Is the color variation system really broken?

[boformer 3,169]

I checked the source code of the game. Cool_Z reported that it is broken for higher.level buildings.

I found no sign of that the system is broken. It works well for spawned and upgraded buildings.

If you want to try it yourself, try this:

• Required Mods: Building Themes, Unlock All
• Start the game with the --enable-dev-ui launch parameter
• Start a new city, build the basic infrastructure.
• Create a theme that only contains the building you want to test, and buildings with a lower level so the level up is possible (e.g. one 4x4 L1, one 4x4 L2, and your custom 4x4 L3)
• Apply the theme to the city
• Then zone a few 4x4 blocks (or the size you want to test).
• Press TAB to open the dev GUI
• Enable the "Full Demand" checkbox in the dev GUI to let buildings grow instantly
• Wait until buildings spawn
• Hit the "Levelup Building" button until the buildings reached the max level
   

If you know of "broken" assets, send them to me so I can check what's wrong with them.

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Yeah but then I suspect the themes mod overpasses the way the game makes assets grow like the eyedropper tool does (I told you that the eyedropper makes all colors spawn).

 

I've been reporting this from the start and Karoliina has once answered they were on it. (although it never changed).

 

Without the mod, I simply never had a lvl5 building grow more than one color, and others have acknowledged it.

 

Make the test without it and see for yourself.

 

 

Edit...

Wait wait wait... maybe we have a beginning of a solution then... your mod and the eyedropper are able to make all colors appear while the game can't do it naturally. So there's a difference here that might lead to an answer.

 

 

Edit again...

I now understand. Builders use the eyedropper to get fast clones of their assets or maybe your method to have them faster ingame for screenshots, and it might be a reason why they don't realize they won't actually grow all colors

  Edited August 30, 2015 by Cool_Z  

[boformer 3,169]

The Building Themes mod does not affect building colors. Not at all. Building color selection works like this:

• Every placed building has an ID (random unique number between 0 and 32k).
• This ID is used as a seed for a Random Number Generator, which outputs a random number between 1 and 4:
  • if number is 1, use first color variation.
  • if number is 2, use second color variation.
  • if number is 2, use third color variation.
  • if number is 2, use fourth color variation.

 

 

 

[Cool_Z 1,547]

The eyedropper tool does not affect buildings colors either. I think it's just the way buildings grow naturally that is broken, and the building and eyedrop tool are actually doing the correct job.

Before saying there is no problem with the color variation in the game, why don't you run a test to make a custom one (like the one you showed in your first pic) grow naturally in several colors ? 

 

I know it's not "immediate" like your method, but that's how it occurs in the game.

[Feindbold 1,190]

Mh colorvariations have allways worked for me.
This one was definitely before I used the Buildingtheme mod, and I had no problems growing all colors, as you can see in the screenshots:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=456552392&searchtext=

Though I do think some colors grow far more often than others. I tested a new colormap yesterday, and even though the building growed in all colors, two colors were very domominat.

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Oh I forgot to mention I didnt test it on european themes (there are assets in the european that seem to have the 4 colors working for all levels, Kliekie made me aware of that).

 

Edit, but even when using those as templates, (tested it like 4 days ago) when used on a temperate map only one color grows.

  Edited August 30, 2015 by Cool_Z  

[Feindbold 1,190]

Mh yeah I do create all my buildings using european templates. But still, I tested that new colormap on temperate + euro themed maps and got the same results: all colors grow, some colors grow more often. (But the the building was level 3...) Im at a Hotel right now, but I test that as soon as I´m home.

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Mh yeah I do create all my buildings using european templates. But still, I tested that new colormap on temperate + euro themed maps and got the same results: all colors grow, some colors grow more often. (But the the building was level 3...) Im at a Hotel right now, but I test that as soon as I´m home.

What boformer forgot to report here (from when I explained what I noticed) is that the problem is for high level buildings. I didn't even try it for level 3. But for level 4 I tested and you can only grow 2 colors (and as mentioned above only one for lvl 5) I think I once tested lvl 1 and it was all ok. Oh and I'm talking about high density here (In case it's different for low density).

[boformer 3,169]

The buildings you see in the screenshot are Lvl5 high-density residential buildings.

Btw, it doesn't matter for the color variations which template you are using. The checkbox in the asset editor should work fine.

It is impossible that only 2 of 4 colors work. Either 1 or 4.

  Edited August 31, 2015 by boformer  

[Cool_Z 1,547]

The buildings you see in the screenshot are Lvl5 high-density residential buildings.

Btw, it doesn't matter for the color variations which template you are using. The checkbox in the asset editor should work fine.

It is impossible that only 2 of 4 colors work. Either 1 or 4.

Did you read what I answered you ? You made them grow using the level up cheat of the building theme mod. They did not grow naturally.

 

I know they are level 5, I tested them.

 

Even the author of this building changed his description and does not mention the color variations anymore (although he still has a pic for it taken from the asset editor)

And he did the same for his next building.

 

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=505937342

 

Before saying "it's impossible" why don't you test things. 

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Took some time to test... again (I don't even know why I do this, you seem not to want to believe what I say and I've already tested , tested and tested again)

But there's one thing I wanted to be certain of actually (only took 10 minutes that one)

 

Yes, the building themes mod makes all colors of a building grow (and no need to force leveling up, just the fact that the mod is used and the building is included in a theme makes it grow all four colors)

 

And the same thing (exact same asset) without the themes mod (took almost one hour to get there... bulldozing the vanilla buildings of the same size and level that grew... yeah I like wasting time so much...)

 

Well ?

Oh before I forget, tested on a temperate map, the asset is a level 4 high res on a 4x4.

 

[boformer 3,169]

can you send me the asset? I want to check what's wrong with it.

I am suspecting what causes the problem.

It is not directly related to building themes.

The thing is that the same random number generator is used for spawning and upgrading.

If the number of possible upgrade buildings is exactly 4 (that's often the case because there are 3 vanilla models of a certain width), the same random number between 1 and 4 will be generated to select the upgrade asset.

I will check that later.

Good thing: Can be easily fixed by a mod or CO with the next patch.

  Edited August 31, 2015 by boformer  

[Cool_Z 1,547]

 

Good thing: Can be easily fixed by a mod or CO with the next patch.

Cool... because CO obviously forgot to look at it 

 

I attach the test asset I used but any other workshop building would have worked the same.

testCOLOR01.crp

 

It is impossible that only 2 of 4 colors work. Either 1 or 4.

Oh and BTW...

 

I'm just testing this (because my only low density building actually only grows two of its colors)

I'll let a few more appear in the test district I've made and I'll take a nice scrrenshot for you 

[Cool_Z 1,547]

So here we go !!

The asset is my Drake villa : http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=424592849

It's a 3x4 level 3 low res.

I've made four color variations, here shown ingame using the eyedropper tool

 

After two hours of fast forward and bulldozing other 3x4 level 3 houses we come to this :

Yep, only blue and orange are growing... I bulldozed the other houses so it's more obvious :

 

So you see, some assets can only grow two colors. (And I wasted two hours... well not completely, it reminded me to unsubscribe some houses with terrible lods).

[boformer 3,169]

I will try to write a fix this thursday.

Can you try to contact the devs? Tell them that they have to use a randomizer with a different seed for the color variation system, or it will not work correctly.

It is a bug that is hard to discover and reproduce, so I think it will help them to fix the bug.

[Shelltoe 15]

it's not only high density... check lower commercial lvl2 and 3 .. the majority of templates doen't work as intended .... if you could provide me a template with actually working color variation i'd love you forever.

i'm trying to make this work since release. (without any additional mods of course; and actually i want it to work without a mod)

i tried to copy everything from a working template (lower commercial lvl1) but as soon as you set it to L2 or L3 its bugged again.

if you plop the building using modtools colorvariations work (i think everytime you plop it a new instance gets initialized / all building that grow afterwards have the same color as the last ploped.)

i'm looking for a solution for the past 6 month and stopped all work by now. it's no fun if the most basic feature doen't work at all.

  Edited August 31, 2015 by Shelltoe  

[boformer 3,169]

Oh, all of the templates work if you enable the "Use color variations" checkbox in the asset editor. That means you can use any template.

The problem is the randomizer that is used by the game. As far as I understand, it only depends on the number of assets you have of a certain size (if there is just 1 asset, it works perfectly, 4 assets definetly do not work). That means it might work for some people who subscribed to the "right" number of assets, and not for others. 

I will fix the problem with a mod when I have the time.

 

  Edited August 31, 2015 by boformer  

[Shelltoe 15]

well when i created my megamart i had no other third party assets at all. didn't matter at all.

i know the checkbox actually sets the var in crp files but as i said: create a lvl 1 lower commercial building (-> color variations work) then set it to lvl 3 ( -> nope).

they added the checkbox with a more recent patch but the var was always there and always enabled.

EDIT:

i gave up some time ago after they told us they'll fix it.... so if something changed recently i don't know about it.

but as they get asked every patch i doubt they changed things without telling us.

  Edited August 31, 2015 by Shelltoe  

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Oh, all of the templates work if you enable the "Use color variations" checkbox in the asset editor. That means you can use any template.

The problem is the randomizer that is used by the game. As far as I understand, it only depends on the number of assets you have of a certain size (if there is just 1 asset, it works perfectly, 4 assets definetly do not work). That means it might work for some people who subscribed to the "right" number of assets, and not for others. 

I will fix the problem with a mod when I have the time.

 

 

This "right number of assets" then explains why when you disable or enable another asset, the color that can grow suddenly changes.

  Edited August 31, 2015 by Cool_Z  

[Shelltoe 15]

some more hints:

back then i decompiled what we had access to and the behavior made no sense. everything seemed fine in the sourcecode.

my conclusion back then was that some part of the code we have no access to checks for the building class and omitts certain once.

like it just picks one color, always the same, of the four and will only init this one.

funny part the stock lvl 3 lower commercial building are setup fine (and there shouldn't be to many for each loot size). all have 4 valid color variations and color variation enabled but all show only one.

all my test were done with LC + HC

you might (and i hope so) be on the right track regarding the randomizer. if i can give you any further help let me know. i want this very badly

  Edited August 31, 2015 by Shelltoe  

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Any idea why some are able to grow two colors ??? 

[Shelltoe 15]

not at all but i know about that. i assumed the behaviour wasn't a bug as we thought and they agreed. it might as well be intended by CO for some odd reason.

  Edited August 31, 2015 by Shelltoe  

[Cool_Z 1,547]

This is not limited to custom buildings : https://community.simtropolis.com/forums/topic/66214-show-us-your-downtowncbd/?page=6#comment-1588537

[Shelltoe 15]

it's like the broken color variations were known before there were custom assets on the workshop

you could do a clean install and it won't work. thats what i do with every patch since release.

if someone is intressted i should be able to provide a save which plops alot of LC lvl3 right when you enter the game.

EDIT: link

only loaded modtools while saving. just fast forward for like a minute or two.

just had a quick look, i think i saw at least shop7a with 2 colorvariations.

saw this some time ago (not to sure it was the same template... could look it up as i actually got excited about it :p)

used this "almost" working one as a template (also checked in a hexeditor all setting were the same) but only one color showed up for my custom asset =/

  Edited September 1, 2015 by Shelltoe  

[Cool_Z 1,547]

it's like the broken color variations were known before there were custom assets on the workshop

you could do a clean install and it won't work. thats what i do with every patch since release.

if someone is intressted i should be able to provide a save which plops alot of LC lvl3 right when you enter the game.

This could be useful for potential testers because the save I use  for "experiments" uses too many custom assets and can't be used by somebody else.

  Edited August 31, 2015 by Cool_Z  

[boformer 3,169]

Any idea why some are able to grow two colors ??? 

2 explanations: Some buildings are in multiple "upgrade lists". E.g. a 4x3 buildings is in the 4x3 list and the 4x4 list, but not at the same position in the list (a building at pos 3 will grow in color 3, a building at pos 1 will grow in color 1).

Maybe it is also related to the way the randomizer works. It is a really simple randomizer (like 2 multiplications and a bitshift).

Using a different seed for the randomizer (e.g. the buildingID multiplied by 7) should resolve the problem.

Using a completely random seed does not work, because that means the building color would change every tick, and when you load a save.

  Edited August 31, 2015 by boformer  

[boformer 3,169]

One of the devs replied to my bug report. So maybe this will be resolved by the end of the month.

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Yesssssssssssssssss !!!! 

[Shelltoe 15]

watched some after dark streams on twitch and sadly color variations still don't seem to be fixed.

could one of the modders with early access check?

won't buy any dlc till this (and other nasty stuff) is fixed ... though night time is great to hide the missing color variations

  Edited September 21, 2015 by Shelltoe  

[boformer 3,169]

From the patch notes:

Fixed: Buildings should now spawn with all or their color variations

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/after-dark-patch-notes-1-2-0.883183/