Bat4Max 2K edition V 4.5

[SimFox 804]

Service Pack 1 is all good - without it you wouldn't be able to use your keyboard while Mental Ray is rendering something...

There is really nothing to clarify (at least on my part). Instructions say MOVE, do you have any other interpretation of "move" ?

Also there is NO mistake in the script (unless you can clearly point one to me). I've checked and re-checked it once more...  As for your problem it only could be result of something being missing, but I can't really think of what exactly given that you do have LettherBeLight rollout, you do indeed have have it, right?), or some "pick&mix" BAT4Max version - when you take some scripts from one release and replace them with same named scripts from other or something like that. Your gamma is not set and from Max 2010 it is suppose to get set automatically on Max start-up... Well at least it does so on my copy of Max 2010Design x64 SP1.

Another possibility is that you have something else installed that takes over the gamma control after it gets set by LetTherBeLight. Unfortunately here I can't help you cause I personally don't know of any such plugin or some such. This, however doesn't mean that it exists...

Could you open you Mat Editor, make a screen grab and post it here? As well as screengrab from onpen Preferences/Gamma and LUT

[woodb3kmaster 342]

Here you go. First the materials editor; I hope this is the part of it that you wanted to see:

And the Gamma/LUT Preferences tab:

Looks to me like the gamma is set. I definitely have the Let There Be Light rollout available to me in Max. How else would I be able to set the lighting? I'm pretty sure I don't have any plugins except BAT4Max, so I doubt there's something else resetting my gamma.

EDIT: If this helps, here's a screenshot of the scripts folders that are in my C:\3dsMax2010 directory. Their "last modified" dates may help you determine whether or not my installation of BAT4Max is "mixed", as you speculated.

[SimFox 804]

Nope it is NOT the part of Material editor I wanted to see as it doesn't show any materials... I needed to see those spheres, not he texts under them. The point of it was to see if gamma is used.

Anyway the Gamma/LUT screen proves that my script had set all the values correctly... So it must be something fishy going on in your Max, as it shows itself being properly set, yet produces wrong image... Could you still show how those spheres in Mat Editor look?

Another thing you could try is to start completely fresh scene. To be precise close Max if it is open, start it again and then create something there and then go through preview routine...

[woodb3kmaster 342]

Oh, that's what you wanted. OK, here you go:

BTW, merry Christmas!

[SimFox 804]

and again it is little bit wrong as I needed the basic gray ones, since it it is very easy to see there if those are rendered with or without application of the gamma. But the shadow on these textured mats is also a clear indication that gamma is applied.

To be honest I'm at a loss here... Everything is set the way it should be - and that is a part what I'm responsible for - setting everything right through the script, yet in the end your Max for some reason chooses to ignore it's own settings...

[GlobexCo 33]

What I've discovered:

Many programs work also if you rename the main folder, but 3dsMax seems to have a lot of links created with the installation that don't change when you rename the main folder.

For example: I installed 3dsMax 2010 in a folder called "3ds Max 2010", but this path can't work with BAT4Max. So I renamed the folder to "3ds_Max_2010", everything work but there are some plugin-style things that don't want to load (preset and help files for example).

The solution is to reinstall again the program in a correct folder or copy everything but the main .exe file in a non-renamed folder.

After doing this, everything loaded fine.

I think that it should be added as "warning" in the instructions.

[SimFox 804]

No I don't think so.

Instructions are by definition are lists of things that HAVE to be done as well as a sequence. If one to start add to the instructions all the things that SHOULD'T be done those will be mile long and nobody will or could follow them. There are things, level of knowledge that is expected, and not to rename the folder into which you've installed a program is such a knowledge. Somethings could be updated - normally those tracked by Windows Registry. But the content of all sort of INI files or various not properly (with a link in registry) installed additions will not. So basically if you want to have your program in a different location you should reinstall it. And with latest versions of MAX your activation information will be preserved, so it all just a 10-15 minutes affair.

Speaking of the latest update to newly released version of BAT4Max some progress has been made. Basically both goals getting nearly perfect looking FSHs (thanx to null45's new converter) and breaking dependence of BAT4Max on max installation to folder with no empty spaces had been achieved.

However as I've stated earlier every silver lining has a nasty dark cloud stuffed on top of it. The one particular here is the fact that in Windows with UAC (particularly Windows7, but I believe that Windows Vista (at least) will have same issue) have a peculiar ideas about what could and could not be done for files and folder withing the Program Files folder. What it means for Bat4Max in practical terms is that it will prevent self-setting features of the Bat4Max from functioning as no additions to BATFORMAX.ini will be allowed by Windows.

Of course this could be overcomed by setting access rights to the BAT folder or particular file. But how explaining in the instructions how and by whom this action should be performed be any better then simple request to install Max to the folder with not empty spaces in the path. Look how many problems people seem to have with this uber simple instruction. Mind you thins is absolutely safe choice with NO draw backs, while tinkering with access rights and permissions may have serious and nasty consequences.

Anyway, As I've said the update is done and yes it will work with any installation of MAX if you know how to set it. I know it, how many other do? Is it really needed?

So, I plan to release it but the strong recommendation of the max installation will remain. Yet for those adventurous possibility to install Max in the default location is there. Bat4Max will work if you sett all the permissions right, but I'm not gonna support such an installation.

Who thinks that this is unfair?

PS

btw, this update will be compativbel ONLY with truNite export, unlike the current setup which will work with both truNite and classic export.

[SimFox 804]

Working on the DarkNite truNite I’ve made few finds (don’t dare to call them discoveries) that may be of use to many players.

Game has 2 main settings for the rendition mode - Hardware and Software. My experiments done on intel i860 CPU and GeForce 260 video card show that there are some limitation on either put by another game mode that is not selectable via normal Setting UI but still possible through editing of game INI file or adding command to launch shortcut – namely Windowed and Fullscreen mode.

 

In old days Fullscreen modes were used to speed up performance and clear some memory for the application in question by removing Windows overhead. Today power of CPUs and memory size of many typical systems could be perfectly adequate to run some older games in windowed mode with not drawback to their performance. This seems to be a case for SimCity4 as well.

In Fact game seem to run smoother (all the animations and some and scrolling) in a windowed mode then in full screen mode on my system. And there may be some good reasons for this.

 

Sometimes it possible to see people discussing effect various drivers have on the game. But the matter of fact is that in order for a driver to be fully at work here the game (while running in full screen mode it is in control) must be able to take full advantage of the features of the Driver. For the game as ancient as SimCity4 this is most definitely an issue, as it wouldn’t understand much of the driver code. Hence when run in the hardware mode eg when videocard is left to do much of the decompressing (say of FSH files) and particularly blending and shadows the result may be far from what the driver in use could actually accomplish.

During day view this effect is virtually indistinguishable. Game manages to run video card with a decent quality. Night view, on the other hand is entirely different story. Game is incapable to get video card to decompress very dark FSHs with any fidelity while it’s running the show in full screen mode. Switching to the software mode – when CPU is left to do the job result in an instant improvement of the look of such FSHs.

Here is an example how Game running in full screen hardware mode ruins perfectly fine FSHs:

 

game view (on the left) and the source FSH (on the right) from Sc4Model file.

Turning control of decompression to the CPU (by selecting software mode) results in instant improvement:
 

Unfortunately software mode has its own limitation (at least on my system). Most obvious are crappy blob like shadows eve on the highest settings. Games own algorithms of blending (shadows in this case) are clearly inferior to those in graphic card drivers and not matter how much power modern CPU can through at it wouldn’t help. Pig remains a pig even with all the lipstick in the world applied to it…

However once run in the windowed + hardware mode control of the driver is taken over by windows. In effect now we have a true show of card's driver capabilities for needed functions. And here is a result:

 

as you can see although game rendition is not 100% like the source FSH it is very, very, very close, in fact for all intends and purposes it is same.

 Very Dark FSHs of DarkNite truNite are decoded perfectly by graphic Card driver once Windows takes control over it, but there is more! Look at the perfect blending of the light cones in such mode.

Left Hardware Full Screen, right Hardware Windowed mode.

Improved look is not limited only to DarNite truNite BATs. Same applies to all BATs and even game default buildings:



left HardwareFuillScreen, left Harware Windowed mode.
 

[Jasoncw 11,949]

I think it's amazing that you still keep on discovering new things. Every time you announce something I think it must be the peak, but you keep on finding things.

[Null 45 3,116]

Strange how it would corrupt in full screen but not in window mode, perhaps Windows controls the graphics card better for some reason.

[SimFox 804]

Well everything is ready for the deployment...

The only thing that is still "missing" is Null45's permission to distribute his program as a part of eh Bat4Max package.

Null, do we have it?

[Null 45 3,116]

Yes you have it.

[mightygoose 92]

hahahahaha maybe some of my model archive will make it to the stex in 2010 lol

[acheson 8]

thank you fox,this work is exactly what I need.

But i got a little confused about the installation instruction.

The archive released from .rar file downloaded includes two folders,one is gamepacks ,the other is Bat4max_ver4_2Kedition ,in which there are two subfolders, 3dsmax and Gmax.

however, the situation differed from that you mentioned above.What shall I do with the folder gamepacks?It is consisted of Maps(folder) , Outputfiles(folder), scenes(folder), scripts(folder), temp(folder), Batformax.ini, cr.txt, DatCmd.exe, fshtool.txt, fshtool.exe, fshtoolreadme.txt, OR_dat.dll, System.bmp.

I notice there are the same files in your 3dsmax\gamepacks\bat.So,where will it go?Gmax installation folder?or just replace the gamepacks folder in D:\max2010?

thanks again

[SimFox 804]

archeson:

thank you fro bringing this to my attention! My bad... All the files that are needed for the installation are those inside Bat4max_ver4_2Kedition folder. Instructions however do say that the source files are located in 3dsMax and GMAX folders and those are found ONLY inside Bat4max_ver4_2Kedition folder. So in effect they are (the instructions) are still complete and accurate.

I was thinking how to release this new update and now given info you've supplied it probably will have to be the complete bat4Max release again as opposed of just replacement files. If you can wait for a day or so please do. On January 1st there will be new version what offer significant improvements over currently available one.

[acheson 8]

Oh it's so kind of you fox.

That'll be great! I mean the complete version.

I put the files to where they should be following your instructions couple of hours ago...well,I thought ,I put them in the right places,but my max2010 still doesn't work right with exporting LOD,so as a matter of fact, I must have been wrong someplaces.And I found when I first launched max2010 after installing bat4max, I also made some wrong settings as about the directory of simcity 4 plugins,what is even worse, I don't know how to correct them, and don't know what gonna happen or not..

Your coming new version does save me from all those anxieties about unaware I'd love to reinstall both max2010 and bat4max at then.

And Happy New Year,fox

yours thankful

[SimFox 804]

Happy new year to you too, but you can fix those things very easily by replacing BATFORMAX.ini

Take on from archive and overwrite with it one in your BAT folder.Then when you start MAX next time it will ask you all the same questions. As for the LODs it will automatically export them to the C:\gmax\gamepacks\BAT folder.

At this point this is hardwired address. So if your GMAX is installed in different place then it will not work... You would need manually edit this address in BATFORMAX.ini

[DazzaDazza 29]

O.k I know this problem has come up before but I just can’t remember where I read it

So sorry to post again.  

 

This is what I get after exporting

Also you said in the instructions  not use any lights when making the models, as I making a stadium I wont to put some directional lights in to light up the inside, how ells can I do that with out using lights    

[SimFox 804]

Originally posted by: mrdazza_460

Also you said in the instructions  not use any lights when making the models, as I making a stadium I wont to put some directional lights in to light up the inside, how ells can I do that with out using lights    

quote>

and where exactly do I say that? Would you care to quote?

As for your fist problem - no valid FSH are attached to you S3Ds. You should examine your SC4Model file to se exactly what is going on there.

[Cockatoo 2,257]

Hey SF, I'm having a bit of trouble with v4.5, I can't seem to get DAT FSH Insert to work, or for that matter, I can't get anything to the SC4Model file at all - same problem with truNite process.

I export the .bmp files no problems at all, click FSH Batch Build and that all seems to be working, FSH's are created properly, but then I hit DAT FSH Insert and nothing happens. The command line flicks open for a split second and then automatically closes again.

I had this problem when I first started out - it was to do with spaces in the model name, but there were NO spaces in the model name this time. Any ideas, I certainly didn't have this issue with v4.

Windows 7 HP, Max 2008. Max root installation folder is simply C:/Max. Everything is installed in the right place.

[SimHoTToDDy 2,939]

Originally posted by: mrdazza_460

Also you said in the instructions  not use any lights when making the models, as I making a stadium I wont to put some directional lights in to light up the inside, how ells can I do that with out using lights    

quote>

If you are trying the trunite method of exporting, you can use as many lights as you like, just DO NOT use the "nitelite_" prefix, as that will initiate the day/night export process that trunite aims to bypass.

Otherwise, continue as normal.

[DazzaDazza 29]

thanks 
I get it to export now,   every thing seems to export all right but all my light don't work when playing SC4
this is what I get

This is what the image look like when rendering

[woodb3kmaster 342]

It looks as if you don't have the game update installed that makes SimCity compatible with BAT nightlights. You can confirm this by looking at the Last Modified date for your SimCity_1.dat file, in the folder where SC4 is installed (most likely in your Program Files\Maxis folder). Is the date there from some time in January 2004? If it's any earlier than that, you don't have the update installed, and you should go to the official SimCity 4 website to download and install it.

[SimHoTToDDy 2,939]

Actually, I would recommend SC4D to get those updates.

https://www.sc4devotion.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=42&Itemid=

Really, don't use EA's site, it is utter garbage. I have only ever had issues with it; Invalid CD-key here, lost login information there, etc and so fourth.

[DazzaDazza 29]

Arrrrrr stupid me! thanks, I forgot all about that when I last install SC4 on my PC

anther question, i am unhappy with the night lights at the movement (they are too bright) do I have to re-export the hole thing again or can I just render the night view and just over ride the other night view already in the model

[acheson 8]

Hey fox, I'm here again.I install your new v4.5 today following your instructions, and the program is just doing so well that I'm so so thankful for your efforts.

A liittle spelling mistake as below ,Mat4Max for Bat4max

"Upgrade from Previous Version

Upgrade is NOT recommended for this version.

If you have any previous version of Mat4Max installed on your system remove it and do the fresh install of Bat4Max as described above "

Good luck fox, and really grateful.

yours sincerely

[SimFox 804]

Cockatooo:

check the actual location of your output files. Sometime when you exporting for the second+ time instead of wiping the destination folder clean new one is created inside of it. I believe this happens when for some reason some of the files from that old destination folder are locked by either OS or max... (may be open or something like that) Unfortunately script would not inform you about that and will quietly just re-create all the file structure one level "lower". FSHs creation works cause bat file created with this subsctructure in mind, however when it comes time to insert FSHs DAT inserter looks for them in a wrong place.

If this is a case you could simply move the whole exported thing one level up and insertion will work.

acheson:

thnax! It was so silly of me...

[Delecto 941]

Hello SimFox,

I have exactly the same problem as Cockatoo, everything works fine until I click on DAT FSH Insert, nothing happens.

Oh...and in the Environment and Effects window, the Background color set right to R,G,B - 65,65,65. But in the preview window, the background is black.

-Windows XP Service Pack3, Max2009Design, Bat4Max 2k v4.5.

I've never tryed version 4, so I don't no if it depends on the max version.

[SimFox 804]

could you do a screen grab of insides of your BAT folder?

Did you do a clean install?

[Cockatoo 2,257]

I did a clean install and I know from past experience that everything is in the right place. I make a habit of always clearing my output files anyway when I'm finished with an export. Besides that, I tested it three times, two of which were on totally new models.

I can also say that I've had the same problem as described by Delecto since v2.7(?) I think, but I always just ignored it. I had to set the BG colour to white to achieve a medium-dark grey.

Just so we're sure: