Detroit & the Rust Belt

[Maxis92 11]

Originally posted by: XSpiderman Quite an interesting topic here...I don't have much to say that hasn't already been said, but did anyone happen to read the article on Yahoo! the other day about the worst commutes? Detroit was number three-I thought it would have been number one!quote>

 

HA! I can ask a large number of people around the world, and they would tell you how they LOVE Detroit's rush hour.

The grid is nice and the traffic is relatively light (unlike other cities half our size).

Now alternative transportation is another story.

[TEG24601 32]

I've always thought that with all the Michigan Expressways (Like Telegraph) the median would be a perfect place to put an elevated transit (like a monorail) or a transit, with little disruption to the traffic. I really feel that as gas prices rise, people will be more inclined to live closer to work, or work closer to home and have commercial interest nearby, either that or every city will need a massive mass transit system, like New York, London, or Berlin.

TEG

[TRNSTN 0]

Well, hopefully if Detroit is able to save itself, the mass transit systrem will have to be implemented quickly and efficiently. A time frame of several years, no less than a full decade to complete 90% of it. Most transit systrems in North America aren't as effective because of the slow expansion and short-sighted reach of the transportation. I hope to see Detroit come out of it's rusty doughnut. Hopefully they can start pumping out some more awesome elctric car models!

[Jasoncw 12,030]

Canuck3360:  I really hope that the line down Woodward goes really well and more lines are built.

Do you post on any Detroit forums?  You say you subscribe to Metromode so I ask.

That's great that you're moving to Corktown.  Canton is, well, Canton, lol. 

My last posts were kind of negative so I should make a positive post now, lol.  If you look for it, it's not hard to find a lot of stuff to be proud about in Detroit, throughout Detroit's history and even up to now.  And I can guarantee that anyone who likes any combination of art, music, theater, sports, bars, casinos, architecture, or history would enjoy a vacation in Detroit.

Here is a small tour.  Click on the photos to go to their flickr.com webpage.

Overview of downtown.  This photo is by Wolverine who is a member here.

Campus Martius Park, taken by JeffreyWiden.  During the summer they have music and movies and stuff playing, and during the winter they have a big Christmas tree and an ice rink.  When there's not something specifically going on, it's usually quieter like this.

New Center, a satellite office district about two miles north of downtown.  Photo by digitaldiva16.

[ak72 54]

I think a good example of a re-built rust belt city, and what Detroit could do, is Indianapolis. After wollowing (sp?) in sorrow they kicked out their incompetent mayor who would do nothing in favor of someone with almost no experience (you here this Detroit? we were fed up with things and used our power to make a point and change things). This led to revitalization of downtown. Dirty areas were made into parks, museums were built, taxes were lowered and change happened. The city is not perfect but a new lively hood has emerged.

[Mebert 5]

What was it they used to say? "I don't know where American cities are going, but Newark will get there first?"

Newark and Detroit have a lot in common; they are both industrial rustbelt cities that died after the end of American industry. And it's not just there; cities like Bethlehem, Reading, Baltimore, Pittsburgh; the list is endless.

There is a solution to the problem that nobody seems to have mentioned. Since the major issue is the collapse of industry - why not rebuild industrial infrastructure? Baltimore's largest steel mill is being reopened soon, and steel throughout the nation is recovering. Detroit, of course, had its home in Ford and GM, not USS. The auto industry has been hard hit, but it is not a lost cause. The largest obstacles to industrial recovery, however, consist of the EPA and the AFL-CIO. If these two organizations can be circumvented, we could see dramatic industrial revival. The timing is perfect; a weak dollar, and a massive boom in immigration mean low wages, unattractive imports, and global demand for American products. That could mean the recovery of American industry, and that in turn could mean the recovery of these cities.

[Shingure 56]

I will say that Philadelphia and Detriot are almost sister cities if you come to think about it. Both have the same problems. The government is a start. The government in Philly has been having problems for well over 50 years. Now that we do have a new mayor in office (Michael Nutter) I am still skeptical that Philadelphia will become better. It is still crime ridden , The city is one big ghetto outside of downtown. The schools are pure crap. And they are so bad that they don't teach the kids life skills and how to apply these subjects in life. But just for the standardized test that make the district money which is wasted on the salaries that work in the offices. And the class sizes are increasing yearly because of "warehousing" or "babysitting" As I so call it. As far as Iam concerned Detroit is almost exactly like Philadelphia or it's carbon copy.

Also economically businesses are moving back into Philly slowly. But in terms of industrial things. Forget about it. They are leaving for Delaware , New Jersey , Upstate PA and West PA. Everywhere that doesn't need the industrial stuff they get it and Philadelphia loses out. I was raised in Philly and as I get older I am ashamed of it because of how the city is and was. The people who govern the so called 'City That Loves You Back' are being mediocre , hence they don't love the citizens back.

[Mebert 5]

The reason industry is leaving is because of the unions and government. If they were able to reform their ways, both Philidelphia and Detroit could make a recovery.

[Milliano 0]

The problem with Detroit, that cities like Manchester didn't have, is the people. Did Manchester ever have a homicide rate similar to Detroit? Probably not even in the Middle Ages. Has Manchester's population ever in the last 50 years been less educated than that of Detroit's? Businesses go where there are employees to hire. There isn't exactly much skilled untapped labor in Detroit. Sorry if I'm not being head-in-the-clouds politically correct about it.

[DARKO 3]

Unions are the reason why cities like Detroit and others came to existence. Without unions everybody would have been making 5 bucks an hour with horrible benefits and in much less desirable environments. They served a very meaningful purpose and still do today. If companies were smarter with their economic model and not so worried about quick fix solutions, some industries in the United States would be better off today. I would argue the bigger reason why industry is leaving is because of opening plants in third world countries and paying third world wages. Then coming back here and expecting people to accept those third world wages. These companies are still making their money, don't be fooled. Abusive globalization is the cause. You can still be competitive by investing in your local economy.

Unions have their place, its true though that they need to be reformed. Non-union talk is for the birds though. Unions built most of this country.

As for the lack of unskilled labor...The university of Michigan(one of the best in the world) is in the backyard of Detroit. Wayne State and U of D Mercy within its borders. Plenty enough for sure. Manchester never had the same slide as Detroit. Nor the extreme segregation. Add to that the type of government aided fear inducing sprawl didn't help. Crime is a byproduct of economic collapse, not a reason for economic collapse. It's pretty simple. Crime is produced by a vanishing tax base.

Detroit will be fine. It will re-emerge once the right leadership is put in place. It has too much to offer, a great location(port wise among others..think international). Great building stock and infrastructure already in place. Great shorelines, and pride that just needs a little encouraging.

[Mebert 5]

Unions didn't build this country, but they did help make it what it is. Let me be clear -

[Flumes 3]

Cleveland, while it still has a long way to go, is headed somewhere better then it is now through major investment $'s in the city in projects like the Euclid Corridor Project, Avenue District, Flats (East AND West Bank), and the Warehouse District. If the corrupt Democrats could ever be unseated from the local government, and the lakefront could be opened up from such stupid uses (seaport hardly in use, minor airport, stadium, and R&R HOF) Cleveland would be sitting pretty... Led of course by the boom that is the healthcare industry...

[canuck3360 14]

ok so now we hit the heart of the problems UNIONS I'm not pro union do I think they have a place....yes but do I think they're in need of an overhaul.....yes do I wish they wern't here.....yes(but thats biased I was in a union and hated the fact that all they wanted was MY money and didn't do squat for me in fact held back my pay in 2 instances) The problem with the Autoworkers Union is that they take the money and protect workers who don't do their jobs and forc wages up to a point where a workforce isn't suistainable.

look at the average wages roughly $30/hour plus benifits= a gigantic wage wheras the Japanese Auto plants here in the US who are no-unioned are paying about 10-15 dollars an hour less and making a better profit with a bigger force they also haven't had to make as drastic of cuts.Now the Unions here for Ford/GM/Crysler have protected workers who don't do their jobs(trust me I've talked to many friends who work in the plants and my favorite guy I've heard about is a guy who works for ford and starts his shift by dragging out a coler full of meat and then a BBQ grill and grilling and charging his fellow employees for grilled foods(all the while getting paid by ford to do a job that he's not doing) when confronted about this the union stepped in and said you can't fire him and further more you can't harras him about his job)

[sakarr 1]

Originally posted by: Flumes Cleveland, while it still has a long way to go, is headed somewhere better then it is now through major investment $'s in the city in projects like the Euclid Corridor Project, Avenue District, Flats (East AND West Bank), and the Warehouse District. If the corrupt Democrats could ever be unseated from the local government, and the lakefront could be opened up from such stupid uses (seaport hardly in use, minor airport, stadium, and R&R HOF) Cleveland would be sitting pretty... Led of course by the boom that is the healthcare industry...quote>

 

well, looks like that has happend already. the FBI just came in last week and sealed off the county gov building along with the commishioners homes, and took everyting out. looks like only a matter of time before theyre indicted on corruption

http://www.cleveland.com/countyincrisis/

[josefmayor 8]

Uh oh... Detroit Mayor thrown in jail!

[patriots_1228 51]

even though overall detriot is the last city in america i'd like to live in, a lot of the buildings that i have seen from there are really nice, and the age factor makes them even better.

[Mike Andrews 0]

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