NAM 32 and Required Patch - Has it done something to Windows?

[SimBuilder2014 0]

I installed the latest version of NAM for SC4 yesterday and had to try a couple of versions of the patch for Rush Hour to enable it to install as I'd got an error message about a missing file.

 

So that all seemed okay and new version of NAM worked fine but next time I tried to boot up my PC it won't boot normally, graphics aren't working (only 16 color display) and programs missing from the start menu. I later discovered the system/32/config/system file was missing. I restored the config files from the CD recovery console (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/307545) and was able to do a system restore in safe mode but still the problem persists.

 

At last attempt to boot up I got a BSOD with an error message that netui0.dll is missing.

 

It may of course be coincidence that this is the last thing I installed. I'm just wondering if anyone has experienced anything similar or any viruses with the NAM or the patch..

 

I'm running XP Pro SP3 on a Core i3

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Well, it is not the NAM.  Unless your machine has 4GB or more and 64-bit decor, the NAM doesn't install the patch for 32-bit programs to have more memory.

 

With the exception of this little patch to your O/S to allow the NAM to load on 64-bit machines, it is all data files.  If you have a crash on your hands, it is something else.  If you can get your machine to come up, run DXDIAG using the run command.  It sounds like your GPU is either loose in its socket or dying of old age.

[SimBuilder2014 0]

I can run linux no problem and everything displays fine. Besides the PC is only a couple of years old - self build and and graphics integral to the Motherboard.

[rsc204 21,804]

I wouldn't go looking for GPU failure, if it's a hardware failure it would most likely be your Hard Drive that was the culprit.

 

 

My best guess is that for whatever reason some files were not written correctly/have become corrupted, this is a fairly common problem with Windows. One possibility could be that your Hard Drive was beginning to fail or has bad sectors thus files in those sectors have become corrupted, but it could also be that the computer was not shut down correctly or something corrupted during a system crash.

 

 

First things first, if you have the ability to create a backup of any personal files (including SC4 plugins ) then do that before you do anything else (more of a precaution really).

 

 

Next thing to do is test the hard drive, if you know the manufacturer of the disk, goto their website and download a tool for scanning/testing your disk. E.g. for Seagate Drives download SeaTools, WD use Data LifeGaurd but each manufacturer has something similar. Follow the included instructions to make a full scan of the disk. If this comes out OK, then nothing to worry about.

 

 

The quickest fix to your boot problems would be a fresh install of Windows on a formatted hard drive, so long as the HDD scan is clean, there should be no reason for file corruption to reappear.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Before you start downloading stuff from system manufacturers, you could try the diagnostics you have with Windoze.  If Linux runs OK, you may be having problems with NTFS (the Windoze file system).  On Linux were you running an ext file system?

 

On Windoze open My computer, right click on your drive and hunt around in properties for the CHKDSK program.  When you schedule this one, you have to boot for it to work since it runs before Windoze loads.  It will check your MFT and the rest of NTFS.  NTFS can easily be corrupted through many deficiencies it has including losing entries in the MFT when there is a large number of multi-extent files.

 

Multi-extent files can be consolidated by running the Disk Defragmenter which is also part of the maintenance package with your system along with Disk Cleanup.

 

If you don't run the maintenance programs weekly on NTFS, it is likely to be very fragmented and full of old garbage files that misbehaving applications have left behind.

 

NTFS has never been very stable unless properly maintained.  It really is an old system that has hung around too long.

[Compdude787 916]

NTFS has never been very stable unless properly maintained.  It really is an old system that has hung around too long.

It was "new technology" in 1993, but not anymore!

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

But MS seems to be stuck with it.  Wonder what the problem is?  The Linux virtual file system (cvfs) is open source.  Surely they must have gotten over their bad case of NIH (Not Invented Here) by now?

 

I don't even have a disk with an MFT any more.

[MandelSoft 2,769]

I think it's more a case of "We Don't Like To Do The Bookwork For It"

[SimBuilder2014 0]

Well things went from bad to worse to an utter nightmare and I had to format and reinstall windows. I also had to recover a partition (using EaseUS) that had been deleted. After that I found a couple of viruses in the files I'd backed up when I restored them and did a full scan and so attributed the problem to these.

 

To cut a long story short - after reinstalling Simcity 4 and Rush Hour this evening I then applied the patch (UPDATE_SKU1_TO_P1_B638) and installed NAM 32 again. After rebooting the same thing happened to my display again (the windows splash started off normal then went to a black screen then the minimum resolution without using the entire screen) so I am now very suspect of something to do with this installation.

 

I immediately rebooted into linux, copied a few files to back up and then booted windows into safe mode to do a system restore to a restore point earlier this evening. That has fixed everything exept it has unistalled Simcity 4 obviously and everything seems to be fixed. I'm still waiting for AVG to finish a full system scan but it found nothing in the folders where I detected viruses previously (in the Java application data folder in docs & settings).

 

One thing I am windering about - NAM 32 flagged that Java was not installed - both before and after installing Java this evening  - it seems like more than coincidence I found the viruses in a Java folder before.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Hmmm.  Make sure you have the very latest Java compiler.  The NAM Installer will actually compile the traffic controller if you do a custom install.  If you omit RHW, for instance, you get a very much smaller controller.

[Ganaram Inukshuk 906]

Hmmm.  Make sure you have the very latest Java compiler.  The NAM Installer will actually compile the traffic controller if you do a custom install.  If you omit RHW, for instance, you get a very much smaller controller.

 

Just wanna clarify the names of something here: there's no such thing as a Traffic Controller in the NAM. The Traffic Simulator and Controller are two completely different things, even though both require Java to compile/customise.

 

In fact, "Controller" and "Traffic Simulator" are the correct names for what is know by the NAM Team as "RUL Files 0x10000000, 0x10000001, and 0x10000002" and "Type 05 Exemplar", respectively.

 

I say this because it's a very common mistake to call the Traffic Simulator the Traffic Controller, even though the name "Controller" refers to a completely different thing in the NAM, and calling the Traffic Simulator the Traffic Controller, or calling the Controller the Traffic Controller would just confuse people as to which is which.

[SimBuilder2014 0]

Well I'm getting closer to the problem. After system restore a completely clean install I completely removed SC4 and its folder in my documents just in case installed components were causing a conflict of some kind. Downloaded NAM 32 and the patch from a different site in case the ones I had were corrupted.

 

Clean installation of SC4 and Rush Hour then I created a system restore point. Rebooted and installed the SKU patch - rebooted again everything OK also doing a virus scan at each stage - nothing found.

 

Next I installed NAM 32, rebooted and on the windows welome screen the graphics were screwed up again (probably other problems too that are less obvious). I hit reset right away and went into safe mode where I'm currently running an AVG command line virus scan of the full system before doing a system restore.

 

I think it may just be coincidence that I had a virus the first time (and it may have been something else that caused me to have to reinstall windows). Either that or whatever the NAM installation did allowed the virus to do its dirty work during boot up prior to the antivirus loading. Where the viruses came from I don't know - I'm blaming Avast! I used AVG for many years - since it first came out infact - before switching to Avast on my previous system (on a recommendation that the PC would run faster and AVG was getting the blame for BSODs that turned out were likely due to the fact the PSU was on its way out) and it never allowed anything through and now that I've gone back to it, I found five trojans on my external HD. I think I'll change to AVG on this laptop as well and see what nasties may be lurking.

 

I did note from the system requirements (which I actually bothered to skim this time) that NAM 32 works best on a 64 bit system - I'm using Windows XP Pro SP3 32 bit version (my PC is a self build with 64 bit processor but I bought the full XP to replace Win 2k on an old P4 system that is now defunct) but my processor is 64 bit. I wonder if that is causing the problem?

 

Surely though I can't be the first person to have attempted NAM32 installation on 32 bit XP.

 

My fall back option is to now try a Wine installation on linux (which should run as 64 bit), at least that way if it screws up I'm not putting the rest of my files and data at risks as I'm now extremely wary of patching this game at least until I buy Windows 7.

 

Alternatively can anyone recommend an earlier version of NAM - not the 2009 version - I've been using that one and the ferry ports and a few other items keep causing the game to crash - which I understand is a known bug with this.

 

The first time I installed NAM 32 I managed to use it in the game and add the new features without any problem - including the ferry ports - infact overall it functioned better that the 2009 version. It's only on boot up that problems are manifesting.

 

I had just installed the latest Java prior to installing SC4

[rsc204 21,804]

Are you quite sure the NAM installer file is not infected, I'd try a new download from a trusted source as the NAM installer itself should not affect your windows boot files.

[SimBuilder2014 0]

I downloaded from SC4Devotion which I assume is a trusted site.

 

However after doing a system restore when I run Simcity 4 the NAM 32 is still installed and working so clearly it is something to do with the installation process.

 

AVG found 22 infections during the scan in safe mode but also lists 22 locked files not scanned in the log files so I assume this is what this number refers to. If I right click on these files and scan them no infection is found. Here is the text of the log file:

 

 

AVG 2015 AntiVirus command line scanner
Copyright © 1992 - 2014 AVG Technologies
Program version 2015.0.5315, engine 2015.0.4181
Virus Database: Version 4181/8432 2014-10-22
C:\Documents and Settings\[user]\Local Settings\Application Data\Microsoft\Windows\UsrClass.dat Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\Documents and Settings\[user]\Local Settings\Application Data\Microsoft\Windows\UsrClass.dat.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\Documents and Settings\[user]\ntuser.dat Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\Documents and Settings\[user]\ntuser.dat.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\Documents and Settings\NetworkService\Local Settings\Application Data\Microsoft\Windows\UsrClass.dat Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\Documents and Settings\NetworkService\Local Settings\Application Data\Microsoft\Windows\UsrClass.dat.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\Documents and Settings\NetworkService\NTUSER.DAT Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\Documents and Settings\NetworkService\ntuser.dat.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\pagefile.sys Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\System Volume Information\ Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\default Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\default.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\SAM Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\SAM.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\SECURITY Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\SECURITY.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\software Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\software.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\system Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
C:\WINDOWS\system32\config\system.LOG Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
E:\System Volume Information\ Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.
F:\System Volume Information\ Locked file. Not scanned. is OK.

------------------------------------------------------------
Test started: 22.10.2014 13:33:06
Duration of test: 3 hour(s) 10 minute(s) 26 second(s)
------------------------------------------------------------
Objects scanned     : 307368
Found infections    :   22
Found high severity :    0
Found med severity  :    0
Found info severity :   22
Fixed high severity :    0
Fixed med severity  :    0
Fixed info severity :    0
------------------------------------------------------------
 

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Just a note where there might be some confusion.  NAM32 has nothing to do with your system architecture.  32 is the current version number.

 

If you have a 64-bit machine with 4GB or more operating as a 64-bit O/S the NAM will apply the 4GB patch automatically which changes the kernel/user split from 2GB/2GB to 1GB/3GB.  SC4 is a 32-bit program, but 32-bit address band width is greater than 2 GB, so this fix gives full capability for addressing very large city and custom content tables.  From other correspondence, I gather this patch is needed for some element of the NAM v32 installer to work properly.  The whole business is rather arcane.

 

FYI: I am running on Linux (Ubuntu 14.04) and I have both a 32- and 64-bit wine prefix, both loaded with SC4 + NAM v32.  No problems.  I am running a 32-bit prefix simply to accommodate some other programs.  I generally don't switch prefixes.

[SimBuilder2014 0]

The Windows I have is 32 bit and I have 2Gb of RAM

[MandelSoft 2,769]

There's your problem: you don't have enough RAM. Your system will run out of RAM because the game demands quite a lot, especially with the NAM installed. SimCity 4 usually takes up 1 to 2GB of RAM, and in exceptional cases even more.

 

The only solution is to upgrade your RAM capacity. 4GB should be enough for XP. More RAM than that will be useless on a 32 bit machine.

[SimBuilder2014 0]

But why would that cause a problem at booting up when the NAM package functions in the game?

 

It seems to me that I can install NAM 32 fine provided I do a system restore immediately afterwards to reverse whatever then installation did to windows. Presumably the NAM stays intact because there is nothing in the registry it needs to run.

 

Alternatively is there anywhere to download an earlier version (but later than 2009 version). I'm thinking because v 30 is modular not monolithic it should be okay.

 

Also the CD I have for Rush Hour says minimum requirements 128Mb ram (though I gather NAM will probably want more) and I used to use it on a Pentium system with only 500 Mb ram

[MandelSoft 2,769]

The NAM is quite a resource hog. The main cause of that is the RUL2 file: in the original game, this file was only about 4000 lines long. With the NAM 32, this has grown to a staggering number in hundreds of thousands of lines! That's gonna count on RAM usage, as well as extra models and textures. If you play with mods, you will sure need more RAM, much more than what's on the box. It's recommended to play this on a machine with a RAM

 

Alternatively, if you leave out the RHW from the NAM installation, the RUL2 size will probably drop by 80% or more. This will definitely increase the game's stability on low-end computers.

 

You might want to try to run SimCity 4 under Linux...

[SimBuilder2014 0]

How would that affect windows booting up though when SC4 doesn't run. The game actually runs ok and I can add RHW pieces (though I'm not that bothered about RHW and really only looking for an upgrade because of lots in the January 2009 version, eg the ferry terminals and some of the rail under road sections, causing the game to crash when placing them)

[Compdude787 916]

Alternatively is there anywhere to download an earlier version (but later than 2009 version). I'm thinking because v 30 is modular not monolithic it should be okay.

Nope, the NAM team only supports the latest version of the NAM. You can't download older versions of the NAM when a newer version is released.

[Cyclone Boom 16,829]

Yes, older versions are no longer available, and the NAM Team have a policy of not supporting them.
 
Short of upgrading your hardware, it might help to install the NAM with the "Traffic Simulator Only" option. If this improves performance, you could then experiment by adding other features using the "Custom" installation. The installer is very well designed, and can detect which features are already installed.

[SimBuilder2014 0]

How will that solve the Windows boot-up issue? I'm assuming nothing connected solely with SC4 or NAM is launching at startup and some configurations were altered by the installation in a way that upsets Windows.

[Tarkus 6,931]

I just replied to a user on the LEX who reported a similar issue (which may have been you, if you go by a different username there).  The problem isn't with the actual NAM 32 mod itself, but with an option that's included to increase the RAM routed to the game on 3GB systems.  It adds a "/3GB" flag to the boot.ini file, as described here.  This does, however, decrease the amount of memory for the OS, and we've gotten similar complaints in the past from some users. 

 

The 3GB patch process should also create a backup "boot.ini.bak" file, so you can revert those changes, by removing the newer "boot.ini" created by the NAM option, and renaming the .bak file to "boot.ini".  This should solve your issue.

 

-Tarkus

[SimBuilder2014 0]

Thanks for that Tarkus yes it was me who posted on LEX.

 

Seems like a fairly simple workaround and as I've indicated - creating a restore point before installing NAM and then performing a system restore after installation does the job - I don't know if it will work right away as I've only tried the system restore by rebooting into safe mode. I suspected it might be something like you've explained.

 

Am I likely to encounter the same problem if I try to install NAM with Wine on Linux and possibly cause Wine to crash?

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Well, here are some facts that may help to clear up the system requirements argument.  I load NAM without RHW, RRW, or GLR and it gives me a much smaller set of RULs.

 

Running with a 32-bit wine prefix on Ubuntu 14.04 with wine 1.7.28 my running stats (the program is running as I type) are:

 

Resident Memory 653.8 MB

 

Writable Memory 644.5 MB (out of the above for updatable tables)  The difference is the program text size.

 

Shared Video Memory 9.6MB

 

City Stats:

R: 1,007,884

C: 345.407

I: 43,489

 

Plugins occupy 1GB on disk, but are much less when in memory tables.  This is a very big city.

 

The wineserver varies depending on what's happening, but SC4 also has a 1.8 GB reservation of unused swap space.

 

If it wasn't for the gigantic RUL section with RHW present, it should run in 2GB provided you shave the O/S.

 

I agree, however, that you should have 4 GB, especially if you have more than one core.  That way, the housekeeping tasks can run in the second processor.