Moderator reviews of STEX posts

[suaviscor 0]

Given all the controversy and negative feedback surrounding some recent posts on the STEX, I would like to ask why bats and lots are not reviewed by moderators BEFORE being posted?  It seems to me that this would ensure there's some meeting of a quality standard; this doesn't have to be anything restrictive, just some sort of minimum standards such as in game screenshots, functionality and capacities, so those who are new to batting can still post their creations.  This would also ensure that people are not downloading lots that would have the potential of negatively affecting the development of their cities. 

[Praetorian Cohort 0]

Do you think the moderators have the time to download and try out every lot submitted?

[suaviscor 0]

I sincerely doubt that moderators would have the time to download and conduct in game trials of every lot that's uploaded.  I am merely suggesting that they LOOK at what the batter is wishing to post to ensure the minimum standards I have suggested.  I am sure everyone who checks out the STEX on a regular basis has seen files that should not be on there, and I am thinking there must be a way to prevent these files from being posted in the first place rather than removing them after a user reports a problem.

[MayorTim 16]

^^ Exactly.

[SimRico 968]

Please keep in mind that it is not simtropolis.com that is the problem here.  Simtropolis  provides great mods, bats files downloads for many of ous around the globe.

Also, perhaps some of the not-so-professional uploads are from young children who are doing their best only to see torn down by instant attacks.

Is it possible to re-vamp the uploading process to something like;

1.  set up a password protected mechanism for assessing the database

2.  Assign professinal BATT'ers to a "pro" status file upload that does not prohibit their work

3.  Identify "rookies" and provide them a "staging" area where they can still upload but
     we download at our own risks.

4.  Should someone of "pro" status load files that result in a storm like this, that person's 
     priviledges gets pulled.

Any solution is going to call for a lot of monitoring and volunteers to help in this area.  It would be a shame to see simtropolis.com effected by a few bad apples .

[choco1 4]

I think in theory its a fine idea. But it would slow down the process so much that it wouldn't be worth it. Plus I don't think are enough buggy lots and BATs on the STEX to justify a check. I think there is a very high quality standard on the STEX. If something looks dodgie then just don'e download it.

Cheers, choco.

[suaviscor 0]

Okay, I know Simtropolis is not the problem, and I am also very impressed by what I have seen on the STEX (most of the lots are far better than anything that Maxis has ever done) and in no way do I want to stop someone who is new to batting from being able to post.  ALL I am suggesting is that in game screenshots, lot capacities (resident capacities, number of jobs provided, etc.) be a standard for postings so that people have some idea of what they're getting.  I admit I've never tried batting before, I would like to but I don't have the time (I'm lucky if I get to play the game for an hour a week, often it's only for ten or fifteen minutes per week), but I am assuming that if one can make a bat they can make a screenshot and give a little information.  And yes, if I don't like the looks of something, I don't download it. 

[MrCinatit 30]

Yes, it would indeed slow down the amount of time it would appear for files to appear on the STEX should a moderator or administrator have to look at them before each upload. Remember - those behind the shields still have lives off Simtropolis. 

In addition, would it be right for one person to decide what kind of lot would appear on the STEX? What one person is to decide what lots and BATs are unworthy of being uploaded. This is where the voting process becomes very helpful - it not only helps push lots which might not be the best towards the back, but it helps the lot creater improve, if the critisism is helpful. In other words, this is where the community comes into play. By giving one person, or a couple people, the ability to decide which lots could be uploaded could slow down one's growing and learning process. 

Yes, there have been instances where literal spam (ie, advertisements) have appeared on the STEX - but those are far and few between. 

[suaviscor 0]

MrCinatat, thank you for your reply; as someone who has viewed your CJs with awe, I do greatly value and respect your input.  But once again, I don't want to stop anyone from posting, and I'm not suggesting that there be any sort of censorship as to what sort of lot gets posted.  I JUST WANT TO SEE A SCREENSHOT AND A LITTLE INFO SO WE KNOW WHAT WE'RE GETTING, THAT'S ALL. 

I give up, forgive me for even starting this thread.

[T Wrecks 10,210]

Well, don't give up so quickly. The criticism of your idea has been both justified and constructive, and your basic idea was equally justified and constructive, i.e. not intended as a censorship method or a way to turn down new contributors. So it's worth discussing the subject IMHO.

Mechanisms to take an upload off the STEX (e.g. too many bad votes - file removed) are potentially dangerous: Personal problems could lead to some creations being deleted although they are not that bad.

This is why I think that it would be a better approach to establish some formal criteria an upload must meet (i.e. an in-game picture, a list of dependencies, some basic stats like plop and maintenance cost for ploppable stuff (and coverage / effect / radius where applicable) and stage, tileset and zone for growable lotss plus lot size(s) for all uploads.

I wouldn't advocate quality criteria, since quality is a highly subjective matter, and trying to use it to permit or prevent STEX uploads is potentially repressive and vulnerable to abuse, as I tried to outline above.

Of course, there must also be a possibility for newbie uploaders to learn how to provide the information that's lacking. The actual work is next to nothing nowadays, with SC4Tool being able to automatically generate readmes and dependency lists for those who don't know how to extract these values manually.

All in all, my favourite approach would be composed of two elements:

1. All uploads must meet certain formal requirements, regardless of their content.

2. The content is then judged by means of comments and rating.

This would ensure that everybody sees what to expect from the download and avoid much hassle. It would also provide a better base on which to make comments & suggestions and/or rate. Ratings and comments, in turn, take care of low-quality stuff being identified as what it is - in addition to the screenshots, of course.

[suaviscor 0]

T Wrecks, your comments are exactly what I have been suggesting.  But it seems to me that very few people actually read and take in what others have posted before firing off a reply.

[toxicpiano 125]

I agree that screenshots of the actual thing and description are ESSENTIAL. If someone dosent provide a screenshot at the least it should be removed from the STEX. Is there any way of blocking map releases that dont have a config, therefore forcing a config to be put in the file?

[callagrafx 3]

Toxicpiano: The simplest method is to make config files compulsory (i.e. make it a required field).

I think peer pressure goes a long way to controlling the quality of the STEX...no-one likes bad criticism and if one receives it, I bet they endeavour to make a better submission the next time.... Everyone remember it's an open exchange, it's not just the playground for the cream of batters/lotters/mappers etc. Whilst quality of content is desirable, it should not be made the responsibility of the admins/moderators who have enough to do cleaning up around after us bunch of slobs. If bad posts are ignored and not downloaded, the posters will soon tire. Remember: no pic, no click.

[Tocheb73 0]

I agree with callagrafx, if you don't like it don't download it. No pic no click. the only problem with this is that these things all take up bandwidth (thats where some tech guy will prove me wrong) So i think that the rule should be if it has no downloads after a certain period of time it should be deleted. No Pic No Click

[AIX 270]

I think a major problem is how attack-happy many members are.

There has been a recent member plagiarizing and uploading other bad files. I looked at the comments on his files and found atleast 20+ people all giving the exact same complaint. There is no need for 20 people to say the exact same thing in the comments.

I feel that most of these spammers are just attention-hogs and they thrive on getting dozens of people to yell at them. That is why I don't comment the obvious spam uploads. I can generally tell if it's a spam or a simple case of an unaware newbie.

[Pipes 0]

The idea of overlooking uploads is an good idea in thery, but i would hesitate to designate more responsibilitys on the moderators. in fact it seems like a grand idea to have a dedicated STEX team to review users and uploads.

SimRico has some good idea in that pro bat'ers would not need be screened. the designation of titles however is a bit of a touch and go situation as we have some great bat'ers that by definition would be "rookies" but in reality they are pro's but just not to simtropolis, like ks_JPN, within days of joining ST he was uploading astonishing bat's, ks_JPN would not need be an rookie. Titles bring one major drawback, in that some users will only wish to download / look at bat's from "pro's" disregarding the starting bat'ers work. making it harder for begginers to bring forth quality material into the fold. everyone has to start somewhere.

the only way i can see this idea working is that there be a team dedicated to "STEX quality control" and they would only need screen uploads of tagged users. an user would onl be tagged once they have uploaded questionable material such as spam, plagarisms, virii, and other such nusances. To me this is the least amount of work for the most amount of gain.

My last thoughts are to do with the upload system, i would like to see more descriptive fields to be filled in for uploaded bat's. the additional fields i would like to see are; Lot Size, Basic Stat's, and Dependency's. the pro batt'ers allready post these details in the decription i just think it might be helpfull to have some of these things into search-able fields that are all uniform in there placement.

[SimRico 968]

Pipes is commenting on something that I think could lead up to the following suggestin that may eliminate physical  human hours(or simhours) to monitor file uploads,e tc.

Step1  Simtropolis develop an "upload" form that must get filled in before the user is passed to step 2 ( the actual uploading of the file itself ).

The form could consist of "required" field entries and a few "check" boxes that could assure that the user is  including all facets of the BAT (i.e.  description, pics, files, etc).

The required field entries is the uploader's "signature" that he/she has followed simtrops' rules and if later it is discovered that he/she has not, then that person's priviledges gets removed /barred.  

This process coul d standardize all uploads from here on ( no uploads unless all required fields are entered) as well as provide a measure of quality and a means to monitor

This should be no  prob for trusted BATers and a new BATer should have no prob if its legit. 

Only false entries (when the BAT; misleading pics; file prove to be otherwise ) should automatically flag the user as a prob.

[moganite 4]

Simrico there already is a form you need to fillout to get content on. The problem is how do you ensure a jpeg is a sc4 related one? that cannot be done autamtically. Second if I find one file that has no readme you will know about it as I expect one with everyting that is not a map. Maps really need a set of instructions.

How many people here jave actually uploaded a file? I have and callagrafx has and mrcincinat probabaly has but he is also a mod and is responsible.

If i see no desription it won't get Dled if there is a missing Readme/instructions on use the uploader will get notified and I might even consider not DLing any more stuff from them. the readme is the first line of help covers comon problems.