Just Played Beta

[kellyboywonder79 15]

I can't agree with this post more, but I would like to point out the best parts. Thanks for putting into words what I could not!

Zoning:

I am very much of mixed opinions concerning the Zoning system as it is presently implemented, as it seems to offer both too much freedom yet not enough. Despite 'breaking the grid', zoning simply resulted in x number of fixed-width lots with no control whatsoever over their dimensioning. Perhaps some use of Shift, Alt, and/or Ctrl would adjust the lot sizing, or even just some means by which the game just evenly divides the dragged area into lots of an appropriate size-range.

Furthermore, there is an entire lack of any means by which the game indicates just how deep the lots are meant to be. This makes it extremely difficult to determine how far one needs to offset subsequent roadways to allow room for development without leaving wasted space (owing to the lack of space due to the overall scale being used). I very much missed the 'field painting' system used by the previous titles, and feel that an adaptation of this would be a viable solution.

...

Transportation Networks:

Oddly, I found myself almost wishing for LESS versatility in placing roadways. At the very least, I expected to be able to hold down the Shift, Alt, and/or Ctrl key as a means to 'snap' the roadway to be placed either perpendicular to an intersecting roadway or to a relatively fixed angle. While the latter would ideally snap in 15-degree increments, even 45-degree increments (targeting the eight cardinal directions) would have been a blessing.

This was further complicated when attempting to add a roadway alongside existing development. I spent a considerable amount of time trying to situate a road so that it would be immediately adjacent to an existing residential lot - neither destroying the development nor leaving a gap of wasted space inbetween.

When encountering other roadways, the opposite seemed to be true. Despite efforts to form a grid-like block (again, owing to the lack of space due to the overall scale being used), the roadway refused to allow straight placement - stubbornly insisting that it snap to the end of the existing roadway (which I intended to extend just enough to end in a T-intersection). While I managed to finally manage the desired configuration by over-extending the stub enough to place the intersection then demolish the excess afterwards, such would have been disastrous had there been existing development in the way.

Being a Beta, I can overlook the absence of trams, subways, and other rail-based network systems - though I cannot overlook the fact that many fundamental transportation components require unlocking. I can only hope this aspect improves greatly by the time the game is actually released.

...

Game Saves:

The absence of the ability to save and load the game completely removes one of the 'undocumented' great joys of Sim City - the ability to unleash all manner of catastrophe on your poor Sims, then go back to business as usual.

It also fails to offer players the opportunity to experiment without putting everything they've worked for in jepoardy. Sim City has been commended numerous times for its educational value and praised for how far players can go in their experimentation. The lack of game saves eliminates all the safety (and most of the incentive) to experiment with new ideas.

...

Simlish:

No. For the love of whatever deity you profess to worship, no! There should be no need to elaborate.

...

I won't deny that this game could prove to be very popular. It will certainly find an audience among fans of Sim City FaceBook and The Sims, but few Sim City fans will find this game to be much worthwhile - particularly not at the exorbitant price point. They, as well as I, will simply have to bide our time until someone finally decides to make a worthy successor to the King of City-Builders crown.

That, or make it ourselves.

[macvirt 361]

Indeed. Sometimes I wonder how serious EA was a few years ago when at a panel discussion it was said that they wanted to get to a system where their customers would equate to individual sims complete with both virtual and real life profiling.

But, a bit more on topic, as solid as that post was, and as it is hardly an exception, I find it interesting that even when people do not compare SC4 to SC2013 or approach SC2013 from an SC4 direction there does appear to be a quite strong segment of people that actually do not like the shallowing of immersion. Or perhaps better worded, the adaptation of games to mass consumption for leisure play as primary focus of development and sales. A segment of people placing value on a deeper experience, on their own as much as with others.

Maybe "dumbing down" is easier, but at this rate it is going to build an interesting market in its own right as a trend of people who do not want to fall in to the categories of casual or leisure or passive

In this industry it only takes one title to upset carefully established trends by publishers.

[SirChick 184]

Just played beta again for the second time and indeed the city size is a bit disappointing, you can easily fill it within an hour and run into space issues, even when you can outsource a lot of stuff to other cities in the region I can imagine on a map like this even a dedicated casino city will run out of space easily.

Another downside in the beta was that many buildings and options were not available and industry per example complaints quite quickly about not enough opportunities to sell goods.

On the other hand I'm very happy that SimCity depsite all the extra rendering of unique sims etc the game runs without problems on my old Windows XP machine, only GFX don't look that great but for me gameplay has always been more important than looks, so its more important it runs smooth than anything else.

The building expansion options are a great way to specialize and enlengthen gameplay on a micro level. As a transport fan I miss some options regarding road improvements (there is no traffic map as far as I could tell) and no option to make streets one way traffic or setup special bus routes. For all transport / road fans out there these options would add a whole new dimension to the gameplay which with the glassbox engine should be easily and realistically possible (missed chance maxis!).

Making money is fairly easy, making Sims happy and getting higher density buildings is a bit vague but I'm sure when the came comes out we will soon get the hang of it.

How did you get to 16k and hour, my last city was around 22,000 pop but the profit was only around 8k per hour

Keep building casinos.

[tomfoolery_79 85]

I spotted the Arcologies! Anyone else?

Also, I'm fine with the "Simlish"

By the way, where are the casinos??? I looked and didn't see them.

[whrm33 2]

I spotted the Arcologies! Anyone else?

Also, I'm fine with the "Simlish"

By the way, where are the casinos??? I looked and didn't see them.

Under the City Speicializion button near the City/Reigon view buttons, they should be under gambling.

[CoolColJ 42]

I don't like the cars driving through the pedesterians walking across the crossing....

[Moofers 10]

I won't be buying this game, it's just to lazy, in terms of depth it's just not there.

I'll agree the new look is really nice and the menu is nicely laid out, but for a Simcity game I'll stick to Simcity 4 Deluxe.

Sorry Maxis but if you let EA force you to do Always on DRM and ruin the game, just to earn a bit more buck then you're not a good developer anymore.

[Jipsu 1]

I played beta few times and after that I installed sc4 back. After that I found this site.

No, new SimCity isn't bad game. I like the new zone system, the way zones evolve density and wealth, like in real life.

But the problem is that the game is too easy, like societies was. And city sizes are really small, so it felt like "Hey, try to get all the achievements and build many small fun different cities" -game for casual players. For those who actually want city simulator, I suggest you stick with sc4. I would recommend new sc for those who like easy city building games like sc societies.

[Motina 77]

I am dissapointed in what you could do in the closed beta. It would be nice to try some of the other specialization, like drilling or mining. The city tile used was kind of boring. Maxis obsessed about curvy roads and showing them on changing elevations, but there was no way to experiment on this with the city provided.

Like all the previous games, the parks are hard to work with. They never fit in. CitesXL did a much better job in this regard.

I will say there is potential to have lots of fun with this game, but it is just feeling many features. Yes, there is oila nd coal now, but what are the sims going to eat? Or make their buildings out of? They had so much time to work on this, so much potential. Where did the time go? This is like Skyrim. The NPC and the quest s are just not as indepth as Oblivions. However, I have invested a lot of time in Skyrim and still have fun with it. I just dont see myself doing the same with Simcity 2013.

No, new SimCity isn't bad game. I like the new zone system, the way zones evolve density and wealth, like in real life.

Really? Zone density has nothing to do with road type. Many times you will see 20 storey residential buildings on streets, not avenues.

[aaronlbarta 6]

I miss classic Zoning, empty hidious spaces everywhere, what a mess. Small City Sizes too! Thank god they got rid of water pipes, I hated that in SC4 and SC3000. I dunno, not as indepth as SC4. It's like playing SC3.5K

[Miranda82 0]

i believe the non-disclosure agreement ("NDA") prevents us from talking about it

just google for "sim city closed beta site:ea.com"

[Jipsu 1]

I am dissapointed in what you could do in the closed beta. It would be nice to try some of the other specialization, like drilling or mining. The city tile used was kind of boring. Maxis obsessed about curvy roads and showing them on changing elevations, but there was no way to experiment on this with the city provided.

Like all the previous games, the parks are hard to work with. They never fit in. CitesXL did a much better job in this regard.

I will say there is potential to have lots of fun with this game, but it is just feeling many features. Yes, there is oila nd coal now, but what are the sims going to eat? Or make their buildings out of? They had so much time to work on this, so much potential. Where did the time go? This is like Skyrim. The NPC and the quest s are just not as indepth as Oblivions. However, I have invested a lot of time in Skyrim and still have fun with it. I just dont see myself doing the same with Simcity 2013.

No, new SimCity isn't bad game. I like the new zone system, the way zones evolve density and wealth, like in real life.

Really? Zone density has nothing to do with road type. Many times you will see 20 storey residential buildings on streets, not avenues.

Yes, road type determine maximum density of the zone. But unlike sc4, you have only residence, commerce and industrial zones, not three of each kind with different density. So if you have road which support high density zones, those zones next to it can be anything within low to high density. Its like building only high density zones (with no cost for some reason which is part game is so easy) and then make sure road is good enough.

[Cob92 360]

I am dissapointed in what you could do in the closed beta. It would be nice to try some of the other specialization, like drilling or mining. The city tile used was kind of boring. Maxis obsessed about curvy roads and showing them on changing elevations, but there was no way to experiment on this with the city provided.

Like all the previous games, the parks are hard to work with. They never fit in. CitesXL did a much better job in this regard.

I will say there is potential to have lots of fun with this game, but it is just feeling many features. Yes, there is oila nd coal now, but what are the sims going to eat? Or make their buildings out of? They had so much time to work on this, so much potential. Where did the time go? This is like Skyrim. The NPC and the quest s are just not as indepth as Oblivions. However, I have invested a lot of time in Skyrim and still have fun with it. I just dont see myself doing the same with Simcity 2013.

No, new SimCity isn't bad game. I like the new zone system, the way zones evolve density and wealth, like in real life.

Really? Zone density has nothing to do with road type. Many times you will see 20 storey residential buildings on streets, not avenues.

Which you can do in the new SimCity. And in cities that are presently in the process of increasing density, road type actually plays a fairly big factor in what gets built where. City governments don't allow dense development on streets that aren't able to support the traffic generated.

[Techleo 18]

I keep hearing people say the game is to easy. *shakes head* We have no idea how easy it will be.

There are so many more levels of services, zone densities, commodities, transportation networks and the structures to support said networks. I suspect once your city starts to enter the higher densities, the commodity needs will soar, just like in real life. The wealthier people are, the more resources it takes to maintain them. Which is one reason highly developed cities are so hard to maintain in real life.

One has to keep in mind this demo was more of a insight into the visual style and capacities of the game at a lower level, with minimized needs to help make it easier to get into in a 1 hour span. Mind you I think they could have taken a easier approach but thats just me.

Also the zoning issue I keep seeing is a null point once you figure out the basic block sizes of larger structures. I literally had no space between my buildings besides park lanes. Speaking of park lanes, people will use those as pedestrian paths rather then circumnavigate a road. Which is a amazingly useful feature. The issue with density became a fairly null point for me as well once I figured out how to use parks and recreation to boost zones into the density I wanted.

All together I fell they took the game in the right direction by making it much more flexible.

[Cob92 360]

They just need to find a way to implement bigger cities. It's annoying to run out of room to build stuff and be stuck waiting for infill development to bring in the workers and shoppers that your city needs. You can do quite a lot to upgrade the city, but there needs to space to expand horizontally as well as vertically. Maybe it will be better when I can just open a new city and build a suburb there.

[Motina 77]

Yes, road type determine maximum density of the zone. But unlike sc4, you have only residence, commerce and industrial zones, not three of each kind with different density. So if you have road which support high density zones, those zones next to it can be anything within low to high density. Its like building only high density zones (with no cost for some reason which is part game is so easy) and then make sure road is good enough.

I know in SC2013 density is determined by road density. This is NOT like real life unlike what you said.

City governments don't allow dense development on streets that aren't able to support the traffic generated.

City governments do allow dense developement on two lanes streets. Something you can do in SC4 but not is SC2013. A low density street can easily support the traffic generated from dense developments. Traffics problems are caused by traffic going though devolopments, not from them.

[Techleo 18]

They just need to find a way to implement bigger cities. It's annoying to run out of room to build stuff and be stuck waiting for infill development to bring in the workers and shoppers that your city needs. You can do quite a lot to upgrade the city, but there needs to space to expand horizontally as well as vertically. Maybe it will be better when I can just open a new city and build a suburb there.

I suppose as much as I disagree with most peoples negative points, thats one we all agree one. Map size is the elephant in the room.

Every reviewer I have seen has the same feeling as almost every player Ive seen. Sure I can live with the map sized but .. its to small by a factor of 4 for me. That being said, I wonder if there servers could handle all the data.. hehe, we have no idea.

[CoolColJ 42]

I wished all buildings had to be built up from the ground up, instead of being plopped, with all with the materials having to be transported to the site first - ie more long the lines of Townz, Dwarf Fortress, Gnomoria etc

[Securion 3]

After playing the beta;

+

Deep simulation

Good sounds and music

Good UI

Good information system

Curved roads

Upgrade-able buildings

City specializations

COOP gameplay

-

Tiny city sizes

"Online only"-DRM

Parks must be at roads

Zoning dont show full zone

Bad textures

All in all... a very good game that I will buy if the "online only"-DRM work without problems.

[dysonraf 37]

Well after a few hours on the beta I'm happy I pre-ordered it.

After playing the beta;

+

Deep simulation

Good sounds and music

Good UI

Good information system

Curved roads

Upgrade-able buildings

City specializations

COOP gameplay

-

Tiny city sizes

"Online only"-DRM

Parks must be at roads

Zoning dont show full zone

Bad textures

All in all... a very good game that I will buy if the "online only"-DRM work without problems.

Gotta agree with most of this post except for the negative ones! The bad textures looked a hell of a lot better with a good filter (Warmer was my favourite) and the parks issue isnt one for me. All parks in the town I live have access from roads... Zoning is ok but there is also the zoning assistant which shows were roads should go to optimise placement of buildings. Online DRM? Not ideal if playing single player but Ive very much adopted online play (and I'm an old time gamer) as it brings a whole new feel to a game when your dealing with other people instead of AI.

Genuinly the only downside for me is the tile size. I have 100% confidence in this been resolved at some point in the future. I really wouldnt be surprised to see this patched soon after launch.

For those that knocked the beta at the end of the day loads of buildings and services were not even available and most importantly no regional play which is arguably the biggest selling point for me so its hard to be truly objective when saying its simplistic or 'easy'.

I have played SC4 and to be honest I just find it a bit boring after a while... I know that this site has a hardcore following of SC4 so thats fine I'm glad you still play it but I really do feel this game is moving in the right direction for the series. For the record I hate the Sims...

As for comparisons to CXL and CIM - SC2013 will never be like those and comparison to them is pointless. For those that want to recreate the real cities of today and micromanage bus timetables they are clearly going to be where its at for you guys.

SC2013 gets my vote though...

[Jokurr 175]

After playing the beta this weekend, the game was more or less what I expected it to be with no real surprises. There was enough to do that I was entertained and kept busy for the one hour I had to play and even left me wanting more, but I also recognized that after as little as another hour I would probably become bored.

The most fun I had was simply watching the simulation of the game once my city was for the most part up and running, I enjoyed watching various sims commute back and forth throughout the town. Within the one hour I played I managed to fill about ¾ of the map, and I figured that in less than another hour I would have filled it completely. In fact I could have easily filled it within one hour if I did not spend as much time just watching the simulation. So like pretty much everyone else, I agree that the map size is probably the biggest limitation in the game and a real deal breaker. I would probably be able to live with the map size if I had control over region connections, but since the only connection I had was a single highway exit, my city felt very isolated.

I enjoyed the implementation of curvy roads and I felt that the tools the game provides made it very easy to create roads in any shape you want. However, I found placing zones on those roads to be very clunky, and it was hard to judge how to space your roads to eliminate wasted space between buildings. The way zones are placed felt like a large departure from the previous games, where it was easy to “paint” large zones in one easy click and drag of the mouse. In this game I had to “line” each road individually with the zone of my choice and it did not feel as intuitive as the previous system.

When I first heard that zone density was a function of road size I was disappointed, and I was disappointed when I was finally able to try it for myself. It takes a large amount of the player’s freedom to build their city their own way, and it’s unrealistic. My first apartment was 26 stories high and would be considered high density, yet it was on a narrow two lane road. The apartment I live on how is directly on a six-lane busy avenue, but is surrounded by low density, single story stores and shops in a largely suburban neighborhood. SimCity 2013 would not allow me to accurately portray either of the neighbourhoods I’ve lived in.

I built bus stops throughout my city and I spent a long time watching a bus zoom around the city picking up and dropping off various sims. Granted it drove from bus station to bus station in a haphazard and unrealistic way, but I still enjoyed watching it. It’s disappointing that I won’t be able to do the same with subway systems, but since the map is so small it’s not like I would have been able to build much a system anyway.

I enjoyed adding plopable subsections to buildings, and I felt it was an interesting and fun way to add to and improve the buildings in your city, and at the same time allow for a lot of unique ways to develop such buildings. In fact, I would say this was one of the best additions that was not previously in any of the Sim City titles.

This has nothing to do with the game itself, but I was also disappointed in the way which EA conducted this “beta.” A beta which lasts three days and only allows players to play for an hour at a time is not a beta, I resent EA using that term. It’s a marketing demo and little more than that. I was also irritated at how EA gave away thousands of keys via facebook and other such giveaways, but very few of the people who signed up for beta months ago received a key through that avenue. The only reason I got a key was because I was lucky enough to be the first to respond to someone who was giving away a spare, if it were not for that, signing up for beta months ago, like it was for many others, would have been in vain.

In closing I won’t be buying this game. It is simply far too restrictive to player’s individual creativity and I feel I would become bored of the game very quickly. The few features I thought this game did better than SC4 are not enough to outweigh the lack of features and creativity that SC4 encouraged.

[StoNe220022 159]

No, new SimCity isn't bad game. I like the new zone system, the way zones evolve density and wealth, like in real life.

Really? Zone density has nothing to do with road type. Many times you will see 20 storey residential buildings on streets, not avenues.

Which you can do in the new SimCity. And in cities that are presently in the process of increasing density, road type actually plays a fairly big factor in what gets built where. City governments don't allow dense development on streets that aren't able to support the traffic generated.

What?? No way, take my hometown of Melbourne, Australia for example, the main two streets in our CBD are Bourke and Swanston...Bourke has been 50% converted to pedestrian / trolly car only....even Swanston street this very year is being cut off from car traffic.

Denser the buildings = less vehicle traffic!

If I gave you a block of land and said "This will cost you $1,900 per square metre in rent per week" do you;

A: Cover 30% of your land in paved sidewalks, parkland, sculptures, or

B: Build that sucker wall to wall of the building next door to maximise return on investment.

Also, you'd find your council would rather sell that land to a developer than take up valuable building space with empty four lane roads. Don't know about you, but I'd sell it for develpoment and ask the population to stop driving their cars and use the public transportation system like most city dwellers.

Not all of us live in Houston, or LA you know!

[Cob92 360]

City governments do allow dense developement on two lanes streets. Something you can do in SC4 but not is SC2013. A low density street can easily support the traffic generated from dense developments. Traffics problems are caused by traffic going though devolopments, not from them.

Well that depends on the city. In the case of a proposed high rise development in Houston several years back, the traffic generated by the building was cited as one of the primary reasons for the project being stopped. For cities with little or no mass transit, denser development just means more cars on the road. And if it really bothers you so much, just think of the outside lanes on the roads in SC as being mainly for streetside parking.

[croxis 150]

While the city tile is small, I am more concerned on how quickly the simulation can enter homeostatis (where the city can maintain itself) and how stable it is. My biggest complaint about CitiesXL was that a city became self sustaining quickly. It was a zone and forget game and it would take quit a bit of work to destabilize the system. The past sim cities had a similar problem but no where near as bad. Once the city was stable I could put the speed on fast and go to school. When I got home nothing bad happened and I was rich. I'll be fine with the small tile size if the cities require constant care to keep them from falling apart. Otherwise if the game is zone and forget, which seems like to be the majority play style in this thread, we will all get bored quick.

[bicmedic 0]

You know what happened this morning? I went to play the beta again and my internet was down, as it often is living in the country. You know what I usually play when my internet is down and I want to play a video game? I play SC4 or CXL. And now playing a city builder with no internet connection is no longer an option. That is a huge deal breaker for me, and the only reason I'm waiting to purchase as opposed to preordering. Something tells me I'm not the only one.

[mapboy 106]

You know what happened this morning? I went to play the beta again and my internet was down, as it often is living in the country. You know what I usually play when my internet is down and I want to play a video game? I play SC4 or CXL. And now playing a city builder with no internet connection is no longer an option. That is a huge deal breaker for me, and the only reason I'm waiting to purchase as opposed to preordering. Something tells me I'm not the only one.

Um, the beta ended by 'this morning', no matter what time zone you are in, so you couldn't have got in anyway...

[K-os 30]

<Snipped amazingly insightful post>

I won't deny that this game could prove to be very popular. It will certainly find an audience among fans of Sim City FaceBook and The Sims, but few Sim City fans will find this game to be much worthwhile - particularly not at the exorbitant price point. They, as well as I, will simply have to bide our time until someone finally decides to make a worthy successor to the King of City-Builders crown.

That, or make it ourselves.

Wow now that's the kind of details I was looking for. Sooo many limitations in road and building. This is definitely not the SC I was looking for.

[bicmedic 0]

Oh, didn't know that. I just saw it was down and didn't even try. Still a deal breaker for me though.

You know what happened this morning? I went to play the beta again and my internet was down, as it often is living in the country. You know what I usually play when my internet is down and I want to play a video game? I play SC4 or CXL. And now playing a city builder with no internet connection is no longer an option. That is a huge deal breaker for me, and the only reason I'm waiting to purchase as opposed to preordering. Something tells me I'm not the only one.

Um, the beta ended by 'this morning', no matter what time zone you are in, so you couldn't have got in anyway...