Will you buy Simcity 2013?

[monsterjamp 42]

After researching a bit more I found out this is most likely not going to happen. But making a entire game cloud based is insane.

[Urban Cartographer 601]

After researching a bit more I found out this is most likely not going to happen. But making a entire game cloud based is insane.

Let me repeat.

SimCity is not an MMO and is not supposed to be an MMO. Multiplayer SimCity is fine, as long as it is completely optional. The three most important things for SC2013 that I want before I would buy it are these: a 100% offline single player mode, large-scale terraforming, and regions without any gaps between cities and have connections where I want them.

[monsterjamp 42]

After researching a bit more I found out this is most likely not going to happen. But making a entire game cloud based is insane.

Let me repeat.

SimCity is not an MMO and is not supposed to be an MMO. Multiplayer SimCity is fine, as long as it is completely optional. The three most important things for SC2013 that I want before I would buy it are these: a 100% offline single player mode, large-scale terraforming, and regions without any gaps between cities and have connections where I want them.

I agree but I don't care about teraforming nor having connections where I want. I always sucked at creating a efficient highway. And the way the game is built it's supposed to be puzzle-like, also it creates a flow through cities automaticly.

[AwkwrdPrtMskrt 22]

That's a surprise. I thought truckloads of you would say NO.

[cirugo 1,889]

That's a surprise. I thought truckloads of you would say NO.

58 percent are saying no or not unless they remove online-only and map-size constraints. That's a pretty hefty majority.

[snick25 384]

Judging by the recent outcry on Reddit and increasingly public criticism EA/Maxis has been facing throughout the development process, I'd say a pretty hefty majority are also aware of the limitations this game forces on the player.

[Ocram's Razr 964]

It would be wonderful if they allow some sort of mode that does not require online connection. This wondrous mode would be more friendly to modifications. I would buy the base game at full price if it had this mode and I would buy the expansion pack at full price that allows it, even if the AI global market is stacked against the player (buying costs less than 30% below the ceiling if not less than 10% and selling cost is less than 30% above the floor, like the Cities XL OmniCorp).

But that ain't happening anytime soon, so I will wait until a hefty discount (like 30-60% off).

--Ocram

[dachsenz 3]

Nope, won't happen. I will not support a game that is simplified so everyone can learn the game in ten seconds. It will become boring and old very fast. The complexity was what made sim city great in the first place. We know EA and I'm sure many have seen what that corporation has done to other loved titles over the years, I'm sure my expectations will not dissapoint me..

[kolakube 9]

Sorry if this offend anyone.

I really really want to BUY a copy of this and fund future releases of SimCity. The better this sells the more chance that is to happen so I want to play my part and buy this.....

But, im not going to. Im not going to be treat like a theaf. I mean, I don't get strip searched every time I go into wall mart or whatever just incase I am one a thousand people that may steal something.

I have bought ALL previous versions of SimCity starting out on the Commodore Amiga.

I dont mean to offend but I may well be forced into waiting for a cracked version to appear This is exactly what I did with Annon 2070 for the exact same reasons. I would have loved to have bought that too, but im not being forced into this online only stuff. I paid my money, now I want to play MY game.

Bizzare isnt it. Here I am an honest guy and im being forced into not buying/playing or using a cracked version that I dont want to do. Man, Ive waited a loooong time for SimCity 5 too. Still play 4. Guess ill just stick with Cities XL. Its not a bad game after all.

[snick25 384]

Indeed, I don't want to have to pay and play at the whims of EA and their infamous servers.

And CXL, with mods, is a great game. Ironic, considering its online origins and the path the new SimCity is taking.

[croxis 150]

There IS an advantage to being online only. All of your city's data is being sent to and from the EA servers. Armed with a packet sniffer it is, in theory, possible to reverse engineer the netcode making it possible to create third party servers. If they don't encrypt the data this will be easy. If they do it will be tougher.

[Ocram's Razr 964]

I will buy it eventually but I might acquire an offline version as well, if possible.

--Ocram

[QuadBaconatorWithHamAndEgg 31]

No.

[Dewm 177]

41% yes

59% no (I think at this point its safe to say Maxis will not change the online requirements/city size)

And considering this is a Maxis/Simcity fansite, those are pretty telling number.

I honestly hope this thing fails, just to show EA and Maxis that its a dumb idea. (Funny thing happened with Age of Empires, it was a RTS that I LOVED, bought all of there games, then they wen't MMO/online & easy mode.. and it crashed horribly.)

Same with Simcity here, I have about EVERY maxis game.. up to this point, but I will NOT purchase SC:2013

P.S. yeah that included SimCopter, SimTower, SimFarm.

[flyer2359 92]

I pre-ordered my copy today. I had a lot of old games to trade in and came out $27 in the positive.

[osse84 18]

It breaks my heart, but I think not. The new concept looks rather annoying, and I realize that the dream about SC5 is now officially dead. Why don't they love SC4? They appear almost ashamed of it. I really don't get it...

[Dewm 177]

I pre-ordered my copy today. I had a lot of old games to trade in and came out $27 in the positive.

Good for you, I hope you enjoy it.

Its just not the game for me, and after 15+ years its making me pretty sad

(Combine that with the recent Red Alert, Age of Empires games, and everything is pretty hopeless)

[flyer2359 92]

I pre-ordered my copy today. I had a lot of old games to trade in and came out $27 in the positive.

Good for you, I hope you enjoy it.

Its just not the game for me, and after 15+ years its making me pretty sad

(Combine that with the recent Red Alert, Age of Empires games, and everything is pretty hopeless)

I'll be honest though, if I didn't have all of those old games to trade in, I probably wouldn't have bothered pre-ordering and have just waited it out. Besides SimCity and GTA V, there's really no new games that I'm looking forward to so I figured I might as well put all of those extra games towards getting at least one of the games I want.

I can definitely see where you're coming from and see how you're not a fan of the new one though, it is a completely different direction but I'm willing to give it a shot. Hopefully it's worth it.

[cirugo 1,889]

I pre-ordered my copy today. I had a lot of old games to trade in and came out $27 in the positive.

Good for you, I hope you enjoy it.

Its just not the game for me, and after 15+ years its making me pretty sad

(Combine that with the recent Red Alert, Age of Empires games, and everything is pretty hopeless)

Age of Empires...what a sad end for the game legacy.

[Hoipus 292]

I dunno... I played a little bit of it and aside from having to do quests and unlock new units, the main meat of the gameplay wasn't completely ruined. I was shocked to see that a free to play game had the option to create matches in which players had their paid advantages disabled.

[davis001 3]

I just have this horrible feeling this game will try an nickel and dime me to death with DLC. New Hospital Wing DLC... $5 bucks, New Factory that makes Widgets...$5 bucks.. I have seen some newer games that can add up to over $100 with the first few months of DLC. I end up wanting and waiting for "complete" editions years later. And then there are the few jerks who after they release a complete edition release another DLC. Ugh. I like SimCity so much, I remeber playing it when I was 12, and growing up with it. I will guess I'll have to watch it for a few months so I can see the business model they are going to run with.

[Xenocity 343]

I just have this horrible feeling this game will try an nickel and dime me to death with DLC. New Hospital Wing DLC... $5 bucks, New Factory that makes Widgets...$5 bucks.. I have seen some newer games that can add up to over $100 with the first few months of DLC. I end up wanting and waiting for "complete" editions years later. And then there are the few jerks who after they release a complete edition release another DLC. Ugh. I like SimCity so much, I remeber playing it when I was 12, and growing up with it. I will guess I'll have to watch it for a few months so I can see the business model they are going to run with.

You are being overly cynicial.

DLC provides games with new content they wouldn't normally get due to development cycles.

[snick25 384]

I just have this horrible feeling this game will try an nickel and dime me to death with DLC. New Hospital Wing DLC... $5 bucks, New Factory that makes Widgets...$5 bucks.. I have seen some newer games that can add up to over $100 with the first few months of DLC. I end up wanting and waiting for "complete" editions years later. And then there are the few jerks who after they release a complete edition release another DLC. Ugh. I like SimCity so much, I remeber playing it when I was 12, and growing up with it. I will guess I'll have to watch it for a few months so I can see the business model they are going to run with.

You are being overly cynicial.

DLC provides games with new content they wouldn't normally get due to development cycles.

I have to say, you sure have a strange definition of the word "cynical".

I suppose you think we all should be happy if, a few weeks after release, Maxis comes out with a "bigger maps" DLC, a "highways and subways" DLC, a "agricultural" DLC, etc. (the list goes on), charging us $5, $10, perhaps $15 on top of the $60 already given to them for features that should have been included in any citybuilding game in the first place?

Is it so unrealistic, irrational, and, as you put it, "cynical" to believe that EA, by extension of Maxis, is purposely holding off on some of these features until after release in order to milk extra dollars from their customers? It certainly isn't unheard of, especially not from a Machiavellian behemoth like EA.

[Hoipus 292]

I just have this horrible feeling this game will try an nickel and dime me to death with DLC. New Hospital Wing DLC... $5 bucks, New Factory that makes Widgets...$5 bucks.. I have seen some newer games that can add up to over $100 with the first few months of DLC. I end up wanting and waiting for "complete" editions years later. And then there are the few jerks who after they release a complete edition release another DLC. Ugh. I like SimCity so much, I remeber playing it when I was 12, and growing up with it. I will guess I'll have to watch it for a few months so I can see the business model they are going to run with.

You are being overly cynicial.

DLC provides games with new content they wouldn't normally get due to development cycles.

Not really. You do see games with Day 1 DLC. Or even DLC as a preorder bonus.

  Edited December 23, 2012 by Hoipus  

[macvirt 361]

For the odd chance Kip is reading this, without an offline mode I can't see myself investing in the next SimCity. My personal circumstances (lots and lots of travel, restricted networks while travelling as well as working and time between work at locations) pretty much deny me an effective use of a cloud perspective outside of holidays (which I spend with family either way). I can't say I'm alone in that situation in my circles either, being member of a Dutch / German Sim group it's a scenario unfortunately much shared set of circumstances.

What surprises me though is not the strict commercial thinking behind these decisions, but the lack of seeing that thinking through. As popular as the social side of ventures is as a means to both marketing and sales, when it comes to determining the value of a venture's gains one must always look at the types of customers one targets. And there the single and offline types are a damn strong set of targets, if only because of the ease of reaching them and the absolute volume of those market groups. In many ways it is as if the project suffers from top down directives which prioritise elements like Origin and the Cloud monetisation concepts without regard for the costs of this. Not costs in terms of "losing customers", but even just for the costs of not reaching customers. It's not maximising the possible gain just for the sake of convictions. Especially considering the ease with which the gain can be maximised (including single / offline play formats) that puzzles me. If only from a purely marketing and sales driven perspective.

In many ways it is uncomfortably close to a scenario of "take my money, oh you don't want it". In commercial terms I can understand the logic behind the reasoning, still with the benefit of looking at the venture from outside of the trenches and outside of the accounting viewpoint I can also see the gaps in that logic. It is not about what any singular perspective applicable wants, for any venture, but always about what the synergy of the multitude of perspectives want - that is what determines the tangible succes. That combines the perspectives of the strategic (above product & service level) perspective, the perspective of the product management and all the different perspectives of the customers.

In simple terms, it makes no sense to sidestep that much income solely on the basis of strategic convictions (I do not use the word "targets" there because there is a difference, any marketeer or executive management overseeing such ventures can spot the difference there and the validity of making the distinction). Cloud architecture in principle design does not equate to absence of client side architecture, on the contrary. That only happens when the conscious choice is made to exclude up to 60% of user type categories (I'm sure Kip can pull that data from the research available from the nice folks behind GD Mag and Edge).

Commercially speaking, there is little to gain with the insistance on a cloud only format, while it denies more than it gains. It's not a case of "what it might lose". Yes there are factors of that type as well yes, but those are clearly (and properly) part of the reasoning behind the decisions already. What stuns me is just that determination to not take the maximum reach of and for the product as the target for the product. As I said, I can understand it from a viewpoint that is strictly focused on brand reach and narrow marketing derived exposure means & targets. From a strategic financial perspective however it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

The mention of cloud architecture being the reason for the design choices is not a reason, it is a marketing argument. Using that as a sales argument is negatively affecting the venture, it is counter productive - especially since cloud architecture as design choice only excludes the client element if so chosen in a reverse design logic. In other words, it is only a requirement because the starting point of the reasoning is the desired outcome by strategic directives (top down influences). And not the result of research, development or design from the ground up. And the ground is where the long term viability is found, because that is the customer. The best commercial results, the best brand value, the best prospects, these are things historically found and created when these aspects are in balance. Unfortunately, this is increasingly less the case with EA. The next SimCity in these regards is - as a venture - a textbook case of such imbalance.

I find that a shame, and I cant deny that it goes against a majority part of sound commercial and creative thinking alike.

To step on a different challenge however, there is something I am very curious about. Unfortunately I have not found the information yet, perhaps I have missed it. But what I am curious about is the intended approach towards monetisation of first and third party content. Who owns what rights for mods for example. Distribution, sales, etc. One of the ongoing biggest strongpoints of the SimCity genre is that modding, it's something which for example Valve have recognised as a strong combination of commercial and creative elements that support and grow both brand and product. They have managed to strike a smooth balance there. EA however has much less of a smooth history in these regards, yet holds the power to break the foundations for such a trend without much consideration for beyond the short term gain.

[LexusInfernus 908]

Yep, Ill definitely get it. Probably not on the release date, as Im a poor student and I have to see if I have the money for it at that moment, but definitely soon after.

[CaptCity 4,915]

Removed the "off-color" comment. Remember: It's usually better to report these types of things to keep the thread from wandering. Thanks.

[JaceTwice 115]

Oh I don't disagree with you one bit. The thing is, personally, I just don't care whether it's a losing fight or not. The alternative is just to give up and accept something that I don't want. I'll keep poking that elephant with my pin until it's dead or I am.

Edit: well email it to someone at EA then. It's very good.

Something to keep in mind though, there are groups of players out there that like the direction that Maxis is going with this latest installment (though I can only speak in anecdotes here, I actually have a group of friends that the sole reason they are buying the game is it's online multiplayer component).

I think there's room for the fresh approach of SimCity. SimCity4, CitiesXL and their respective modding communities seem like they're bearing the torch of the traditional city builder fairly well. Even more focused games like Tropico and Anno2070 still retain the spirit of the single player experience.

[Mr Saturn64 742]

yup

[macvirt 361]

Oh I don't disagree with you one bit. The thing is, personally, I just don't care whether it's a losing fight or not. The alternative is just to give up and accept something that I don't want. I'll keep poking that elephant with my pin until it's dead or I am.

Edit: well email it to someone at EA then. It's very good.

Something to keep in mind though, there are groups of players out there that like the direction that Maxis is going with this latest installment (though I can only speak in anecdotes here, I actually have a group of friends that the sole reason they are buying the game is it's online multiplayer component).

I think there's room for the fresh approach of SimCity. SimCity4, CitiesXL and their respective modding communities seem like they're bearing the torch of the traditional city builder fairly well. Even more focused games like Tropico and Anno2070 still retain the spirit of the single player experience.

Definately. That is part of the strengths today of having those global distribution channels. It is incredibly easy to find user types and groups that match goal sets. It's logical, the absolute volume of potentials is enormous. The low cost nature of hooking on to trends after the advent of social media is another solid enabler.