Canadian Federal Election

[Duke87 1,070]

"Concervative"?

Might wanna check that topic description there, buddy.

[GreekMan 246]

so harper won?

hey

Our President gets 4 years in office. if he wants to be re-elected he can serve for another 4 years with a total of 8 years. after that he can't be re-elected

is that the same for PMS?

[patriots_1228 51]

^ PMS.

hahaha...

hahahah

gahahaghgagaha

guess im still immature.

[thinboy66 6]

Nah,Geekman. In Canada, PM gets 5 year in office unless he calls an election and he can serve the country as long as he wants(correct me if I am wrong)

[GreekMan 246]

^really??? as long as he wants

patriots_1228-I guess you are =)

[IDS2 3,429]

Originally posted by: patriots_1228 ^ PMS.

hahaha...

hahahah

gahahaghgagaha

guess im still immature.quote>

Don't feel bad, I thought the same thing... So is the PMS like the president or more of a secretary of state kind of thing? Like, is he the supreme leader or is there a president too?

[Haljackey 17,398]

Thanks for the pointer duke! 

Turnout this time was 59%, the lowest in the country's history!

Anyways, here's a rundown for the country.

And the ridings:

Click this image for Full Resolution!  (WARNING: PNG Image @ full resolution)

And here's a chart for ALL the parties, major and minor.

Party		Party leader	Candidates	Seats					Popular vote
				2006	Dissol.	2008	% Change	% seats	#	%	% Change
	Conservative	Stephen Harper	307	124	127	143	+12.6%	46.4%	5,205,334	37.63%	+1.43%
	Liberal

[beebs 129]

Originally posted by: IDS2

Originally posted by: patriots_1228 ^ PMS.

hahaha...

hahahah

gahahaghgagaha

guess im still immature.quote>

Don't feel bad, I thought the same thing... So is the PMS like the president or more of a secretary of state kind of thing? Like, is he the supreme leader or is there a president too?quote>

The PM is the leader of party with the most seats in the House of Commons. So yes, he's the leader of Canada.

[Easy Bakes 253]

Wow 59% turn out is low?

[Haljackey 17,398]

Originally posted by: Easy Bakes Wow 59% turn out is low?

quote>

For Canada it is.  It has hit nearly 80% before so yes, 59%, the lowest percentage ever, is a number no Canadian should be happy about.

I would assume that the majority of that percentage came from baby boomers, who are liberal and conservative voters.  Since there was no real issue in this election election (other then the recent economic crisis) there was really no reason to call this election. 

If there was an issue that the public actually cared about and could trust the political parties with, then voter turnout should therefore increase.

Best,

-Haljackey

---

EDIT:  While I am here let me post the breakdown of seats per party:

[Aontan 0]

Since the Conservatives have a minority, are they going to form a coalition with any other party?

Or even, would the other parties form a coalition amongst themselves?

[Micah 16]

Originally posted by: Easy Bakes Wow 59% turn out is low?

quote>

 

My thoughts exactly when I heard that. That's very high here in America.

[beebs 129]

Canada historically hovers around 70-80% voter turnout, although the highest this decade has been only 64%.

Aontan: Canadian parties generally don't like each other very much... I think I have a better chance of winning the lottery than seeing any coalition between any party for a great length of time.

[your_adress_here 11]

Originally posted by: patriots_1228 ^ PMS.

hahaha...

hahahah

gahahaghgagaha

guess im still immature.quote>

I was going to say "Yes, quite indeed".

And then I realized what you were laughing about...

... and I laughed.

[Easy Bakes 253]

This thread is about the 2008 Canadian election.  The election was called on Sunday, September 7th (when Governer General Michaëlle Jean approved Prime Minister Stephen Harper's request to dissolve parliament), and voters head to the polls on Tuesday, October 14th (the day after the Canadian Thanksgiving).quote>

You canadians realy know how to have an election.

6 Weeks. Sure beats listenting to them spew thier agends for 6 years like we are doing here.

[spa 970]

Hold the phone, the election isn't quite over yet. The Conservatives came into the House with a lot of swagger but they went too far and backed the Opposition into a corner and now they're on the verge of being replaced in favour of a coalition government. Not uncommon in Europe of course, but fairly unheard of in Westminister systems. The last time it happened at the federal level in Canada was World War One! Anyway, if it happens Stephen Harper is going to make Joe Clark look like a tactical genius. Joe Clark lost on a budget vote, but Harper, if it happens, is set to lose on an economic update, what should have been a non-event. Harper may yet be able to dodge the bullet by pro-roguing parliament.

Opposition set to present coalition to Governor-General

Leaders from all three parties drafting letter that informs Rideau Hall a viable alternative to Conservative minority exists within current Parliament

DANIEL LEBLANC

Globe and Mail Update

December 1, 2008 at 11:35 AM EST

OTTAWA — The three opposition leaders are drafting a letter to Governor-General Michaëlle Jean in which they formally call on her to allow the formation of a coalition government if the Conservatives are defeated in the House of Commons next week.

Opposition sources said Monday the drafting of the letter is at an advanced stage, and will be made public with the agreement of the leadership of the Liberal Party, the New Democratic Party and the Bloc Québécois.

The goal is to inform Ms. Jean that a viable alternative to the current government exists within the current Parliament, in the form of a coalition between the Liberal Party and the NDP. The Bloc is expected to promise to support the coalition to survive for at least a year, which would allow for the passage of two budgets.

Prime Minister Stephen Harper has raised doubts about the legitimacy of a coalition government, and is expected to urge Ms. Jean to call an election in the event of a defeat in the House.

The opposition letter, in that context, is designed to persuade Ms. Jean to reject the Tory push to send Canada to the polls for a second time in three months.

"She has to be ready to say 'no' to Mr. Harper's request to call an election," an opposition strategist said. "We want to demonstrate that the new Prime Minister would have the confidence of the House."

On Friday, Mr. Harper went before television cameras to slam a potential Stéphane Dion-led government as illegitimate because he lost the Oct. 14 election.

But the Liberals and NDP said those arguments were undercut by Mr. Harper's 2004 letter to then-governor-general Adrienne Clarkson, which requested that she turn to him if Paul Martin's newly elected government were defeated in the Commons.

"We respectfully point out that the opposition parties, who together constitute a majority in the House, have been in close consultation. We believe that, should a request for dissolution arise this should give you cause, as constitutional practice has determined, to consult the opposition leaders and consider all of your options before exercising your constitutional authority," the 2004 letter stated.

Over the weekend, the Liberals and NDP reached a deal to bring down the Conservative government and form an unprecedented coalition to take its place that would include cabinet seats for both parties — 18 Liberals and six NDP.

The two parties held emergency caucus meetings Monday to lay out the plan under which the Tories would lose power to Canada's first coalition government in 91 years.

The key question of who would lead the first coalition government of modern times remained unsettled, as Liberals differed over whether Mr. Dion should take over as interim prime minister, or a new leader be chosen — and leadership contenders Michael Ignatieff, Bob Rae and Dominic LeBlanc met Sunday to discuss how to proceed.

That meeting took place against the backdrop of frantic efforts to avert the downfall of the Conservatives, who announced they will withdraw measures that would have banned civil-service strikes for three years and eliminated the $1.95-a-vote subsidy for political parties, which the opposition relies on.

The Tories also unveiled a surreptitiously recorded tape of a New Democratic Party caucus meeting, alleging it showed a long-existing cabal with the Bloc Québécois to defeat the government — and there were rumours that as a last resort, Mr. Harper might seek to prorogue Parliament, ending the session to avoid defeat in the Commons.

[beebs 129]

Regardless of any agenda's the Liberals/NDP/Bloc may have in doing this, I certainly welcome Harper being booted out. The sooner the better, imo.

[Zelgadis 638]

Yup, no question here that Harper has become arrogant. He backed all three opposition parties into a corner and now he's paying the price. Not that I have a problem with that.

Thing is, when he falls, he's going to take the entire Conservative party with him. He is the strongman holding the whole thing together and frankly, I don't see anyone who can replace him. I think it's going to take quite a long time for them to recover.

ISF

[Haljackey 17,398]

Ugh! Its pretty sad it has come down to this.  Can they really trust one-another?

At least the three opposition parties agree on one thing: anything is better than a conservative government, even a collation government.

The conservatves have got to work hard to fix the budget if they want support from the opposition.  What is the Governer General going to say about this?  

Who knows, we might be going back to the polls if nothing can be agreed upon.

Best,

-Haljackey

[your_adress_here 11]

I'll be happy to see Harper out of office.

[Zelgadis 638]

I'm having a little trouble understanding the concept of "prorogue." I'm generally pretty familiar with the parliamentary system, but I'm not sure about that part.

So, is this a "final" thing? If Harper were to do this, could the Governor General still accept the opposition parties' offer anyway? I guess, in other words, let's say, for the sake of argument, that the PM decided to do this. Would the Governor General's hands be tied? What would be the possible outcomes of this?

ISF

[Meg 368]

okay, so according to Wiki

The term governor general or governor-general refers to a vice-regal representative of a Monarch in an independent realm or a major colonial circonscription. A governor general is a governor of high rank, or a principal governor ranking above "ordinary" governors. quote>

That didn't help a whole lot but it continues later on . .

Since the 1950s, the title governor general has been given to all representatives of the sovereign in independent Commonwealth realms. In these cases, the former office of colonial governor was altered (sometimes for the same incumbent) to become governor general upon independence, as the nature of the office became an entirely independent constitutional representative of the monarch rather than a symbol of previous colonial rule. In these countries the governor general acts as the Monarch's representative, performing the ceremonial and constitutional functions of a Head of State. quote>

The ceremonial part, I understand.  But what are the constitutional functions here?

I don't understand the "prorogue" either.  Websters defines it as "to terminate a session of (as a British parliament) by royal prerogative".

So this basically boils down to people playing the Monarch card?  

[Wrightguy0 40]

Mr. Harper has become too arrogant, He's treated his minority government as if it were a majority. He has insulted the opposition for trying to make the minority work, and accuesed them of trying to stage a coup to advance their own political agendas. Lets not forget that Harper called the october election illegaly and at a time when the opposition parties were at their weakest. Then His economic update tries to remove the rights of unions and women in government and remove funding for the parties, it seems that this was designed to annoy the opposition, NDP are the champions of the unions, Liberals are major players in womens equality, and the subsidy is how the bloc gets most of it's cash.

In my opinion, Mr. harper wants to destroy any opposition to the conservative party and make Canada a Sham Democracy, where there are still elections, but the only party with any chance of winning is the PC.

[Scaley McSlither 1,714]

Wrightguy, are you kidding me? Dion has been overwhelmingly rejected by us in his bid to lead this country. Dion led the liberal party to its worst popular vote in the history of Confederation and he's trying to seize power without the backing of the Canadian electorate and you're saying that Harper is making us a sham democracy? I think you need to re-evaluate your statement.

If the election were called illegally, would there still have been an election? No. He's removing the rights of unions? Yes, of public service unions' right to strike; so you support the right of Police, EMS, Doctors, Nurses to strike and put the lives of canadians at risk? I seriously doubt that the Conservative party is trying to remove the right of women in government. Let's not forget that removing the subsidy to federal parties also puts ALL parties on an equal footing, so the tories would also be affected, right?

The liberal party has in the past years prior to PC government, cancelled the Helicopter replacement contract; a staggering waste of money in that we had to pay to cancel it. The SeaKing continued to crash and cost the lives of Canadians, and we still had to end up replacing them! Chretien oversaw a deterioration of relations with the US that reduced us to the point of being a red-headed stepchild in the eyes of America. We aren't even recognized as their greatest ally anymore! Our dollar languished at around 60 cents in relative value. Shall I go on? These are the policies and legacies the Liberals leave us. The so-called green-crap Dion was shoving down our throats would increase taxes across the board.

The NDP are even worse!! Look at what happened to Ontario when the NDP came into power - they ruined Ontario fiscally. They'll do the same to the rest of Canada given the chance. Then when it comes time to pay the bill, what would they do? Tax the hell out of us.

What has happened to taxes under the Tories? Well, as he promised, Harper cut the GST putting money back in our pockets. Out of all the g-20 nations, our banking system is in the most secure position of any in the face of the world's economic turmoil. Are we really better off with Dion in power? Canada has already said, "NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

[Wrightguy0 40]

Yes, but the tories have historically been the best fund raisers, so that puts them in a better financial situation than any other party. If unions feel their employees are not being treated fairly and no negotiations work, then yes, I think that they should have the right to strike. I think that a woman should be able to sue if she cannot get equal pay for equal work.

Canada's decline with the U.S. started when Mulroney signed the NAFTA agreement, same thing with the dollar. Since then the US has walked all over us, and I wouldn't guage our standing by our relationship with the states anymore. The NDP got us the public healthcare system we have, and our last PM with any real degree of awesomeness was Treaudeau. The liberal legacy has left us better equality accross all races and sexual orientations. Harper broke his own law by calling the election before it was mandated. He wasted millions in taxpayer money just to try to get a majority. He acts like he's our supreme leader, he cut funding to groups in the gay community and community arts programs. What have the conservatives done for civil rights, sure the cut taxes, 1% whoop dee freakin doo, his party created the GST in the first place. I'd rather pay more taxes for better services, it's my civic duty. Besides Tax and spend is how a government is supposed to work, first they tax me, then they spend on public services. Heck I can't think of anything better to spend my money on, I'd just spend it on crap I didn't need anyway.

canada did not say no, 55.57% of the voters did not vote conservative, they voted for the left.

The opposition is well within their rights to hold a vote of non confidence, they're there to oppose the government, not sit around and doodle in their note books.

[torontotransit 2]

First, shouldn't the thread subheading read "Conservative government? COALITION government?" It was spelled wrong. Back to the discussion, the only reason the Conservatives get the most donations is because their supporters are mostly rich or owners of companies. Since corporate donations to parties were outlawed, a company can channel their money through an individual. Frankly, the subsidies mean that my vote counts because I voted for the Green Party, and there was no way they would win in my riding, but at least they get financial help with increased support. The CPC promised during the campaign it would work with the other parties, but instead slapped them in the face. Harper expected for this to pass because the liberals honestly had no backbone to stand up for themselves. And also, this talk of the Bloc destroying Canada, the Bloc's not in the coalition. All the Bloc promised was to keep the coalition in power, meaning vote with them. The Bloc gets no cabinet ministers, and the only reason they're cooperating is because the Conservatives ARE bad for Quebec, and he's fighting for what's best for Quebec, which is definitely not secession because Quebec gets 7 billion dollars in equalization payments. Lastly, the stock market plunge was all over the world and it was majorly due to bad news from the US, not necessarily the situation in Ottawa. Oh, and one more thing, Harper was ready to "get in bed" with the "socialists" and the "separatists" in 2004, and is now calling this undemocratic. More Canadians actually voted against him than for him, and the majority will be in power now.

( ) The Fascist Neo-Conservative Reform Party of Canada

(X) The Liberal Democratic Coalition for Canada

[beebs 129]

Originally posted by: mike_oxlong Wrightguy, are you kidding me? Dion has been overwhelmingly rejected by us in his bid to lead this country. Dion led the liberal party to its worst popular vote in the history of Confederation and he's trying to seize power without the backing of the Canadian electorate and you're saying that Harper is making us a sham democracy? I think you need to re-evaluate your statement. quote>

You're right, Dion and the Liberals don't have the backing of the voters. But the Liberals, the NDP and the Bloc combined do. The opposition is totally free to form a coalition government during a minority government.. it just doesn't happen too often here because the parties usually don't get along too well. I don't quite see how you can imply that the Libs are making us a sham democracy.

Ski/Zel: Proroguing is basically ending the current session of parliament early. Basically trying to stall to avoid the vote of non-confidence. Harper would go ask the GG to prorogue it, at which point she would have the choice of handing over government to the coalition I think.

[kibblewitbit 0]

In my mind the first one to compare their opposing view to fascism automatically loses the debate. But to give my view on all of this I would say that although I agree that taxpayers shouldn't be counted on to fund political parties, especially separatist ones, I think that what Harper did was an extremely stupid political move, I can't understand how he could be so blind to the fact that the opposition parties hate his guts. It's really too bad that because of this we will have New Democrats calling the shots on economic policy, and remember, they didn't only ruin Ontario but in the 1990s they held power in B.C. as well and became so despised by the electorate that after the 2001 election they were left with only 2 out of 79 seats. And although it is true that a majority of voters didn't vote for the Conservatives just six weeks ago, barely a quarter of Canadians voted for the Liberals. The betrayal of the will of the people and the formation of this coalition will only backfire on the Liberals when it is time for a new election and the Conservatives will probably get a majority.

[beebs 129]

Originally posted by: kibblewitbitAnd although it is true that a majority of voters didn't vote for the Conservatives just six weeks ago, barely a quarter of Canadians voted for the Liberals. The betrayal of the will of the people and the formation of this coalition will only backfire on the Liberals when it is time for a new election and the Conservatives will probably get a majority.quote>

Explain to me how it's a betrayal to the voters, because I don't think I quite understand that line of thinking. This is not going to be a Liberal government. It's a coalition of 3 seperate parties who combined command the support of the majority of Canadians. Where's the issue?

[kibblewitbit 0]

I don't think a majority of Canadians support a government that includes the Bloc Quebecois and if anti-Harper voters were truly serious about removing him from office six weeks ago, why did they split their vote.