pgxpgx said:

I hope some Mac users will post a specific answer, because I have to decide quick.

I hope so too. But fair warning, we have very few Mac user members and it's hit or miss when they might pop in.

Here's hoping for the best. Good luck.

[rsc204 21,866]

When I listen to your arguments, I have to say I am a little confused. You refer to buying a Mac that won't play SC4 as "an expensive mistake", so the question here really is, why do you want to upgrade at all? Because if your other usage of the computer doesn't justify the upgrade, what's wrong with sticking with your current machine? Likewise, if your other usage or a problem forces you to move on to a new computer, you'll just have to bite the bullet and hope things work out.

I can categorically tell you SC4 works on Sierra / High Sierra, because a brief look around these forums and the NAM support forums, will show you plenty of users who've done just that. Incidentally, many of those same users have huge problems installing NAM, because changes in those Mac OS versions required modifications to our Mac installer that we simply were not able to make.

When I buy a Stereo, I expect to be able to bring some of my Music to the store and see how it sounds on various equipment. Because in a similar vein, one wants to be sure before you buy expensive hardware, it meets your needs. Surely, given the prices of Mac's, it couldn't be totally impossible to get a store to let you double-check this before purchase? Otherwise, find a store which will allow you to return the goods within a reasonable period. If you are in Europe, the Distance Selling Directive is your friend. It gives you the right, within 7 days of delivery, to return anything, without needing a reason, that was purchased indirectly (i.e. online/mail order etc.). Literally, the retailer would be in breach of European law in refusing a refund you, even if you opened and used the item.

Quote

Article 6

Right of withdrawal

1. For any distance contract the consumer shall have a period of at least seven working days in which to withdraw from the contract without penalty and without giving any reason. The only charge that may be made to the consumer because of the exercise of his right of withdrawal is the direct cost of returning the goods.

The period for exercise of this right shall begin:

- in the case of goods, from the day of receipt by the consumer where the obligations laid down in Article 5 have been fulfilled

See here for full details.

So, whilst I'm as sure as can be it will work, there are options to ensure you don't waste your money should it not.

[pgxpgx 398]

2 minutes ago, rsc204 said:

When I listen to your arguments, I have to say I am a little confused. You refer to buying a Mac that won't play SC4 as "an expensive mistake", so the question here really is, why do you want to upgrade at all? Because if your other usage of the computer doesn't justify the upgrade, what's wrong with sticking with your current machine? Likewise, if your other usage or a problem forces you to move on to a new computer, you'll just have to bite the bullet and hope things work out.

I can categorically tell you SC4 works on Sierra / High Sierra, because a brief look around these forums and the NAM support forums, will show you plenty of users who've done just that. Incidentally, many of those same users have huge problems installing NAM, because changes in those Mac OS versions required modifications to our Mac installer that we simply were not able to make.

When I buy a Stereo, I expect to be able to bring some of my Music to the store and see how it sounds on various equipment. Because in a similar vein, one wants to be sure before you buy expensive hardware, it meets your needs. Surely, given the prices of Mac's, it couldn't be totally impossible to get a store to let you double-check this before purchase? Otherwise, find a store which will allow you to return the goods within a reasonable period. If you are in Europe, the Distance Selling Directive is your friend. It gives you the right, within 7 days of delivery, to return anything for any reason bought from the internet or via mail order. Literally, the retailing would be breaking the law in refusing to refund you, even if you opened and used the item.

See here for full details.

So, whilst I'm as sure as can be it will work, there are options to ensure you don't waste your money.

Thank you for your answer.

The reason why I want to change ? Well, playing SC4 on a 13" screen, wearing glasses, is not really what you can called "comfortable" ! 21.5" will be much better for my eyes. That's the main reason.

I know SC4 is going fine with Sierra, but I've seen there might be issues with High Sierra (someone is reporting grahic problems). Unfortunately, I can get an Imac wih High Sierra installed, but I can't get some with just Sierra (I'm talking about new products, not used ones). For the NAM, no problem, I will keep my Macbook, if needed I can install the NAM on it, then move the plugins folder to the Imac. The true concern for me is that I want to be sure that SC4 is OK with High Sierra. Trying in the shop before buying or sending back the product in case of problem is more theorical than practical, most shops now are "cash and carry" type, and by experience sending back a product is always a bit complicate (law is one thing,  reality is another), and I'm at a point in my life where as soon as things are turning even a bit complicate, I run away! Age effect, probably ;-)

 

[rsc204 21,866]

Well perhaps it may be worth considering buying an external monitor, allowing you to have a bigger screen for use with your existing machine?

14 hours ago, pgxpgx said:

Trying in the shop before buying or sending back the product in case of problem is more theorical than practical

It doesn't have to be, I've yet to meet the salesperson who won't quickly back down when you are about to walk out of the shop. Especially for high-end products when it's very clear you have the money and want the product. Ultimately, you are in control of such a situation, you don't even need to be that pushy about it.

As for the internet, it's absolutely your right, no sane retailer would make that hard. Amazon's customer service is excellent, I can't imagine you'd have problems returning one to them. In the UK, I know shops that you can return anything and they never question it. If you have a chain like that, again that's a good solution here.

[Tarkus 6,933]

Regarding macOS Mojave (10.14), Apple apparently caved in and decided to let the 32-bit support remain for now, albeit with a warning message that pops up every time a 32-bit app is started (similar to the behavior in macOS High Sierra after an update sometime earlier this year).  The plan now, apparently, is to bar 32-bit applications completely by Fall 2019, which is apparently the planned timeline for Mojave's successor.  Aspyr announced in February that they are looking at updating at least some of their 32-bit ports to 64-bit, focusing on the "more popular" ones--provided, of course, that the process of doing so is itself feasible--but it's unknown if SimCity 4 will be among those.

It's also worth noting that 99% of all of the questions I receive over at ModDB on the NAM download page are from High Sierra users who can't get the mod to install.  As no one on the NAM Team has access to a High Sierra machine at present, we're completely unable to provide technical support.

-Tarkus

[Rpbaileysr 10]

I have a 2010 MacBook I'm currently stuck with using. I got SC4 RH from the app store and I installed NAM 36. It's running just fine for me. I was just watching some Tarkus vids on u-tube showing the use of FTL. The icon box with the red ftl label on the vids, am I supposed to have that? Because I don't. Also when you drag the road it shows a large dot at the ends, don't got that either. Is it not out yet or am I missing something. HUMMMM!

Forgot to say I'm running High Sierra 10.13.6

  Edited June 26, 2019 by Rpbaileysr  

[rsc204 21,866]

8 hours ago, Rpbaileysr said:

The icon box with the red ftl label on the vids, am I supposed to have that?

Only if you chose to install it when installing NAM, but it was released in v.36. If you re-run the installer, choosing the custom install option, you can select to install the FTLs.

8 hours ago, Rpbaileysr said:

Also when you drag the road it shows a large dot at the ends, don't got that either.

Generally speaking by default roads just end with a stub, but there is an option to have cull-de-sacs instead. 

If that's not what you mean, perhaps you could clarify, ideally with a picture, what large dot you are referring too?

[Rpbaileysr 10]

Watch the video, see the circle on the end of the road, I don't have that, but I can make cul-de-sacs but they are tilted one side or the other. I do now have 2 icons in the road list that have black letters on red background, they are "FTL" and "QuickTurn". When I click on either one they are empty and I only get a red curser arrow that does nothing. When I hover on the icon the description box says whats suppose to be there but like I said I get no pieces. Any ideas or do you need more info?

Robert

 

More info... I had to add "NAM_Controller.dat" to the custom download to get everything to work. Here's the install.log

install.log

Robert

[rsc204 21,866]

1 hour ago, Rpbaileysr said:

see the circle on the end of the road

I'm pretty sure that's the Cull de Sac option I mentioned previously, it's basically an optional override for those textures where roads don't continue.

1 hour ago, Rpbaileysr said:

When I click on either one they are empty and I only get a red curser arrow that does nothing.

Usually a sign you are missing the RUL required to actually make them work. You mention adding NAM_Controller.dat to the download, not being overly familiar with the installation procedure on Macs, that might be a required step. Usually however, during installation, a custom controller is built. It's this controller that contains said RUL code.

[Rpbaileysr 10]

I have INRUL Overrides , I even put it at the bottom in a folder "zzz", still nothing. The FTL.dat file is 7.2M. Something is not letting it run.

[Tarkus 6,933]

It appears the installer skipped installing a copy of the NAM Controller. In cases where the the Controller Compiler can't run (which is always the case with the Mac version), it's supposed to install a full copy of the Controller as a failsafe, but it didn't do that. 

I don't know where you obtained that "NAM_Controller.dat" file, but the NAM Team does not distribute a file under that name (the failsafe files have different names, all beginning with "NetworkAddonMod_Controller").  Most likely, this "NAM_Controller.dat" file you obtained is outdated, was pulled out of an old NAM version by a third-party, and pre-dates the addition of the FLEX Turn Lanes (and wouldn't be supported by the NAM Team). 

If the game is loading the icon for an item, but doesn't have the RUL code that allows it to operate, the result is the red arrow you've encountered.  If this is an old/non-sanctioned controller file, it's also quite likely that it doesn't support other current NAM features properly, either.

The INRUL Overrides have no impact on the FTLs, as their implementation is solely based on the three RUL files in the NAM Controller (RUL0, RUL1, and RUL2). 

Here's a proper full copy of the NAM 36 Controller.  Extract this to the main Plugins\Network Addon Mod folder, and make sure you've removed that other controller file you obtained.  If you're still getting a red arrow after installing the file I linked, then that would indicate there's another outdated controller file hiding somewhere in your Plugins.

We are ditching our current installer setup for NAM 37, and going to a cross-platform one, which should work essentially the same on Windows, macOS, and Linux, and will hopefully eliminate these sorts of issues going forward.

-Tarkus

 

[Rpbaileysr 10]

I dowloaded and installed the controller you said to put in, I removed "NetworkAddonMod_Controller.dat"(which is what it was). Tested game. Now when I click any road building icon my cursor arrow turns red until I move it then the piece appears and I can place pieces. But alas, the FTL and QuickLanes icons still stay red arrow and show no pieces even when I move arrow around. I still don't show ends of roads like in Tarkus vid. Here is screen shots of my Network Addon Mod folder. Had to do two shots to show it fully. If you need to see in any folders let me know.

Robert

[Rpbaileysr 10]

Well, I finally found my missing dat file for cul-de-sac ends on roads and streets. I put it in z__NAM road textures folder, zzzNAM_Retexture_and_Cosmetic_Mod_Culdesac_Plugin_Superhands.dat , that problen is fixed. I'm still at a loss as to why FTL and QuickTurns is not working.