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Morlow

Two questions about CAM

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I have been on a downloading spree recently and it really bothers me that I can't download some of the buildings for CAM, specifically some of the industrials. I have enough skyscrapers but my industrial areas still need more variety.

1.) When you install CAM does it change the capacities of all Maxis buildings? I have modified all Maxis building capacities to fit my playstyle and it would be a pain to lose all that work. If CAM does change them am I able to change them again or does CAM have some master file that changes everything at once?

2.) I know that I can still use "old" stage 8 buildings with CAM, they will just show up at the wrong time. Can I just go into Reader and change the Growth Stage on all the growables I have or are old buildings not able to grow on any stage past 8?

2a.) Would this work the other way? Just change a CAM building's Growth Stage to somewhere in the Maxis range? Or is there a true dependency on something that only CAM has? If this would work there would be no need for me to install CAM since really all I want is the additional buildings.

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1a: CAM doesn't change any Maxis exemplars besides those that exceed stage 8. Perhaps the industrials, I can't remember.

1b: CAM has a copy of every Maxis building exemplar AND lot. It'll overwrite/be overwritten by whatever you have. Datpacker/Reader will be required to work incompatibilities. You may also wish to accept it, as CAMmed buildings are using an extended version of the formula Maxis used for their buildings.

2: You can, but that doesn't mean the occupancy numbers will be correct. PIM-X allows you to calculate the proper occupancy and stage for buildings. Reading the manual is an absolute must!

2a: It'll work the other way, too. Growth stage numbers are kept in the lot file of buildings. CAM only dictates when stage 9-15 buildings can grow.

3: Read thread. It lays out a strategy you can employ to eliminate the doubled residential bug CAM 1.0 has. This bug makes it so your city requires double the amount of commercial population than it ordinarily would. For the most part, bad. However, some people actually find it a boon because they love large commercial areas.

Edit: Clarifying what CAM includes.

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Apparently it's not that simple. CAM users who downloaded my recently published industry mod reported that the old lots kept growing, even after they put the industry mod in a folder starting with "zzz_" in order to force the game to load my re-lots last.

So far I haven't had the time to dig into the matter. To be honest, the incompatibility surprised me, because I would have expected that the CAM only affects building exemplars (which I didn't touch).

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CAM adjusts growth stages for many (all?) lots, I think CAM has 10 stages for industrials where a unmodded SC4 only has 3, and the growth stage property is in the lot exemplar.

Edit: Read a little on CAM and this may not be true, but I think it's plausible to explain the conflict.

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CAM basically change the demand level (extend the demand graph so it can reach up to tens of thousands so it will make it possible for building with higher stage to grow), the stages (I will explain it further below), the employment level, the capacity of industrial buildings, and a bit change with pedestrians.

A. Stages

The maxis default stages :

R ($-$$$) : stage 1-8

C (S and O, $-$$$) : stage 1-8

I (A, D, M, HT) : stage 1-3

CAM stages :

R ($-$$$) : stage 1-15, stage 9-15 are new stages

C (S and O, $-$$$) : stage 1-15, stage 9-15 are new stages

I-A : stage 1-7, stage 4-7 are new stages with stage 5 employed most of workers

I (D, M, HT) : stage 1-10, stage 4-10 are new stages

B. Employment level

CAM also change the employment level of C$, I-A, and I-D

Maxis default :

C$ : 100% R$

I-A : 100% R$

I-D : 100% R$

CAM :

C$ : most workers are R$ and few of them are R$$

I-A : most workers are R$ and few of them are R$$

I-D : most workers are R$ and few of them are R$$

C. Industrial Capacity

The capacity of all type of industrial buildings are changed, mostly having more jobs than the maxis default, like the MPR metals and all maxis default I-M and I-A building (except pumpkin acres), but some other also employ less number of sims like yards and shed.

This thing only happened with I, while all of R and C buildings' capacity is not changed at all.

D. Pedestrian

There is a small change with the pedestrians, since the CAM change walking speed of the pedestrians.

CAM-walking : 2 km/h

CAM-running : 5km/h

CAM-cycling : 20km/h

For further information, you can ask about it or here (must login/register first).

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  • Original Poster
  • 2a: It'll work the other way, too. Growth stage numbers are kept in the lot file of buildings. CAM only dictates when stage 9-15 buildings can grow.

    This is all I needed to hear! If the only difference between CAM buildings and normal buildings is the growth stage I can edit that in Reader. Like I said I actually don't want to download CAM, I just want the buildings that are designed for CAM (I will obviously edit their capacities to my playstyle as well).

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    Apparently it's not that simple. CAM users who downloaded my recently published industry mod reported that the old lots kept growing, even after they put the industry mod in a folder starting with "zzz_" in order to force the game to load my re-lots last.

    So far I haven't had the time to dig into the matter. To be honest, the incompatibility surprised me, because I would have expected that the CAM only affects building exemplars (which I didn't touch).

    I apologize. CAM doesn't just include all Maxis building exemplars: It includes all Maxis lots to enable tinkering of growth stage...

    In order for your (excellent) relots to be fully compatible with CAM, they'll need to be run through PIM-X to correct capacities/stages. Or just datpack CAM and your relots and live with it. A few of the larger industrial buildings will be at a stage lower than they should be, but eh. It's not the end of the world.

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    D. Pedestrian

    There is a small change with the pedestrians, since the CAM change walking speed of the pedestrians.

    CAM-walking : 2 km/h

    CAM-running : 5km/h

    CAM-cycling : 20km/h

    Actually, I'm looking at the innards of the CAM traffic simulator right now, and the numbers are 5, 10, and 15 kph, respectively. However, this only applies if you use the optional CAM traffic simulator, which you definitely should not do, as it is horribly obsolete, and is also incompatible with the NAM. Instead, CAM (and everything else) will work far better with the NAM traffic simulator. (FWIW, the NAM traffic simulator was originally designed in a CAM environment, and is actually a distant descendant of the CAM traffic simulator.)

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