NAM General Discussion Thread

[tf923 0]

I agree that the NAM should be made more easy to install, including a shorter readme/instructions file and fewer overall files.

One thing that stands out to me is the sheer number of cheat mods that come with NAM. Part of the game is designing good transportation systems that work, and when you load up on cheats like 10xcapacity10xspeed it's just dumbing down the game while making the NAM bigger and more needlessly bloated.

When I first got NAM I tried the 2xcapacity cheat for about 10 minutes, and found that it made the game way too easy. So I took it out. Ever since then those files have always seemed out of place in the NAM. I think they should be available as a separate mod, not part of something that is generally considered essential as NAM is.

[DRoseDARs 0]

Don't take this as argumentative, please.

Date: 8/3/2005 7:09:10 PM
Author: tf923
I agree that the NAM should be made more easy to install, including a shorter readme/instructions file and fewer overall files.

quote>

There is nothing difficult about installing NAM. Seriously, how hard is it to simply move the files from the .zip file to your Plugins folder? Sure, the readme files could be written more smoothly, but as they are they convey the necessary information to determine which particular files are right for you.

One thing that stands out to me is the sheer number of 'cheat mods' that come with NAM. Part of the game is designing good transportation systems that work, and when you load up on cheats like 10xcapacity10xspeed it's just dumbing down the game while making the NAM bigger and more needlessly bloated.

quote>

Apparently, you're unfamiliar with the origins of NAM. It started as an attempt to correct a number of flaws, both graphically and within the simulation numbers, of the game. Commute times and capacities were widely regarded in the vanilla game to be unrealistic, hence the mods. The radical mods may be considered cheats but only just.

When I first got NAM I tried the 2xcapacity cheat for about 10 minutes, and found that it made the game way too easy. So I took it out. Ever since then those files have always seemed out of place in the NAM. I think they should be available as a separate mod, not part of something that is generally considered 'essential' as NAM is.

quote>

Those files are the very core of NAM. Don't use the alternate commute/capacity if you don't want to.

[Tropod 144]

Andreas:

That's not a bad idea. The main reason though nearly everything is in the main NAM.dat is so that any TGI conflicts can be picked up more easily (which has happened) & to help keep track of everything in general. Seperating them may make it more difficult (or time consuming) to cross-reference any files used. The way I'd make any items optional, where possible/applicable, would be via the MenuButton system (Menu Exemplar files), not the RULs (which would be very messy/ugly).

 

 

tf923 :

I wouldn't call it a cheat, but let's not get into that . There's a whole histroy behind why those Traffic Plugins are there. I suggest searching older threads. Long story short; the default version (i.e. stock standard version of the game) is skewed & nowhere near accurate. I'm not saying the ones in the NAM are accurate, but they provide more flexibility for the user & the majority of users do like them.

[fisherman783 3]

Oh, one more, Tropod. Assuming this is the appropriate thread for bugs... seems like it.

Note the odd diamond-shaped pit... it was spontaneously created upon plopping. I've had this happen with both varieties of the OnSlope road puzzle pieces, too. I believe I've used the road pieces more than the others, but so far it's only the road puzzle pieces that have done this. Coincidence? I don't know, but hopefully you guys will be able to figure it out.

[peanutgallery83 0]

This is happening to me too when placing the initial road puzzle piece for creating an overpass.

 

Date: 8/4/2005 2:08:08 AM Author: fisherman783 Oh, one more, Tropod.  Assuming this is the appropriate thread for bugs... seems like it. Note the odd diamond-shaped pit... it was spontaneously created upon plopping.  I've had this happen with both varieties of the 'OnSlope' road puzzle pieces, too.  I believe I've used the road pieces more than the others, but so far it's only the road puzzle pieces that have done this.  Coincidince?  I don't know, but hopefully you guys will be able to figure it out.

quote>

[chocolate_city 93]

Is it at all possible that the some other Avenue Underpass mod could be conflicting with the  Left Turn Lane mod in the new NAM .... i'm  positive i have it installed coreectly i've never really had any problems with any of the updates....until now... I've deleted all the GLR plug-ins i've never used the Traffic Cop or the transit bug fix.... and honestly everything was working fine until i updated from 6-17 to 7-25.... Now i don't have any friggin Turning Lanes.... anyone out there have a 6-17 NAM  they can e-mail me.... as far as I was concerned... that mod worked perfect within my cities... although your work is cherished and anticipated each time....I ain't happy with this new one....  email: williamallen88@yahoo.com

[prince_of_sims 0]

@chocolate_city

yo, read the readme.... i had the same problem with ATL not showing up, and it turned out that i had some file conflicts... yea, i thought i'd read the readme, then Tropod told me to read it again, and i found out that i had the Tranist BugFix modds.... deleting those fixed it for me

 

try that first

[Bones1 96]

Date: 8/3/2005 7:09:10 PM Author: tf923 I agree that the NAM should be made more easy to install, including a shorter readme/instructions file and fewer overall files. One thing that stands out to me is the sheer number of 'cheat mods' that come with NAM. Part of the game is designing good transportation systems that work, and when you load up on cheats like 10xcapacity10xspeed it's just dumbing down the game while making the NAM bigger and more needlessly bloated. When I first got NAM I tried the 2xcapacity cheat for about 10 minutes, and found that it made the game way too easy. So I took it out. Ever since then those files have always seemed out of place in the NAM. I think they should be available as a separate mod, not part of something that is generally considered 'essential' as NAM is.

quote>

I totally agree that the increased commute/capacity mods are a cheat, and totally unneccessary. Most of the game involves designing a good traffic system and proper zone placement; the cheats remove that. I suppose if you don't want to bother with the game aspect, then the cheats are useful. I classify them in the same category as infinite money cheats and demand cheats... perhaps even worse.

 

Anyway, if the NAM would integrate the vanilla settings into the main file, then only one file would need to be installed as the core NAM. Everything else would be optional. The traffic cheats would be optional, and if installed would override the vanilla settings of the core NAM file.

 

The readme could simply say to install the single file in your plugins folder, and optionally read the rest if you want the optional components. Certainly, that would make things easier for newbies installing NAM.

[nealos101 20]

Date: 8/4/2005 2:08:08 AM Author: fisherman783 Oh, one more, Tropod.  Assuming this is the appropriate thread for bugs... seems like it. Note the odd diamond-shaped pit... it was spontaneously created upon plopping.  I've had this happen with both varieties of the 'OnSlope' road puzzle pieces, too.  I believe I've used the road pieces more than the others, but so far it's only the road puzzle pieces that have done this.  Coincidence?  I don't know, but hopefully you guys will be able to figure it out.

quote>

Ive noticed this problem too occasionally, especially if I place the puzzle peices on uneven land...

 

Nealos101

[brtim2 11]

I figure this is a general enough question to ask here and get answered in one form or another.

Is there one setting that decides how high the overpass pieces are? Can I open a file with the Reader and change an element or two and all the puzzle pieces are now a different height above the ground? (I think the height is 15m, is that correct?)

And is there a movement to build a puzzle piece that is blank under the road surface? No poles, no nothing?

I faked this by placing a piece with the avenue, but there are sometimes a blank roadway would work better.

[GoaSkin 2]

The height is set:

- in the S3D files (vertex points)
- in the SC4PATH files (longitude; latitude; height)

The height should be 15.5 meters by default. That's the height of elevated highways. Please note that we discussed a few weeks ago about higher elevated puzzle pieces with the result that it is not wanted as official part of the NAM. If you make changes on it, you do it possibly only for you.

[Dan Ryan 0]

what about build a double decke avenue?

[Tropod 144]

This is a known issue. It is a side affect of their internal design that makes placing them on Water, next to each other, having minimal terrain movement, possible. The same issue exists with the Orthogonal version. I'll see what can/can't be done. It probably could be fixed, but you'd most likely lose the above listed abilities for the item when placing it.

 

 

 

 

 

Bones1

True. But then why take the fun out of 'a game' . As far as integrating vanilla settings into the main file; if you're able to elaborate on this a bit more?

 

brtim2

No there isn't a setting per se which sets the height, least not with the NetworkRUL files that are associated with your picture. The way Puzzlepiece items work are different from the games Real Bridges (bridges are partially hardcoded). So no, you wouldn't be able to simply open the files & change a simple setting. Blank #NetworkName# PuzzlePiece without Poles; you suggesting having a PuzzlePiece like the normal BlankTerrainPuzzlepiece, except without the Poles? May I ask what (additional) purpose it might serve that the existing one can't? It helps (me) to visualise.

[Bones1 96]

Date: 8/5/2005 4:20:41 AM Author: Tropod

True. But then why take the fun out of 'a game' . As far as integrating vanilla settings into the main file; if you're able to elaborate on this a bit more?

quote>

 

Well, I was thinking that if NetworkAddonMod.dat, NetworkAddonMod_Automata_Plugin_Standard.dat, and NetworkAddonMod_Traffic_Plugin_Standard.dat were integrated into 1 file, then only that file need to be installed.

 

However, since the ANT is now optional, the latter 2 files appear to be unneccessary, as they only modify ANT settings. Perhaps those files should be integrated into the ANT plugin?

 

In any case, I think the installation readme needs to be updated, since it states that a traffic plugin and an automata plugin needs to be installed with the main NetworkAddonMod.dat file. That's no longer the case, since ANT is optional. Only the NetworkAddonMod.dat file needs to be installed, and that leaves vanilla traffic settings like I wanted.

 

(Actually, I do use the perfectpathfinding setting, so I'm not really using pure vanilla.)

[Dan Ryan 0]

I have an idea how about tking the median in the avenues and putting a railroad there.

[Tropod 144]

Dan Ryan

If you have something (of a technical nature) to contribute &/or a general question, then by all means go right ahead & post it. Otherwise, if you have a request then please use the proper request thread thanks.

 

 

Bones1

Thanks for the explanation . Many people do & have actually their own modified version of the Automata/Traffic Plugins (NAM based or other). Merging them with anything would essentially be making them, or those particular individual versions, 'invisible' to the end-user, something I think would probably not be a good idea considering the nature of those particular files & the fact that there are multiple ones to choose from. It'd give more rise to the possibility of file conflicts (such conflict issues use were very common Pre-RH > Post-RH). Also, having the standard ones there gives users a template to work with if they wish to modify them for their own taste. The most recent version saw a file/folder restructure because of the additional content contained in the modd. So from time to time ways are sought to improve these sorts of things.

 

[brtim2 11]

Date: 8/5/2005 4:20:41 AM
Author: Tropod

brtim2

No there isn't a setting per se which sets the height, least not with the NetworkRUL files that are associated with your picture. The way Puzzlepiece items work are different from the games Real Bridges (bridges are partially hardcoded). So no, you wouldn't be able to simply open the files & change a simple setting. Blank #NetworkName# PuzzlePiece without Poles; you suggesting having a PuzzlePiece like the normal BlankTerrainPuzzlepiece, except without the Poles? May I ask what (additional) purpose it might serve that the existing one can't? It helps (me) to visualise.

quote>

Thanks, I was hoping there was a quick fix height adjustment, but I thought there wasn't. But I did learn the height to be 15.5-ish meters. That might be helpful to know later.

And you want help to visualize, oh I can do that.

I did not like other canal bridges because it doesn't look like there would be enough space for a boat to go under, so I made a prop that over hangs a lot and added it to go under the NAM Bridge pieces.
With the BlankTerrainPuzzlePiece (with poles), trying to create a NAM Bridge over a canal defeats the purpose of leaving the canal open as there are poles in the waterway of the canal. Also you lose the purpose of the rock arch as it is clearly shown the arch is not supporting the roadway.


When this is the look I am going for:


Right now the only way to achieve this look is to add a piece that has a roadway under it, as the pillars disappear then (in my case I use the avenue).


With a BlankTerrainPuzzlePieceNoPillar the effect can be made that the arch is supporting the bridge. Also, a simple overpass can be made showing the pillars on the sides of the canal and nothing in between.


Now, that's the only additional use I would need a 'no pole' PuzzlePiece. Granted it is a very specialized design issue under said canal pieces. The only problem I saw with using the OverAvenue piece is I am afraid it may mess the way the game uses the bridge. I think I have seen a problem with the game thinking the overpass is an intersection, am I correct in this? That would slow the overpass down a bit. But if you tell me there should be no problem with using the OverAvenue, then please forgive my request (in the wrong thread too) and I'll continue doing what I am doing.

(And while typing this I thought of an idea using overhanging canal props to hide network pieces, thereby making them seem useful in the game to transport freight/people. But that is niether here nor there.)

[prince_of_sims 0]

i was cleaning out my plugins folder, and came upon a zero-NAM FSH.dat

do i need that file with the new NAM? i checked the contents of it, and all it has is some FSH files of network textures. i think i downloaded it from smoncrie's NAM Cosmetic thred, but im not sure

[Tropod 144]

Doesn't sound like anything I've ever released. I wouldn't name a file like that. I couldn't say whether it's something related to the cosmetic mod though. I'd check the InstanceIDs of the files used. NAM content uses 0x5####### IID range for most things.

[prince_of_sims 0]

out of the 14 FSH files in the dat, 12 have 0x5xxxxxxx IID ranges.

[Tropod 144]

I'd suggest comparing them then to those of the same IID in the NAM, &/or alternatively use the Readers Compare.dat function (in the Options menu) to compare that file against the NAM. Otherwise, well I dunno post a pic or the file itself perhaps?

 

[tungston 19]

would anyone know how to rework the monorail ramp over elevated highway in NAM?  I was happy to see it in NAM.... until I used it.  I was expecting something more on the order of the monorail bridge (across a river), and not something that takes up 10 tiles in length. 

https://www.simtropolis.com/idealbb/files//Monorail_Hiway.jpg align=baseline>

[aps_000024smallcampus 0]

~Please be sure to read the forum rules. And please don't abuse the smileys. Thank you.~ T.

https://www.simtropolis.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=63238

 

How about Underground Road Puzzle Pieces?!(like subway,but for cars ,of course)

so we can gonna build some tunnels(underwater)!!!

 

please???!!!!  

 

And, Higher Puzzle Pieces too!!

 

Because I need to get some pieces go OVER   the Puzzle pieces!!

 

Thanks!!!!

 

[+Guest]

aps_000024smallcampus don't use such a big font size!!! the underwater tunnel can be found in another thread (use search!!!), and as for the other request, i'm not too sure about that, just be patient

[vester_DK 477]

Behave yourself aps_000024smallcampus.

That post is consinder rude and big letter is just like shouting. Be patient PLEASE.
Give people a day or two to answer. There are something called real life.

PLEASE read The All-in-One Simtropolis Guide to Posting

1. DO NOT POST YOUR TOPICS IN ALL CAPS. IT

[alexr15 2]

Is there anywhere else where I can download the NAM other than here because for some reason the server cannot be found.

EDIT: And the NAM in Greyveil's sig doesn't work.

 

EDIT 2: Maybe STEX is down...

[vester_DK 477]

Well just look back the thread, found a link on page 95 in post by Andreas Roth.

[GrandCentralParkway 1]

Dan Ryan, aps_000024smallcampus: post in the NAM Requests thread, not here.

[buckeyefreak 0]

Hey all

i have not found the answer to my problem anywhere so i'll post it here.  i recently downloaded the NAM and had the turning lanes mod installed.  it worked in giving me turning lanes but they were on the wrong side.  i live in the U.S. so right side of the road for me is where i like my cars driving.  The problem is that the turning lanes show up on the oppposite side of the intersection that they should be on.  As if the cars should be going in the opposite direction. 

 

Thanks for any help

 

[shanghai kid 6]

Check in your NAM folder that there is a plugin with the name left hand side only in it, if yes remove this dat. file as this is made for left hand side driving in the NAM(for people with left hand side driving version of the game).