Synekism - A New City Simulation Game

[nthooze 13]

Originally posted by: kingdiz_55

This looks very promising. However, I think there needs to be more realism when it comes to the buildings. I hope that the buildings could be developed more.quote>

Here is their explanation on this subject (from the website)

"As of now, buildings will look very much like rectangular shapes while we work on our methodologies and logic to generate more complex structures. "

I say so far so good!!  I like the idea of logic driven auto generated buildings.  Less god like and more mayor like.  I'd think you could control zoneing and architectural standards as mayor but beyond that the developer is the one that is going to drive the look of the building, in this case it's going to be the simulator it's self.

[Ocram's Razr 964]

Hello, do you have utilities yet? I (or anyone else) could quickly whip up something.

The installation failed. I just upgraded my laptop (Dell Inspiron M90) from Windows Vista to 7. It has ALWAYS supported Direct X 10.

[Yelmond 19]

Hello,

No, we don't have any utilities yet. We are focusing now on certain crucial features (like saving) right now and wont get to utilities for some time. When we do, we'll see how the community can contribute. Thanks for the offer though.

Now, regarding your installation issue, did it give you the "Does not support DirectX 10" error? Remember that simply going into NVidia's Control Panel or DXDiag to check DirectX support does not tell you the truth (I really don't know why). If you run a program called GPU-Z (which we use during our installation) it will tell you which DX your computer actually supports. In any case, just wait 2 weeks for our Jan release when this stupid restriction will be lifted and you should be able to play the game.

[Synekism 19]

Saving, Windows XP, and DirectX 9.0c support has arrived. This is, however, an unstable release as we are still struggling with DirectX 9 and Windows XP programming and need more time to mature the code. We recommend waiting for the February release for a more stable game.

[MTT9 187]

Have tried it and its great! The only thing that bothers me is using the "wasd" keys to move arround as it's too slow.

I also hope you can add farms and suburbs for the next release, as having so many tall buildings is not realistic at all. Maybe if you can add some pre made house models on top of low density lots, we would be able to make realistic suburbs.

Other than that this it's great, keep it up.

Matt

[Finkle 14]

I like it want to make a Christmas tree and post it on face, it was a little bit hard. I wanted green for the tree with a yellow star on top and yellow and blue lights winding up the tree.

I also thought that it would be cool to make a wooded lake with the sun coming up over the ridge.

[DefStar 1]

Synekism looks great. I am definitely interested in a 3d city building simulator that is easy on the specs. Will public transport be worked in at some stage?

[Tysons4 68]

it would be interesting to see zoning for everything, instead of ploping anything

keep going the direction you are going but add more types areas that can zone and new types that unlock when certain zone sizes are met

just a thought

[Yelmond 19]

Hello everyone,

Matt (emmotic):

The camera controls will be updated this or the next release to a click-and-drag type of movement. In the mean time, if you zoom out you can move around much faster and zooming is relatively quick. Now, regarding suburbs, the last update separated the lots from the buildings so now we just need to implement smaller buildings. Expect more zone types (based on different densities) soon (err. in two to three months). Regarding pre-modeled buildings, that will take a bit longer.

Finkle:

For you we might just introduce money cheats in the next release.

DefStar:

Probably not this year but public transit along with traffic simulation (when the roads become more than eye candy) are definitely part of our plan. Traffic sim might just make it this year.

Tysons4:

We are definitely taking a zone-dominant approach but will always keep plopping as an option, like, we'll definitely not make a "space shuttle launch platform" zone type. Also, for things like airports, they will still be zones but we also want the user to have some control over where runways and terminals go. And as said above, expect more zone types soon. We're still thinking about how and if we'll have lockable items.

[Tysons4 68]

i was sorta thining of the game once you step back from it...

from a far it could look like the monalisa or some other work of art... and when you zoom in it's a bunch of people and a city

why not for the launch pad idea:

zone launch pad area and port, and when you go to build roads in that zone they turn to those big gravel roads they use in florida

if you zone for a marina when you tried to build roads in the marina zone they turn into docks, or in an airport zone when you do roads they turn into runways

and i would rather zone for a police station and see one procedurally drawn to the foot print that i zone than to plop one in that is square or seems out of place... you have an excellent thing going with the way the zones can curve and move..

and about the road that is there in the beginning; maybe start with an empty map and after your reach a threashold you have to build a neighbor connection... that way it starts out totally organic

another thought: i was thinking about what will wright said about simcity 4... how it backed it self into the corner... now it feels like the simcity fans are playing around back in the corner when the game could have lead a better life... cities are extremely complex... and there are many things that have to be accounted for... so why not make a game that is overly complex... yet manageable at whatever setting you like to play at maybe have tons of different difficulty settings... and say if there was multi-player it could take a team of people just to manage the roads... or another team to audit sims that don't pay taxes... and so on.so that the whole world is working on a map like google earth (and all the different ways you can view google earth\:street view, globe, map, as a flying simulator).not like cities xl where it is one of the 20 or whatever maps on some world... and you can't see your neighbors unless you load their city, and then you can't see their funds or stats.. the whole idea is mocking the idea of a world that everyone can play on. i would have really liked to have seen simcity grow into something more mature... with wit... sadly will wright picked us up and let us down,... boo to him and ea... *silently plays sc4*

[Yelmond 19]

Wow, lot a good ideas (I almost feel bad taking them from you). Seriously, the road type based on zone type idea is really interesting. We'll definitely put that on our whiteboard.

And yes, that was the idea with the government zones (at least once they actually work). We were also thinking that gov buildings would upgrade automatically based on city growth which is easier with zones.

The idea behind the initial road is that people have to come from somewhere to your city. We are aiming for realism and something just donsn't quite make sense to have a city grow with absolutely no connections. Maybe if the game was set in earlier times but we are actually aiming for a futuristic feel. Nevertheless, once we have an options menu we'll add the initial road as an option.

Now, the heavier topic. So, I personally love the complexity of SimCity and would have welcomed even more complexity because it meant (hopefully) more realism. I also believe complexity is not a problem in general, rather, its the way it is presented to the user. The full depth of the game should not be simply presented to the user all at once. Instead, the game should feel simplistic and all complexities should be optional (things to explore, one at a time). So things like public services should be fully automatic unless the user decides to explore them. This way, a broader range of users can enjoy the same game. So, what im getting at is that Synekism's complexity will grow without limit but many features will be optional. By optional I mean that one could still make a descent working city without using these features. Of course, exploring these complexities will have its rewards like being able to attain larger populations or reducing spending (optimizing). This is our approach anyway, it will take a long time for it to mature.

Also, Synekism's complexity will not be managed through difficulty settings. Instead, each tool will have the option to open up more uses and each piece of information (like population) will have the option for more detail. This way, everyone can choose exactly what they want to explore and what they want to keep on auto.

[Tysons4 68]

to maybe get over the people coming to the city and say they are already there and looking for something to do... like the simulator is their prison... confined to the boundaries of the map (some say that one went beyond the boundary and taste like chicken) the power of the users sysem could make this map very big or small...

this could open some crazy simulator situations... say you just let it run and the people will build their own houses and homes and make their own foot paths to get from a to b... never worrying about running out of money adjusting the books unless you wanted to.

or you could take a hands on aproach and say do this here and do that here, and this over here, live here, and so on by zoning zones... the detail could run so deep to say what generation they were and their lineage from once you started the simulation.

a good next step would be getting some sort of dot or pixel down from the building and on to the street into another pixel, down the streets to destination and so on... because you have a good idea for the basic simulator, you just need to make me believe i am in a city

i like the idea for the interface of each tool having more options... how about this.... no tools on the side or anything on the screen, just the landscape. right click moves you and tab+left click opens a flower that will start small with a few zoning options or network tools on separate petals and after you've ran for a while opens full bloom where you can manage funds... or sign treaties to keep them from war... or whatever maybe have destruction tools as one of the petals of the flower. open the communications petal and read a newspaper read petitions to zone more or less of something. and then of course if you don't want to do anything click on the center again and it goes back to you and the simulated world and see how they do it.. and also make keystrokes and hot-keys so people that know what they are doing won't have to mess with the interface..

the game could be as much as a screen saver were things could go on for a time and the simulation finds an equilibrium.. or you could go out of your way and give them this or that and interact... make it feel like a true god game... where you could care for or negelect them...

i kinda like how you dont have a save function because i had an interesting idea instead you take a picture of an area you like... it is then saved as a png that can be loaded in the game again to give you the same situation you were in when you took the picture.. so you could save just a house or the whole city just with a picture that could then be viewed by anyone else that has the game... then not only would you have a screenshot.. you could then use that screenshot to see it in real time in the game (kinda something like spore did) just drag the file into the game window and presto you can see that nice yard you created... or the metropolis that reaches the sky

[Yelmond 19]

Well, your natives idea is definitely interesting and does somewhat relate to something we where thinking for later on. One thing to note here is that the current city borders are temporary. We will eventually remove them completely and have you be able to build a city anywhere on the entire planet. I also mentioned we are going for a futuristic feel, especially if we introduce multiple planets, so footpaths, huts and natives don't quite fit in the picture (at least for now). Regarding our related idea, once the game grows beyond one city and onto regions we were looking at different ways to keep non-active cities up to date. One such method would essentially be to auto-develop (huge topic so just a thought for now).

I'm assuming the "a good next step" line implies better graphics and I fully agree there.

Now, the UI is something very fragile in that it's really hard to find the balance between minimalism and functionalism. I think the best way to go about this is to simply let the user decide so expect the ability to hide different portions of the UI soon. You can hide the entire UI in the current building by pressing F5. As for the flower, its certainly an option. I'm not sure yet if I want to have lockable items yet. I personally prefer logic limitations over hard-coded limitations in any game so we're still thinking how to do lockables (or emulate their concept).

So, as of January, we do have save functionality. See our site, the Info page, for details. And i'm not sure but did you mean load parts of a city from a picture? Like, if I take a screen of a house I can then load just that house as a functional, simulated city in-game? If so, i'm not sure if that's possible since we need lots of simulator related date to save as well. Please correct me if I'm wrong here.

[Tysons4 68]

the planet idea blows my mind...but then all those straight across roads would form a grid around the world... it should be the user that creates the network in the area of which they want to start, and then branch out to other players in the areat, and in the time waiting for that to happen why not make the simple core simulator multi-player... say only allow 12 or so... then when you introduce the worlds it could offer team play (one player does zones, another adjust spending, another one does roads ect).or it could teach everyone how to work together

and im not saying the next good step is better graphics at all

to quote early George Lucas..A special effect is a tool, a means of telling a story. A special effect without a story is a pretty boring thing.

the dots could be the story (maybe change their colors, white is person, blue is vehicle, yellow sea vessel, red emergency vehicle).. when the time comes around to display something for those dots the pathing algorithms should be worked out. moving in sync an harmony

a string of blue dots along a road... white dots come from their lots and move into the blue dots... the blue dots then spring to life and start driving around (maybe one dot stay as his engine wont start) some turn around doing 3 point turns and all begin following the lines on the roads that you put down they make their way to their  destinatioin ... some jump in purple dots and fly arcoss the map, or yellow dots and troll along to sea,... others make their way to parking garages and city centers... where you see sidewalks covered in white dots in front of the shops.. with their blue dots not far away in parkinging lots littered with blue dots and still others looking to park... some white dots playing in their back yards.. or in line at the school house piling out of yellow dot on land, which could be the school bus...some white dots out all the time as they are homeless...

none of the dots really ever touching... unless its a an accedent, a fight, or 2 are in love, group rally, a parade, ect... but if blue dots touch its a car accdent... what im getting at is they have a buffer zone around them or it could mean trouble if 2 are comming right at each other one will swerve or react...

and maybe even brown dots that could be nature that do whatever, groups of brown dots moving in patterns could be  birds flying in the trees... or slow moving are grazing in the field... but maybe im getting a little ahead here start really simple and then when the processing power is given to code it then displaying something for those dots... and you could get it down to where everything moved realisticly it could get some people looking to invest... and you could be the company making the next true city simulator

yeah im saying that it will load what ever the user wants to share... if it;s a screen shot of the whole city it will load from that point of view and once the user takes over the view controls have the ability to see everything in the area that was capturing... like loading from that picture point... that way if someone likes to design homes you can then load their home into your city by dropping the png where you want it in your city and have user created work to start with.... or load someones city and play around with it as a template.. you could load them into any part of the city simulator and see what was going on... it could give a whole new meaning to screen shots... with the world idea maybe take out the paste city aproach and stick to the pngs of lots so that way every lot could be unique and user created... and people that dont have the game can see the picture that was take... maybe enticing them to get the game

[Yelmond 19]

We are actually planning on adding multiplayer this year (like Fall). It will start off very simple, peer-to-peer, 2-player only, co-op type gameplay on a single city. All stats, money and control will be shared by both players. From there we'll go to regional play where adjacent city areas can be loaded (by clicking outside your city's border instead of going to menu) and multiplayer will get the ability for 2 players (or more?) to play different cities with their own stats but at the same time. We want to always have that sync between two actively played cities (while you're building your own city). This is also when we might have to program a server and have clients connect to it. The server would than store the cities and players could then just log in now and then and add more to their own cities.

Now, the dots. I'm not an expert on graphics or simulation, we are all just learning the ropes still, but I suspect that simulating those dots in the detail you described is actually a huge task, much larger than making them look like cars, people, ships and so on. I recently interviewed with a company that does pedestrian traffic simulation for public transit facilities (like subway stations) and they maintained an entire software suite just for this purpose. In addition, none of the simulation work was done live as it required many calculations. So, what I'm getting at is that we'll start small, as we will with every major feature, and simulate car traffic only. Planes, trains and ships will follow after we have terrain and regional gameplay. Finally, we'll work on pedestrian traffic sim. In the mean time, as there will be plenty, our graphics will have time to catch up.

About the screenshots, I'm really not familiar too much with png, jpg or any other formats so I can't tell if one could embed too much data into them while keeping the images intact. I do know some small amount of data is possible but we would need quite a bit more for entire cities. As for simply analyzing the images and loading based on image recognition algorithms I can say that its close to impossible unless maybe we have strict requirements on screenshot angle, pitch and zoom. Especially as we add plugin support, people will have crazy visuals in their cities that may not be loadable for others. We might just create zip files that will contain the screenshot as well as a data file with whatever was on the screen when the shot was taken, be it a single house or an entire city.

[Tysons4 68]

multiplayer should be more than 2... i should be more like a lan party game where everyone works together to achieve something, or go against each other for resources.. will all different play situations

i was thinking more of the dots of having something to do with the zoning.,..

if you zone residential you get white dots, if you zone industrial and commerical you will seen see blue dots moving on networks at much faster speeds (as the industrial built the cars, and the commerical sold them... if you zone an airport you see purple dots, marina yellow, zone for police or fire station and their are red dots... government zones, black... that all have the ability to move about the map

and i would stay start with the pedestrians first, as this should be the most abundant thing...

spore did a pretty good job with the png file... when you created something it creates a png image that you can view... and if you have the software you can load it up....

check out the spore creature creator and the sporpedia... take an image you like of a creature and drop it in the game (drag it onto the screen while you play) and it will load it to your database and you'll be able to see it... in the game while you are playing you can take a building that you/ve come across and be able to place it in one of your colonies..

spore went cartoony with it though... start simple and it will come together and it will be epic

[knighthawk75 56]

loving where this is headed; bring on the next rev.

[mightygoose 92]

i will download and review this tonight.

[Yelmond 19]

Ya...I would recommend, if not downloaded already, waiting until the February release (Feb 1st). The current version is quite buggy and was released as "unstable".

But then again, the bugs themselves are often entertaining themselves.

[Evillions 552]

If you want buildings, I guess you could try doing City Engine's way of generating buildings which are rules or parameters. They can be interchangeable to make new buildings.

[Yelmond 19]

That's our hope. Still trying to master drawing simple boxes though.

[Synekism 19]

Released our February 2011 update which brings back DirectX 10 along with many visual glitches fixed for both DX9 and DX10. We also have a new Road Tool feature and a more realistic simulator.

[Liszak 48]

I don't know how to run newest Synekism in Direct X 9 mode. If i try to start game it just says that d3d10.dll file is missing. 

[lacivian 0]

me to 

[tarrina 2]

Very cool looking. I can't wait to try this out when I have access to a PC. As the others have said above, this looks promising.

[Synekism 19]

Liszak, lacivian, and probably others:

Our poor installer got confused again (so it was entirely its fault, not ours). It seems if you did support DX10 but ran Windows XP it would install the DX10 executable which obviously does not run on Windows XP.

The fixed installer was uploaded under the same version (v0.2.1.40) as our main release, so we can pretend this never happened. You only need to download the game again if you are running Windows XP and have problems (like missing dlls).

Our installer is sorry about that.

[Ocram's Razr 964]

How funny! I am not supposed to put games on my university laptop and my (gaming) desktop is infected.

[Yelmond 19]

But this is not a game, its an educational tool...

[DazzaDazza 29]

Got to say I'm quite impressed so far, I've seen quite a few project like this one, but this is the best so far,

I like the direction you're going with, you seem to be focusing how the overall city looks. I love some of the pic on your web site, grate job

[Yelmond 19]

...you mean besides all the bugs and face palms?

Thanks for the motivation boost though.