Modify trees that show up on JRJ SAM

[Raymond7cn 6,776]

5 hours ago, junspud said:

I tried copying over all of the RKT values from the Rowan tree exemplars into the palm trees thinking it might override them in game, but it does not. Am I editing the wrong file and exemplars?

Hi junspud:

Do you want to make a T21?  As RSC204 have mention before:

On 2019/10/14 at 12:09 AM, rsc204 said:

Where this method comes unstuck is changing non-seasonal trees to seasonal ones or vice versa. Like I mentioned in an earlier post, you'll need to add/remove props, depending on the changes you are making. But the real deal-killer is that changing the RKT type # of existing props leads to Prop Pox. I.e. you can't safely override an RKT 1 Exemplar (non-seasonal) to an RKT 4 (seasonal) or vice versa. In this case you would need to give the Prop Exemplars unique IDs. Which means you'd still have to go through the process of altering all the T21s, you'd also need to refresh them in-game before the old ones were replaced.

I think you need to replace them with a props but not a Flora type. (could tell by you picture)  From the pic below you can see that girafe made LE_ files for most of his trees, you can find that from there.

It's just my experience, I'm not profession but hope I can help.

-- Raymond

[rsc204 21,866]

7 hours ago, junspud said:

I tried copying over all of the RKT values from the Rowan tree exemplars into the palm trees thinking it might override them in game, but it does not. Am I editing the wrong file and exemplars?

I suspect you need to do a little more digging to ensure you are overriding the correct exemplars. Girafe typically releases each model with two sets of exemplars, Flora (used for MMPs) and Props, which can be used in the Lot Editor. But if the trees you are looking to change are showing on networks in-game, then the Exemplars referencing them must be T21s. However, I suspect an override is also in play complicating matters, because I don't know of a single T21 mod for Girafe's trees in the wild. Most likely, you have some sort of Maxis Tree replacer that's replacing the regular Palm trees with Girafe's nicer models. I'd therefore have to assume that you were using TWrecks mod here:

 

It will be the exemplars for the Palm trees in that set which need the RTK IDs changing. But you need to cross reference the Exemplar IDs carefully to be sure you are altering the right IDs.

[junspud 1,069]

Thanks for the support.

I was attempting to replace the palm trees 'at the source', as in replace the prop/flora entirely so every instance of them is overridden, like some of the mods that exist for the Maxis trees. My understanding of modding is not that great though. I suspect now I was modifying only the MMP exemplars.

At the moment, I'm kind of looking over some of the plugins that replace the Maxis palm trees to try and gain some insight into how I would do the same thing with this Canary Palm tree.

I do actually use that plugin of T-Wrecks, I also am using the component which replaces the palm trees with cypress trees.

Frankly, I think I'm going to have to start my plugin folder over, which I'm not looking forward to. I went a bit datpacker happy with it and didn't take the time to keep everything clean and compartmentalized/backed up properly, so I've been running into some issues.

To try and save some time, I've just been using those overrides you included in the previous post in this thread. They do the job for the most part, but they also makes these canary palm trees show up in heavy numbers which I think may be the result of a mixture of conflicts from several different plugins.

Eventually I'd like to break into the T21 side of things, but tbh I still have a pretty poor grasp of this stuff.

 

 

[junspud 1,069]

18 hours ago, Raymond7cn said:

Hi junspud:

Do you want to make a T21?  As RSC204 have mention before:

I think you need to replace them with a props but not a Flora type. (could tell by you picture)  From the pic below you can see that girafe made LE_ files for most of his trees, you can find that from there.

It's just my experience, I'm not profession but hope I can help.

-- Raymond

Thank you, actually your screenshots from the reader have been very helpful, you're much further along with this stuff, and I do like your work and appreciate the help.

[rsc204 21,866]

8 hours ago, junspud said:

I was attempting to replace the palm trees 'at the source', as in replace the prop/flora entirely so every instance of them is overridden, like some of the mods that exist for the Maxis trees. My understanding of modding is not that great though. I suspect now I was modifying only the MMP exemplars.

To do this, you want to work the other way around. Instead of changing RTK IDs of Exemplars, change the IDs of the actual models. Then every exemplar that links to the old model will instead show the new one. Remember an RTK ID is simply telling the game which Model ID to display.

8 hours ago, junspud said:

Frankly, I think I'm going to have to start my plugin folder over, which I'm not looking forward to. I went a bit datpacker happy with it and didn't take the time to keep everything clean and compartmentalized/backed up properly, so I've been running into some issues.

My first attempt with the DatPacker was also an unmitigated failure. I packed 6GBs of plugins and promptly broke many things. Since then I've learned to DATPack smaller chucks more slowly, although I often take a more manual approach to consolidating files together. It helps that I've a grounding in how things work.

[Raymond7cn 6,776]

9 hours ago, junspud said:

Thank you, actually your screenshots from the reader have been very helpful, you're much further along with this stuff, and I do like your work and appreciate the help.

That's so nice of you to say. I am also a freshman,  These website have many friendly and polite people, like rsc204. I just influence by them, Recently i am learning the NAM, english and build some lots by myself(Dodger stadium). if i can help you more please tell me.

-- Raymond

[junspud 1,069]

Trying to follow this guide;

https://www.sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=7367.0

 

So I would copy all of the S3D exemplars into a new dat, and then edit them all accordingly, or do I misunderstand?

[rsc204 21,866]

You are confusing the RKT property of Exemplars (files full of properties), with S3D model files and their FSH pairs. I.e. the tutorial is for modifying the Exemplars, when we are trying to modify the model files. 

If you want rid of the Palms, you need to find the current RKT ID of the model you want to replace. Just look at the Group ID of all the S3D/FSH files of the respective model, they should all use an identical GID.

Then open the file containing the model you wish to see instead of the palm tree. Using the TGI Editor, give all items inside it the GID of the model you no longer wish to see. Use Save As to make your modified file a copy. Make sure your new DAT loads after any instances of the model you want it to replace.

[junspud 1,069]

It's such a shame that most of the modding tutorials I've found for SC4 no longer have the pictures which accompanied them unfortunately rendering many if not most of them unusable.

[rsc204 21,866]

8 hours ago, junspud said:

It's such a shame that most of the modding tutorials I've found for SC4 no longer have the pictures which accompanied them unfortunately rendering many if not most of them unusable.

I hear this argument a lot, but this does not match with my experience. Usually, despite missing pictures, with some understanding, most things can still be figured out. Is there a specific tutorial or point where you are having trouble?, someone can probably help clarify things if you point us to the tutorial and tell us what you're trying to work out.

[junspud 1,069]

On 12/26/2019 at 5:49 AM, rsc204 said:

I hear this argument a lot, but this does not match with my experience. Usually, despite missing pictures, with some understanding, most things can still be figured out. Is there a specific tutorial or point where you are having trouble?, someone can probably help clarify things if you point us to the tutorial and tell us what you're trying to work out.

https://www.sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=7049.msg224353#msg224353

https://www.sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=70.msg1905#msg1905

These two are the latest I've come across, I've been trying to figure out how to replace the textures on the Pedmall tiles, specifically the cobblestone/pavement ones, apparently it's not supposed to be too difficult but I'm still pretty useless at using the Reader competently, I'm having difficulty trying to follow the steps in these tutorials.

A tutorial on creating custom MMPs presented the same issue for me. If I remember right, I ran into the same issue with a tutorial on how to make overhanging props for lots like the diagonal fillers.

https://www.sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=6843.msg325217#msg325217

Also unfortunately none of the images for the RHW interchange guides remain.

[rsc204 21,866]

I've looked at the T21 tutorials and most of what you need to know is explained. You just need to match what you are seeing with the descriptions. T21 mods are not all that complex, just a series of properties you set in the Reader. The most complex of which is kPropertyID_Network Placement Pattern. Indeed to even begin to understand that, you'd need the original image, good job I've a copy:

Actually, I had embedded it into an Excel 2003 file, which I use as a consolidated resource/reference. No way to get at that in Excel 2003, but I can save as 2007 .xlsx format. After converting it and using this trick, voila!, a perfect quality image restored. I'll try to get the tutorial updated, at least with this image, doubtful I kept the others.

On the subject of T21s, if you have any other questions, just try to be specific. It's very hard to assist anyone who just states general problems. No matter how many you have, they can be worked through one at a time if need be.

On 28/12/2019 at 1:36 AM, junspud said:

A tutorial on creating custom MMPs presented the same issue for me. If I remember right, I ran into the same issue with a tutorial on how to make overhanging props for lots like the diagonal fillers.

MMPs are again just a case of understanding how things connect together and having a good template to work with. Poking around files that work similarly to something you want to do is a great way to better understand them. But, you will need some grounding in how Properties/IDs and such link things and alter how they work. I have got this on my to-do list to make a new tutorial, but I've very limited time for such things right now and a ridiculous amount of outstanding projects.

Overhanging lots are easy and there really is only two methods:

1. BAT a 16x16m model with the texture applied, which means lots of work colour-matching.
2. Use the same S3D (3D Model/RTK0) approach I do for many of my props.

I'd not only recommend the second method, but if all you want to use is shapes that already exist with different models, you can use mine (MGB Filler Set - file MGB S3D Props.dat) as templates. To alter the texture, you need simply:

• Copy the Prop Exemplar/S3D model you need, treat both as one "set".
• Right click on the Prop Exemplar and select Generate New Group/Instance, to give the Prop a unique ID.
• Repeat for the S3D file, note neither ID need be remotely similar, just unique.
• Edit the Property Resource Key Type 0 in the Prop Exemplar, give it the new Group ID and Instance ID the S3D now has.
• Rename Exemplar Name to something more accurate.
• Select the S3D file in Reader, click on the "Mats" tab.
• Find the texture used on the S3D, note many of mine use a "Diffuser" layer.
  This automatically makes a lot texture used with this S3D appear colour-corrected in game. If you are using a transit texture, usually you will want to disable this, I'm guessing you won't need to do this.
• Right click that and select Set Texture.
• In the Instance column, replace the Instance ID, with the ID of the Texture you want to use.
  Note: Only "Transit Textures", i.e. those with a Group ID of 1ABE787D will work with these S3D models. By comparison Lot Textures use the Group ID 0986135E. I'm not talking about correcting colour shifts, but this time you must use the first GID or your texture won't appear on the model.
• Click OK to close this window, check the ID under Material ID has changed. In the top left of the S3D section of Reader (Right Pane), click on Apply.
  Otherwise you'll loose all changes.
• Now you can save the file and test your new Overhanging Prop.
  Note textures can look funky in the LE, but trust the Process and in-game they are always fine.

On 28/12/2019 at 1:36 AM, junspud said:

Also unfortunately none of the images for the RHW interchange guides remain.

True, but there is nothing that can be done about that sadly. A lot of the designs would have used outdated methods, but of course just as inspiration they were great.

[junspud 1,069]

Would you know why I can't see any of the lots/ect in the preview box? I tried dropping the dll's I saw mentioned elsewhere but it's still just blank.

The only previews I can see are the Simcity1.dat lots.

[rsc204 21,866]

19 hours ago, junspud said:

Would you know why I can't see any of the lots/ect in the preview box?

Because that box is not a preview of the lot, rather of the linked model in the Buildings Exemplar. The ID used (Resource Key Type 0), is a blank or invisible model, so what you see is actually correct.

[junspud 1,069]

On 10/13/2019 at 11:09 AM, rsc204 said:

That's much simpler, just create an override. As above, find all the relevant Exemplars and make a copy of them. DO NOT re-ID these Exemplars, the idea is to use them as overrides for the originals. Now for each copied Exemplar alter the RTK ID to the tree you want to replace the one of the original Exemplar. This way the Exemplar IDs are still there, so you don't have to refresh your T21s, it just dynamically updates the tree models.

About finding/coping the exemplar, say I want to override a Maxis prop, is it necessary to open Simcity1.dat and find the specific exemplar for the prop and copy it, or is it possible to create a new exemplar manually if I have the prop ID, and then edit the RTK in the new exemplar to the prop I want to show up?

[rsc204 21,866]

3 hours ago, junspud said:

About finding/coping the exemplar, say I want to override a Maxis prop, is it necessary to open Simcity1.dat and find the specific exemplar for the prop and copy it, or is it possible to create a new exemplar manually if I have the prop ID, and then edit the RTK in the new exemplar to the prop I want to show up?

Really, either way is fine, provided the Prop Exemplar's TGI's matched. If you do copy the one from SimCity_1.dat, it can be useful to have a copy of the properties of the original prop to work from in some cases. If finding a Prop Exemplar is troublesome, use the Navigator window in Reader, sort by Object and you'll see a list of Prop Names. You find what you are looking for in this Window and either use the Patch option to export the Exemplar or Synchronise, to jump to the selected item in Navigator in the main pane of Reader. For stubbon ones, things aren't necessarily named for easy finding, open PIM-X with the Maxis folders selected, open any lot and go through the Props visually to cross-reference the name. This will make finding it in Reader much quicker.

 

[junspud 1,069]

Thanks, I've been trying to fix this weird glitch where one of my vanilla Maxis trash cans has been replaced with a staircase looking thing.

 

Kind of off-topic, but do you know anything about PIM-X not saving groups after closing the lot editor? The groups themselves stay, but after the lot editor is closed all of the stuff in the groups disappears.. tried changing file permissions and moving the PIM-X folder to /C:/ but nothing seems to work.. The only objects which stay populated in the groups are ones added into groups.ini manually from the included file in the KOSC plugins. I'd add stuff to the groups.ini file manually but I don't understand the formatting/syntax.

[Flann 1,709]

On 10/29/2019 at 2:17 AM, Raymond7cn said:

Hey, everybody! I am back. Finally i finished my JRJ's Replace work. I replaced all the trees with girafe's HD seasonal trees, I have to say it takes hours to modify the T21 and plenty of work for me. But whatever when i saw the dream come true in the game, It's going to be worth it. Below there are some pictures of the result:

These are not the most beautiful views of my city, The Ash and Rowan are my favorite, but since the trees came out by random, So i will just trying to capture them next time.

I use 13 kinds of Girafe’s seasonal trees(each of them has 3 to 7 species of appearences). And I also made the Avenue,Street,Road,Oneway side’s seasonal trees. With the Road and Oneway, I also deleted the colorful parking signs, since it’s not match in my opinion. When i modifing i try some strange ideas for a faster way to do it, unfortune, most of them were failed, I just simply replace each tree for three or two(autumn,summer winter||summer winter) props . After all i am not profession, I am still growing.

Next step I want to replace some other staffs with HD one, Such as car bench or trash can with my taste.

And I have rsc204 to thank for it. Also with the help of the tools 'DATANode'(help me to figure out what to be replaced quickly).

 

 

 

Hi Raymond,

I'm wondering if the work you did replacing the JRJ streetwise mod trees is something you'd be willing to share?  I'd really like to use it in my cities.

[Raymond7cn 6,776]

19 minutes ago, Flann said:

Hi Raymond,

I'm wondering if the work you did replacing the JRJ streetwise mod trees is something you'd be willing to share?  I'd really like to use it in my cities.

Hiya @Flann, Thank you for your appreciation, But i thought i couldn't publish my custom mod here, I just modified and replaced those trees and props, however that's still Jeronij's work due to T21 Exemplar's IID IMO, i'm not sure, Could we wait for the permission or tips about this from @CorinaMarie @Cyclone Boom.

Sorry about that, But i have had a plan to make a T21 mod from scratch by myself, I'm still learning in my Newbie's thread,  You may could wait for a while, since i'm really have tons of works to do by now. Sorry! Flann.

Sincerely,

-- Raymond

[CorinaMarie 29,894]

13 minutes ago, Raymond7cn said:

Could we wait for the permission or tips about this from @CorinaMarie @Cyclone Boom.

Our own understanding is that it is the creative work such as S3D models that are typically not allowed to be modified and shared. However, exemplars are simply data and as such wouldn't have the same restrictions for altering and sharing.

All the trees and whatever props would, ofc, still be dependencies and those need obtained from their original source.

-Cori & CB

[Raymond7cn 6,776]

Hiya @Flann, 

I'm probably just being a little overcautious, CoriBoom™ has explained it to me, Now i have known how to do it, Please give me more couple of days, i need to tidy it up a bit and also some tests, then i will let you know it's done here.

Sincerely,

-- Raymond