Jamaica Bay, East New York: SimCity 4 tips and tricks (NAM36)

Nice job with another thorough CJ entry.

One itty-bitty thing tho.

Quote

Current Jobs – This is a measure of prosperity, with 0 representing actual employees and 46 representing maximum possible employees for that type of building.

The first part of this is what we all believed that number meant. However, on the query popup the first number is the number of current jobs provided by that building considering all economic factors. The 2nd number is, as you say, the maximum possible. The only way to tell how many Sims work there is to use the route query tool.

Yes, @CorinaMarie, as I wrote the piece, I was trying to decide whether or not to make mention of the "oompa-looompas", so I'm glad you commented!

I'm also super glad that you feel happy to correct any details I might miss ... thank you!    That's part of learning deeper subtleties of the game, by talking about it, and I'm under no illusions that I understand it all, most especially because it's still entirely a black-box to me as yet.

 

4 hours ago, CorinaMarie said:

One itty-bitty thing tho.

Quote

Current Jobs – This is a measure of prosperity, with 0 representing actual employees and 46 representing maximum possible employees for that type of building.

The first part of this is what we all believed that number meant. However, on the query popup the first number is the number of current jobs provided by that building considering all economic factors. The 2nd number is, as you say, the maximum possible. The only way to tell how many Sims work there is to use the route query tool.

I've amended that "Current Jobs" point, @CorinaMarie.  Thank you for making me think that through some more.  Here's the amended parts in blue text:

Current Jobs – This is a measure of prosperity, with 0 representing actual workers and 46 representing maximum possible workers for that type of building.  Note that not all workers are sim employees, see comments below for further details on that!  

1 hour ago, Naomi57 said:

Current Jobs – This is a measure of prosperity, with 0 representing actual workers and 46 representing maximum possible workers for that type of building.  Note that not all workers are sim employees, see comments below for further details on that!  

May I suggest:

Current Jobs – This is a measure of prosperity, with 0 representing actual jobs available under current economic conditions and 46 representing the maximum possible jobs that building could offer under ideal conditions.  Note that neither of these jobs numbers represent actual sim employees (workers), see comments below for further details on that!  

Tip never use Dirty industry like ever change those to agriculture preferably SPAM and put down water treatment plant at least 2 per island or if big city at least 3 - 4 if needed add more. Trash find a better trash mod like PEG garbage chute or landfill eraser. Beautification is fine just plop em all around even some of your landmark should have jobs. C$$$ is not important C$$, C$, CO$$ takes R$$$ workers too. They won't grow with out those wealthy residents

 

Spoiler

TRASH:

 

Landmark with Jobs:

 

4 minutes ago, powerfullshammy said:

Tip never use Dirty industry like ever change those to agriculture preferably SPAM and put down water treatment plant at least 2 per island or if big city atleast 3 - 4 if needed add more. Trash find a better trash mod like PEG garbage chute or landfill eraser.

I dare say this misses the entire scope of Naomi's project.

This really is another well documented exploration into an aspect of SC4 gameplay. As with your previous entries, it just goes to show how there's lots to learn and observe with the simulation. With using a mostly vanilla game with the NAM and that's a wise way to discover too. Very fascinating, and keep up the good work!

53 minutes ago, powerfullshammy said:

Tip never use Dirty industry like ever change those to agriculture preferably SPAM and put down water treatment plant at least 2 per island or if big city at least 3 - 4 if needed add more. Trash find a better trash mod like PEG garbage chute or landfill eraser.

You're right that Dirty Industry can mess up commercial growth big time ... but there's ways around that.  It was a fantastic economic foundation for my Castro Valley city tile.  For my newest city tile, Jamaica Bay, there'll be no Dirty Industry at all, and only a smattering of Manufacturing.  Jamaica Bay's economic backbone will be tourism (literally) — here's a post on that if you'd like to see.

I've got my eye on the SPAM mod, one day ... hearing so many good things about it.  Agriculture isn't my focus, generally, but I'd like to do some peripheral agricultural cities at some point, on the outskirts of East New York, perhaps in the greenbelt somewhere like Roslyn.

I don't like the garbage chute, looks like a bit of an eyesore to me.  This one appeals more, check this out!

 https://www.sc4devotion.com/csxlex/lex_filedesc.php?lotGET=3700 
SM2 The Pit, by Simmer2
  

Ever wonder where the garbage goes in SimCity? Wonder no more.
This lot serves up to 100.000 pop at a rate of reduction = to 100%
Coupled with my waste to energy lot, they can clear an entire large city tile of garbage.

Lot size 6X6
Plop cost 8000
Bulldoze cost 850
Monthly cost 50
Power consumed 20
Water consumed 10
Life expectancy 75 years at full capacity.

Please mind the hole......

That looks absolutely glorious!    

Mind you, I prefer vanilla economic gameplay, and something like The Pit (above), might unbalance the economic gameplay for me ... but I'm determined to use it at least once!  

@Naomi57 thats crazy u said Castro Valley, Ca cuz i live in San Leandro, Ca , hella close to that place lol. 2 questions tho, what do you mean high traffic volumes? like as in they need lots of traff to grow? also what do you mean about demand caps? what do you mean u used Army, etc to lift them??

On 29/11/2019 at 1:52 PM, LightSkinnedPisces said:

thats crazy u said Castro Valley, Ca cuz i live in San Leandro, Ca , hella close to that place lol.

My Castro Valley probably looks a wee little different to yours! 

I used the Maxis San Francisco region map for that one, so my Castro Valley actually included Hayward, San Lorenzo, and Russel City, too.

On 29/11/2019 at 1:52 PM, LightSkinnedPisces said:

what do you mean high traffic volumes? like as in they need lots of traff to grow?

Use your Traffic Volume view to see where the traffic is.  Basically, high traffic in an adjacent 2-tile radius of each lot is called "Traffic Noise" for residential lots, and "Customers" for commercial lots.  Like my post says, commercial needs lots of things, but adjacent traffic is one of the most important.  Pedestrian and bus traffic works, too, it doesn't have to be cars, but I don't think rail, subway or monorail traffic counts toward "Customers" at all.

"Customers" is a misleading term for adjacent traffic.  Basically, this is potential customers.

Back to a real life example, my daughter worked at a florist shop earlier this year.  It was located in an arcade (think Pedmall), right next to one of the busiest subway stations in my home city of Sydney, Australia.  There was literally a constant flow of potential customers passing by that shop ALL the time, and many of those potential customers decided to stop by to buy a bouquet of flowers.

Compare that to a florist shop I pass by in my car about 4 times a week, which is tucked away in the suburban backstreets 2km from my home.  I have NEVER, not once, seen a customer go into that shop.  Back streets are simply not a good place for a successful retail business.

SimCity 4 simplifies that real-life model of retail business success, making it the model of success for EVERY kind of business.  Looking at the way commercial skyscrapers work in real-life, clustered in high traffic central business districts, using adjacent traffic is moderately accurate as ONE predictor of real-life business success.  In SimCity 4, the easiest way to do this is by using car and bus traffic on avenues and highways, but pedestrian traffic works, too.

On 29/11/2019 at 1:52 PM, LightSkinnedPisces said:

also what do you mean about demand caps? what do you mean u used Army, etc to lift them??

Again, to use a real-life example, military forces need enormous amounts of manufacturing, to create tanks, jeeps, submarines, aircraft, radar systems, and weapons, let alone all the parts needed to create those things.  Even military uniforms need to be manufactured somewhere.  Most military forces don't make these things themselves, instead relying on contractors (manufacturing industry), to create all the many different things they need.  This creates enormous demand, for new factories, and for industrial jobs to design and manufacture the things needed for the military forces to do their job.

SimCity 4 represents this, by the Army Base increasing demand caps for manufacturing industry (I-M) jobs.

If you don't have enough demand in your city, you'll see this in one of two ways:

1. Zoning residential, commercial, agricultural, or industrial, and the zones remain empty, or
2. Having residential, commercial, agricultural, or industrial build, but then dilapidate, or become vacant, due to lack of demand.

You can almost predict what will happen in advance, by looking at your RCI Demand graph.  This RCI Demand graph (below) shows that you already have more than enough houses for everyone, but you don't have enough farms (I-Ag), highly polluting factories (I-D), or manufacturing plants (I-M).  Now, just because there is high demand for something (e.g. dirty industry), doesn't mean you have to do that, but it does tend to make for a more prosperous economy, as long as you manage the pollution, too.

The Army Base serves to increase manufacturing (I-M) demand.  Trick is, that's not the only factor.  Other factors that drive manufacturing demand are:

1. Availability of workers with the correct wealth level ($, $$ or $$$), and education (EQ).
2. Proximity to a successful export point, such as road access to a Sea Port, and Rail or Road access to a city edge.  Note that only successful freight deliveries to an export point count toward increasing BOTH demand caps and demand.
3. Tax levels, with lower taxes improving demand, and higher taxes reducing demand.  Low taxes improve demand, but DON'T raise demand caps.
4. Demand is also affected by economic cycles, and demand very likely has several subtle links to other aspects of your city's economy.  Basically, a prosperous economy, which is balanced across all the types of demand in the RCI Demand graph above, tends to grow more easily than one that is unbalanced.
5. Demand is also affected by regional growth.  A city in a region of other cities, even if the other cities are really small, also tends to have higher demand.  Even just one small neighbouring city in your region, makes a HUGE difference to how stable your city's economy is, and how much demand it will experience.

I am still trying to figure out if Freight Rail links are more powerful than Road links for increasing manufacturing demand.  I'm not sure.  It might also be possible that exported freight by rail or road, is more effective if there is a real neighbour city on the other side of that Neighbour Connection instead of "SimNation".  Demand caps for commercial growth (C$$ and C$$$), certainly works that way.

Weirdly, none of the manufacturing freight goes to the Army Base, even though the Army Base is a huge driver for increasing manufacturing demand caps.  All manufacturing freight goes to an export point, and then disappears from the game, each successful freight delivery improving BOTH manufacturing demand and demand caps in your city.

The plops that increase manufacturing demand caps are:

1. Sea Port – Though there is a bug with the Maxis Sea Port, which makes it less effective than originally intended.  There are downloadable modded Sea Ports that fix that bug, but they are complex mods and from what I understand, you should never install two different types of Sea Port, due to compatibility issues.  The amount by which the Sea Port increases demand caps, depends on the number of successful freight deliveries to the Sea Port, as long as you adjust Sea Port funding to match (or exceed) the number of freight deliveries.
2. Lighthouse – Increases manufacturing demand caps by 3000 jobs.
3. Radio Station – Increases manufacturing demand caps by 9000 jobs.
4. Army Base – Increases manufacturing demand caps by 100000 jobs.  Yes, that's 100 thousand!  

Raising demand caps doesn't guarantee demand, but it's one of the necessary factors.   You can think of demand caps as the maximum that your city can grow, and current demand is how much your city can grow at the moment.

There is a nasty cost to having an Army Base.  It increases crime, with a Police Corruption Effect over a 64 tile radius.  I always plop an Army Base in the far corner of a large city tile, and then I draw out an Army Base exclusion zone, in which I only zone for agriculture, dirty industry, low wealth commercial services, and maybe some manufacturing near the edges of that crime zone.  Besides having Police stations, there are three City Ordinances that help to reduce crime:

1. Neighbourhood Watch Program - Works exactly like real life.  :-)
2. Junior Sports Program - Keeping energetic youth out of mischief!
3. Pro-Reading Campaign - An educated population is less likely to commit crimes.  This complements the education effect of schools and libraries and everything else on your Education menu.

There are other demand factors, and demand caps, for residential and commercial.  You might find this other post of mine helpful.

https://community.simtropolis.com/journals/entry/29044-tutorial-for-building-your-first-city-in-a-brand-new-region/

... and at the very bottom of this post, I talk about the "Army Base, and all the nastiest NIMBY stuff", in the current manufacturing city I am building:

https://community.simtropolis.com/journals/entry/29088-brownsville-new-york-google-satellite-virtual-tour-of-a-low-wealth-simcityscape/

 

6 hours ago, Naomi57 said:

I am still trying to figure out if Freight Rail links are more powerful than Road links for increasing manufacturing demand.  I'm not sure.  It might also be possible that exported freight by rail or road, is more effective if there is a real neighbour city on the other side of that Neighbour Connection instead of "SimNation".  Demand caps for commercial growth (C$$ and C$$$), certainly works that way.

I haven't found the post to back this up, but I'm rather sure that Industrial Cap Relief from exported goods via a connection is the same regardless of how it leaves the city tile. And, iirc, it is one half (0.5) increase per successful freight trip. So, two freight exported will increase the industrial caps by 1.

For the Commercial Office Cap relief from neighborhood connections, it does depend on the connection type. In @RippleJet's Demand Simulator: Demand, Supply and CAPs over at Devotion, we see this table:

Network Type	CO CAP Relief
ANT (RHW)	1,000
Road	10,000
Avenue	20,000
Highway	100,000
RailRoad	10,000
LightRail	20,000
Subway	20,000
Monorail	20,000

And each subsequent connection to the same neighbor has less cap relief dropping 5 or 10 percent each. SimNation does count as the same neighbor even when its on multiple sides of the current city tile.

Commercial Services have no cap so there's no relief needed.

 

6 hours ago, Naomi57 said:

In SimCity 4, the easiest way to do this is by using car and bus traffic on avenues and highways, but pedestrian traffic works, too.

As you mentioned, buses will contribute to traffic when set that way via NAM, however my experiments with pedestrians indicate they don't contribute to traffic noise and therefore don't increase customer counts for commercial. (In that same thread a little further up, I did an experiment checking if freight trucks contribute to traffic noise and the result was: Yes, but at half the rate of cars.)