Interchange Tutorial Thread

[Daeley 46]

ah let's hope for some nice BATers (TGC, where are you?) to take a look at this and spawn some nice interchanges

[frogface 352]

good work on the tutorial
hopefully we'll start seeing some new interchanges in the near future!

[Tropod 144]

EDIT; no longer applicable.

[xannepan 513]

Red, amazing piece of work[:0][:0]!

I read halfway through it and really am stunned[:0] that you were ever able to create the interchange... so much work!!

Anyway, this is much and much more complicated than I had hoped for so I'm not sure I'll have the patience to start building these network pieces. Maybe for now I'll just go on with making buildings.

[redlotus 16]

Thanks for all the complements, folks.

 

I truly wish that there was an easier way to do all of this.  I kinda assumed that the tutorial would scare some people off (not that I did it intentionally that way).  However, one thing to remember is that one person doesn't have to do everything.  Some people are better at different stages.  If you can get several people together to concentrate on the section(s) that they are good at, we can really reduce the time it takes to get a new interchange up and running.

 

Anyway, I would just encourage anyone who's interested to go through the entire tutorial and find out what phase(s) interest him/her.

 

One thing that I also forgot to mention is that this tutorial isn't necessarily just for interchange mods.  Pieces/parts can be used for other types of mods.  For example, you can use the first 5 phases to create new vehicles.  As much as possible, I've tried not to 'dumb it down' just for this reason, which is why the tutorial is so large.

 

-red

[the7trumpets 10]

Awesome job Red, you have certainly given the entire community a chance to improve the game in amazing ways. Thanks for your determination and thoroughness.


To anyone who wants to get an interchange 'team' together, I'll volunteer to complete all the tasks that have to do with the RUL and Path files. I have a good understanding of all the RUL file formats, and while plotting points in GMAX does scare me a bit, I think I'm up to that limited amount of interaction with the BAT

I don't feel that I could take a lead in such a team, but if anyone is serious about forming one and would like my assistance, I'm offering it (especially to finish up work on the freeway stack and avenue Y interchanges, hint hint )

[xannepan 513]

t7t; I have been trying to do cobble stone puzzle pieces for streets or roads for some time already. But frankly; I have no idea were even to start. What I could do is make very simple cobblestone road models in BAT for a straight piece to begin with. After that I can make transition pieces for a smooth connection to the original road/street. Probably crossing also have to be modelled...

But is this the correct approach? Could you write path files etc.etc. for something like this?

-Xannepan

[ardecila 124]

You don't need to write path files, as long as you don't want to change the width or anything. You just need to copy the existing road/street ones and change their instance numbers to match your s3d/exemplar.

[edcase2k4-thugangel1983 1]

i think my brother could possibly design and model realistic interchanges... but i doubt we have the time

[the7trumpets 10]

Hrmmm...

Well, I decided I should get somewhat familliar with the BAT and this process, since it's such a huge part of transit modding .

Unfortunately, I simply cannot get the exporting right. I have removed the maxis BuildingMill.ms script file and replaced it with the one in the interchange tutorial, but the result is no different from using the original maxis file.

I've tried replacing it and restarting the program, replacing it and rebooting, deleting the original maxis file from the disk, etc.


Basically, the resulting sc4model file in the mydocuments/plugins folder still had all the FSH textures and models like it was a building, and none of them (including the s3d at IID 0x#####400) had the entire model in them. Does anyone have any idea what I'm doing wrong? Again, I'm sorry for the elementary nature of this, I'm just trying to get started using this thing, and it seems like I can't even do the first step

Anyway, I thought I remembered reading somewhere that if you installed gmax and the bat in your program files directory, you'd have problems. So I said, oh, this will be easy. Uninstalled it and reinstalled it in the default directory.....except that it didn't install the help files . So now I'm left with gmax, no idea how to use it, and no help files...great


And the exporting still doesn't work


[edit]

sorry all, I finally figured it out. I wasn't doing the LOD correctly...eeek!!! Please forgive me ??? I also found a place to download all the help files again, so all seems to be well, for now

[Tropod 144]

hey T7T, didn't realise you'd posted this till now.........

Good to see you've figured out the problem(s) . I remember having some initial problems with all this batting stuff when I started. heck, I still do with some aspects . Much rather stick to modding if/when I can help it .

 

 

Just thought I would remind people, since some folk (still) ask about this here & there:

Real 3D Models:

As mentioned, redlotus' tutorial does also apply to other things, like Automata, such as Cars, planes, blimps, & other similar items that are real 3D models. The tutorial doesn't explicity explain all the aspects involved for everything related to 3D models, as that would be quite the tutorial. Just be aware, that the tutorial is namely aimed at interchange related aspects, but part of the process for interchanges is the '3D Model' aspect.

 

When it comes to 3D Models, there are essentially 3 basic components (usually):

1. The Model file (singular - real 3D Models should only ever have one S3D file ~ typically. There are some very limited exceptions to this) & the FSH file(s) for the model.

2. The Exemplar file(s).

3. The Proper Group IDs for the above files.

 

The Group IDs for the Model file & FSH file(s) will be the same as they are in the tutorial. The Group ID for Exemplar file(s) on the other hand; can, do & will depend on the the area of the game, &/or what the item(s) are for, that will dictate what the Group ID is for the Exemplar file(s) (these are many & varied ~ I'd suggest looking at the Group ID of existing Exemplar file(s) for an area of the game you're trying to make something for if it's a real 3D model).

[CryinG.FreeM4n 19]

Hello,

I am trying to apply this tutorial on a small model but I have some difficulties with the boxes in phase 2. I don't know to which objects the mentionned box refers.
Can I suggest drawing some diagrams to illustrate the 4/5 first steps?

Thx for this great tutorial.

[redlotus 16]

Date:9/28/2004 10:34:17 AM
Author:CryinG.FreeM4n

Hello,

I am trying to apply this tutorial on a small model but I have some difficulties with the boxes in phase 2. I don't know to which objects the mentionned box refers.
Can I suggest drawing some diagrams to illustrate the 4/5 first steps?

Thx for this great tutorial.

quote>

How small is the model you are working with?  If it is smaller than 16 meters in length and width, Phase 2 isn't necessary at all.  If it is larger than 16m in length and/or width, the boxes that I refer to are any objects that would span more than one tile.  Because of the way that the game handles placement and terrain-conforming, transportation pieces must be smaller than 16mx16m (of course, there are always exceptions as noted in the tutorial).

I hope this answers your question.  If not, feel free to send me a PM and I'd be glad to help.

-red

[CryinG.FreeM4n 19]

My model is larger than 16m in both length and width. If I compare with the example of the tutorial, I should have 10 pieces, numbered from 000 to 140. But this help

[the7trumpets 10]

sorry red, I'm really trying to get the hang of this, but something is just acting weird. I'm working on reskinning some flat models for new ped mall pieces with new textures. Unfortunately, when I try to associate a model with a new texture, it seems like it can't find the new texture. The new FSH texture is at the correct type and group IDs (0x1abe787d GID) and is not an overlay texture, so it has no alpha layer.

Basically, it shows nothing in the mats display, and the s3d preview shows a white plane, as if there is no texture. Selecting the texture in the Mats tab shows that there are no numbers in the T/G/I grey boxes underneath the dark grey area.

I can change it back to a different texture and it works fine, but for some reason it doesn't like my texture. What could I doing wrong?


[edit]

nevermind, I found it. It appears that the reader doesn't like to assign uncompressed FSH files which were not in the file before the s3d as mats for that s3d. So, make sure it's compressed and everything is fine.

[the7trumpets 10]

Red and Tropod, an idea to make all the modeling aspects after slicing much easier:

Actually skin the interchanges in gmax. Then export them with the normal building mill script and turn them into props in the reader. Then insert the required lotconfig line on a type21 exemplar to insert the prop (that is actually the network piece) onto the tile.

The only big drawback I see, other than it not being the standard method, is that preview models would be nonexistant. I'm not sure if there is any way to get props to appear on the preview models, but maybe there is. Then again, maybe the nature of the prop system will lead to inconsistencies and tiles not lining up with each other if this were used.

It's just an idea to ponder. If it cuts 2/3 of the time out of creating an interchange, it may be worth it.

[redlotus 16]

Not a bad idea at all.  Preview models wouldn't be a big deal since they are really a separate process that is independent of the actual pieces.  However, I think that you are correct about the pieces not being able to line up.  AFAIK, the only way for an object to be 'terrain-conforming' is to make it completely 3D.  Of course, it has been a very long time since I've done testing on things like this, so I could be wrong.  I'll see if I can't run a few tests on your idea in the next few days.

 

-red

[redlotus 16]

I've finally updated the tutorial and made it available to download at the address in my first post.  Here is a list of what has been changed:

 

-added the7trumpets' warning about common entry/exit sides for seperate paths

-added a description of the changes to the BuildingMill.ms script

-added the format to use for textured network file IIDs

-general cleanup of language/grammar

 

As always, I would greatly appreciate any and all comments.

 

-red

[builderman 3]

Great job Redlotus, shame I haven't had more time to use it though.

[Shadow Assassin 336]

Great job. This would work in 3dsmax, right?

Since I can export S3D files in 3dsmax 6, I wouldn't need that script, would I?

---
edit: How do I make all the pictures show up... they all show up as red x's (or at least Mozilla's version of a red x)

edit2: never mind, I fixed it... by unzipping the file.

[redlotus 16]

Well, after several weeks of writing, getting feedback, and re-writing, the Interchange Tutorial is finally ready for public view.  I would like to warn all of you that it is still beta and may contain errors, though the should be minimal at most. **crosses fingers**

 

Download the tutorial here:  http://f2.pg.briefcase.yahoo.com/redlotus5@sbcglobal.net

*Note*  the above link will take you to my personal briefcase storage.  You will need to go into the Public folder to download the tutorial.

This file is over 4MB in size, so dial-up users beware.

 

Here is a quick look at the contents:

 

Phase 1:  Creating the GMAX Model

Phase 2:  Dividing the Model Into 1-Tile Pieces

Phase 3:  Creating LODs and Exporting the Pieces

Intermission:  Notes Regarding IIDs

Phase 4:  Creating the FSH Textures

Phase 5:  ReSkinning The S3D Files

Phase 6:  Creating the Exemplar Files

Phase 7:  Creating the SC4Path Files

Phase 8:  Modifying the Intersections RUL File

Phase 9:  Creating the Preview S3D

Phase 10:  Creating the Preview Effects Directory

Phase 11:  Testing

Hope you all enjoy this.  If you have any questions/comments/errata reports, don't be afraid to speak up.

Thanks,

-red

[Tropod 144]

A few people of late have been PM'ing myself regarding the BuilingMill script mentioned in the tutorial, despite the tutorial explicitly explaining the changes made to the script. So for those of you who can't access or have other probelms with the script, or are just to lazy to properly read the tutorial, I've decided to attach the file to this post.
Before using the file, make sure you back up the existing one.

[Athens2004 1]

Meh, no dial-up here, I've got Proxy. Either way, I'm thinking of making that Spaghetti Junction in Birmingham.

[artforce_1 1]

I am just learning how to use the BAT and gmax and I was curious to know if there was a tutorial on how to build a highway interchange from scratch.

[brtim2 10]

Alright, I have a question. I have read the tutorial on different occasions. And I still can't quite grasp the idea of what I am supposed to do. I am fairly learned in gmax, so it isn't a matter that I'm totally baffled, but I am baffled of what the documentation says. I think I know what it is saying, I just would like to know, in laymen's terms.

Splitting the Model into Pieces
This means deleting everything that is not in a selected (16mx16m) tile, grouping those files and moving them to the exact center (0,0,0)?

Creating LODS
Taking the individual tiles pieces created I make LODS that fit snuggly against the object? I have an easier way than the tutorial, if that is in fact what I am supposed to do.

And do I have to texture the model in gmax or can I form fit the model to one of the fsh files already in the game? If I can do that it would make things so much easier as I would only have to make and export one model and then retexture the thing with FiSHman 3 different times. If I can't do that then I retexture 3 different times in gmax and export 3 different times. That isn't a problem but it is more work.

Wow, I didn't know it was this involved when I first started. Anyway, I think I have an idea of what the tutorial is saying, I just can't see the forest for the trees with all that technical mumbo-jumbo.

[ianpaschal 77]

I'm making a new Y stack, but im not sure if it will work becuase of a mini intersection on the bottom level.

Please let me know if it will work to make.

 

http://img477.imageshack.us/img477/1713/interchangeexample2fv.jpg align=baseline>

[Ryan B 35]

Scipio - Nice work!  Seriously nice work!

Even though I'm not a interchange creator / RUL / SC4Path wizard ( I know nothing about the stuff ), I imagine that this could work with having one of the ramps in that mini - intersection stop for the other, or an all - way stop.  Something about stop path files . . . . I think.

[artforce1 5]

Scipio.

How did you do that!!!!!  Very nicely done, I am trying to learn how to do this myself but am very confused.  Would appreciate some tips on how to get started.

[GoaSkin 2]

I think we can keep the old Y-Stack, so let's call it T-Stack!

[MiniMark 7]

Date: 11/20/2005 2:23:41 PM Author: Scipio

I'm making a new Y stack, but im not sure if it will work becuase of a mini intersection on the bottom level.

Please let me know if it will work to make.

http://img477.imageshack.us/img477/1713/interchangeexample2fv.jpg align=baseline>

quote>

Hurray we will see a new interchange in the works. Perhaps for a future NAM edition. Also there is one problem with this. There is weaving right where the X meets in the middle. You don't want to see any accidents there lol. Likewise it would be good to have an avenue immediately coonect to this interchange as it would be completely a smart thing to do.