100% Pedestrian City

[japerson 0]

Can this be done? And if so, how is it done?

I'm talking about no cars, no buses, no subway, no ferry boats, no monorail, passanger train or even freight train, not even one frieght truck. Zippo, nada, nothing but 100% old foot power. With no use of mods either.

Eh? Do you think it is possible?

My answer is yes. I am not saying how yet. I just want to see if anyone else has done this too.

[pnorrell 4]

Date: 1/24/2006 4:48:29 AM Author:japerson Can this be done? And if so, how is it done? I'm talking about no cars, no buses, no subway, no ferry boats, no monorail, passanger train or even freight train, not even one frieght truck. Zippo, nada, nothing but 100% old foot power. With no use of mods either. Eh? Do you think it is possible? My answer is 'yes'. I am not saying how yet. I just want to see if anyone else has done this too.

quote>

Not without the use of mods. At the very least, you would need the pedestrian mall tiles of the NAM, which function like streets for pedestrians. Even then, the size and growth of the city would be severely constrained by the long commute times.

 

The main point of the game is to create jobs and have people commute to them. To commute, they have to have streets (or ped mall tiles). People won't just hike across open ground to get from their homes to their jobs and back. If there are streets, with no other public transport, they will simply drive their cars.

 

As far as industry goes, it has to have neighbor connections in order to develop. You need roads and/or rail for neighbor connections and if you have roads or rail, you will have freight trucks and freight trains.

 

That said, you seem to have something up your sleeve, so I'm interested to see what your idea is...

 

 

[ten1902 4]

my curiosity has been piqued as well...i can imagine a small village being made with only ped tiles, but a whole city, i dont know yur gonna do but im tuned in to find out

[Micah 16]

Yes, it would only work in small communities... not big cities.

[+Guest]

Sims hate to walk.A city without Roads looks good on paper but I'm afraid it can't survive.Goodluck

[Glenni 1,445]

if you create residential lots and comerical aside each other in some kind of pattern it might work though.but i have never tried so i dunno.only thing ive made is a whole city block but thats all.

[dev 47]

it seems possible...but everything would have to be SUPER close togehter...and I'm not sure that Fire Departments could function...you could probably use the police kiosk....but I dunno...I am not very sure how it would work.

[Cloud Strife 0]

Date: 1/24/2006 8:08:46 AM Author: Micah Yes, it would only work in small communities... not big cities.

quote>

I think it could be cool to build SMALL pedestrian areas even in big cities... ofter in the very center of cities there are no cars and only pedestrian paths (for instance, between historical monuments)... or at least here in Italy I saw very often this kind of situation.

 

In such a contest, there would no be problems with the firestations and police departments because the pedestrian-only areas would be small and placed in a bigger contest where there are roads for the emergency cars to run on.

 

Just my 2 cents.

C.

 

[aaronperry 0]

trains a city of trains u said that we could use it in ur first post

[Bones1 96]

Perhaps you could do it by using only single, unconnected road tiles in your city. Place a residential lot on one side of the road, and a commercial or industry lot on the other side.

The sims would be forced to work at the job right across the street, because they couldn't get to any other job. I'm not positive, but they may just walk across the street rather than drive.

[Rymac91 15]

actully yes it can be done but you have to use mods...but you have to use streets for residential and you have to make sure that the commerical grows faster then the residential...I made one but it's a bit crappy...but personally I prefer when sims are able to use mass transit.I mean it's problobly possible to do it without NAM but that'd be nearly Impossible.and yes a pedestrian city is possible...you just have to plan it right

[pnorrell 4]

Date: 1/24/2006 10:19:18 AM Author: Cloud Strife

Date: 1/24/2006 8:08:46 AM Author: Micah Yes, it would only work in small communities... not big cities.

quote>

I think it could be cool to build SMALL pedestrian areas even in big cities... ofter in the very center of cities there are no cars and only pedestrian paths (for instance, between historical monuments)... or at least here in Italy I saw very often this kind of situation.

In such a contest, there would no be problems with the firestations and police departments because the pedestrian-only areas would be small and placed in a bigger contest where there are roads for the emergency cars to run on.

Just my 2 cents.

C.

quote>

This is certainly possible. It's the whole reason for the NAM ped mall tiles.

 

Interesting idea about the unconnected road squares, Bones1. I'm going to see if that works right now. Should still have the same problems with police and fire (and all other public services)...

[bradleybaggins 0]

I believe this is possible, but it has to be low density. If you had 4 tiles square, it may work. I will give an example of what I mean by this:

R - One tile Residential
C - One tile Commercial
- - road

--------------------------
-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-
-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-
-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-
-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-
--------------------------
-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-
-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-
-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-
-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-RRRR-CCCC-
--------------------------
and so on....

It would have to almost be a segregated community.

[SamFlash 0]

A very interesting idea but probably not possible on anything but a very small scale.  One issue that I see as a porblem would be making enough money to stay afloat.  Without mods or a money cheat how would you generate enough income to survive? No rail or road connections means no regional trade which limits growth which limits revenue. 

[jorday 0]

bradleybaggins: with your example, it is possible for them to use cars instead of walking is it not?

[japerson 0]

Thanks everyone for your replies. I would like to reply to many of your comments.

Author:pnorrell
Not without the use of mods. At the very least, you would need the pedestrian mall tiles of the NAM, which function like streets for pedestrians. Even then, the size and growth of the city would be severely constrained by the long commute times.

quote>

I did not use mods. I did not use pedestrian tiles from NAM.

Yes, my city is small. How large should I get it to call this a success?

Author:BlackBeard
A city without Roads looks good on paper but I'm afraid it can't survive.

quote>

It has roads. Nothing would grow without roads. So roads were a must. The trick is to get the Sims to walk the roads instead of drive on them which I manage to do on a small scale.

Author:Glenni
if you create residential lots and comerical aside each other in some kind of pattern it might work though.

quote>

While this might help, I did not use such a pattern.

Author:dev
it seems possible...but everything would have to be SUPER close togehter...and I'm not sure that Fire Departments could function...you could probably use the police kioskit seems possible...but everything would have to be SUPER close togehter...and I'm not sure that Fire Departments could function...you could probably use the police kiosk....but I dunno...I am not very sure how it would work. I did this with a small 64x64 city.

quote>

You did this on a 64x64 map, but you're not sure how it would work. How does that work? Okay, I am being mean. Sorry. I just know as soon as I tell everyone how I did it, everyone else will say, Oh yeah. Of course. I did that too. Yet no is saying or showing how.

Fire and Police just need to cover the area. Seems they don't need actual road access to the entire area they are covering. I did however need to give them enough access so workers could actually work there. I wanted no no-car zots in my city. All my civic buildings that provides jobs have road access so that pedestrians can get to work there.

Author:aaronperry
trains a city of trains u said that we could use it in ur first post

quote>


I don't belive that post was for me or even this thread.

I am not holding any kind of contest. If you wish to use trains on whatever you are working on, that is fine. My personal goal was to not use any kind of mass transit, which would include not using trains. Not even for frieght.

Author:Bones1
Perhaps you could do it by using only single, unconnected road tiles in your city. Place a residential lot on one side of the road, and a commercial or industry lot on the other side.

The sims would be forced to work at the job right across the street, because they couldn't get to any other job. I'm not positive, but they may just walk across the street rather than drive.

quote>

A road must be at least 2 tiles long to get anything to build on it. And yes, even if the job is right across the street or even nextdoor, Sims will drive. I tried this, but it didn't work.

Author:Rymac91
actully yes it can be done but you have to use mods...but you have to use streets for residential and you have to make sure that the commerical grows faster then the residential...I made one but it's a bit crappy...but personally I prefer when sims are able to use mass transit.I mean it's problobly possible to do it without NAM but that'd be nearly Impossible.and yes a pedestrian city is possible...you just have to plan it right

quote>

No but's, no mods! And yes, for the most part, you need a plan.

Author:bradleybaggins
I believe this is possible, but it has to be low density. If you had 4 tiles square, it may work.

quote>

I started working on a larger city and had success with medium density as well (6x6 and 8x8 blocks). So I see no problem getting this to work with high density too. I just need to get a decent large city built to prove it. But I suck at building large cities, even with cars.

Author:SamFlash
One issue that I see as a porblem would be making enough money to stay afloat. Without mods or a money cheat how would you generate enough income to survive? No rail or road connections means no regional trade which limits growth which limits revenue.

quote>

My cities always make money without the use of cheats and/or mods. I have no idea why so many people have money problems.


Alright everyone, here are my current city stats:

Small 64x64 city
Pop: 16,381
Ind: 8,444
Com: 3,178

Monthly income $4,761 (Res tax at 4.5%, Ind at 3.5%)
Monthy expenses $4,357

2 Oil Power Plants
1 Waste to Energy Plant (Budget set at $0)
2 Water Pumps
1 Large & 4 Small Fire Stations
2 Small Medical Clinics
1 Library

No neighbor connections of any kind.
All civic building have road access.
No no-car zots.
Traffic volume is about 7,500 pedestrians. All other traffic categories is 0.
Average commute time is 85 minutes.

All zones are low density. I have about 10 houses which are abandoned. I am pretty sure I could correct that slight problem, but I wanted to work on this same idea on a bigger scale.

I am using my trick on a large 256x256 map. I want to know how far you all want me to take this before claiming this a success?

[pnorrell 4]

Date: 1/25/2006 12:50:55 AM Author: japerson

I am using my trick on a large 256x256 map. I want to know how far you all want me to take this before claiming this a success?

quote>

 

As far as I'm concerned, if you've gotten 16,000+ people and 8,000+ industrial jobs, you've proven your point already. Clue us in! The basic questions is, if you have roads, how do you get people to walk instead of drive?

[SamFlash 0]

I'd say, with the stats you've given us, that you've proven your point that it is possible to have only pedestrians but I'm interested in what you'll encounter as you go to a larger map.  

[AlexNielsen7 2]

This sounds very interesting

-i'm a bit sceptic though..

[wafgking 22]

You can't claim success until you can prove it:  2 things are required

1) Picture of your graphs & city

2) Steps to reproduce your results so that others can also prove it.

 

This does sound interesting.  I have tried to have my cities use as little cars as possible, and even in one city I've had half of the people walk.  (So I guess it could be possible to get all, I don't know how).  I do use NAM, but i dont force people to use a certain thing.  I just use it for better pathfinding and increased capacity (because the original is too lame) and the cute roundabouts.

 

However, I'm aslo inclined this is a hoax since I would have started this post with a picture or atleast provided some proof.   Not just some number, which I could also easily give from one of my cities and just claim they all walk.

 

We will have to see.

[rctshack 182]

Please Show and Tell. This is getting annoying...

[soldyne 111]

Date: 1/25/2006 8:15:28 PM Author: rctshack Please Show and Tell. This is getting annoying...

quote>

 

Yes I agree.  it could be said that your topic is posted in poor taste.  if you have a good experiment and wish the share the results then do so.  this is not a contest of who is the better city planner this is a forum for the sharing of ideas.  to lead us on and tell us how great you are is just plain rude.

 

post pics and layout the steps please.

[japerson 0]

Author: rctshack

Please Show and Tell. This is getting annoying...

quote>

I am sorry if all this annoyed anyone. I did it this way to prevent from being annoyed by having everyone put me down for showing something I presume as new. I swear, if anyone says, Oh yeah, I done many cities this way, I am going to scream!

Date: 1/25/2006 8:33:16 PM
Author: soldyne

Yes I agree. it could be said that your topic is posted in poor taste. if you have a good experiment and wish the share the results then do so. this is not a contest of who is the better city planner this is a forum for the sharing of ideas. to lead us on and tell us how 'great' you are is just plain rude.

quote>

Your comments sir really annoyed me. I believe you are the rude one. I explained why I posted the way I did. I suck at building cities. I came to these forums looking for answers to my traffic problems. I was intrigued by cities others had built using only mass transit. I combined a trick I had used unsuccessful with their tricks and made the city I did. It was quite easy and I was surprised that no one else had ever claimed of doing what I had done. So before I posted my findings, I merely wanted to make sure one last time that you all already didn't know about this. I hate getting made fun of and it happened anyway. You have no idea how tempted I am right now to really be rude and leave you hanging. But everyone else who is being polite and patient don't deserve that. So here you go...

My original experiment which I spoke of:



Notice how all the no-job zots and abandoned homes are at the end of these dead end streets. If I would have shortened my streets by 2 tiles, this would have even been better.

This is a shot of the new city I was working on. I modified the original design to get it looking and working much better.



This is the close up view of the trick. That portion of street that looks like a speed bump is actually a segment of one-way road.



Here are the very easy steps on how this is done.

Step 1: Lay down a one-way road 2 tiles long headed in the direction of the planned residential area.



The rest is all common sense from here, but I'll contine anyway.

Step 2: Connect that section with a street that gives access to your planned industry or commercial area.



Step 3: Lay a street from the other end of that section.



Step 4: Zone one side with jobs, the other side with housing.



Your Sims are prevented from driving to work over the one-way section of road, thus they must walk or starve.



Can you believe how simple that is? Neither could I.

Now aren't you glad I am not as rude as some claimed that I am?

As far as I know, this works with high density as well. The problem is when you have R$$ & R$$$. They hate walking. So all I did was set R$$ & R$$$ taxes to 14% to keep them away.

Also, I tested emergency units with this. They do get stuck at those sections.

Have fun. I will be looking forward to see what the rest of you do with this trick since I still suck at building large cities. But at least I solved my traffic problems.

[pnorrell 4]

Ah-ha! Sure, I've built lots of cities that way! (just kidding )

Seriously, it never would have occurred to me. Neat trick. Doesn't have to be used on such a large scale either. Could be employed selectively, to create quiet pedestrian streets in certain areas.

 

Thanks for sharing the tip!

[Simbourgeois 139]

Your Sims are prevented from driving to work over the one-way section of road, thus they must walk or starve

Nice experiment An easy way how to solve the problem of overweighted population

 

 I'll tell about this to my city planners

 

Simbourgeois

Mayor of Belleville

[unexistance 1]

Wow dude, you rocks , by the way, does the city grows?

[dgrid 0]

very cool!!

 

At some point, I'd like to create an Ecotopia region, I'm sure that trick could come in useful!

[SamFlash 0]

Congratulations.  Neat trick with the one-ways.  Not something I would have thought of. 

[wafgking 22]

Great Work!  I'm amazed

Perhaps I will force certain sims to walk.  I'm actually forcing you to walk.  This is a hold up, I have gun.  WALK!

 

We're just all impatient, and the long wait made us go crazy.   (We've been waiting to long for SimCity5)

[Xyloxadoria 1,098]

walk or die!!!

I never thogt of doing that, it reminds me of the early industral age, large factories, small low quality houses , everybody walked, i woder what the avarage income is?