SPAs Urbanist BAT Thread

[spa 970]

Eagle Scream: Nice! I was hoping I would see a picture of one of my BATS at work. Only thing is your picture isn't 800x600 so it might get deleted. Thanks though. One other thing, I see Simgoober's helicopter port off on the left there. I would be careful with that one as there have been some problems with it. Simgoober actually removed it from the exchange.

Spike345: Thanks for the comment. I'm planning two lots with this building, one 4x3 for left corners and one 3x4 for right corners. Both lots will fit snugly against one side (the other side will have a small parking lot and an entanceway to the upstairs offices). For the 3x4 corner it'll be snug on the main street whereas the 4x3 will be snug to buildings behind it.

[Kwakelaar 92]

Your off to a great start with your new project.

[mackeast 0]

Wow spa!! That is so awesome looking...I love the size of it, it will fit in perfectly on the corner of one of my downtown streets! Im eagerly awaiting its release!

[spa 970]

Thanks for the comments everyone. I'm just putting up a small update right now. I was out today in the nice Alberta Spring weather taking pictures. I didn't feel like working on my corner building tonight (I'll come back to it soon) so I started tinkering around with one of the ones I took today. The project is pictured below.

So this is the building. It's on 17th Avenue in Calgary and I think it's a kind of a neat building. It has a lot of little details, espeically for a modern building, that can I play with. Anyway, this is what I have done so far.

I know it doesn't look like much, but I spent two or three hours on it, mainly figuring out dimensions. I was trying to make the building fit w2w on a 1x2 or 1x3 lot, but each time I set out I ended up with either the brick posts or the windows next to the doors too small and out of proportion with the rest of the building. This thing just won't fit on a one tile across lot. At the same time 20 units across would look silly on a 2x2 so what I'm going  to double the building. I'll have another two store fronts which, with the additional brick posts and entranceway, should make for approximately 44 units across. That'll be a much nicer fit on a 3x2 or 3x3. It won't be w2w, but it'll be close. I'm also planning on ditching the Western Union. I'll have something nicer in the second store front. I'm thinking a Bernard Calibeau chocolate store. Anyway, I have had enough math for one night so I'm going to go actually play the game for a while.

[spa 970]

Just a little but more work to show.


I decided to make the other busineses in the building a Flight Centre travel agency and a Bernard Callebaut Chocolate shop. I figured out the dimensions and it measures 31.95 making it w2w on a 2x2 or a 2x3 lot and giving me .25 to play with on each side when I put the roof outline on. I think this size should work fairly well. Anyway, below is a preview picture. I was going to get an ingame preview, but I don't feel like emptying my plugins folder to render right now. I'll render a preview when I have the front done.

[tag_one 133]

wow this looks really nice. I love the variaty in the wall textures

[Kwakelaar 92]

Some very good details you have made for your storefronts, and I think you have made the right decision to make it wider to fit better on the lot and still keeping the proportions of the building.

[6459978. 106]

Nice detailing, but if you ask me, it looks like it's been stretched a little too wide... Can I ask how tall it is? For a single story BAT 5 to 6 m (i.e. grid units) wouldn't be unreasonable.

[spa 970]

Tagone: I'm glad you like the wall textures. I'm not the most original batter in making things up from scratch but my photos of this building give me a lot work with!

Kwakelaar: Thanks. I think so too about the dimensions. A 2x2 with approximately 85% of the second tile unused would probably look foolish. Another store front seems to be the logical course.

6459978: Thanks for the feedback. I'm not sure that I understand what you mean by streatched? The dimensions are 31.95 long by 6.55 to the top decorative brick (top railing not included). I have started working on the next floor up. Since half the storefront signs are actually walls to the second floor's deck, that leaves the groud floor with a total of 5.5. Since the top is set back though, it'll probably appear to be a little taller than it actually is. I have attached a picture below (I normally wouldn't put one up that had so much missing and unpolished), that hopefully will make my reply clearer. By the time I'm done, the whole building will be 31.95 and approximately 19 high for three floors and some extra space between floors and at the roof. It won't be as high and narrow as the real building... of course I could make it closer by adding several more upper floors on but I'm not sure that would be an improvement? To keep the narrow and tall look of the original I would need to make it six or more stories high which probably wouldn't look good with the entranceway to the floors above that I have. The other option is the one I am working with right now of shorter and fatter? Please do try again to tell me what you mean.

[jt_144_2004 0]

Looking good, Your using great textures

[Yisginlasvegas 5]

I wish I could create every building I see!

[sloppet 3]

Nice work there!

quote>

Very good, it looks just like real!

[6459978. 106]

Hmmm, well what I was trying to say was that the aspect ratio looked too short and wide, although, the dimensions you give seem to be reasonable for the height. It's just that in my opinion, at least, the doors look kind of clumsy; too short and stout. Although, I could get used to it, not a big deal.

[spa 970]

Thanks for the kind words everyone. It's appreciated.

6559978: The doors are each 1.5 wide so that makes 3 wide for each set of doors and 3 high. Do you think I should make them 4 high instead? I was under the impression that 3 was fairly standard. Just wondering because you've had a lot more experience with the BAT and your feedback is appreciated (your texturing tutorial on your BAT thread opened up the world of not tiling roofs for me).

[6459978. 106]

Well I'm glad that another BATer has been converted to the "non-tiling" ranks ... As for the door, I think 4 high would be a good dimension, especially given a width of 1.5. It's a bit of an exageration if you consider the real world dimensions, but I think that with lowrise BATs it's necessary, otherwise the structure seems altogether too miniature in the game's scale.

[mattb325 28,890]

Nice work on all of these BATs spa - I must say that the scotiabank is really useful and I like the fact that you are doing commercial lowrise. Sorely needed in SC4 given everyone concentrates on the really large stuff  Well done!

[spa 970]

6459978: I think before I finish this one I'll see about increasing the size of the ground floor doors and store fronts by about .5 The only danger could come in that it might look funny having the upper floor doors smaller. I'll have to play around with it.

Mattb325: Thanks! I'm glad you like my work. I agree about the small commercial buildings. Too little has been done in this area. I keep an eye on your thread and I'm glad you're also producing some low rises.

So I haven't had a lot of time lately for batting. I have been finishing up school and dealing with a lot of odds and ends. Adding to that I was away this weekend. I went down into Southern Alberta with the girlfriend. Of course, being Alberta, we had a beautiful day yesterday where it was in the 20s (celius) and today it snowed. The extreme temperature fluctuations that happen in this province are a little nuts.  Anyway, before I left and a for a little while this evening I picked away at the Royal Manor Building. This is where things sit right now.

It's starting to come together. Lots left to do obviously, but the front is coming along. I have a few ideas about how I'm going to make the back of the building bouncing around my head too. It's just a matter of finding the time. I'll update again when I have some more progress to show (probably when I have the front wrapped up likely in the next few days).

[spa 970]

Well this morning and last night I ended up putting in some more time on the Royal Manor Building. I'm please to say with the exception of putting some gradients on the wall textures and the outside light fixtures on the ground floor, the front is now done. The rest should be a lot simpiler. Here's where things sit as of now:

In GMAX:

GMAX Preview:


Acutally I just noticed that a piece of the 3rd floor deck is sticking out between the two windows on the tower. I'll have to fix that too. I might add some more logos on the left third and second floors to keep the left side from looking so bare compared to the right. The real building doesn't have them but hey, with the exception of Corner Gas none of my BATs are suppose to be exact replicas. I just use real buildings as a starting point. Very few of my BATs haven't involved taking some liberties. Anyway, I guess you could say the front is largely done

[Kwakelaar 92]

Well, I like it, I guess I would go for some stuff on the balconies, a chair and table or some plants maybe. Still I also like the clean look.

Again you have put a lot of details into this front, good work!

[spa 970]

Kwakelaar: I have been working on the back of the buidling (pic below) and I have put a bunch of balconies on it too. There really are a lot on this building. I think for the most part I want to leave them empty as balconies on commercial buildings usually have little on them (no time to play when on the clock). However, I think something needs to go on a few of them. My thought is some plants and maybe an odd chair here and there. I was thinking that I might experiment with custom LODs on this BAT to put some props on the baconies rather than trying to BAT plants (I have no idea how I would even start on something as complicated and unsquare like as a plant!). When playing with LODS you can cut pieces out using the boolean tool can't you? If so then this shouldn't be too hard since I should be able to drop a block on the balcony and then boolean it out to leave a hole for props to sit in that corresponds to the balcony. If not, I'm not sure that I'll be able to do it. If you or anyone else has any advice about making LODs here do let me know. Any advice would be appreciated.

Anyway, as I mentioned I have the back of the building well underway. I have had the concept in my head and sketched (poorly) out on paper. So here it is:

I don't think it's half bad. I like the contrast created between the front and the back: the front has relatively closed balconies on a straight wall and the backs are pretty exposed on a terraced setup. My plan for the back includes a ground floor entranceway leading to a back parking lot (similiar to my TD, Royal and CIBC banks). On the grond floor going from the entrance across to the far left hand side will be windows with planters below them. On the third floor, the door on the large balcony will be moved and put on an angle between the two sets of windows to make an angled access point onto the top balcony. I'm also planning some decorative stone tile patterns along the balcony walls. I'll update again when I have the back finished up. In the meantime, comments/criticisms are as always welcome.

Oh and now that I have everything finalized I can say with certainity that this will be a 2x3 w2w building.

[onlyplace4 605]

Looking real good. The textures work very well, and everything looks nicely proportioned. One small point I do have to make is with regard to the doors at the front of the building. At the moment they look a little squat, and when you consider the foreshortening effect of sc4, this is going to be a concern. Even though it will mean making your dorrs and thus the remainder of the ground floor higher, I do think it will look better in game.

Aside from that, can't fault you. Look forward to seeing this one on the STEX.

[spa 970]

Onlyplace4: Thanks! 6459978 made the same point about the proportions. I'm planning on making the ground floor doors an additional .5 bigger. I have just been avoiding doing it because it means modifying the brick posts, the windows and window frames on all the store fronts, the doors and door windows, the door knobs and the walls. I'll do it soon since I'm not going to start modelling the back ground floor until I have it properly adjusted. I might finish the roofing first though. We'll see what I feel like. Thanks for your comment.

[tag_one 133]

wow amazing progress, I love the front of the building it's really nice

[mattb325 28,890]

This is looking really good. There is a real lack of this sort of commercial building on SC4- keep up the good work!

[Kwakelaar 92]

Hi Spa

I know there are some gmax files that you can download, one with furniture and another with plants. I have used both of them and got some problems with my gmax files, so if you want to try, be careful and save often.

A chair and a table and some very simple potted plants is not as difficult as you might think and I am sure with your skills you are more than able.

You can make the LODs in the way you described, but if I have understood the working of the game, complicated LODs will slow down the game. I have made custom LODs for my puzzelpieces, but still fairly simpel shapes.

Difficult to say what is the best solution for your balconies, you should just try out some different options and see what you like the best.

Backside is also looking good so far.

[spa 970]

Tag_One and Mattb325: Thanks for popping in guys and offering encouragement.

Kwakelaar: Thanks for the advice. Do you know who uploaded the plants? I found furniture models, but that's not really the one I need (I can make tables and benches and such). I appreciate the vote of confidence, but I really don't know where to start with plants. They're such complicated things. I could probably handle a small bush or something by mashing a bunch of shapes together, but I'm not sure it would look all that pretty. What I'm thinking is that I'll probably model some chairs and a few planters and then I'll just slap a flower texture down inside the planter. Since flowers don't grow very high and the texture will be small, it shouldn't really show that my flowers have no depth. I'll supplement this with one or two cuts into the LODs to put some of those potted Maxis plants on one or two balconies. With this plan I can have some variety by mixing my own stuff with the props without slowing things down too much with customized LODs (I didn't know that they affected the game). Thanks for the advice and info.

Anyway, I have been working away today and things are coming along quite nicely. I enlarged the ground floor by .6 (let me know if you guys think it was too much) and I modelled the sides and this is where things sit:

So things left to do:

1. Model the windows and doors on the ground floor back wall.

2. Make some textures with gradients for the walls (the ones on there are way to clean).

3. Deck details (furniture, plants and maybe some more signs)

4. Roof junk and a roof texture.

5. Interior floors

6. Some decorative stone work on the back.

7. Lights

I have a thesis chapter due on Thursday and, if I'm lucky enough to get tickets, I might be driving up to Edmonton to see the Oilers play on Friday so this one might not get finished until sometime next weekend. A lot depends on how efficently the writing process goes over the next few days. One way or the other though I'm rolling down the home streatch here.

[tazdog 0]

Excellent work, these all look great...!!!

[bixel 1,224]

Hell yah! These are good.

[spa 970]

Thanks for the compliments guys! Nice to know I'm on the right track with things.

This weekend I didn't end up doing much batting. Instead I actually played Sim City for several hours on Friday and Saturday, but I did tinker around a little bit today. However, I didn't work on the Royal Manor Building though, instead I went back to my Kensington Plaza (see the previous page of my thread for older pictures of it that include all angles). I like the Royal Manor building better, but I just felt like a change. So one of the big things I had left to do on Kensington Plaza was to finish the back office entrance. This is what I have come up with.

It's not terribly exciting but I don't think it's bad either. It's tough to deal with the large amount of space between the 1st floor and the 2nd floor since I had to make the 1st floor quite tall to accound for the streetsides shops on the other sides. The one thing that I haven't done that I'm planning on is putting some piping up the left side of the building (that's why there are no windows there). One question for anyone in the know, is there somewhere where I can get the Maxis parking lot texture? I want to put a driveway up to the garage/loading bay door and I know the lot editor isn't going to do it  well so I figured I would bat it in. To do so without it making the parking lot I'm going to put in with the lot editor look dumb I need my batted pavement to match.

There is one other thing that I have come up with that I'll mention. Since all my BATs come from a handful of real neighbourhoods in Calgary and Halifax, I have decided to release them as series. So when I put them up on the STEX, a logo will be part of the secondary picture. Kensington Plaza is the first entry in my Kensington Set which are buildings from the Kensington neighbourhood in Calgary. Below is a picture of the logo, which I made from the winter version of the street banners that are present throughout the neighbourhood. 

My Royal Manor Building is also from Calgary but it's over on 17th Avenue (aka the Red Mile). I'll post the Logo next time I update my progress on it.

[Pipes 0]

that plaza is looking some real, you re the next "king of kensington".

lol okay so i know the tv show had to do with kensington market in downtown toronto to which the north end is a huge boatload of computer stores. it still shares the same name however, but you would'nt find that kinda nice building in that distrect of toronto

great work spa