Getting Started with BATs

[Mr Saturn64 742]

After the failure of Simtropolis Batting School in Spring of 2014, I am wondering how to get started on my own.  What I really mean by this is that I want to know what programs and tools to use, not really a tutorial of sorts.  I have GMax installed, so that's good to go.  I more often hear of 3dsmax, which seems to be the more prominent choice.  Hence I want to know what version to use.

 

Sorry to be a bother, and if this is in the wrong place, I guess a moderator can move it where it need be. 

[cogeo 960]

3DSmax is indeed a much more featured tool, however it's not for free, unless you happen to be a student (and I'm not sure whether this offer still holds). Gmax on the ther hand is for free, and you are going to need it anyway, to create the .SC4Model files (and then render them with 3DSmax). So I would say start with Gmax. You may find that you don't like making 3D models after all, so why get 3DSmax? The evaluation period is short (30 or 60 days, can't remember exactly) and you won't be able to make anything worthy in so little time.

[Huston 5,796]

Actually, I did manage to get 3ds Max a little over last year, and I'm pretty sure the student offer still stands. It'd be worthwhile grab since you can use it beyond the purposes of SC4, but best you try GMax first to see how BATing goes for you. Optionally, if you want a simpler building design tool, you could use Sketchup which is far more straight forward and quicker to use (for me anyway compared to GMax or 3ds Max).  Then you could import it to either program and render from there.

 

The primary reason to get 3ds Max btw, is the more obvious reason that its HQ rendering as opposed to GMax. But in comparison, it tends to lean on the more complicated since the possibilities are far more extensive (reflections, glare, sharp detail, varied materials, various texture mapping options -- stuff GMax doesn't provide). So if you're looking to persue BATing, I'd suggest you try getting the student free version which is not too hard to accquire. If you do, try downloading the 2012 or 2014 versions, since 14 has a little more support and 2012 is virtually bug free with BAT4Max. The 2013 version comes up with Cyan ridden colorations on the renders with no fix (as I found out) so avoid it. You'll probably also want a photo-editing program, something like Photoshop which is great for developing textures. Other than that, you're pretty much good to go.

[Toothless Stitch 2,901]

People should ask themselves why SBS failed ...

[Mr Saturn64 742]

Alright, I'll be getting started with it after... I get a mouse that scrolls.  

[JP Schriefer 5,590]

It's great you will start batting

Good luck! 

[JakeMD 107]

I know you're not looking for tutorials, but looking through the omnibus will offer you lots of information. Looking through the BAT-Open Discussion forum will also provide lots of useful information. The main tools you will need are the BAT (with gmax), if you want to you can use 3ds max with bat4max installed. (You must have gmax/bat installed for the export process from 3ds max to work properly or at all), the plug in manager (or PIM-X from sc4devotion), and the lot editor. Other tools include ilive's reader and sc4 tool for various custom properties. Photoshop helps a ton for making textures but most free image editors will do the trick. There is a guide in the omnibus going through the process of starting a BAT to the export process if you're curious. 

[Bombardiere 591]

I have only recently started batting, so perhaps I can offer my insights from my trials.

 

 

Start with GMAX. Yes, it is an old program and I have found that there some annoying bugs. (such as mirror tool or rotate can sometimes mess up the texture. Especially if I have done careless job  to model or texture.) But it is free and suited to SC4. As someone said, perhaps you don’ like batting after all, so why waste money for a program, which may not be any use for you.

 

 

I have thought to upgrade to 3DS Max. The student version is no option for me. Possibly I could buy old versions. I saw an ad for original (disk etc.) 2008 version for 200 Euros.  Still it is a lot of money, but I definitely want legal version. No pirated copies. I am not into nightlight, but I could use more preset shapes. Does anyone know that if there extra plug-in for GMAX? I could use  a pyramid shape.

 

 

I would say that choose a building you like and start with that. Perhaps a small house. I think it is better to start with something small and concrete.  I have used drawings and elevation pictures to help with dimensions. Lately I have gone through STEX and I have seen buildings that are skilfully modeled, but simply don’t look right. For example, windows are too small or door is too big in comparison to the building as whole. Or building can been wide, but narrow or the roof is flat looking.

 

 

One thing I try to teach myself is that while in real life or in pictures we look at the building from side, but in SC4 we look from top. So in opinion, the roof is most important part of the model. Gutter, chimneys and lively texture are simple ways to break monotony.

 

 

 

Toothless Stitch, on 03 Oct 2014 - 3:56 PM, said:People should ask themselves why SBS failed

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry, I understand that it is a rhetorical question, but still… I wasn’t here when Batting school begun, but I have read some threads. I think Reddonquixote said it best a year ago. I think his post nail it.

 

 

We have very different interest and quite naturally batters do things that are in their personal interests.  Learning cannot be forced. Best thing for a seasoned SC4 player to do is to support Bat thread. Not just say “Great” or “Awesome”, but give real feedback. Off course, it varies between cultures and persons how much “honest” feedback one can take.  Ok, I came from Eastern Scandinavia and we are famous for our bluntness. Too much I am afraid, but then again I can’t stand dozens of “awesomes”, especially if the work is anything but awesome.

 

[Toothless Stitch 2,901]

It was not basically about the way of "teaching" people skills they might want some day to have an easier life to start with batting. In fact, there was quite a lot interest in this project to start. This was the reason why I could make Hamish as an Admin join the project. If this only would have been an idea, we wouldn't have created a spererate subforum. When we started with the schools (and we had 3 awesome teacher thinking of Jason, darn and Hamish) there were about 8 or 9 people in each class making almost 30 student in total. However, there were only 2 people following darn, Hamish only had one after some days and Jason technically never really started because no one was there. The students, including Saturn, had envinced interest but shortly after it became real, many just quit. So the original intention to bring forth the batting community failed due to lack of patience and seriousness. 

[T Wrecks 10,209]

...and this will always be what happens when you ask for confirmations or commitments of any kind on the 'net: 50 people say "Yes, we'll come", and if 5 show up, you can mark the day in your wall calendar and consider yourself stupendously lucky. I understand your frustration, believe me. Especially since the part about the "failure of the SBS" could be interpreted as a claim that there had been something wrong with the organising/teaching side, which was clearly not the case.

 

However, I don't think it was meant that way (although I understand why it stings you to read it nonetheless), and I don't see how dicussing the situation again will benefit the topic.

[Toothless Stitch 2,901]

It won't benefit the topic in any way. I just wanted to point out what I meant by the post I did earlier. And no, there's no real frustration because actually this is simply a project which failed. But you learn from it and, though I'm quite sure there won't be a second attempt on SBS, this may help in future.