Young Sex Offenders

[DOXXP29 5]

Seems like everything I've been posting lately is related to some bizarre criminal incident. This is pretty sick, but rape? Playing "doctor"? Or just gettin' down but starting earlier? The violence involved is hard to take if she was forced into the woods, but the girl says it was consentual. Oh well, read it and see what you think...

Ga. Boys Ages 8 and 9 Charged With Rape

By SHANNON McCAFFREY, AP

2 hours ago

ACWORTH, Ga. — 

Three boys, ages 8 and 9, were being held Monday in a detention center on charges of kidnapping and raping an 11-year-old girl near a suburban apartment complex, officials said.

The alleged attack happened Thursday and the girl's mother reported it to authorities Sunday, Acworth police Capt. Wayne Dennard said.

"The victim said they were playing outdoors and the girl was forced into a wooded area where she was sexually assaulted, where one of the boys raped her," Dennard told The Associated Press.

The three boys _ an 8-year-old and two 9-year-olds _ were charged with rape, kidnapping, false imprisonment and sexual assault, Dennard said. They were due in juvenile court Monday afternoon. Their names were being withheld because of their age.

Dennard would not comment further.

Acworth Police Chief Mike Wilkie said said one of the boys was accused of threatening to hit the girl with a rock before the alleged assault. Wilkie also said the investigation is "far from over," and investigators are looking into claims that after the alleged attack, the girl talked about it with her friends at a slumber party.

The father of the 8-year-old boy said his son had been falsely accused and had not had sex with the girl.

The sexual activity was consensual, and the girl accused her playmates only after her parents had learned she had sex, said the father, Brandon LeBlanc.

"There was no violence involved," LeBlanc said. "This is a clear case of a girl who didn't want to get in trouble with her parents."

He added, "In order to save her hide, she tried to blame it on rape."

The girl's mother, however, told WGCL-TV in Atlanta, "They do need to be taught a lesson because if they do it to her, they could do it to somebody else. And who knows when they become teenagers what they can do to other girls."

The case involves children from a working class apartment complex on the northern outskirts of metro Atlanta.

LeBlanc said the kids all played together, biking or throwing a ball around in the apartment complex's parking lot. He said his son is a third grader at a Baptist school who loves the Atlanta Falcons and is a batboy for his church's softball league.

Prosecutors had not received the case report from police on Monday, nor had they decided whether to try the suspects as adults.

"That decision hasn't been made," said Kathy Watkins, a spokeswoman for the Cobb County District Attorney's office. She had no further comment.

Acworth, 30 miles northwest of Atlanta along the shores of Lake Allatoona, is a town of about 17,000. Acworth police said their department has never before investigated allegations of rape where all the parties were this young.

"This wouldn't be normal anywhere, but especially not Acworth," Dennard said.

Copyright 2007 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.

[A Nonny Moose 8,263]

Well, criminal children are not all that rare.  There was a case in the UK recently where two boys murdered a younger kid.

IMHO society is becoming too permissive.

[patriots_1228 51]

Somthing bout this case seems odd. 8 or 9 year old boys don't even think about girls in general, let alone in sexual ways.

[ilikehotdogsalot 311]

hate to sound inappropriate, but don't you have to hit puberty before you're charged with raping someone?

[coolotter88 2]

don't you have to hit puberty before you even know what sex is? at least, that was the case for my generation.

[Godzillaman 21]

Rape is rape, they should get a sentence. How long would their sentence be if they're at that age?

[toxicpiano 125]

Originally posted by: N_O_Body Well, criminal children are not all that rare.  There was a case in the UK recently where two boys murdered a younger kid.

IMHO society is becoming too permissive.quote>

I know the case you are talking about, the famous one anyway. 1993 I think it was...

Anyway, rape is a particularly difficult crime to prosecute for (With adults anyway), I heard in Canada there is no crime called rape, it is split up into different degrees of sexual assault?

Doesn't the US have the highest number of children in prison for life or something to that extent?

[Voar Tok 4]

Originally posted by: toxicpiano

Doesn't the US have the highest number of children in prison for life or something to that extent?quote>

Even if we do, which I don't know nor am I disputing the validity of, it would be an incredibly small number, and only people who were tried as an adult.  In the US, kids tried as kids can't be sentenced to life.

[belfastuniguy 18]

You don't need to have hit puberty to be charged with rape.

These boys engaged in a sexual assault of an 11 year old girl. I wouldn't be surprised if they were already aware of what sex was and how it happens, nothing much surprises me these days.

They committed a crime and should be punished. The whole "they're young and didn't know what they were doing" doesn't wash with me. When I was 8/9 I didn't have thoughts or sexually assaulting a girl or a guy for that matter (I'm gay)

IMO I blame the parents and how they have been raised. But they should pay the price for their crime, I hate seeing criminal deviants not going to jail or being treated soft......

[toxicpiano 125]

Originally posted by: Voar Tok

Originally posted by: toxicpiano

Doesn't the US have the highest number of children in prison for life or something to that extent?quote>

Even if we do, which I don't know nor am I disputing the validity of, it would be an incredibly small number, and only people who were tried as an adult.  In the US, kids tried as kids can't be sentenced to life.quote>

Maybe it was 10-18 year olds I was thinking of (In the UK you can't be charged of anything under 10...). It was something like that. Juveniles/minors maybe? I assume that exceptional circumstances would depend on what the crime was, and what state it was committed in?

[Voar Tok 4]

Originally posted by: toxicpiano

Originally posted by: Voar Tok

Originally posted by: toxicpiano

Doesn't the US have the highest number of children in prison for life or something to that extent?quote>

Even if we do, which I don't know nor am I disputing the validity of, it would be an incredibly small number, and only people who were tried as an adult.  In the US, kids tried as kids can't be sentenced to life.quote>

Maybe it was 10-18 year olds I was thinking of (In the UK you can't be charged of anything under 10...). It was something like that. Juveniles/minors maybe? I assume that exceptional circumstances would depend on what the crime was, and what state it was committed in?quote>

I don't know if there's a cut-off point at which you can't be charged with anything over here as every state can do it differently, but I do know that after about 16, if you did anything heinous like rape someone, rob a store, shoot someone, etc, they'll try you as an adult instead of a kid, which means they can put you away for a really long time potentially.  Most people who do something and are charged as kids are either given community service work they have to do, or they are sent to juvenile hall, where they're record will be wiped after they hit 18.

[Somebody 12]

this is just a weird case. why would the kid want to do this, he's 8!!!!! i think that the girl is covering up her sexual encounter. would you want to tell your parents you had sex with an 8 year-old???

[Zelgadis 638]

I agree that there is something very fishy about this case. A lot of questions are popping into my mind that aren't easily answerable.

1) Rape when they're 8 and 9? Possible, but unlikely. Do boys this young even have such feelings? Are they even capable? I'm at a bit of a loss on perspective here because, for me, 9 was 22 years ago...

2) Isn't an 11 year-old girl a lot bigger than an 8 year old boy? Most girls I know could beat the crap out of any younger boy quite easily.

3) Any proof of rape? Or evidence at all? From the article, it seems that there's only the word of the girl to go by. I realize this is always the big problem in rape situations: proof. But again, this sure seems fishy...

ISF

[coolotter88 2]

wow umm, actually considering statutory rape, wouldn't both parties be raping each other? the males raped the female and the female raped the males.

[masochist 111]

From http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/11/19/national/main3522075.shtml:

"He's only 45 inches, 40 pounds in the third grade," the boy's father said. "This girl's in the fifth grade, she's 11 years old, 2 foot taller than him. How can my boy with a broken wrist be accused of any kidnapping charge?"

I don't see it happening. Some things the girl said in the CBS article make me question the validity of her claim.

[screamingman12 30]

Why would anyone even attempt to prosecute this? The parents are responsible for educating the kids about this type of behavior (well, the school is to, they just aren't doing it). These resorces would be better spent on doing a massive study on various parenting types, to find out which is most effective.

[Voar Tok 4]

Originally posted by: screamingman12 Why would anyone even attempt to prosecute this? The parents are responsible for educating the kids about this type of behavior (well, the school is to, they just aren't doing it). These resorces would be better spent on doing a massive study on various parenting types, to find out which is most effective.quote>

The money would be better spent fixing pot-holes in the road than doing that kind of a study.  There's no such thing as a "most effective" parenting type because A) all kids are different B) all parents are different C) various parenting practices may work on one of the siblings and not another D) there's no good way to measure what produces the best results because all the guidelines would be completely subjective.  My mom would have failed every basic parenting course out there, but I still turned out to be a decent law-abiding citizen despite that.

[krbe 193]

Originally posted by: Godzillaman Rape is rape, they should get a sentence. How long would their sentence be if they're at that age?quote>

 

They should get an injection. At least life in prison.

BBC: US prison system 'costly failure'

[Meg 368]

Originally posted by: patriots_1228

Somthing bout this case seems odd. 8 or 9 year old boys don't even think about girls in general, let alone in sexual ways.quote>

I agree.  I think it is extremely likely that this isn't their first sexual experience.   Kids that age usually don't just decide to do this; they learned this behavior from someone.   I think it is worth the time, effort, and money to find out who "taught" them and what the circumstances were.

Speaking more generically, the rules have changed regarding what is okay to kids this age to do.  When I was in grade school, girls were required to wear dresses or skirts but we all knew that we needed to wear shorts underneath them because the boys thought it was great fun to pull our dresses up and show our underwear.

At the time, it was chalked up to "boys will be boys" behavior and no one attempted to stop them.  These days it wouldn't be tolerated in most places.  Some people claim that is taking childhood too seriously.

Which makes more sense:  to let boys pulled up girls' dresses until they reach a certain age and then tell them the girls are off-limit unless she consents or to tell them all long that each individual's physical being should be respected?

[Joesocwork 4]

At those ages I think it would be foolish to set a hard and fast law about prosecution. The level of cognizance and intent can vary so wildly. I would definitely require a mental health assessment of all four children though. I would also do an investigation of the boys' families. And one of the things I would look into is the possibility of sexual abuse w/in their families.

[Godzillaman 21]

Originally posted by: krbe

Originally posted by: Godzillaman Rape is rape, they should get a sentence. How long would their sentence be if they're at that age?quote>

 

They should get an injection. At least life in prison.

BBC: US prison system 'costly failure'quote>

No injection is basically giving them the easy way out in the long run. Life sentence would be overboard. 10 years would be rough but only at the veryMaximum and if they don't learn then let the judges decide.

Thanks for the link too. It's interesting.

[Jasoncw 12,060]

Yeah, 8 and 9 year olds aren't really sexually developed enough for that.  And like it was said, an 11 year old girl is a lot bigger than the boys.  11 is old enough to think about sex though, so it's also possible that it was the other way around, with her getting the boys to have sex with her.

But whatever the case, there needs to be a lot of investigation, because something is not right.

[hym 358]

Originally posted by: Jasoncw Yeah, 8 and 9 year olds aren't really sexually developed enough for that.  And like it was said, an 11 year old girl is a lot bigger than the boys.  11 is old enough to think about sex though, so it's also possible that it was the other way around, with her getting the boys to have sex with her.

But whatever the case, there needs to be a lot of investigation, because something is not right.quote>

I agree.

[Meg 368]

Originally posted by: Jasoncw

Yeah, 8 and 9 year olds aren't really sexually developed enough for that.  quote>

No, not fully developed.  but still capable of meeting the standard for first degree rape in most jurisdictions.

I won't go into the details here but If you want first hand testimony from a boy who had first sexual encounter with a woman when he was 9 years old, go read "I Know My First Name is Steven" by Steven Stayner.  It is the true story of a boy who was kidnapped by a pedophile when he was 7 and escaped when he was 14 (at which point the guy had kidnapped a 5 year old).

You might have trouble finding the book, though.  It's a bit too graphic for most libraries.

[belfastuniguy 18]

Exactly, just because they are not as developed as older boys/men does not mean that somehow they are totally incapable of committing a sexual assult. Just because when we were all 8/9 we would not have any thoughts like that, doesn't mean some did not have them and that is still the case today. Many 8/9 yo's would not even know what would be involved in such an attack, but some do just as some have the ability to murder and commit other crimes.

The excuse of age is no longer valid in a world were horrible crimes committed by young children is no longer shocking and rare.

[coolotter88 2]

well, still, what the girl says is hearsay as it is nearly impossible for the boys to leave any definitive evidence of anything.

[sedimenjerry 1]

Originally posted by: patriots_1228 Somthing bout this case seems odd. 8 or 9 year old boys don't even think about girls in general, let alone in sexual ways.quote>

 

i dont know about that. they do think about girls and they do think about sex. they think they know what it is although they may be highly confused about it. who knows, maybe this was a case of curiosity killed the cat, and raped an 11 year old girl.

[HONG KONG 74]

Children are the future. What happens tomorrow?

[Voar Tok 4]

Originally posted by: SkiGeek

Originally posted by: patriots_1228

Somthing bout this case seems odd. 8 or 9 year old boys don't even think about girls in general, let alone in sexual ways.quote>

I agree.  I think it is extremely likely that this isn't their first sexual experience.   Kids that age usually don't just decide to do this; they learned this behavior from someone.   I think it is worth the time, effort, and money to find out who "taught" them and what the circumstances were.

Speaking more generically, the rules have changed regarding what is okay to kids this age to do.  When I was in grade school, girls were required to wear dresses or skirts but we all knew that we needed to wear shorts underneath them because the boys thought it was great fun to pull our dresses up and show our underwear.

At the time, it was chalked up to "boys will be boys" behavior and no one attempted to stop them.  These days it wouldn't be tolerated in most places.  Some people claim that is taking childhood too seriously.

Which makes more sense:  to let boys pulled up girls' dresses until they reach a certain age and then tell them the girls are off-limit unless she consents or to tell them all long that each individual's physical being should be respected?quote>

I agree with a lot of what you posted there, especially on the last point, but for reasons I won't go into here, I have a strong feeling that this is entirely the girl's fault and that she's probably the instigator of all of this.

[Meg 368]

Originally posted by: Voar Tok

I agree with a lot of what you posted there, especially on the last point, but for reasons I won't go into here, I have a strong feeling that this is entirely the girl's fault and that she's probably the instigator of all of this.quote>

"Entirely" the girl's fault?   She may or may not have been the instigator but please explain how Person B's actions can be Person A's fault.  

Granted, there are some situations (like coercion at gunpoint) where this could be true. 

But, in most cases, Person B has a choice.   Even 9 year olds have some clue about right and wrong.