Light rail modding help

[bloo 0]

Date: 10/31/2004 5:34:59 AM
Author: lakeyboy

Date:10/30/2004 9:22:03 PM

Author:bloo

On another point where did you get that image?

quote>

I got the aerial photos off this website:

http://www.aussoft.com/OnlineMapping/Custom/AusMap/AusMap.asp?view=0

This only covers the City of Whitehorse.

http://www.knox.vic.gov.au/Landscape/Pages/Directory.asp?cookietest=1&&map=1&layer=0&streetsearch=1

This link does the City of Knox. Both sites use the same software but Knox has more info in there.

And the box hill extension concrete/grass issue, Here is the evidence:

Zoomed In:

This should clear up everything now and I take back saying that all of Melbourne's tram tracks are paved. (I forgot about the Sth Melbourne Light Rail when the converted it in the 80's or something.)

quote>


I thought of another place where they are not paved, the track through royal park is not paved. The track down the center of dandy road after chappel st untill glenferry is mostly reass/dirt. The track running down the side of albert park (old railway) is dirt/gravel. The new track section at box hill (other than the stations) has grass between tracks. The Burwood to Vermont South extn will also use this grass format. It is very grassy the tracks are kind of concealed in the grass, however it is obviously kept well manicured at least by the trams passing over. The grass wouldnt have a chance to like grow over the tracks. However equally there are places where the track is separate from the road and has concrete, like burwood highway also places like fitzroy st, however traffic is permitted to cross the tracks.

Im sure there are lots of other interesting examples but I can't think of any right now. As for the aerial image its possible that was during construction, the dirty section to the left should now have grass, or even has grass just with the colour of the image you can't tell.

EDIT

Even better Rubber insulation on tracks will be used to lower noise from tram wheels, smarter wiring will reduce the number of overhead tram poles and the space between tracks will be grassed. http://www.dpc.vic.gov.au/domino/Web_Notes/MediaRelArc02.nsf/d025c300601da9dc4a25688e00143d49/f9d73d1a844ffda94a256ab7000009cf?OpenDocument


EDIT again

All this riminds me check out http://www.mitchamfrankstonproject.com.au/html2/maps/maps/aeri.htm for some awsome aerial map.

EDIT

Wow that is scary I just happened to come across this page when browsing for an unrelated reason.
http://www.myweb.net.au/trams/109extension/020503/

[JohnB 66]

Well I tried to make a tram line with the beta, but is it possible to add concrete roads to the tram line? I mean like in some of the photos in this thread you have cars driving alongside the tram. That is the way it is in real life. So far I was only able to add train rails to the tram stations. I know that you included some lots with the concrete tram track, but I can't seem to add those to the tram station and have the tram ride along on them. Am I doing something wrong?

[friedbrice 0]

Date:11/2/2004 2:10:47 PM
Author:JohnB

I know that you included some lots with the concrete tram track, but I can't seem to add those to the tram station and have the tram ride along on them. Am I doing something wrong?

quote>

No, you're not doing anything wrong. It's a game limitation that prevents this.

You can't have two transit-enabled network lots next to each other (as in road-top bus stops and HOV lane stickers) so you have to build the track sections at least one tile apart and connect the station and the tracks with rails.

[Daeley 46]

friedbrice is correct... you cannot connect two transit enabled lots together (mind you, network puzzle pieces are not lots, however the pieces from the light rail mod beta are NOT network pieces, they are simple lots) so you'll have to place them 1 tile apart and connect them with rail. If you intersect them with road on those connection points it actually doesn't show all that bad... you'll just have the corners looking like real rail.

If of course anyone could make ground rail puzzle pieces, they could be retextured to look like tram tracks... but for now nobody seems to have any interest in doing that...

[eangulus 3]

Can someone tell me if this is possible:

Why not make it dynamic?

Similar to the way Roads get different footpaths for different zoning, why not make it so that the tram lines will have concrete between it and road only. If no road along side then its grass. If you get a road along both sides it would fill in completly with concrete.

Also if possible it would at least look visually sweet if your rich zones could affect the concrete to a pavement or something. I know the zones wouldn't touch the rail and therefore won't work but heres a thought....

The roads footpaths change with the sims wealth. There for the road must have a dynamic value to show what wealth value it should be and therefore show the trees and paved footpath etc. If you can detect that value from the tram lines then it too could be a matching pavment. Low wealth you have plain concrete and high wealth could be paved.

Sorry to waste everyones time if it is not possible to do, just my thoughts on the issue.

[Daeley 46]

like many things it's possible, but it's not gonna get much further than a request if nobody makes the textures for it...

 

problem here is we have many ppl requesting things but only a few who can actually do the requests.

[Angel 1]

First of all, a big thank you to everyone involved in the creation of this mod.

I've already started using it in some of my cities, even replacing the elevated rail by light rail in two of them, and I've noticed that my electricity consumption rockets each time I place a light rail station. Is it normal, just to add more realism to the mod (after all, light rail runs with electricity, so...) or is it some kind of side effect?

[eangulus 3]

Well if someone could tell me what format and such too make them in I can do some of the textures myself. Don't know much about the actuall files needed for simcity but if someone just needs the images to convert then I can do that too.

[jtportland 184]

could someone post pics of what the beta light rail looks like and does? because i am tring to recreate portland in simcity, and they have some streets that have half light rail and half for cars, would this be possible to make?

i wouln't really care if cars could actually drive on it along with the trains, but if just for looks that'd be fine too haha.

here's a pic to show what i mean of downtown Portland:

[eangulus 3]

Everyone here is asking for help to get this mod going.

Why is it that I offer my services and no-one replies?

Looks like this mod is finally dead then. Pitty, it would have been awsome.

If it isn't then why is it taking so long? other than getting the textures it should be as simple as to making the set as a NAM puzzle peice. Tab should cycle thru the single track, over other transport (roads etc) and also the stations.

Very simple to make in theory at least

[Tropod 144]

Date:11/4/2004 8:54:27 AM
Author:eangulus

Well if someone could tell me what format and such too make them in I can do some of the textures myself. Don't know much about the actuall files needed for simcity but if someone just needs the images to convert then I can do that too.

quote>

Format: BMP - For the Colour

Format: BMP - For the Alpha Channel/Map (If no Alpha Channel is needed, then just the BMP for Colour. It's best to provide an Alpha Map though).

Size of BMP: 128x128

Number of image(s): 1 (one of each, Colour & the Alpha map)

And FiSHMan can do the rest. i.e convert images to FSH & generate the other (smaller) images if need be.

 

As for your theory; that's all well & good, & more than welcomed, but the file structure behind how the NAM Puzzle Pieces work, aren't interchangeable with non-network pieces (such as Lots, & Stations). Though, that is not to say it is absolutely impossible, if it is (possible) no one has found a way to do it.

[eangulus 3]

Can someone send me a sample bitmap. I need to know how wide to make the tracks etc.

[Tropod 144]

Here;

 

http://www.ftc.net.au/tropod/Rail_Straight_Alpha.bmp

 

http://www.ftc.net.au/tropod/Rail_Straight_Colour.bmp

 

That should give you some idea.

[Dexter 40]

I think this modd will get finished, unlike some of the others (roundabout, 12 lane highways ext.)

 

BTW:

 

I think it should look like this, but maybe with black tarmac:

 

[Yajimari21 0]

sorry for asking if its already been discussed... is it possible to have noth regular trains and trams in the same city... i think i remember that being talked about...

[kassarc16 4]

At the moment no, because this mod is basically being tested on the rail network. The plan is to find a way to use the ANT, the unused network that Maxis left in, to implement a useful way of having light rail in the game.

[Daeley 46]

Date:11/7/2004 7:32:16 AM
Author:eangulus

Everyone here is asking for help to get this mod going.

Why is it that I offer my services and no-one replies?

Looks like this mod is finally dead then. Pitty, it would have been awsome.

quote>

well excuse me for not devoting my life to replying to questions here... This mod is not dead, it's just that there is little time for the creators to work on it. Looking up the format for a texture really isn't that hard... just look at any existing one, that should give you a pretty good idea. Oh well, looks like Tropod answered most of your questions anyhow.

secondly, the light rail station aren't purposely consuming a lot of electricity... I'll compare their values to the existing train stations and if necessairy do an update.

and lastly... in some remote future it may be possible we have both trams and trains, but we'll need The7trumpets for that and it looks like he's busy with other things at this moment.

 

[jglei701 8]

Thanks for your dedication and work on this project Daeley... It really will add a new dimension to the game!!

[mikeseith 457]

Ok folks, I've made some 3d and FSH files for puzzle pieces. They do not work in the game so please do not try to put them in your sc4 plugin folder. Go ahead and download them and check them out in datgen or ilive.

Please note that these will be experimental and will be improved over time if they can be made to work.

If you can path these, write the exemplar file and make them work in the game please take them and make them work. This is as far as I can take it, so please lend a hand if you can.

Download them here.
Light rail puzzle pieces

[Daeley 46]

hmm looking pretty good... anyone care to lend a little hand? I'm really totally $%&^! concerning the creation of puzzle pieces...

[lakeyboy 12]

Tropod and the NAM team should give you a hand and then include it in the NAM. Then we have to make light rali station puzzle pieces or something if possible

 

[theBrad 25]

Congragulations on everyone's hard work! I just started replaying the game & I'm glad that my first request - before & immediately after - is coming closer to reality. Though I had been wanting a streetcar - this is close enough

[eangulus 3]

Whats is the progress of this mod?

Not trying to sound pushy but rather just wondering were its upto.

Has anyone started making functional puzzle peices?

Just a thought too... what about making a puzzle peice that sends the tram under the roads/avanues? And maybe a Light Rail to Subway and/or EL Rail?

I know its early to ask for things like that when its not even ready yet but before I forget I gathered I'd post..

[mikeseith 457]

Unfortuatly nobody has done any puzzle pieces for the mod. I have made a few attempts and have only been able to make the game crash in short order. So as of now we are waiting for the7trumpets to finnish with his work on the ANT and we are waiting for any kind-hearted modder to make the puzzle pieces work.

Looks like it could be a long wait, but I hope I'm proven wrong.

[yochillout 0]

omg I love the LRM it is so cool. I have it in most of my cities!

[Tropod 144]

Date:11/10/2004 12:27:25 AM
Author:lakeyboy

Tropod and the NAM team should give you a hand and then include it in the NAM. Then we have to make light rali station puzzle pieces or something if possible

 

quote>

To be honest; I don't/can't see how making puzzle pieces for something such as this will solve anything at all. Puzzle Pieces are essentially network pieces, not Lots. So making something like lightrail station puzzle pieces wouldn't be possible I would think (perhaps I'm reading that wrong though?). Making rail PP would be kind of a mute point really. Perhaps if someone were to clarify &/or elaborate a lot more on the whole matter, that might help clear things up.

 

[mikeseith 457]

Date: 11/16/2004 8:00:54 PM
Author: Tropod

Date:11/10/2004 12:27:25 AM
Author:lakeyboy

Tropod and the NAM team should give you a hand and then include it in the NAM. Then we have to make light rali station puzzle pieces or something if possible

quote>

To be honest; I don't/can't see how making puzzle pieces for something such as this will solve anything at all. Puzzle Pieces are essentially network pieces, not Lots. So making something like lightrail station puzzle pieces wouldn't be possible I would think (perhaps I'm reading that wrong though?). Making rail PP would be kind of a mute point really. Perhaps if someone were to clarify &/or elaborate a lot more on the whole matter, that might help clear things up.

quote>

Well Tropod, it is really a matter of looks. The way the light rail trains behave now, they stop on every transit enabled lot. The tracks that I made for the mod are transit enabled lots, so they stop on every one.

If you think about it, I just want a set of puzzle pieces to differentiate the light rail from the regular rail and to make it look good without having the trains stop at the end of those lots. Most light rail systems have rails embeded in concrete or asphalt and new puzzle pieces for the tracks would give the mod a more realistic feel. The light rail stations are transit enabled lots also and having the trains stop at them is great.

So all that I'm saying is the puzzle pieces wouldn't be for the stations but for the rail line. The7trumpets is working on a way to run this on the ANT, but in case it can't be done some puzzle pieces would be something to fall back on.

Oh, and by the way, I like your new medals.

[Tropod 144]

thanks mikeseith for that. That helps understand the matter a bit more clearly. So essentially; it is all purely a visual thing? To get automata of a specific type to appear only on specific areas on 'a' network? You mentioned having this work on the ANT network? Do you mean having the Lots placeable on the ANT network, or the Automata, or both? (or something else?).

Sorry if this sounds silly, but I've read this thread over & over from beginning to end, but am still having a little bit of trouble grasping exactly what's trying to be accomplished here (I still haven't been able to visualize it in my head). Thanks!

 

 

I have downloaded the file(s) on the previous page (page 10). V0.02E the latest version? One thing that needs addressing;

-It is very bad practice to assign & use files with 0x00000000 as the GroupID &/or InstanceID. Some files have issues with the game when using values like these for the GID &/or IID, not to mention the higher likelyhood of conflict issues since the values aren't even remotely random at all (if someone else just so happens to use the same IDs. It'd be like using 0x12345678 ~ someone else is definately bound to use it).

I'll take a look (at the files etc) and see if I can/can't contribute (anything) at all.

 

EDIT: A basic readme of some sort might be helpful (also).

[Daeley 46]

actually Tropod, there are two ideas... I'm afraid they may have gotten a bit mixed up somewhere halfway this thread.

T7T's first idea was to use the ANT as light rail network, i.e enable it for traffic, work out the RUL's and texture it correctly.
But since we haven't heard from him in a long while, and it would be nice to have the illusion of a separate network, some people have brought up the idea of ground rail puzzle pieces - textured for light rail. That way, one can have both normal rail and light rail without having to change anything about his current train networks.

[Daeley 46]

another idea just hit me... would it be possible to create these light rail puzzle pieces as ground-level elevated rail? (gosh that sounds silly )
that way they'd be usefull for someone who doesn't actually want the light rail mod too, and it makes it easier to have trains and trams co-existing. It does kinda shift the problem to making trams and elrail live together, but personally I don't think too many people would mind if I replaced the normal elevated rail with trams... they're light rail too anyway.