IM and I-HT: Gotta keep 'em separated!

[Potetgul 2]

When I research SC4, one of the issues I see most frequently asked about or explained is how to get I-HT to develop in a city. Totally understandable, people want their cities to advance and to fill them with healthy, wealthy sims. I want to ask the opposite question, though: Are there any methods or ideas for limiting HT development in certain areas? More specifically, I want to keep it from mixing in with my Manufacturing.

I ran into a situation where my first and main city started getting some IM demand, but there wasn't much room left to zone it, so I started a neighbor city specifically to fill that demand, with a little bit of residential and a small medium-density industrial zone. I only needed to raise the ID tax level to 12% to ensure a nice, negative demand level for that, and I got a little IM-only industrial park started, just enough to satisfy IM demand in the first city.

Then I played the first city for a while, until the demand for IM went up again. In the meantime I had also managed to generate some demand for HT. I went into City #2 and zoned more industrial in a long rectangle. The sections at the end of this rectangle, farthest from the existing Manufacturing development, grew a mix of HT and M. The pollution from the M then chased out some of the HT and I had abandoned buildings in my zone.

I am a control freak and did not like seeing HT develop just to be chased out by the pollution of its neighbors. I'd rather not spend my time bulldozing abandoned buildings if I can avoid it.

Can it be avoided? Is a mix of M and HT something I will have to live with until demand for HT rises enough for me to be able to grow some exclusively-HT zones, or is there a way to balance desirability of a zone such that M will develop, but not HT?

Maybe whoever is reading this thinks I am missing the point of the game and should just take the HT that I can get because it is a good thing for my city and region, but this is bugging me. If there's no viable option I'll let this slide and plan to bulldoze stuff. And grumble about it.

Side question: I've never played a region long enough to find out for myself, but is it possible (without using mods or cheats) to develop a region so that all dirty industrial is eliminated, or is it necessary to have a place for it somewhere? All of my past attempts to get rid of it and replace it with cleaner industry just threw my whole region out of whack. It was chaos and anarchy, I tell ya...

[urbanconstanta 36]

you can raise the I-HT tax to 20% si it will develop slower and reduce the I-M tax to a minimum or even 0, any other ways i dont' know

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

Setting any taxes to 20% inhibits development entirely for that sector. Adjusting taxes will certainly do it, but it is city wide. One method is to isolate industry in a separate city tile connected by roads and/or rail. This is not the best way to handle this.

The game is designed to be balanced with all three development types present. However, the amount of each is regulated by zoning, and can be controlled by taxes. You can certainly reduce the IM by setting the taxes up to around 12-13% and get rid of ID by setting its taxes to 20%.

Also, pay attention to what zoning means. The development types are density, not wealth. This is how you get R$$$ mansions on single occupancy properties. You don't zone for wealth, but buildings of a certain wealth need certain densities to be grown. (Groan!) It sometime takes people quite a while to realize the relationship is not direct. It is a fact that the only industry that will grow on a single occupancy industrial lot is a farm. All factories and plants grow on medium to high density, and any wealth class may grow there.

  Edited September 16, 2012 by A Nonny Moose  

[Potetgul 2]

Thanks Nonny, your reply has been very helpful as usual.

I'm not confused about the difference between density and wealth levels, just looking for a way to develop nice I-HT zones.

After doing some closer checking, I realized my problem isn't as bad as I thought: I saw I-HT buildings turning darker and more sooty and thought they were abandoned, but they weren't fully abandoned, they were just not fully-staffed I guess. I then realized that fully-abandoned buildings look almost black. So functionally, it looks like having some I-HT interspersed with the I-M is not a problem.

I'll live. But I still don't like it! Hah!

That being said, since fiddling with tax rates is indeed citywide, I would probably steer clear of that.

So what are high-density industrial zones like? I don't think I've ever zoned that dense with industrial. Never felt the need to, as I've always been able to satisfy demand with medium density zones. I know that with C and R, I get taller buildings housing more sims or providing more jobs, but I can't envision industrial "skyscrapers." Are there different lots that grow? Bigger factories? Or does the high density just tend to favor I-HT development over the others?

[Lucario Boricua 7,060]

High density industrial zones will yield the big factories--sizes 3 x 3 and up to 4 x 6 coming from Maxis are typical, some are much bigger (say, 6 x 6, or more at times) coming from custom buildings. Now, in order to get them, do the following:

- use the "ctrl" key to zone custom-sized lots in the industrial area--you hold the key while defining the zone with the mouse

- make sure to provide water in order to make them grow

- any building you particularly like should get historic rating

- in general, make sure the narrow dimension of the lot faces the road--most of these grow this way

If this isn't done, you'll get a lot of smaller buildings in the way, minimizing the chances of appearance of the large ones.

  Edited September 16, 2012 by Dragonxander  

[KonstantinII 1,106]

If pollution is the problem,try downloading air filters.

[jason leo 485]

Thanks Nonny, your reply has been very helpful as usual.

I'm not confused about the difference between density and wealth levels, just looking for a way to develop nice I-HT zones.

After doing some closer checking, I realized my problem isn't as bad as I thought: I saw I-HT buildings turning darker and more sooty and thought they were abandoned, but they weren't fully abandoned, they were just not fully-staffed I guess. I then realized that fully-abandoned buildings look almost black. So functionally, it looks like having some I-HT interspersed with the I-M is not a problem.

I'll live. But I still don't like it! Hah!

That being said, since fiddling with tax rates is indeed citywide, I would probably steer clear of that.

So what are high-density industrial zones like? I don't think I've ever zoned that dense with industrial. Never felt the need to, as I've always been able to satisfy demand with medium density zones. I know that with C and R, I get taller buildings housing more sims or providing more jobs, but I can't envision industrial "skyscrapers." Are there different lots that grow? Bigger factories? Or does the high density just tend to favor I-HT development over the others?

No, industrial skyscraper never exist even in the real world, as i know. They just a bit bigger and need more workers than normal factories. They will grow in area that Dragonxander already explain. It will not easy for you to keep demands in the rate that you want if you don't have any mod. The best way to steer the demand is steer the quality of the required workers. Highly educated rich and medium wealth sims will make higher I-HT demand while poor and low educated people will cause I-D demand to rise. While I-M will need low and mid-educated people with medium wealth. If you reach the quality of worker that certain industry type need, than the demand of that industry type will rise. By this way, you could steer the demand without getting no money because of too low tax that cause those factories pay nothing or too high tax that could cause abandonement. That is my best way to solve this demand problem, but you also need to know how to reach the quality of workers that those industries need. To make sure people with higher wealth come, you will need longer lifespan, safer community, availabilty of power and water, and education facilities availability also job that they will need. It is totally your choice about the way to advertise peoples that you want to come to your cities and the way to steer your demand. Remember with one of the basics of the game, It is impossible if R or C or I demand will not affecting each other.

[estevesbk 4]

In my personal experience of someone beginning to play SC4 again, increasing Education and Health even further decreases the demand for I-M and increases for I-HT. The only point is that I-HT doesn't seem to "bulldoze" I-M buildings to occupy their space on their own as it does to I-D, so you may need some manual bulldozing (but I'm not sure though). From my previous experiences of the past years, I'm starting small. Getting just a few people, then educating, then getting more... I think you will have a lot more of control. It takes much more time but it's more pleasant.

Try also zoning small amounts of zones. Mix them a little, R C and I. That way, I-M factories will really not cause a lot of pollution.

[Commikaze 1]

I've found that the best way to help out I-HT that grows into a predominantly I-M area is to place parks near the buildings. This can very noticeably improve the occupancy of the buildings, as well as promoting the growth of I-HT in newly zoned land.

If you want to select for only I-M, you can zone the medium-density industrial into an area that is not serviced with water. I-HT will not at all grow without water, but neither will high-density factories if you later choose to change the zoning.

[robloxkiller 25]

or if u want it easy just use Dusktrooper's building blocker use all of the industrial blockers except I-HT increase the taxes for all industrial density levels except I-HT and voila a very techy city

thats how i got my I-HT

  Edited September 23, 2012 by robloxkiller  

[woodnava 30]

I've found that the best way to help out I-HT that grows into a predominantly I-M area is to place parks near the buildings. This can very noticeably improve the occupancy of the buildings, as well as promoting the growth of I-HT in newly zoned land.

If you want to select for only I-M, you can zone the medium-density industrial into an area that is not serviced with water. I-HT will not at all grow without water, but neither will high-density factories if you later choose to change the zoning.

its true? for IM ? i want to b IM only in town

[Bdub01 201]

If you only want MI in the city then tax DI and HT-I to the max.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

I-M needs water.  Not many plants grow without water -- pun intended.  If you keep a medium level of pollution in an I-M area, I-HT will not grow there.  Check your desirability display.