Cities Unlimited

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

it would also be cool i think if you had to have a developed industry before you can get tall buildings, or an advanced seaport. You cannot have high rise buildings if you dont have te meant to produce ot buy the iron.

[Badfish301 60]

I forgot to mention before, that I hope CU ends up looking something like this:

it's from microsofts virtual earth, but you get the idea.

Imagine if that building variety, and realistic city engine existed, and the gameplay was there..  I would never stop playing that game.

Also, this image reminds me that you don't need a Police and firestation every 10 blocks, you just need appropriate funding and a few citywide.  This also goes for hospitals.  The fun part is laying out neighborhoods and commercial areas, not dicking around with firestations and hospitals every 6 blocks.

Anyway, really excited about seeing the website.. have a feeling it should be soon. 

[Sap59 3]

i'd have to agree with Badfish and Rctshack on their points.

the hardest thing to obtain should be highrises and the wealth of the city should dertimine it so successfully building the economy and trade in the city should reap its rewards.

[KeanoManu 42]

Why not let us choose if we want highrises or not? Maybe i want to build Manhattan?

The game should have big variety instead. If you don't like highrises - don't build/zone them.

[Sap59 3]

a sandbox mode would be nice too.

[dodson1055 1]

I like the idea of being able to set restrictions for building within set zoning "districts". In the real world, developers can propose whatever they want, but there are area or city commerce commisions, building departments, histroric preservation societies, etc. that all have to approve the plan based on a set of standards for the proposed location. In many urban neighborhoods that border CBDs, there are strict guidelines for height of buildings, use, amenities, and even building style, to maintain the integrity of the existing neighborhood. However, these guidelines can be adapted to fit individual development oppurtunities. Maybe we could set up guidelines such as I've mentioned, and if a "developer" wants to build a highrise apartment where we've restricted it, an advisor can pop up and ask for clearance to build "outside the regulations." Just a thought, let me know if it's any help!

[Nevets13 27]

Originally posted by: Sap59 a sandbox mode would be nice too.quote>

Not just nice, needed.

[Imprezza05 1]

Originally posted by: Androv I think the difficulty would be in simulating a large enough urban area to support the number of low density houses, to support the medium density, and then the high density. If the simulator can cover this much area then great, but I don't think modern machines are capable of running a 1000km2 city (large cities in SC4 = 16km2). So we either have to reduce the detail of the smaller sections of the city (ie: don't zone streets/individual lots) or allow the city to expand beyond the edges of the map (into the 'region') as was done in SC4. These 'suburb' cities could either be created directly or simply increase in size as the population and density of the main city increases.quote>

 

wow this is explaining what i think.... but by making the region act as one city you can have the city as large as you like but only work on one or two neigbourhoods at a time. like the population,  income,  expences and civic services are calaulated regionally. 

By letting the populace travel freely through each neigbourhood freely to and fro work but only processing what is going on in the neigbourhood that you are in.... by calculating some things regionally then the majority of things done in the neigbourhood if you understand what i mean... this could save processing power.

Of course unless this has been implamented in CU allready it is probably too late to put it in.

edit: the mistake maxis made was making the region more like and a country and each area like a single city

[rctshack 182]

Originally posted by: KeanoManu Why not let us choose if we want highrises or not? Maybe i want to build Manhattan?

The game should have big variety instead. If you don't like highrises - don't build/zone them.quote>

Well obviously there should be zoning to keep the game from having them, but at the same time, if you want Manhattan you should have millions of people in your city. Or you can go to a sandbox mode to create recreations or whatnot. I don't want to obtain skyscrapers as soon as I start building my city. There should be special zoning for buildings over a certain height and it should be only when the are is dense enough that developers feel they need to go up, like in life.

Also I think someone mentioned this before, but I would love a lot of factor to play in to why skyscrapers would be built. If you have a small island that is 1 mile by 1 mile, then highrises condos should come about sinner than being in the middle of the desert. Why? For obvious reasons, rich people would rather pay more to live in a nice highrise condo with an overview of the nearby bay, then of sand. Not to say you couldn't acheive highrises in the desert, it would just be a lot more work. A small island will fill up its land fast and be an area of tourism and wealthy residents and they want a view for their money. Just my thoughts about that.

[City2TheMax 3]

In my opionion, the city should only develop high rises on certain conditions (examples):

- when there is very little open land

- when public services can support them (for example: high capacity roads and/or public transit, enough water & power, etc.)

- when it fits into the city-scene (no high rises in rich residential suburbs or the country)

That kind of idea. I don't want them to be hard to obtain, I would just like them to develop at the right time and context.

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

city2themax, i agree completely. I find it very stupid when i get high rise buildings in sc4 when the city is not even very wide and most of the land is low density or nothing being built on it.

[Badfish301 60]

Totally agree, high rise buildings should appear only under 'special' conditions.  When a city has matured past the 'town' and 'city' phase toward larger city.  There should also be a certain level of industrial and economic sophistication.  They shouldn't just be a birthright...

In a perfect urban simulator, certain special geographical settings should be more conducive to skyscrapers and high rises. Examples of such would include peninsulas, riverfront land,  isthmuses, or just high enough land values combined with a more diversified economy and good transportation links could suffice.

I think many SimCity players didn't even realize how much they missed having transportation a more central part of city planning gameplay. Elements such as railyards, and seaports, as well as their close relationship with industry are important.

Think elements of Transport Tycoon/A-train for the train networks, cargo management system for seaports and railyards, and Aerobiz for the airport route management interaction with other cities.

This would make make transport a lot more fun.   I'm not necessarily talking about lots of different industries, just perhaps generic 'goods' you have to get to and from industrial centers to the Seaport and airports, and conversely from seaports stockyards to commercial centers, or to long-storage in warehouse districts (if a city is industrial-oriented)..

I think the team should be able to handle that

[+Guest]

I've just read the question about getting a dense population, and i little disagree about the way it should be the most difficult goal of the game. Of course, there should be a quite serious challenge to have dense population, but what about the quality of life of the citizens ? Even though i think both are in a way linked, since it's not really realistic to have a dense population without the proper facilities, there should be rewards based on other aspects of the game, since not everyone playing city building games wishes to manage a megalopolis. So i mean the biggest challenge would be about the quality of life, which would be harder and harder to achieve when the density of population rises. One way to reward the quality may take the form of special building or events when a specific attribute of the quality of life is achived, as low stressed citizens (commuting time, crime, noise ...), low crime, high education ... which could take place (for bonuses) or be placed (for building) in the area which match the reward (i mean a speacial building reward shouldn't be placed anywhere in a city).

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

I always hoped that transport tycoon and simcity would merge into one game, but that might be too much to handle, micro wise. Regarding the high rise buildings, what is there were certain sets of things you had to achieve in order to move up the level.

Example:

VILLAGE REQUIREMENTS:

Population: 50,000

Buildings: City Hall

Income: $$1,000 p/m

TOWN REQUIREMENTS:

Pupulation: 500,000

Buildings: City Hall, Court House, School, Hospital, Fire Station,

Income: $$10,000 p/m

CITY REQUIREMENT:

Population: 5,000,000

Buildings: All previous, Mass transit, Parks, Airport, Seaport, Stock Market, Waste Management, 500,000 commercial jobs, 200,000 industrial jobs, ect.

Income: $$100,000 p/m

What do you think, this is off the top of my head, but i would like to see somethign liek this, what do you think phillip??? You can also add power consumption along with waste produced to the list of requirements to go to the next stage. These stages will also have buildings that go along with them. A village will have only 1-2 story houses and a town will have maybe 3 story houses, and a city will allow higher buildings to be built. This can be programed into the game as a set of limitations on construction. Please make zoning, i have played city life and zoning is the biggest thing that i miss.

[Androv 6]

There aren't many towns with 4,000,000 people.

It should be more like SC Classic:

Hamlet: <100 people

Village: 100-1000 people

Town: 1,000-10,000 people

City: 10,000-100,000 people

Metropolis: 100,000-250,000 people

Megalopolis: > 250,000 people

I think those were basically the city sizes from SC Classic. It also depends on the size of the map; a metropolis never has 100,000 people but if you squeeze 100,000 people into a 100km2 area then it would be 'metropolis' density (with surrounding suburbs).

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

most cities in the world have over 250,000 people in them so a megalopolis cannot be 250,000. i think these numbers should reflect on real world numbers,. PS, the numbers i used were only estimations and not actuall data. I have stated that "this is off the top of my head" and not to be taken seriously. cities usually have populations of over 1 million i think.

[djrules5454 5]

The U.S. Census Bureau's definition of a city(this is for a single area of jurisdiction) is an incorporated area of 50,000 or more people that has a downtown/urban center. Everything else that is an incorporated area is considered a village.

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

ok, you get the point people, i want to know what you think of the idea, not if the numbers are correct, lol.

[rctshack 182]

I think there should be many many more factors than that. What if you have a resort island of 1/2 mile by 1/4 mile. It has tourist and high paying rich residents. A skyrise isn't out of the question just because the population may only be 10,000... many other aspects should be included. Location is a major decision on building up. Miami has a lot of land, but they build up because people want condos with views of the bay. Las Vegas builds up even though litterally 50 feet behind these hotels is flat sand for miles, New York builds up not only because of lack of land, but to show off it's wealth. Many other things can play a part. Dallas for instance has about 6 different patches of skyrises, all in different location miles apart. There is plenty of land in the DFW area, but why build up? Density isn't everything. BUT desity is a large player. Location and Views is a large player, and the choice of wealthy citizens who will invest in skyscrapers is a large player also. I am sure there is so much more to add onto that. I think Monte Cristo should research why development goes upwards and at what time cities choose to go up... sounds good.

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

i agree that there are alot of factors, but it would be nice for it to somehow be implimanted into the game.

[amdinside 2]

I agree it would be nice to control the high rises but as rctshack says there are reasons for putting them into smaller cities so it should be a type of zone so you can zone for high rises when/where you want or not zone for them if you do not want them in your city.

[mastrobrace 1]

I belong to the "plop all party" so i like to build what i want where i want (if i have enough money).

I think that if a player want to spend tons of money to build many skyscrapers, the game should

let him to do it.

But...probably a small city can't support so many financial building...so if player will query his

skyscrapers, he will discover that they are almost empty, so he had spent many money to earn

only few revenues!

When a city become bigger with many commercial and industrial bld, than financial bld begin to

develop faster and skyscrapers will increase their workers generating enough revenues.

I think the same thing about residential bld...

If i would plop rich and high density bld in an area with few services i will discover that they are

few populated, because rich people wants more services, and poor people can't spend so

many money to live in rich houses.

At the same time if i would plop low cost bld in a central and well serviced area they will be

mainly crowded by poor people and not rich people because rich people don't like to live into

ugly houses.

I could go on with other examples but i think that my thought is enough clear...i don't want to see

the game change automaticaly buildings onto the map, i want to see the population judge my

choices, using my buildings if i do the right choose.

if i had done a mistake or i had changed my mind i should spend money to demolish "wrong choice

building" and spend other money to replace it with another one.

[rctshack 182]

plopping skyscrapers is not a great idea to me. It would be nice to approve permits for taller buildings, but in real cities, the mayor doesn't buy the land and build the buildings, he zones the land and approves any investors who want to build whichever building they choose to build. Plooping causes every city you make to look remotely the same because you get used to your own design style, which you can still do with roads, but zoning and growing lots help diversify the way each city you have looks.

[Badfish301 60]

The problem I have with having tall skyscrapers just by zoning is that  this woulud usually never occur in real life. In reality tall buildings show up when and where the market forces exist.   Perhaps we could have a 3rd category of zone, not commercial or residential, but a resort/hotel driven option (may have been mentioned before).

In Hawaii for example, this is the type of zone you would use to get hotel guests, and timeshare people to visit.  This type of high-rise would be completely dependent on the tourism draw of your city (geography could have a lot to do with this, as could entertainment options you added). 

That way, we would have 3 'unique' sets of skyscrapers growing, all relying on different types of demand. 

This way you could have the Honolulus (mostly resort/hotel), Vancouvers (mostly residential condos),  and Detroits (mostly commercial buildings) of the world. Or just a happy medium of them all (Chicago, New York).

Edit: or better yet, have a 'zone editor' as was mentioned earlier, and have the ability to zone a plot a mixture of commercial office/hotel/residential.

[rctshack 182]

It has definitely been brought up before, but it's a great idea. There definitely needs to be a Tourism/Entertainment zoning. People will try to argue that Tourism is commercial... and they are correct, but I feel there may need to be a distinction between them. I think tourism can also has a little bit of residential added to it. Most tourism areas have condos, and most residential skyscrapers are condos.

As for the Zone Editor... I'm not keen for that... it sounds like people would screw up their games with that.

[NYM1980 3]

Im not sure if this was mentioned or not. But it would be pretty neat if CU were to have canals as a transportation network. This way we could remake Venice. Also upgradeable networks. If i road is too heavily used, upgrade it to double lanes, or add lanes to a highway without having to wipe out tons of nearby buildings and use up extra tiles.

Speaking of Upgrading, upgradeable buildings would be neat too. Say large companies or malls that do so well they need to expand, possibly upward, or even outward, forcing you to decide if you want to allow it, and if so, how will your clear the nearby land if already occupied.

I know one of the first Sim Cities did this with the mayor house, which is something CU should also have. As your city grows you are offered rewards to purchase to add to your home. I think this would create more of a sense of ownership and pride in your city.

[mastrobrace 1]

I want to plop everything because i don't want the city I make looks the same. I remember in simcity 4 often the game was used to grow the same type of building one near the other probably because simcity select the best building needed in an area following the rci request. Also if there are corner houses the growing metod could insert them onto the map not correctly (correct L _ not correct _L ).

I'm not a skyscraper fan, i like much more european style cities and their hystorical buildings than a manathan style, but i think that who plays the game should have the freedom to build his cities as he likes.

I don't want exclude zones from CU but i want them so: if i built a res bld in an area in the map, the area should be marked as residential. Or if I prezone an area for residential, after i can only plop res.building on it.

I don't know how things go on in your country...but i live in italy and infact a general plan sign the zones in the city where building are allowed or not, but the land owner must wait that the city goverment accept his project, if it doesn't likes the project, the land owner can't build anything.

[NYM1980 3]

Yea, maybe they could add a feature to place Height Caps on certain areas of a city, or all of the city.

[Arthuryazhemskiy 0]

i think the height limitation is a great idea. As we have set the building style, there should be a box where we enter the high limitation of the buildings in the game.

[Badfish301 60]

I also feel that height caps would be very valuable in the game.. they are used widely in real cities after all.   Hope to see them implemented, maybe moded in.