SimCity: Transit and Roading Networks

[baertooth 330]

MaxisGuillaume, is it possible to make pedestrian cities? In Simcity Societies, one of the things that was possible with that game was I was able to make cities that were completely walking cities. This especially works well with islands and villages. Such as can one build using just sidewalks to connect RCI?

And I was wondering what happens to Sims if they go to a neighboring town to go to work but the transit to the home city is cut off? How does the engine deal with that?

  Edited September 20, 2012 by baertooth  

[Wiimeiser 452]

And I was wondering what happens to Sims if they go to a neighboring town to go to work but the transit to the home city is cut off? How does the engine deal with that?

I wouldn't know. But maybe that's why all routes are two-way...

[Haljackey 17,385]

Its good to know we're getting some information on transit.

Has there been any development on the roads front? Still looking to see the first highways, interchanges, roundabouts, turning lanes n stuff if they are to be included in this game.

[MaxisGuillaume 289]

MaxisGuillaume, is it possible to make pedestrian cities? In Simcity Societies, one of the things that was possible with that game was I was able to make cities that were completely walking cities. This especially works well with islands and villages. Such as can one build using just sidewalks to connect RCI?

I've touched on that a bit on the SimCity forums:

http://forum.ea.com/eaforum/posts/list/8992736.page#25095185

If you're very careful about your planning, keeping your blocks mixed with R, C & I, I think you'd be able to achieve it.

[tombrown14 6]

Complexity is different from complicated. Making a game complex and feature rich but simple to use is honestly the ideal.

Exactly. The problem is that they have lost sight of that ideal. The implementation of that ideal was what made Simcity successful in the first place.

I'm always worried when people claim that something has grown to complex. It obviously wasn't much of a jump for anybody to move from Simcity 2000 to 3000. Imho, saying the gme ight have been too complex for new players is really pointing out that SimCity 4 was by far the least finished game in the series. Buggy, awkward, poor pathfinding, contrary game outcomes and so for me i couldn't simply jump in the same way i had in Simciity 2k or 3k.

To me, it was because the game wasn't exactly right that people found it difficult or hard to play. Because it didn't play how you expected it to.

One example would be the RCI demand graph. Now there is no reason why it should have a negative axis, seeing as that suggests that you need to destroy or close rather than the demand is low. Either the demand is there or not, but it cannot be negative anything as zero is the base. Yet that simple (but utterly ridiculous) concept of supply and demand escaped everybody. It also added a level of complexity that was unnecessary.

If games like Anno that dress up simple theoretical economics as something complex can exist then there is no reason why EA and Maxis need to assume that the game is too complex. I can't think of any reviews i read where anybody suggested that the game was unplayable because it was too complicated, rather they complained about shoddy things here and there.

The need to appeal to the lowest common denominator seems to be a waste here because on balance if building a fantasy city sounds difficult chances are they don;t want a game with much complexity at all. For me the prostituting for trade aspect is the most creepy, because most people know where to go. You rarely have to advertise unless there's a lot of competition - which there isn't. The alternatives barely come close to what has been achieved however THEY, not SimCity has the new player market. I think the bottom line is if YOU say your OWN product is too complex without the actual players agreeing then you doomed yourself. it's the eternal;

'I'm fat!'

'No! You're beautiful!'

But if you don't listen to me the you'll always think you're a fatty.

[grugor 60]

The blog that was supposed to be released friday was up on the insider site for a bit before it was pulled.

noting noteworthy really except emergency vehicles will change the traffic lights to green.

sims follow rules to get to their destination

[Wiimeiser 452]

And no mention of highways I assume?

I guess One Way Roads will mess up the pathfinding...

[mikamocha_ye 0]

A suggestion for the new game, I agree that transit networks should be divided into these categories (suggestion):

Normal Roads, Full Access Roads, 2 to 8 lanes, speed limit: 50 km/h

Fast Lane, Limited Access Road, 2 to 10 lanes, speed limit: 80 km/h (intra-city), 120 km/h (inter-city)

Railway: Single and Dual Track Railway; Small, Medium, and Large Passenger Railway Station; Small, Medium, and Large Freight Railway Station

Road Mass Transit: Bus, Trolleybus, Angkot (Shared Taxi), Taxi, Busway (BRT/Bus Rapid Transit)

Rail Mass Transit: Light Rail, Commuter Rail, Underground and Elevated Metro, Monorail

Sea and Air Mass Transit: Helicopter, Ferry, Speedboat

Inter City: Airports, and Harbor

Hub: Hubs of 2-5 mass transit mode

[wtrtwnguy 3]

I think it is safe to say there won't be any limited access highways (expressways). The 6-lane avenues seem to be their replacement, which, considering the small city size, is probably not that big of a deal. I wish the pre-built highways were real highways though, not roads with at-grade intersections that lack any design.

I am still hoping one way roads and side streets make it into the game, but it looks like that won't be happening either. For small cities/towns, narrow alleys would be nice. On the upside, those things could be added in an expansion pack.

[Vampirovibrio 43]

Subways would be a great option to have. If they do make it to the game, I wonder if the park and ride option will also work with it. Or importantly, will the park and ride option only work with bus stops what about trams?

[Wiimeiser 452]

I am still hoping one way roads and side streets make it into the game, but it looks like that won't be happening either. For small cities/towns, narrow alleys would be nice. On the upside, those things could be added in an expansion pack.

Question: what would happen, in theory, if each road connection was either an entrance or an exit, not both? The game would go crazy trying to figure stuff out, right?

[grugor 60]

I am still hoping one way roads and side streets make it into the game, but it looks like that won't be happening either. For small cities/towns, narrow alleys would be nice. On the upside, those things could be added in an expansion pack.

Question: what would happen, in theory, if each road connection was either an entrance or an exit, not both? The game would go crazy trying to figure stuff out, right?

Not really.

I think it is safe to say there won't be any limited access highways (expressways). The 6-lane avenues seem to be their replacement, which, considering the small city size, is probably not that big of a deal. I wish the pre-built highways were real highways though, not roads with at-grade intersections that lack any design.

I am still hoping one way roads and side streets make it into the game, but it looks like that won't be happening either. For small cities/towns, narrow alleys would be nice. On the upside, those things could be added in an expansion pack.

i have watched loads of gameplay videos looking for one way roads without any luck. An avenue has basicly two one way roads side by side and traffic will go to the correct side when turning onto it. It should be possible to include one way roads by just using one side of an avenue. ill block one side if i have to.

  Edited September 22, 2012 by CaptCity  
Language. See the rules.

[MaxisGuillaume 289]

I am still hoping [...] side streets make it into the game.

Yeah that's the two-lane street (one lane on each side), or are you talking about something even smaller?

Or importantly, will the park and ride option only work with bus stops what about trams?

Mmmh good suggestion, I'll see what I can do.

[Eurofighter1200 0]

Can we set prices for the public transport so that the Town can earn money or we can influence the attractiveness for buses? or can we set some road charge like in sc4?

[grugor 60]

I am still hoping [...] side streets make it into the game.

Or importantly, will the park and ride option only work with bus stops what about trams?

Mmmh good suggestion, I'll see what I can do.

You have included park and ride ( great btw ) , but are you seriously saying that you never thought of park and ride trams or trains until now ???

One way roads ? yes / no

[Haljackey 17,385]

Hmm Park'n'ride,,, Kind of how the Public Parking Garages exist in SC4? They actually work very well when placed next to train stations and the like.

Still patiently waiting for highways... Hope they're done right.

[1962boon 1]

maxisguillaume,

don t know if you guys at maxis still are able to make alterations to the new simcity to be launched in 2013, but if so, you need to take a close good look at the street intersections/crossings with trafficlights! all the trafficlights are at the wrong end of the street intersections/crossings! meaning instead of being placed at the near right corner in front of the intersection (where they should be), the trafficlights are placed at the far right corner over the intersection where the traffic enters the street right after the intsection/crossing.

as i said don t know if you guys are able at this point to fix/correct that, but if so, would be great.

apart from this, great looking game, sure gonna buy it when it s available next year!

[wtrtwnguy 3]

I am still hoping [...] side streets make it into the game.

Yeah that's the two-lane street (one lane on each side), or are you talking about something even smaller?

Thanks for the response. Well in SimCity4 there were main streets called roads (two lanes, one on each side) and (side) streets, that were also two lanes, but had no markings and slower moving traffic. They were excellent for low density residential neighborhoods. As an added benefit, traffic on side streets would yield to traffic on main roads, allowing for more efficient traffic planning. It seems like in SimCity2013, there are only "roads" and two types of "avenues" and that's it as far as the road network goes.

  Edited September 23, 2012 by wtrtwnguy  

[rbchaffe 9]

maxisguillaume,

don t know if you guys at maxis still are able to make alterations to the new simcity to be launched in 2013, but if so, you need to take a close good look at the street intersections/crossings with trafficlights! all the trafficlights are at the wrong end of the street intersections/crossings! meaning instead of being placed at the near right corner in front of the intersection (where they should be), the trafficlights are placed at the far right corner over the intersection where the traffic enters the street right after the intsection/crossing.

as i said don t know if you guys are able at this point to fix/correct that, but if so, would be great.

apart from this, great looking game, sure gonna buy it when it s available next year!

1962boon,

Are you sure about that? For almost all of the intersections I've seen in the real world, the traffic lights are placed at the far right for easier visibility by the drivers.

[1962boon 1]

the real world is much larger than the US alone... but i checked it on google streetview, in the US it seems common practice to put the trafficlights at the far end of an intersection, in Europe (where i live) the trafficlights are always placed at the near side of an intersection, in Australia they put the trafficlights on both sides even, near AND far!

but thanks for your comment rbchaffe, didn t know that, and now after checking it i do.

and maxisguillaume, forget i mentioned it, thought it was a blip

[1962boon 1]

maxisguillaume,

another question, from what i have seen so far in official presentations and also on the internet, is that the whole game is moving too fast (or is it shown in 'fast(er) forward' mode during those presentations ?), i mean all sims are speedwalking, cars (and even trucks) move at (super)highway speed once they re not in a trafficjam , including in downtown streets, also rounding the sharpest streetcorners way too fast; what we ve been shown in formentioned official presentations and on the internet, is that the game at its slowest possible speed ?

if so you guys really should be doing something about that much to high a speed of the whole game (wich otherwise looks great apart from this, that s why it would be such a missed opportunity) in order to make it look even more realistic. if you take real life speed and scale it down to simcity 2013, everything really should be moving much slower in the game (at standard/normal gamespeed that is, ofcourse not when you click the 'fast(er) forward' button in the game)

[lsandstrom 0]

the real world is much larger than the US alone... but i checked it on google streetview, in the US it seems common practice to put the trafficlights at the far end of an intersection, in Europe (where i live) the trafficlights are always placed at the near side of an intersection, in Australia they put the trafficlights on both sides even, near AND far!

but thanks for your comment rbchaffe, didn t know that, and now after checking it i do.

and maxisguillaume, forget i mentioned it, thought it was a blip

Yes, I think it's a bit mixed up depending on where you are. In Sweden there are both options. When it comes to bigger intersections we have stop lights both near and far (at least in some cases).

MaxisGuillaume: Just wanted to say that it's nice having you on the board answering questions. Really looking forward to the game!

[1962boon 1]

I am still hoping [...] side streets make it into the game.

Yeah that's the two-lane street (one lane on each side), or are you talking about something even smaller?

Or importantly, will the park and ride option only work with bus stops what about trams?

Mmmh good suggestion, I'll see what I can do.

maxisguillaume,

another question, from what i have seen so far in official presentations and also on the internet, is that the whole game is moving too fast (or is it shown in 'fast(er) forward' mode during those presentations ?), i mean all sims are speedwalking, cars (and even trucks) move at (super)highway speed once they re not in a trafficjam , including in downtown streets, also rounding the sharpest streetcorners way too fast; what we ve been shown in formentioned official presentations and on the internet, is that the game at its slowest possible speed ?

if so you guys really should be doing something about that much to high a speed of the whole game (wich otherwise looks great apart from this, that s why it would be such a missed opportunity) in order to make it look even more realistic. if you take real life speed and scale it down to simcity 2013, everything really should be moving much slower in the game (at standard/normal gamespeed that is, ofcourse not when you click the 'fast(er) forward' button in the game)

the only things/vehicles that move at a proper scale speed seem to be the new streetcars/trams!

i can t imagine that i m the first one to start up this speed to scale issue!

looking forward to your reaction

[Vampirovibrio 43]

I am still hoping [...] side streets make it into the game.

Yeah that's the two-lane street (one lane on each side), or are you talking about something even smaller?

Or importantly, will the park and ride option only work with bus stops what about trams?

Mmmh good suggestion, I'll see what I can do.

Thanks. Hope it will make it into the game.

[MaxisGuillaume 289]

You have included park and ride ( great btw ) , but are you seriously saying that you never thought of park and ride trams or trains until now ???

Train stations have parking, so yeah, people will drive there before taking the train. Tram stops however are placed in the middle of avenues, so I'm not sure where their parking lot would be...

[MaxisGuillaume 289]

I am still hoping [...] side streets make it into the game.

Yeah that's the two-lane street (one lane on each side), or are you talking about something even smaller?

Or importantly, will the park and ride option only work with bus stops what about trams?

Mmmh good suggestion, I'll see what I can do.

maxisguillaume,

another question, from what i have seen so far in official presentations and also on the internet, is that the whole game is moving too fast (or is it shown in 'fast(er) forward' mode during those presentations ?), i mean all sims are speedwalking, cars (and even trucks) move at (super)highway speed once they re not in a trafficjam , including in downtown streets, also rounding the sharpest streetcorners way too fast; what we ve been shown in formentioned official presentations and on the internet, is that the game at its slowest possible speed ?

if so you guys really should be doing something about that much to high a speed of the whole game (wich otherwise looks great apart from this, that s why it would be such a missed opportunity) in order to make it look even more realistic. if you take real life speed and scale it down to simcity 2013, everything really should be moving much slower in the game (at standard/normal gamespeed that is, ofcourse not when you click the 'fast(er) forward' button in the game)

the only things/vehicles that move at a proper scale speed seem to be the new streetcars/trams!

i can t imagine that i m the first one to start up this speed to scale issue!

looking forward to your reaction

We're shooting for this aesthetic:

[lsandstrom 0]

We're shooting for this aesthetic:

Beautiful video, if the game can hold somewhat that standard it will be amazing to just sit back and watch your city!

On an other note.. I was thinking about the roads. Will you be able to prioritize on street over another in an intersection? Will there be an option to put in stop signs for specifik streets etc? Or will all of them have stop lights?

  Edited September 24, 2012 by lsandstrom  

[MaxisGuillaume 289]

On an other note.. I was thinking about the roads. Will you be able to prioritize on street over another in an intersection? Will there be an option to put in stop signs for specifik streets etc? Or will all of them have stop lights?

The game figures it out for you. Street & street intersection is all stops, road & street has lights (longer green for the road than it is for the street), road & road has lights, etc...

[grugor 60]

You have included park and ride ( great btw ) , but are you seriously saying that you never thought of park and ride trams or trains until now ???

Train stations have parking, so yeah, people will drive there before taking the train. Tram stops however are placed in the middle of avenues, so I'm not sure where their parking lot would be...

Perhaps on the side of the road and the sims then cross the road to get to the stop on foot or right beside the stop if you build the tram line without the road. btw how do the sims get to the tram stop ? just cross the busy avenue?

[The Pennsylvania Turnpike 252]

Like stated before, maxis has been playing "Big Brother" on us and trying to make Sim city 5 better. We are getting Trams like in NAM. we are getting shuddle buses and trains. And more detailed transportation system. The Main factor is that Maxis is one of the few video game companies that listens to it's gamers. I know it's owned by EA but that's Not the point. The point is Maxis is striving to make sim city 5 Fun right out of the Box. If you are not satisfied just wait for modding to be enabled