simmars-forum-threads Language

[Something_started 5]

the resolution isn't going to be that great enough to read a dictionary a martin (ie futuristic human) is reading at a bus stop. and in 200 years nothing realy major is going to happen with the language, other than a more popular form of txt (text, im, lol all of that). and besides in movies most, you will see them using the language of the viewers... so realistically speaking the popular languages would be more or less heirs of the more popular English, Spanish, Chines and Russian.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/bythenumbers/2004-02-26-future-language_x.htm

[TimeMaster 4]

You change the letters, make an alphabet, put the letters sounds together and start making words. You dont take another language, and change the alphabet symbols.

A new language would be cool on signs and stuff but it is unnecessary, I consider only putting effort into to that if we have extra time. Only an add-on, it is not the point of the game.

[borntoboogie 15]

but there wouldnt be a new language! Earth is colonising Mars so the sims wil leither speak English (which by the way technically originated in Italy with Latin), Russian or Chinese since these are the big space-faring nations

[TimeMaster 4]

Lets just make it a Mars colony. You choose your colony type and language in options. Once again only use time on language if we have extra time!

[timcravey 168]

I think current global demographics indicate that most of the martian immigrants will be Asian - there may be an early move by Japanese, Europeans and Americans to establish bases but population pressures in Asia will eventually lead to forced deportations to the martian colonies and the common people of Mars will likely be Chinese, Indonesian, Indian, and Filipino.  Low and medium wealth housing and commercial lots ought to reflect that - while higher wealth structures might sport English or Japanese signage.

[balkair 6]

Well i dont think the alphabet will change in 500 years. The greek alphabet (which is actually older than the latin one, and it is the one Latin is based on) was created more than 2500 years ago and is still used today...

But the idea is cool! I like it!!

[timcravey 168]

Our computers are used to latin - we're probably stuck with it. Maybe we could use more Japanese though.

[TimeMaster 4]

I would probably just use English since it is an English Game. You change the language in options. It is suited in about 100-150 years ahead in time.

[TimeMaster 4]

The richer ones would be English, French, American, Italian, Russian, and Spanish. Middle would be like Portuguese, Turkish, Scandinavian, German, Japanese, Yugoslavian, Greek and Poor like Chinese, Indian, Indonesian, South American, African, Middle Eastern (Not Turkey), and other Undeveloped Countries. That is how it would probably set up like but the Earth is constantly changing.

[timcravey 168]

probably just chinese, arabic, english and spanish.. . we really don't know.

[balkair 6]

And russian too!

and btw greek is richer than english, french, italian and spanish

[timcravey 168]

We could expend the whole bandwidth with discussions of what is the most beautiful language (Irish!).

Sims actually communicate by tone of voice (in nonsense syllables) and icons. Those files shouldn't be too hard to find and edit.

The real question is SHOULD we edit them?  I think eventually we should.  Advances in technology make it possible for us to create better samples than the original. The real problem is to examine all those originals and discover what each is meant to communicate tonally and what triggers it in the game.  I wonder how 'international' tone of voice is? Maybe we ought to consider sampling syllables from many languages that include the most difficult to pronounce or distinguish sounds.  Educate the player to the texture palette of language arts rather than trying to teach them this cultural expression or that.

It might be easier to focus our attention on replacing the icons first as this will be much simpler.

[TimeMaster 4]

@Timcravey: Just a joke. This is still in beta mode please do not BAT anything with a new language on it atm.

@Balkair: Umm I posted that... Are you sure about greece?

@Timcravey(2): Who said Irish is? It is probably Latin! There wont be very many even minor changes in language in 100 years, because there wasn't in the past 200. Please don't. There wouldn't be one. It is not set 500-1000 years forward in time. The game time is supposed to start at 01-01-2100.

-Time

[balkair 6]

yep, the biggest greek dictionary has about 610.000 words. The english language has about 250.000 or something... But greek is very hard to learn, unlike English. No wonder english is a universal language now

[TimeMaster 4]

Balkair: Actually English is very hard. Hard unless you took Latin. Now, I am lucky because my normal language is english. Greek is hard too, though.

-Time

[balkair 6]

no, English is NOTHING compared to Greek. You don't have cases, noun endings, verb endings, 5 (!!) different types of "e", 2 different types of "o" and so on And yeah, english is ok to learn, the pronunciation is hard... But its not THAT hard...

[timcravey 168]

re: the SimMars alphabet

How can we make these more martian but still meaningful?  Any suggestions for martian ideagraphs? The landmark icon looks like the Grand Central Station model - is there a similarly recognizable landmark structure for Mars? ngeeves is working on a model in e's regular BAT thread that looks like a space elevator which would make a very distinctive icon.

Time:  We should try to get that for the Rewards menu! BTW Did I say "Irish"? I meant to say Cherokee.

[TimeMaster 4]

Uh Uh Uh.... Hmm. Out of ideas, let me see if I can find any.

[timcravey 168]

Here is another group of icons:

[TimeMaster 4]

Cool, that is intresting....

-Time

[Gunnster3 0]

In reading these posts, I still can't get over people saying that language hasn't changed much. The best example of how the English language has evolved in 500 years (or less) that I can think of is a comparison of William Shakespeare's works to today (most of his work was done in the late-1500s and early-1600s). While mechanics and sentence structure have not really changed significantly (notwithstanding his use of iambic pentameter, which was obviously not representative of the typical day-to-day structure of speech), prose and common vocabulary have changed immensely. Proving this point, the terms and vocabulary used in his works would have been commonspeak to most in those days, whereas most students reading his works today need reference materials to understand the same verbage.

In short, the notion that a Martian language variant is necessary is absolutely plausible. I would submit that the variant should be a spin-off of the English language, primarily because, currently, the universal aerospace language is English (mostly due to the historical dominance of the United States in that area). This may or may not change as other countries are moving into the aerospace scene (the U.K., India, China, Japan, and others have rising space programs). Even so, it's hard to imagine that any effort to get humans onto Mars wouldn't involve efforts from the U.S. in some way (due to the complexity of such an endeavor as well as the financial burden, it would likely involve astronauts, engineers, and scientists from multiple countries working in tandem, similarly to research and development on the International Space Station), increasing the likelihood that the language that evolves there would spin out of English. Now, it's very likely that the resulting dialect would involve the fusion of multiple languages with English in order to make communication easier for non-English speaking individuals out there. I still feel, though, that the general framework of the language would revolve around English--that is to say sentence structure. It's the terminology used that would likely evolve the most. These are just some thoughts.

[TimeMaster 4]

@Gunnster3: Well, at that time, Middle English was just coming to an end. And this is NOT set 500-1000 years in time, instead just about 100. Everything else is understandable but it is going to help the game..?

-Time

[Lahn266 15]

Greentings people. My computer just failed so I lost my simcity save files and I had to start all over again. So I downloaded Sim Mars and find it very interesting.

I have finished reading this topic and I an a Chinese from Taiwan myself, so I might be able to help you on the Chinese part. And, the Chinese version SC4 can show chinese characters fine. I don't think its impossible to show Chinese, the only thing is about programming.

But I am not saying that we should make a patch that allows everyones computer can read chinese. I think English will still be the primary language on Mars, although it might be slightly different with the English we use today. Chinese, Japanese, and other languages may be spoken by people, and widely used in certain areas, as how Espanol is in the US. So I think the Mars official language will still be English, while everyone can speak a little bit of this and that.

[qinbenjiaren 0]

mars language is whatever comes first from one's mouth, maybe a little English and a little French, depends on which one is short. like I am short in English but very long in Japanese, and some French words are shorter than English counterpart. Japanese words are too long and definitely will be rejected. and Chinese, who knows, if too many Chinese are there, maybe they will speak Cantonese.

[timcravey 168]

I think a common written language made up from many different sources with each individual community having its own spoken language (promotes cultural diversity). Some people may not use spoken language at all, prefering implants. Our whole concept of what language is may have to change as we learn to interpret one another's perceptions directly.

[AndisArt 2,067]

very interesting idea tim! if it is true that the earth is shifting into a higher dimension, 4th or 5th, then Telepathy will be the common communication

[miguelkuk 109]

Originally posted by: borntoboogie but there wouldnt be a new language! Earth is colonising Mars so the sims wil leither speak English (which by the way technically originated in Italy with Latin), Russian or Chinese since these are the big space-faring nationsquote>

 

Even though the english language has many influences from latin, it didn't directly originate from it. Also, if you want to be pedantic, both Latin and English originated from Proto-Indo-European, which, some theorize, originated from Proto-World Language, the mother of all languages.

Originally posted by: Gunnster3  Now, it's very likely that the resulting dialect would involve the fusion of multiple languages with English in order to make communication easier for non-English speaking individuals out there. I still feel, though, that the general framework of the language would revolve around English--that is to say sentence structure. It's the terminology used that would likely evolve the most. These are just some thoughts.quote>

 

I totally agree!

[Lahn266 15]

Timcravey: this is for you.

But I have changed a bit so it would match better for a building. Traslating directly sounds like the title of a book.

[qinbenjiaren 0]

nice try lan, but still dont know why sound wave affect mars

[Lahn266 15]

its something that tim wants me to translate....