McDRye tries BAT again..

[Evillions 552]

Are you sure that is LOD issues?

[mcdrye 104]

I'm wondering if it is, but why in that corner on that single view? The LOD isnt overly complex either

[Delecto 941]

Have you tried to open the SC4Model in the Reader to have a view on it? I had this kind of problem once and it happens that I accidentally edited a LOD.

[SimFox 802]

I second Delecto's suggestion.

Open and see what is really going on. Is that particular FSH missing? Or has it for some bizarre reason got wrong Instance or other ID? It may be so that all you'd have to do is fix that ID...

May I also ask you, when you were installing this new release of Bat4Max (or when you had installed Bat4Max 2.6HD if you had it before) did you update all the rigs for the GMAX as well? I ask cause this also may be caused by miss-alignment between LOD that is created by GAMX BAT and FSHs created in MAX. To be precise miss-alignment of the cut lines. This may be caused my slight misalignment that did exist between cameras rigs in two BAT (GMAX and MAX) before. THat is a reason I redone all the GMAX rigs and included them. Although in your case we're talking about quite sizable chunk... still if you were doing it HD any problem like that would be magnified..

[mcdrye 104]

I looked at it in reader and that view is split into 3 FSHs. But when you look at the UV map the last FSH (the bit that doesnt show ingame) it has been duplicated. One has the correct UV map associated and one doesn't have any UV map associated. I'm assuming that this is not normal, and the game must be using 1x2EndA_UserModel_Z5E_2. I've tried different LODs in 3dsmax.

In the picture the top one shows the working Eastern view, whilst the bottom two show the problematic Western view.

SimFox, I think I did update the rigs but I'll update them now to be sure.

[Simbourgeois 139]

Wow, some amazing development here  I really like these, and can't wait to integrate them in my city transportation system!

I'll be watching this very closely; sorry that I can't help with the technical issues... So the only thing I can say is "Keep up the great work"

Best regards,

Simbourgeois

Mayor of Belleville

[mcdrye 104]

I'm also having another problem. When rendering the 90 Degree turn in HD, 3ds Max either crashes or a message pops up saying mental ray has run out of memory, this pops up whilst mental ray computes Final Gather points, so it hasnt even started rendering before it runs out of memory :S

[GlobexCo 33]

Originally posted by: mcdrye

I'm also having another problem. When rendering the 90 Degree turn in HD, 3ds Max either crashes or a message pops up saying mental ray has run out of memory, this pops up whilst mental ray computes Final Gather points, so it hasnt even started rendering before it runs out of memory :Squote>

Your 3dsMax version?

It says "Out of memory" or "can't allocate # bytes"?

And... are you using BSP (what settings) or BSP2?

[mcdrye 104]

I'm using 2010 and BSP. Max just says put of memory and just terminates the render. I have had the can't allocate # bytes error with a different BAT which causes Max to close.

EDIT: OOOOO I never knew about BSP2 and the fact that it can flush unused render elements from memory, I'll give it a go

[mightygoose 92]

bsp? what is this??

[GlobexCo 33]

Originally posted by: mightygoose

bsp? what is this??quote>

Originally posted by: mcdrye

I'm using 2010 and BSP. Max just says put of memory and just terminates the render. I have had the can't allocate # bytes error with a different BAT which causes Max to close.

EDIT: OOOOO I never knew about BSP2 and the fact that it can flush unused render elements from memory, I'll give it a go

quote>

So: BSP and BSP2 are two RayTrace acceleration algorithms, you can find them in "renderer" by pressing F10.

BSP = Binary Spatial Partitioning

With BSP (always used) you can decide the algorithm, and with BSP2 you can't.

If your scene poly number is 0-1.000.000 then choose BSP, if higher then choose BSP2.

3dsMax runs out of memory when the scene is too big for BSP (so choose BSP2) or when BSP settings require too much memory.

To create your own BSP algorithm, you have to edit Depth/Size settings: you start with

Size: 10

Depth: 40

For scenes with more than 500.000 poly, your settings should be:

Size: 40

Depth: 20

So, if you increase S and lower D, render will be slower but will use few memory;

if you increase D and lower S, render will be faster but will use lot of memory.

This can be useful (normal scene):

Another common problem with renders is antialiasing; if you have lots of fine details and lots of polies, try to set antialiasing to 4/4 (you start with 1/16).

BSP and Antialiasing are two common problems (if you still have problems, start a new scene and merge the old one into it - sometimes it works).

Another TIP: if you have "modular" details (cables for example), try to use proxies. Create a mesh, create a Mr Proxy, select the mesh as source and write the file. A proxy (0 polies) is useful with modular things - it's a solid like a box, so you can use it as you want (remember to apply the texture).

Hope this helps; I've got other tips, but start using these things, if you still have got problems I'll suggest other things...

[mcdrye 104]

Thank you very much GlobexCo! I tried BSP2 and it rendered fine but was slow so I adjusted the settings for BSP and it rendered fine but quicker. I've rendered the 90 degree turn now but will have to do it again as I made a mistake with the alignment .

[SimFox 802]

I don't think there should be problems with BSP on this project. I mean I needed to switch to BSP2 only when I had a scene with about 150 million polies.

What you had probably was just a error in a memory manager, or some issues with you memory module (try to run it through Prime95 test). And it might have been fine next time around (basically after restarting MAX).

What would definitely do NO GOOD what-so-ever is all that Merging into new scene - this BATing voodoo really got to be put to rest!

If you will be re-rendering things you may consider to lower saturation on your textures just a bit (about 10-15%) this should make it look more realistic and help lighting as well.

[GlobexCo 33]

Originally posted by: SimFox

a scene with about 150 million polies.quote>

150.000.000???? Are you sure this is the right number? I had fps and render problems with 1 millions polies + 6 millions of proxies - how can you manage a scene with that number of polies? (or do you have 20Tb of ram?)

What would definitely do NO GOOD what-so-ever is all that Merging into new scene - this BATing voodoo really got to be put to rest!quote>

Few months ago I had this problem:

"out of memory" in a render (2mil polies scene) - before this one I did other three renders of the same scene with no problems. I was really angry, so I deleted all the scene leaving there only a box... out of memory error again.

Max crashed, so I had to restart it - same memory problem, also after deleting the scene as I did before. I merged the model in a new scene and everything worked fine. I can say that this voodoo saved me! (probably there are more technical explanations behind what I did, and I don't know them...)

Anyway, I don't know the number of polies in your scene at the moment (have you tried to click on the [+] in the viewport and click "enable statistics"?), but I think that bsp is fine.

Have you tried also to modify Final Gather settings? It can helps a lot in slow renders (it doesn't help quality...).

[mcdrye 104]

I've re-rendered the 90 degree turn to fix alignment and also lower saturationm I have also re-rendered the 1x1 straight piece and end piece to reflect the new saturation. I'm STILL having that missing FSH on the end piece, any ideas guys based on what I posted earlier?

Other than problems with the end piece, i'm now redoing the Rail to SSR transition piece. When all is solved and the transition piece is completed I plan to release the 'Starter' pack with these 4 pieces.

Heres a pic of it ingame so far, I like how nicely the NAM works with it.

PS How you edit a lot so that it has NO/INVISIBLE Base textures?

[GlobexCo 33]

Very Very good... but it's only eyecandy .

PS How you edit a lot so that it has NO/INVISIBLE Base textures?quote>

I think you should edit something in the Reader... but I really don't know this kind of things (but I'm courious!)

[mcdrye 104]

Eyecandy indeed, how cool would it be if you could see trains down there!

Yeh to get invisible base textures you edit the Exemplar bit of the .LOT file in Reader but where and what to put I do not know

[Delecto 941]

You can use PIM-X, it allow you to creat lots without base textures. You can download here!

Looks beautiful even if only eyecandy.

DEL!

[toxicpiano 125]

Nice work mcdrye. Had you ever considered onslope wall pieces for sunken stuff using just the walls? It would be useful for sunken railways and that kind of thing.

[mcdrye 104]

toxicpiano yes I remember you suggesting this a while back but I didn't answer for some reason.

I have had a look at this, I'd have to use a different method to render a one sided piece, an to get a shadow you'd have the LOD covering the whole thing, but that has caused funky inverse shadows and such for me in previous stuff. I need to see how people do highway walls and such before doing this, I like the idea though, because you could actually have trains passing through.

[SimFox 802]

For those type of wall you don't need the actual model, I believe. Most of them are just textures.Of course than there are things like that russian guy -his nick escapes me... you know whom I'm talking about one created those famous seawalls - those are modeled....

Anyway if you want to create impression of a shadows and some such you may still get away with just a texture. Texture with backed in shadows, or what ever else effects.

On the other hand if you want to go model route you should make it into foundation rather then building. This way you can occupy only one tile - the one of the slope itself, rather then like with above mentioned seawalls which actually take 2 tiles.

I personally never done foundations but as far as I understand there is nothing to it apart from selecting foundation as a type in Plugin Manager.

PS

but with those rendered pieces... I think they are still a bit too dark. I mean it is prolly all correct and stuff, but it just look a bit off in game... could you send me one of the files I'll try to play with it to see how it could be lighten up without creating incompatible results...

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

WOW!!! I love this work of yours I can not wait till its done, somthing I need in my city!!!

[Simbourgeois 139]

These look really amazing, indeed  And an eyecandy is still a candy, isn't it 

Best regards,

Simbourgeois

Mayor of Belleville

[T Wrecks 10,209]

Originally posted by: SimFox

Of course than there are things like that russian guy -his nick escapes me... you know whom I'm talking about one created those famous seawalls - those are modeled....quote>

You mean The User Formerly Known As "marrast", who nowaday calls himself "Criquette".

As for deleting the base texture, if you do it with the reader, the method is as follows:

First, the LE work:

1) Use any base texture.

2) Write down its IID number (e.g. 0x12345678). You see it in the LE screen when the texture is on your mouse cursor, or below the texture in the texture list.

3) Save the lot.

Then we switch to the Reader:

4) Open the .sc4lot file in the Reader.

5) Select the LotConfigExemplar file in the left column. You should see its properties in the right half of the screen.

6) In the right half of the screen, expand the rightmost column (REPs) so that you can see everything

7) You will see several lot objects (LotConfigObject), each with 13 (?) REPs. (I'm not at my SimCity PC right now, so I'm not entirely sure). 

The first REP tells you what the object is - 0x00000000 is your building model, 0x00000001 is a prop, and 0x00000002 is a texture. 0x0000007 is for transit-enabled tiles.

The last REP is the Instance ID (IID) of your building, prop, or texture.

You are looking for a texture, so you need a LotConfigObject that has 0x00000002 as first REP.

And you are looking for a texture with the IID 0x12345678, so you need a LotConfigObject that has 0x12345678 as its last REP. I.e, its list of reps will be:

0x00000002,....(the other 11 REPs).......,0x12345678

Locate this object, and delete it.

9) Right-click and select "Re-index lot config"

10) Save and exit.

You are done!

Another bit of info that might help: The object lines are added to the LotConfigExemplar in chronological order. For example, if you add the texture to be deleted as last object in the LE, its line will consequently appear as last line in the list of LotConfigObjects.

I hope this might be helpful for you or anybody else.

[mcdrye 104]

Thank you very much T Wrecks! I'll give it a go later on. I've made a second type of end piece that looks like a bridge when placed on either side of a road or rail. I've also shortened the walls to let a little more light and more detail to be shown.

[DazzaDazza 29]

that look awesome dude

[Aaron Graham 4,417]

Wall  height looks good, now it looks like the perdestrians can see the passing trains.

[kellydale2003 2,276]

Four words for you!

I-am-in-love

[Jasoncw 11,840]

Cool stuff!

[mcdrye 104]

Thanks for the comments peeps! (Y) I've rexported the 90 degree piece to reflect new settings and wall height. I'm also nearly done on the SSR to Rail piece but I want your opinions! In addition to what you think of it overall, how in particular do you think the rails should be ended? The electric rails are easy and slope down like in real life but its the main rails I'm wondering about.