nybt-forum-threads Parisian Factory for NYBT

[Parisian 556]

Under Construction /

 * Bank Of America (One bryant Park)

 * Cathedral Saint Patrick

Projects

* San Remo building

* Silver Towers

I m working with GMAX and I m still improving the way I bat. I consider the One bryant park building as finished.

I m still looking for someone to create a nightlighting and to upload it via Gmax for it. Any volonteers?

Saint Patrick will come at the end of this summer but only stay the night view problem (no nightlight)

Enjoy!

PS : I don't know how to create a nightlighting. Maybe it could be helpful if someone who is a pro in this team post a topic on how to do that.

[Parisian 556]

[Sgt Pepper 864]

That tower is looking wonderful. May we see a preview render?

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

WOW!!! I have to see the render.

[Parisian 556]

Thanks for your comments colleagues.

I ve try few mins ago to make a render. The problem is the following : It takes like more than hour for only one render at zoom 4. Maybe my computer is not enough powerful for this building. It's the first time I encouter such a problem with a building. Anyway, I was able to watch the top of the building in the render, the building looks darker than it is in real. instead of being light green/grey, it's more dark green/grey.

What should I do?

[Parisian 556]

[SimFox 804]

First of all you to show that render, rather than some pointless pictures.

And the fact that it takes time.. well what did you expected? instant gratification? The bigger the building is the more complex it is the longer it will take to render. And computer power is only one variable here. The renderer in BAT is very very old and even then it wasn't on the level with others. It can't, for instance, take advantage of multiple cores of modern CPUs, has memory management issues etc. So if you are with GMAX all you can do is sit and wait. Or to model your buildings accordingly. For instance don't use "transparent" glass. It will NEVER look good in GMAX. Will be impossible to lit up well and will take much longer to render. If stack with GMAX you're better to "fake" glass - along the lines sgt. Pepper does. But you notion of "being light green/grey" is extremely erroneous. You better first to read on properties of glass. I bet ther should be enough info on that in the net in French.

PS the choice of Excelsior is a bit odd one. Do you really hae all the needed source material on it?

[Parisian 556]

I can try everything, I let that project down. I ve already let my computer on for 4 days, it was not finished and my PC was still rendering on a black screen (it's like if it was in a break), I think it's a problem of processor, it's too slow...  not normally slow.

Excelsior is the devise of the city of New York, it's not an invention.

Anyway, what could you suggest? to change of program, for 3dMAX for instance?

Originally posted by: SimFox

First of all you to show that render, rather than some pointless pictures.

And the fact that it takes time.. well what did you expected? instant gratification? The bigger the building is the more complex it is the longer it will take to render. And computer power is only one variable here. The renderer in BAT is very very old and even then it wasn't on the level with others. It can't, for instance, take advantage of multiple cores of modern CPUs, has memory management issues etc. So if you are with GMAX all you can do is sit and wait. Or to model your buildings accordingly. For instance don't use "transparent" glass. It will NEVER look good in GMAX. Will be impossible to lit up well and will take much longer to render. If stack with GMAX you're better to "fake" glass - along the lines sgt. Pepper does. But you notion of "being light green/grey" is extremely erroneous. You better first to read on properties of glass. I bet ther should be enough info on that in the net in French.

PS the choice of Excelsior is a bit odd one. Do you really hae all the needed source material on it?

quote>

[+Guest Gnarologist]

bank of america tower, saint patricks cathedral...you have nice tastes in buildings

First post!

[T Wrecks 10,210]

Parisian, you can always send your model to someone with a powerful computer so he can render it. This has often been done in the past (I remember NDEX where SC4Meister rendered other people's buildings because his PC was fast) and it's being done by others.

Maybe you could tell us the specifications of your PC and of your BAT (object count, LOD size)? This way, people with some rendering experience might be able to confirm "yes, such a complex BAT on such a computer will take ages", or they might know that the render should be considerably faster - which could mean that there is some problem with your BAT.

Getting 3dsmax (if you can) is a good idea anyway! It renders sharper and better, it's less prone to crashes, and it offers more (and more powerful) tools.

If the problem persists, I'd recommend sticking to smaller structures that your computer can handle. NY is full of interesting architecture, after all.

[SimFox 804]

I seriously doubt that the rendering problem is due to the insufficient CPU power as such. Or, to be precise, that it will be fixed by moving to some other system with more powerful CPU. Not if on the home system it wouldn't progress for 4 days! It must be something about this file. I'm sure of it.

Moving files to 3ds Max for all intents and purposes runes them. All is smoothen out and broken down. To fix such problems in not perfectly organized scene for a large model would be nightmare. I can take a look at this scene but I'm not promising to fix it. But I may determine what exactly is causing such problems.

[Parisian 556]

Thanks for you message Gnarologist

T Wrecks, this is the informations you asked to me :

Maybe you could tell us the specifications of your PC and of your BAT (object count, LOD size)? 

- Object counted : 1458

- LOD size : I don't know where to find that, I join this message some print screen captures :

Now, my computer system is the following :

Microsoft Windows XP professional (it's a laptop computer)

Media Center Edition

Version 2002

Service Pack 2

TOSHIBA

140Go

Intel® Celeron ® M CPU

439 @ 1.73GHz

1.73 GHz, 448 Mo RAM

Thanks a lot for your comment, it's very helpful

[SimFox 804]

Those couldn't be specs of your computer. There is no way there is a computer out then now with 448Mb of RAM. Just no way. Still it is pretty weak computer. For 3d (rendering bit) you really need a powermill of a machine.

I can't shake of odd feeling- you show us very complex and quite advance model. Yet you don't even know it's dimensions and say you don't know how to find them out. Don't you agree it sounds a bit strange? Plus you show screenshots of the viewports. To what reason? what it suppose to tell anyone looking at them?

It also strange that someone who made this is incapable to find his way around the bat (eg figure out how night windows work). I would understand if some newbee would say that. But than again what newbee would make this building? To many things that are just don't fit together.

Just tell me if you would get 3ds Max would you be able to rebuild this model there with may be some adjustments to the scale, proportions etc? Or will you only try to export it to 3ds max?

[Parisian 556]

Originally posted by: SimFox

Those couldn't be specs of your computer. There is no way there is a computer out then now with 448Mb of RAM. Just no way. Still it is pretty weak computer. For 3d (rendering bit) you really need a powermill of a machine.

I can't shake of odd feeling- you show us very complex and quite advance model. Yet you don't even know it's dimensions and say you don't know how to find them out. Don't you agree it sounds a bit strange? Plus you show screenshots of the viewports. To what reason? what it suppose to tell anyone looking at them?

It also strange that someone who made this is incapable to find his way around the bat (eg figure out how night windows work). I would understand if some newbee would say that. But than again what newbee would make this building? To many things that are just don't fit together.

Just tell me if you would get 3ds Max would you be able to rebuild this model there with may be some adjustments to the scale, proportions etc? Or will you only try to export it to 3ds max?quote>

Guy, stop judging me like this ok? You don't seem to be a teacher because of your lack of pedagogy. Anyway, I m a novice, you understand what does it mean? It means that I need more advices than hard critics and evaluation as you're making with your daily comments...

If you re unable to be a minimum understable and cooperative, you don't need to come back on this.I m not a as "geek"  as you are for sure. I m not as good as you in simcity, it doesn't mean that I m dumb ok. I just know how to BAT since few months, so just think about when YOU started to BAT and try to imagine how does you feel if someone is arguing you and is suspicious with what you are creating instead of being helpful.

I made this by myself. If I send you the scene, you will see by yourself that this building is full of imperfection. The original form of the One Bryant Park was very hard to make. First, I make the structure (like bones), then I put windows by windows, the one after the one, level after level (it was hard and minutious because when you upstair, the facade is becoming narrow). I don't know how to explain in english because of specific word you use in this language, anyway, what I know is I made this building, I m not a cheeter. What 's interesting in this is being part of a team to create with the others, specifically in a team consacred to New York which is a city I love since many years. I m student in architecture, so this is my passion and of course a hobby.  I don't understand someone who pretend to having BAT something, while it's a fake.

Just take my GMaX scene, and you will se by yourself that a novice can BAT this because of details in the structure. which are far away to be good.

It's the first time that someone suspecting me to cheet, and I hate that idea, because I never did that!

Thanks to understand me before leaving another unpleasant comment.

[Sgt Pepper 864]

Play nice kiddies. Anyone want a ducky to calm themselves?  Puuurrr like a ducky...purrr like a ducky...

Anyway...

Parisian- SimFox is trying to help you, even if you think he sounds harsh. He is posting here to help, not to be annoying or mean. Follow his suggestions, explain anything if needed, and above all else, relax. He is also asking if you would be able to get 3ds. Max, a powerful much better program than Gmax, especially for its rendering capabilities. I would get it myself, but I'm a little lost at how exactly right now given certain limitations... Also, remember that SimFox is on the team, so he is here to help out his fellow team members.

Also, I have a 2002 Microsoft Windows XP Desktop, with 768 MB of RAM...which mainly comes from a Graphics Card or whatever I recently added to my system to replace the old burnt out(literally) card. I'm not sure if its enough to handle such a building....

[DCMetro34 577]

I have 4 gigs of RAM, Windows 7, and the BAT.....you could send it to me.....

Just wanting to help get this great model onto the STEX!

-DC

[SimHoTToDDy 2,939]

FYI, you need processor power more than anything. As simfox said, the problem probably lies in resource heavy transparent glass and the like. To measure something I just turn on snap and draw a box or rectangle and just read the dimensions, that is if you can't already just look them up on the LOD itself.

I think having 448mb is rather funny because it means you would need 256mb, 128mb, AND 64mb sticks all at once! I haven't even seen a 64mb stick in years!

[PBGV103 729]

DCMetro, how fast is your processor? can it overclock itself? what graphics card do you have? these are all important too, especially the graphics card. And from what I hear, gmax can only use one processing core at a time, so the speed, not the number of cores, is everything. 3ds max on the other hand can handle multi-threeading, so if you have a multiple core processor it's great.

[SimHoTToDDy 2,939]

Graphics card is actually irrelevant, with the exception of the viewports. It has nothing to do with the render process.

[T Wrecks 10,210]

Originally posted by: SimHoTToDDy

I think having 448mb is rather funny because it means you would need 256mb, 128mb, AND 64mb sticks all at once! I haven't even seen a 64mb stick in years!quote>

Maybe it's one of those computers with an internal graphics adapter and a so-called "shared memory" architecture, where the gfx adapter claims some portion of the computer's RAM? I've never owned such a computer, hence I cannot say how memory would be counted in such a setup.

Anway, I'd like to remind everyone not to jump to conclusions or start accusing each other of anything. This will quickly turn a technical problem that's to be solved with the help of the community into a personal matter and a quarrel between community members.

A last note concerning the move to 3dsmax: Of course moving this particular, existing gmax model over to 3dsmax will cause problems. What I meant was the general step from modeling in gmax to modeling in 3dsmax.

[cmdp123789 710]

amd turion II dual-core mobile m 500 2.20 ghz... does that help?? 4 gb RAM

[DCMetro34 577]

Originally posted by: PBGV103

DCMetro, how fast is your processor? can it overclock itself? what graphics card do you have? these are all important too, especially the graphics card. And from what I hear, gmax can only use one processing core at a time, so the speed, not the number of cores, is everything. 3ds max on the other hand can handle multi-threeading, so if you have a multiple core processor it's great.quote>

I have an Intel Core 2 Duo at 2.10 GHz

[Parisian 556]

I m just sorry about my behabviour of today, i was just disappointed and angry to have been suspected of cheeting. I juts want to say that through having integrate this team few month ago, I respect all rules of the NYBT and I will try as many time as possible to prove my undertaking for the NYBT. I try and try again to conclude that project. Bank Of America is a building I ve really appreciated when I was there, and that the reason why I want to share it. I ve spent many hours and days in this and that's my objective to put in on the stex. Anyway, I don't doubt about the fact that SImFox is here to help and being a active member of the team for sure.

I m not that a pro to understand "computer language". I just content oneself to use the computer functionnalities without interest in its performance. But now, I m facing the obligation to find an interest in it.

I want to thank you to be patient with me and to try to help me, I am gratful for that.

[Francis90b 748]

I have an AMD athlon II X3 435, 2.90 GHz

with 4 Gb of total ram and 3,5 Gb of available RAM.If you need on exporting it (and only on exporting it) i'd like to offer some help...

Parisian:

You're an architecture student? that's good!.

[PBGV103 729]

When it comes gmax, memory doesn't really matter because it has managment issues and can't handle using more than about 1.2 Gb at a time. For instance, I was trying to render something a while back and gmax told me I didn't have enough memory, but I have 8Gb ram total and it was only using 1.2 Gb. Gmax is just too old and flawed if you ask me. The processor in my computer is 2 cores at 2.8GHz but gmax can only use one core. Renders of small scenes would take a couple hours sometimes, while with 3ds max I can render my latest BAT in under one hour. It just goes to show how outdated gmax really is.

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

Man, man, man This makes me mad as hell, I need a better computer. You guys that have computers that is over 2GB RAM is lucky.

HP computer

AMD Athlom 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4000+ 2.10 GHz

894 MB (RAM)

[Sgt Pepper 864]

Wow parisian, that looks great! Could we see an in game photo or closer pictures of the rest of it?

EDIT: Oh and can we see a night shot?

[Parisian 556]

Yes sure. For the closer shot, I will make them tomorrow (for me it's already late night). I will show you a new ingame pic from my Sim New York. I ve to fix some problem at the top ( a LODs problem).

Unfortunately I still don't know how to nightlight it. Do you know a good thread where I can find this? 

[Sgt Pepper 864]

The Omnibus my friend. Look for the BAT Essentials in there. It teaches ya everything.

[Parisian 556]

Thanks Sgt Pepper! I m trying to render it, I ve change some stuffs to make them more realistic. I was rendering it when I ve seen that there was a problem. The render look too dark compared to how it was in real. I ve change the brightness, now it was ok. But another problem came :

When I m rendering it, it starts with zoom 5 (South, East, North, West) ---> Til here everything is normal

South view look like the normal facade of the building, but when it changes of view (when it changes to the East View for instance) instead of changing of facade, it stays the same. And for each direction (S, E, N, W) it's the same.

I remember I had the same trouble one day, and if I continue to render the scene, when I will be in lot editor, it will create a problem on the facade (like if it was flat instead of having relief).

I ve try everything, Merge in another scene, change of camera... etc etc. Nothing change...

Does anyone know what's the problem?